All Things 2021 Minnesota Vikings In-Season Thread




stocker08

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The team put the offense in position to get more points. The team put the defense in position to prevent more points.

Nope. That argument doesn't do it for me. It's a team game.


But Vikings fanbase is a bitter, bitter bunch, and rightfully so.

The defense and the offense did exactly what they had to do to put the kicker in a spot to win the game with a kick that is made about nine out of ten times. It's a team game.....and the kicker is on the field for only a few plays. Nobody screwed up a higher percentage of plays....or a more important play than Joseph. Period.
 

MplsGopher

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The defense and the offense did exactly what they had to do to put the kicker in a spot to win the game
The defense and special teams did exactly what they had to do to put the offense in a spot to win the game.

The offense and special teams did exactly what they had to do to put the defense in a spot to win the game.


We'll never agree, obviously.


It is telling, though, how Zim is using kid gloves -- this time. Obviously has learned his lesson with how he burned himself with Carlson.
 


stocker08

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The defense and special teams did exactly what they had to do to put the offense in a spot to win the game.

The offense and special teams did exactly what they had to do to put the defense in a spot to win the game.


We'll never agree, obviously.


It is telling, though, how Zim is using kid gloves -- this time. Obviously has learned his lesson with how he burned himself with Carlson.

Your argument seems to be that the offense should score a touchdown every time they touch the ball and the defense should get a stop every time they are on the field. The kicker should never be asked to kick a game winning field goal from a distance where it is made 88% of the time.

Every player on the field is expected to do their jobs. Joseph didn't do his job on the final.....and most critical play of the game.
 

atsgopher

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This is absolutely true, has been forever really.

No excuse for missing that kick though. The Cardinals field is routinely voted one of the best fields in the league by the players, opening week regular season, the surface was immaculate. He pushed it right, pretty much a dead giveaway of a choke job. You miss right, 9 times out of 10 you didn't make a good strong pass at the ball. He choked, and I have always been one to hate, hate, HATE saying that when it comes to kicks but in this case, no other way to say it.
I heard Ryan Longwell go off toward the end of the season (perhaps end 2019) about Vikings kicking problems.

He indicated it was all Zimmer’s fault:

This is paraphrasing, so my apologies, but he listed what went wrong under every kicker back through Blair Walsh.

Essentially, his central criticism was Kicking is all about rhythm between the LS, holder and Pk. Apparently, Zimmer screws with all 3. Whereas other coaches usually leave these guys alone for years.

This year, he did fire the holder right before the 1st game,
 

MplsGopher

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Your argument seems to be that the offense should score a touchdown every time they touch the ball and the defense should get a stop every time they are on the field. The kicker should never be asked to kick a game winning field goal from a distance where it is made 88% of the time.

Every player on the field is expected to do their jobs. Joseph didn't do his job on the final.....and most critical play of the game.
Why isn't it that Cook didn't do his job by breaking tackles for a touchdown rush during the second half?

Why isn't it that Harrison didn't do his job by getting home on that blitz for a sack, instead of a TD throw?


You're never going to convince me.

But, I think by far most Vikings fans side with you.
 

MplsGopher

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This year, he did fire the holder right before the 1st game,
If the holder isn't the punter, it means some other player on the roster has to take time away from practice to practice holding.

The punter has to be a good punter first, though.
 



stocker08

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Why isn't it that Cook didn't do his job by breaking tackles for a touchdown rush during the second half?

Why isn't it that Harrison didn't do his job by getting home on that blitz for a sack, instead of a TD throw?


You're never going to convince me.

But, I think by far most Vikings fans side with you.

lol. Cook ran for 6 yard per carry. And again....the defense didn't play that great. But they made the stop when they needed to. Joseph choked when it was his turn to step up. And again....he had seven kicks and missed two.....including on the most important play of the game. That is a pathetic percentage.

