A qualifying list of potential replacements

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TNGophfan said:
Here's what I don't get so maybe someone can enlighten me. Fleck has 100 some players and does a good job of keeping most and does a really good job getting kids in the portal, most if not all getting NIL money through DTA or some other means.
Why can't Ben be somewhat successful with the same pots of potential NIL funds? Yet, all I hear is Ben has no NIL money. I don't understand.
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Well, remember that donors can indicate program targets for their donations. I suspect that men's basketball is low on the list of donor targets. We can guess the most obvious reasons why.
 


formerlybis said:
He grew up in Iowa City. Therefore, dot, dot, dot
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He was born in Iowa City, but grew up in Storm Lake and went to his first two years of college in Mason City. I don't think being born in Iowa City deters him from taking a high-paying Big Ten job if it is offered.

formerlybis said:
I think people are right in thinking it's too early for him to move up. He's winning with a roster largely made up of his D2 players that transferred with him. That's impressive, but want to see him do it with new players before backing up the Brinks truck. I think it's more likely than not that he does have the chops, but it's still speculative at this point.
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100% agree.
 


Tucker32 said:
Let’s hope he does better than last time. I don’t know where this rumor started, but Ben was his hire. No mandate, just Coyle making a bad hire.
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The search process to hire a men's basketball coach after Richard Pitino was fired was different than every search Coyle has conducted here. The entire process was different. There was a reason for that. This isn't a rumor.
 

tjgopher said:
The search process to hire a men's basketball coach after Richard Pitino was fired was different than every search Coyle has conducted here. The entire process was different. There was a reason for that. This isn't a rumor.
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The rumor was that the aau coaches disliked Pitino and were actively recruiting kids away from the U. Coyle’s next move was to hire someone who was well liked within the state. The rest is history.
 






bga1 said:
I don't know the answer to your question based on any inside knowledge but theoretically- individual football players beyond an elite few don't have as dramatic of an effect on a team as individual basketball players. I'd guess football has 5x the NIL and I doubt that more than 10+ players are getting 6 figures or more. In basketball we had an average team with average talent last year and there were 3 guys commanding 300-500k per each and another that could have perhaps been retained with a million (Christie). 3 million to buy a good roster in basketball and 5 million might get it done in football despite the vast difference in numbers. All guesses but I feel like this is the NIL issue.

Here's the sad part- a smart administration would understand that there is a better chance to rapidly rise in basketball than there is in football because with the right coach and an attainable amount of NIL you could catapult much higher- fairly quickly. I cannot even begin to imagine what OSU/Alabama and the like are spending on football NIL.
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There isn't much an administration can do outside hiring/firing since the school can't be involved in NIL officially. (yes I know) This whole thing has blown up so fast and so out of proportion most schools were caught flatfooted especially in basketball. Especially the schools that didn't have massive established under the table payoffs prior to all this ya know.

As for the reason Fleck can do what Johnson can't...Fleck (for all his faults) has the football team very popular, winning more than it is losing including beating rivals. The team may not always be the most exciting to watch, but the fans are mostly satisfied with the program and the position they are in. He also is out giving talks, having local leaders in to talk to the team, has a national brand...etc. Fleck is a promoter, of himself and the program and that brings in money. He is not afraid to say we need more if we want to win, and while we Minnesotans don't like to hear it, it works. Johnson is not that guy. The team doesn't particularly play a good brand of basketball even with good players and you never see him out pushing the team or brand.

Look, Pitino was not a good coach for this squad and is probably at the level he should stay at...but that dude was everywhere and he was very Fleck-like in promoting the program and shaking hands and kissing babies. He would be doing better with NIL than Ben is because he would be out doing the nitty gritty to try and bring in the cash. He would be pimping his players way more than Ben does which will get them opportunities. (not officially of course but exposure helps) What the guy lacked in coaching (a lot) he made up for in spades in enthusiasm and promotion. Does Ben tweet anything but "Boom" when he brings in some transfer from a school no one has ever watched play? I remember Pitino (before the practice facility) tweeting out multiple times about the gym at the complex they practiced at and it was super positive while also highlighting they need better facilities. That kind of stuff works...especially now.

Look, we are never going to be Michigan, who could have their whole squad suspended and forfeit the season and bring in millions in NIL. We need to build it up. we need a coach who knows the Xs and Os but also will be a bit of an influencer. Make Gopher Basketball a brand unto itself (with obvious cross promotion) and make the locals take notice. They dont need to fall in love right away, but right now they aren't even friend zoned. Build up a relationship and the money will start to come in.
 






