All Things Former Gophers Thread

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MennoSota said:
Good point. Richard inherited an NIT championship team his 1st year at Minnesota.
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Totally untrue. He went out and got Lil Dre who was a major difference maker and convinced Mo Walker to lose 50 pounds and become a solid Big Ten center. Also brought in the good three point shooter from Milwaukee who was a very good 6th man.
 

MennoSota said:
Good point. Richard inherited an NIT championship team his 1st year at Minnesota. How did it go over the long run? I wish he had more success here at MN, but he didn't. Now we move on and give Ben a chance. Ben had the bad fortune of an unrestricted portal that decimated his bench. That's life. Ben is recruiting well. He needs time to show us he can develop who he has recruited. Short sighted people cannot grasp this.
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There are a 1000 ways to build a team but you can't bemoan the portal as an excuse for Ben.
He has the opportunity to recruit from the portal too.
Ben seems to have chosen to build with freshmen...the problem with that is the very portal you mentioned. Are these guys all going to stay here for four years? ...because that is the length time for us to be good in Ben's plan. Visionary or short sighted? Seems like a bigger gamble to me to try and build with freshmen in the 2022 climate when you have a portal available to accelerate the process by 3 or 4 years and can blow it up annually if it doesn't work versus building something totally unproven that may never get to the finish line years down the road.
Freshmen if they stay can still be ineffective and never develop.
Guys in the portal have proven they can play college basketball or are a gamble.
BUT, you need the vision to recruit guys who can play together...be parts of one team. A team without guards is shortsighted. A team without shooters is short sighted. A team without more lock down defenders is short sighted. Rebounding is a mentality...either recruit it or coach it.
And having said all that the Gophers could be good with Ben's plan but it is in year 3, 4 or 5 and it's still a total crap shoot EVEN if we add some good guards because it requires the unproven freshmen to ALL get good and stay and play well together.

Richard has buzz in year 2. At Minnesota he had buzz almost every year too...then each season the bottom falls out with injuries, suspensions etc (And no backup plan) Be nice to see his team stay healthy for a season.

On side note: He did inherit Andre and Austin Hollins along with a bunch of guys who couldn't play.
Richard totally rebuilt Mo Walker. He recruited D. Mathieu, Joey King, Malik Smith, to make it a team.
And Richard recruited House from ASU.
 
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gopherguy15 said:
Actually, House was in the transfer portal and Pitino got him to commit to New Mexico.

Pitino didn't get it done here, but I hope he does well at New Mexico.
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My point is still accurate.
 

60's Guy said:
There are a 1000 ways to build a team but you can't bemoan the portal as an excuse for Ben.
He has the opportunity to recruit from the portal too.
Ben seems to have chosen to build with freshmen...the problem with that is the very portal you mentioned. Are these guys all going to stay here for four years? ...because that is the length time for us to be good in Ben's plan. Visionary or short sighted? Seems like a bigger gamble to me to try and build with freshmen in the 2022 climate when you have a portal available to accelerate the process by 3 or 4 years and can blow it up annually if it doesn't work versus building something totally unproven that may never get to the finish line years down the road.
Freshmen if they stay can still be ineffective and never develop.
Guys in the portal have proven they can play college basketball or are a gamble.
BUT, you need the vision to recruit guys who can play together...be parts of one team. A team without guards is shortsighted. A team without shooters is short sighted. A team without more lock down defenders is short sighted. Rebounding is a mentality...either recruit it or coach it.
And having said all that the Gophers could be good with Ben's plan but it is in year 3, 4 or 5 and it's still a total crap shoot EVEN if we add some good guards because it requires the unproven freshmen to ALL get good and stay and play well together.

Richard has buzz in year 2. At Minnesota he had buzz almost every year too...then each season the bottom falls out with injuries, suspensions etc (And no backup plan) Be nice to see his team stay healthy for a season.

On side note: He did inherit Andre and Austin Hollins along with a bunch of guys who couldn't play.
Richard totally rebuilt Mo Walker. He recruited D. Mathieu, Joey King, Malik Smith, to make it a team.
And Richard recruited House from ASU.
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Clearly Ben isn't doing it your way. If he fails, then perhaps you'll get your wish and someone who comes in can act like a pirate and steal kids from other programs to come join Minnesota.
 

MennoSota said:
Clearly Ben isn't doing it your way. If he fails, then perhaps you'll get your wish and someone who comes in can act like a pirate and steal kids from other programs to come join Minnesota.
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Right now if you fail to use the portal you are working with old technology. Ben will be in the portal this spring shopping for at least one guard. If everyone else stays or if he loses just one to the portal from this roster, that would be a good sign that the kids believe in what Ben is doing despite the losing. If he loses 3-4 kids then, that is a big problem and he will have to go hard into the portal.
 


bga1 said:
Right now if you fail to use the portal you are working with old technology. Ben will be in the portal this spring shopping for at least one guard. If everyone else stays or if he loses just one to the portal from this roster, that would be a good sign that the kids believe in what Ben is doing despite the losing. If he loses 3-4 kids then, that is a big problem and he will have to go hard into the portal.
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The one thing that almost never gets discussed here is Ben’s recruiting for the intangibles and cultural fit. Do the guys fit? Are they all in on what he wants to do? Both the big recruits for next fall made reference to Ben being the real deal on a human level. If he is recruiting guys like that who can also play, his chances for success are much greater. It will also show, as you say, in whether they stay the course despite a really crappy season. It will be telling if they do get better as the season goes on, or if they mail it in the through the last month of the season. I fear the general impatience of young men, though. We’ll see.
 