The NFL sees tight games week after week. Asking a kicker to hit a reasonable FG.....one that is hit nearly 9 out of 10 times isn't too much to ask a guy that doesn't have to react to anything happening on the field. They have ONE job. Kick the ball straight. lol....just this past week we saw THREE game winning field goals.

Hopkins kicked a 43 yarder to give Washington a win over the Giants
Zuerlein kicked a 56 yarder to give the Cowboys a win over the Chargers
Bullock kicked a 36 yarder to give the Titans a win over Seattle in OT

Two more in week one:

Succop hit a 36 yarder to give Tampa the win over the Cowboys
McPherson hit a 33 yarder to give the Bengals a win over the Vikings


Those guys did their jobs....because kicking game winning field goals in tight games is part of the job. Especially ones inside the 40. And I'm not saying that Joseph should be cut or anything like that. He hit a huge one to send the game to OT in week one. But that doesn't excuse Sunday's epic failure.
 

BleedGopher

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per The Athletic:

Do you think the Vikings need to make the playoffs for Zimmer and Spielman to keep their jobs? — Mark D.

Probably, but not definitely. Sorry if that’s sort of a vague answer. There are scenarios in which they can be kept after a playoff-less season. If they were to suffer a bunch of injuries or simply had really bad luck in not making the postseason, both could return.

But we’ve also talked since the summer about what an important season this was for Zimmer and Spielman. They acted accordingly, spending a lot of money in free agency to try to fix the defense while using their first-round pick to try to fix the offensive line.

So if they did all of that and then were to miss the playoffs for a second straight year, it would probably be more likely than not that ownership goes in a different direction.

If or when Zimmer is let go, what are the odds we can land one of our own in Eric Bieniemy? — Jon W.

It’s still crazy to me that Bieniemy didn’t land a head coaching job at the end of last season, and it will again be crazy to me if it doesn’t happen this year. But Bieniemy will probably have options beyond the NFL, including potentially the USC job if he were interested in coaching at the college level.

As you allude to, Bieniemy worked for the Vikings from 2006 to 2009, starting as the running backs coach (for a certain ball carrier who was pretty darned good) before being elevated to assistant head coach.

I had a good time talking with Bieniemy for this story on the day Adrian Peterson ran for 296 yards and loved his comparison of Peterson to Michael Jordan. I think he’ll be a great head coach wherever he ends up.

Was job security the reason Zimmer wanted Klint Kubiak as the OC? As in, Zimmer knew that Klint wouldn’t be a threat to his job if things went south. With Klint as OC, who can replace Zimmer midseason? — Adam J.

I understand why you ask, but Kubiak wasn’t named the offensive coordinator for that reason. Zimmer wanted to keep the same playbook and same scheme, so he went with the former play caller’s son to keep things as similar as possible.

If Zimmer were fired midseason (which I think is a big if — one that would probably require losses in the next two games), then Andre Patterson would probably become the interim coach.


Skol Vikes!!
 

MplsGopher

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lol. Cook ran for 6 yard per carry. And again....the defense didn't play that great. But they made the stop when they needed to.
They (the D) did indeed make a big, quick stop on that last drive.

I thought Zim was nuts not to go for it at that point, but he proved he is correct for being the defensive minded coach that everyone loves to rag on.


So it's just a little too "neat" for me that you only care about that one drive. Not the others where the Cards scores. Same for the offense. You only seem to care that they scores more than zero points, which on paper is technically enough to win a game.


Nope. Everyone shares in the loss equally.

Don't waste your time. You won't change my mind.
 

Ogee Oglethorpe

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All the pining for Eric Bienemy and the entire world knows that Andy Reid calls the plays and runs the offense for the Chiefs. Hard to say just what his role is with the Chiefs without being in the building.

Not saying EB couldn't be a great Head Coach, but Reid may not be doing him any favors by calling ALL the shots with the Chiefs. Someone will take a shot on him eventually, the Rooney rule almost guarantees that. I hope he gets a shot and I hope he takes it and runs with it. Seems like a very solid dude by all accounts
 



Ogee Oglethorpe

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What's (unfortunately) getting lost in the Vikings loss to Arizona is that the Vikings actually played a very very good game. Essentially, Kyler Murray happened. Any other QB for AZ and the Vikings win the game by 10-17 points.