Spaulding!No! said:
The rumor was that the aau coaches disliked Pitino and were actively recruiting kids away from the U. Coyle’s next move was to hire someone who was well liked within the state. The rest is history.
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I believe that the strategy in hiring Ben Johnson is that he had good relationships with the AAU framework in Minnesota. That hasn't really materialized, but the absolute blowing-up of the NIL and portal took place after Johnson took the job. I don't know if Johnson would have been a better coach in more traditional times, but he's having problems sailing into the new world of the sport.
 

tjgopher said:
The search process to hire a men's basketball coach after Richard Pitino was fired was different than every search Coyle has conducted here. The entire process was different. There was a reason for that. This isn't a rumor.
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Yes, it is. It's conjecture by people because it was a baffling hire. It wasn't different than others, he just made a bad hire - took a swing and missed. Dumb, but it was his hire. Just like Maturi did with hiring Brewster. He has had the opportunity to correct it but has stood by his hire to this point.
 

50PoundHead said:
I believe that the strategy in hiring Ben Johnson is that he had good relationships with the AAU framework in Minnesota. That hasn't really materialized, but the absolute blowing-up of the NIL and portal took place after Johnson took the job. I don't know if Johnson would have been a better coach in more traditional times, but he's having problems sailing into the new world of the sport.
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It's also true that the talent pipeline in MN has been but a trickle during his tenure, at least compared to the Pitino era. Even if NIL weren't the dominant factor, the pickings within MN are too slim anyway.

My #1 criteria for a new coach is demonstrated competence without superior talent. I don't care one iota about fanbase buzz or self-promotion. That will come with success, and to be successful, you must be able to implement a system (because you'll never out-talent the competition here) that works. The PSU guy is my mental model.
 


Hire Dave Smart. The same name I've been mentioning for years. Pacific seems like a place he'd be willing to leave for a Big Ten job. He's 58. Has coached in the USA for couple years, is a current head coach, has experience and strong recommendations from college and pro coaches.

If he's a success here, he may stay for 10 years. Stabilizes everything. And likely within the budget.
 


Dave H said:
Please. That is such fatalistic nonsense.
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There are 76(?) head coaching jobs in the power 5. Minnesota is one of them, and despite recent struggles not the worst of them. There are a lot more than 76 "good" college coaches out there. And the 34 B1G and SEC jobs are even more coveted than the rest.
 

UpAndUnder43 said:
Hire Dave Smart. The same name I've been mentioning for years. Pacific seems like a place he'd be willing to leave for a Big Ten job. He's 58. Has coached in the USA for couple years, is a current head coach, has experience and strong recommendations from college and pro coaches.

If he's a success here, he may stay for 10 years. Stabilizes everything. And likely within the budget.
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This is less crazy than when you suggested it four years ago, but it would be nice if he had more than 1 season in the US. Maybe in another 5 years when Musselman leaves for Kentucky after winning back to back national titles...:cool:
 

howeda7 said:
This is less crazy than when you suggested it four years ago, but it would be nice if he had more than 1 season in the US. Maybe in another 5 years when Musselman leaves for Kentucky after winning back to back national titles...:cool:
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I'll take less crazy! I like people who can coach, and everyone says he is a good coach. He can take an average team and make them above average. If they are good? Could be really good.
 

DAVE SMART

What They're Saying
"Dave Smart is one of the greatest coaches in all of basketball. Coach Smart's ability to win speaks for itself but his understanding of how to help people grow is what separates him." – Grant McCasland, Texas Tech Head Coach

"Dave is one of the best basketball coaches in the world. His experience with FIBA basketball and his success at Carleton University give him a diverse and unique background. I have the utmost respect for Dave and his teaching of the game." – Mick Cronin, UCLA Head Coach

"Dave Smart is as bright as anyone I've met in our business. His defensive philosophy and techniques have been helpful to us. We always look for opportunities to learn from Dave." – Jay Wright, former Villanova Head Coach

"One of the best basketball minds I have encountered. His players are always the most prepared and always execute the exact game plan. He has been a most valued assistant for me, and a huge part of our National Team for years." – Jay Triano, NBA Coach/Canadian Senior Men's National Team

"One of the most forward thinking coaches I have ever been around. He challenges everyone around him to think beyond their own boundaries and beliefs." – Bryan Gates, Sacramento Kings Assistant Coach

"During my 10 years at Lakehead University, my greatest learning experiences were the time spent watching film preparing to matchup with Dave Smart and the Carleton Ravens. His success as a coach is matched only by his knowledge and innovation on the court." – Scott Morrison, Boston Celtics Assistant Coach

"Dave Smart has one of the most brilliant and innovative minds in all of basketball and his coaching is respected internationally. I have known Coach Smart for decades, and competed against his teams many times. In doing so, I always learn something about the game and come away a better coach. His defensive system is extremely well thought out, and is designed to exploit the other team's weaknesses and minimize its strengths. From concept to detail, his system is as good as I have seen, and without a doubt a main reason for his unprecedented success throughout the years," – Bill Coen, Northeastern University Head Coach
 

howeda7 said:
There are 76(?) head coaching jobs in the power 5. Minnesota is one of them, and despite recent struggles not the worst of them. There are a lot more than 76 "good" college coaches out there. And the 34 B1G and SEC jobs are even more coveted than the rest.
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This is interesting - which of the P5 jobs ARE worse than MN? It's not that many.