Nobody has mentioned that the Vikings OL played a VERY good game against a very stout AZ pass rush and defense. The OL was very good. The defense against what the Cardinals normally do was game-planned by Zim exceptionally well. They were prepared for what the Cardinals typically do, Murray just got loose a few times and made plays. Sometimes you just have to tip your hat.

0-2 sucks, big time, makes it really hard to make the playoffs, but I would still maintain this is a really really good Vikings team. The schedule is tough though, and making the playoffs is a big uphill battle right now. On the bright side, they are just one game back in the NFC North and the Packers are far from flawless
 

jamiche

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This is absolutely true, has been forever really.

No excuse for missing that kick though. The Cardinals field is routinely voted one of the best fields in the league by the players, opening week regular season, the surface was immaculate. He pushed it right, pretty much a dead giveaway of a choke job. You miss right, 9 times out of 10 you didn't make a good strong pass at the ball. He choked, and I have always been one to hate, hate, HATE saying that when it comes to kicks but in this case, no other way to say it.
I agree that he choked. Perfect kicking conditions. People always argue that there were multiple mistakes or poor decisions earlier in the game that might have allowed the vikings to avoid this situation. However, this happens in every game. It's the kicker's job to fix all of that. He failed.

The camera was on him briefly as he was coming on the field for the FGA. When I saw the look on his face I knew he was toast. Kickers have to be arrogant as hell and the goal posts have to look as wide as the Amazon to them.
 

Wally

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No one saying anything about the high snap. Maybe the holder angled it just slightly wrong.

No one saying anything about that Cards coach did not try to ice him with the final timeout, which almost always happens now a days. Can you think of a time off the top of your head when the opposing coach still had timeouts and didn't use at least one to ice? I can't. Maybe Cards coach is a genius.
Or he just watched the game I saw where they iced the kicker and he missed that kick and made the second one.
 


MplsGopher

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Or he just watched the game I saw where they iced the kicker and he missed that kick and made the second one.
Well you're not supposed to let the kicker get that first practice attempt, at all. Zim was red hot at the refs in Cincy for letting their kicker get that.
 

howeda7

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Since 1993, the Vikings have used 15 primary kickers:

Fuad Revez 1993-95
Aaron Elling 1996
Greg Davis 1997
Eddie Murray 1997
Gary Andersen 1998-2002
Doug Brien 2002
Aaron Elling 2003-2004
Morten Anderson 2004
Paul Edinger 2005
Ryan Longwell 2006-2011
Blair Walsh 2012-2016
Kai Forbath 2016-2017
Daniel Carlson 2018
Dan Bailey 2018-2020
Greg Joseph 2021

The Denver Broncos have used 3:

Jason Elam 1993-2007
Matt Prater 2007-2013
Brandon McManus 2014-2021.
 

stocker08

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They (the D) did indeed make a big, quick stop on that last drive.

I thought Zim was nuts not to go for it at that point, but he proved he is correct for being the defensive minded coach that everyone loves to rag on.


So it's just a little too "neat" for me that you only care about that one drive. Not the others where the Cards scores. Same for the offense. You only seem to care that they scores more than zero points, which on paper is technically enough to win a game.


Nope. Everyone shares in the loss equally.

Don't waste your time. You won't change my mind.

Everybody shares in the loss equally....lol. That opinion is incredibly wrong....but you are entitled to it.
 



Wally

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Why was there no one in this organization who could stand up to Zimmer on Carlson. Just a joke. Organizational failure.

Carlson 29/31 in last 2 years.

Daniel Carlson kicks his way to AFC special teams player of the week
 
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LakevilleBro

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I heard that not one Viking rookie from this last draft class, played in the AZ game. Is that correct? How is that even possible?
 





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