But it can change quickly - certainly you'd think DePaul is a worse job than MN, but they hired Holtmann, and now they're respectable again. Same town - Northwestern - the right guy can make it work reasonably well.
 

formerlybis said:
This is interesting - which of the P5 jobs ARE worse than MN? It's not that many.

But it can change quickly - certainly you'd think DePaul is a worse job than MN, but they hired Holtmann, and now they're respectable again. Same town - Northwestern - the right guy can make it work reasonably well.
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This is subjective of course but:

ACC:
Cal
SMU
BC
Virginia Tech

Big 12:
UCF
TCU
West Virginia (the new Big 12 hurts them IMO. Buried pretty deep; geographic outlier).

Big East: (With revenue sharing coming, I'd argue almost all of them not named UConn purely based on total Athletic Dept revenue but factoring that out):
-DePaul
-Butler
-Providence

Big Ten:
-Penn State
-Nebraska
-Northwestern
-Rutgers
-Washington (would be even but playing half your games two time zones away etc. doesn't help)

-SEC:
-Miss State
-Vandy
-South Carolina
 

UpAndUnder43 said:
DAVE SMART

What They're Saying
"Dave Smart is one of the greatest coaches in all of basketball. Coach Smart's ability to win speaks for itself but his understanding of how to help people grow is what separates him." – Grant McCasland, Texas Tech Head Coach

"Dave is one of the best basketball coaches in the world. His experience with FIBA basketball and his success at Carleton University give him a diverse and unique background. I have the utmost respect for Dave and his teaching of the game." – Mick Cronin, UCLA Head Coach

"Dave Smart is as bright as anyone I've met in our business. His defensive philosophy and techniques have been helpful to us. We always look for opportunities to learn from Dave." – Jay Wright, former Villanova Head Coach

"One of the best basketball minds I have encountered. His players are always the most prepared and always execute the exact game plan. He has been a most valued assistant for me, and a huge part of our National Team for years." – Jay Triano, NBA Coach/Canadian Senior Men's National Team

"One of the most forward thinking coaches I have ever been around. He challenges everyone around him to think beyond their own boundaries and beliefs." – Bryan Gates, Sacramento Kings Assistant Coach

"During my 10 years at Lakehead University, my greatest learning experiences were the time spent watching film preparing to matchup with Dave Smart and the Carleton Ravens. His success as a coach is matched only by his knowledge and innovation on the court." – Scott Morrison, Boston Celtics Assistant Coach

"Dave Smart has one of the most brilliant and innovative minds in all of basketball and his coaching is respected internationally. I have known Coach Smart for decades, and competed against his teams many times. In doing so, I always learn something about the game and come away a better coach. His defensive system is extremely well thought out, and is designed to exploit the other team's weaknesses and minimize its strengths. From concept to detail, his system is as good as I have seen, and without a doubt a main reason for his unprecedented success throughout the years," – Bill Coen, Northeastern University Head Coach
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"Ben Johnson is doing an amazing job. That will be a top 25 team next year"-Tom Izzo

"Tim Brewster is doing a great job" (and totally isn't going to be fired days after I say this)-Pat Fitzerald

FWIW I'm sure he's a great teacher of basketball. So is Dave Thorsen. But that's not even close to the full job today. He might be good at the rest of it, but how can we know? He's coached 12 games as a Division 1 head coach. So far he's 5-7.
 
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howeda7 said:
This is subjective of course but:

ACC:
Cal
SMU
BC
Virginia Tech

Big 12:
UCF
TCU
West Virginia (the new Big 12 hurts them IMO. Buried pretty deep; geographic outlier).

Big East: (With revenue sharing coming, I'd argue almost all of them not named UConn purely based on total Athletic Dept revenue but factoring that out):
-DePaul
-Butler
-Providence

Big Ten:
-Penn State
-Nebraska
-Northwestern
-Rutgers
-Washington (would be even but playing half your games two time zones away etc. doesn't help)

-SEC:
-Miss State
-Vandy
-South Carolina
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I think you're optimistic on some of these - for instance, in the B10, I don't think Neb or Rut are worse jobs than MN. We can disagree, but both of them have assets that MN does not, IMO. And Northwestern has found their level - if Collins left, they'd likely be more attractive than MN, too.
 

formerlybis said:
I think you're optimistic on some of these - for instance, in the B10, I don't think Neb or Rut are worse jobs than MN. We can disagree, but both of them have assets that MN does not, IMO. And Northwestern has found their level - if Collins left, they'd likely be more attractive than MN, too.
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You can argue some of these are equal, but I think it's hard to argue they're better. Nebraska is still a football school that has never won an NCAA tournament game, has almost no natural recruiting base (I realize this matters less now) and is the 2nd best program in their small state. On the other hand, they now have a better arena and likely have more NIL $$.

Rutgers is a historically awful job in a bad arena. Piekiell has made it respectable. But I'm not sure a coach would take that job over MN. Same story at Northwestern, except a better arena but more difficulty getting kids admitted etc.
 

Maybe I can be convinced to cross Holtmann off my list. Daddy Pitino might beat him by 40 tonight.
 

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