MennoSota said:
We will never know. Nor would we know if he'd be undefeated in the B1G.
So, props to Richard at New Mexico. I was cheering for his team over Papa. And, I would take House in an instant as the point guard at MN. That's a kid Pitino inherited who he has to be delighted that House stayed at New Mexico.
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Read the StarTribune article...Pitino did not inherit House.
 

bga1 said:
Right now if you fail to use the portal you are working with old technology. Ben will be in the portal this spring shopping for at least one guard. If everyone else stays or if he loses just one to the portal from this roster, that would be a good sign that the kids believe in what Ben is doing despite the losing. If he loses 3-4 kids then, that is a big problem and he will have to go hard into the portal.
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This seems fair. Our upperclassmen have already went portal shopping so I don't see them constantly jumping. The young ones are getting playing time so it's hard to see them jumping somewhere to sit the bench. Here they are leaning to play the game against great competition. If they leave, it's because they recognize they don't belong at this level of play. In that case, I applaud them on their realistic assessment of their skills.
Ben is a smart man. He will try his best to build a competitive team through the means he perceives as the proper route for his philosophy of coaching. Whether it succeeds or not is yet to be seen. I'm just not going to give up at this present time. I have given every coach, from Musselman on up, the chance to show me what they could do. So far, Dutcher and Haskins have shown the best product on the floor. The others have been up and down.
 





60's Guy said:
There are a 1000 ways to build a team but you can't bemoan the portal as an excuse for Ben.
He has the opportunity to recruit from the portal too.
Ben seems to have chosen to build with freshmen...
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I tripped over this sentence because I don't agree with this premise. Cooper/Battle/Garcia all came from the portal, all start, and all have eligibility beyond this year. When they leave (assuming they stay next year), the current freshmen will be juniors, and likely experienced juniors.

Did you mean to say that he's chosen to build with the "traditional" high school recruits? That's closer. He'll still need to augment the roster from the portal, but probably with guys who'll occupy a scholarship for only a year, possibly two.
 

formerlybis said:
I tripped over this sentence because I don't agree with this premise. Cooper/Battle/Garcia all came from the portal, all start, and all have eligibility beyond this year. When they leave (assuming they stay next year), the current freshmen will be juniors, and likely experienced juniors.

Did you mean to say that he's chosen to build with the "traditional" high school recruits? That's closer. He'll still need to augment the roster from the portal, but probably with guys who'll occupy a scholarship for only a year, possibly two.
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Well, yes we do have guys from the portal but in the present we are bad. By the time the freshmen are ready will they still be here? With 7 freshmen recruits (This year/next year) it looks like that's the emphasis to me?
We need two more guards next year to decide if we are winning next year or always looking to the future. Or are we expecting Christie to come in and immediately lead us? He's good but I don't think that's who he is.
If the other guard is a freshman....he's gotta be really good! If he's from the portal he needs to be able to defend, make free throws and get the team in an offense. Cooper can't do that.
Who we gonna be? I don't know...but I think it looks like we are trying to be good with freshmen
who develop.
Again, the pieces gotta fit together. Can't just add guys to add guys. Guys gotta fill roles.
Whatever we are doing, we gotta do it better.
 

60's Guy said:
Well, yes we do have guys from the portal but in the present we are bad. By the time the freshmen are ready will they still be here? With 7 freshmen recruits (This year/next year) it looks like that's the emphasis to me?
We need two more guards next year to decide if we are winning next year or always looking to the future. Or are we expecting Christie to come in and immediately lead us? He's good but I don't think that's who he is.
If the other guard is a freshman....he's gotta be really good! If he's from the portal he needs to be able to defend, make free throws and get the team in an offense. Cooper can't do that.
Who we gonna be? I don't know...but I think it looks like we are trying to be good with freshmen
who develop.
Again, the pieces gotta fit together. Can't just add guys to add guys. Guys gotta fill roles.
Whatever we are doing, we gotta do it better.
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You're sounding like an old Hewlett-Packard commercial saying "What if..." Unfounded speculation leads to unfounded fears and assertions.
 



Congratulations to Richard, but seriously.....look at the schedule they've played. Their only quality win is vs. St. Mary's. I'd argue the Gophers would be close to the same record if we played the same schedule.
 

bga1 said:
Totally untrue. He went out and got Lil Dre who was a major difference maker and convinced Mo Walker to lose 50 pounds and become a solid Big Ten center. Also brought in the good three point shooter from Milwaukee who was a very good 6th man.
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That’s essentially saying Tubby Smith inherited his entire career and livelihood to Rick Pitino leaving Kentucky for the NBA and gifting him a stacked team (which he slowly did a 180 with until parting ways)…and now is at High Point.
 
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cheeseheadgophfan said:
Congratulations to Richard, but seriously.....look at the schedule they've played. Their only quality win is vs. St. Mary's. I'd argue the Gophers would be close to the same record if we played the same schedule.
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They must have had a real easy schedule.
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
Congratulations to Richard, but seriously.....look at the schedule they've played. Their only quality win is vs. St. Mary's. I'd argue the Gophers would be close to the same record if we played the same schedule.
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So are you saying the Gophers should drop out of the BGT and join the Mountain West?
 



They are ranked 18 because they are 11-0.
Of the 11, they've only played 2 road games.
They are 7-0 in quad 4 games (more than any other team on the list).
My point stands.....their schedule has sucked so far.
 



Bob_Loblaw said:
Ben's only decent players are ones he stole from other programs.
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Stole? Pretty harsh. I don’t think he stole any players and I think he has some good, if inexperienced, players he recruited. It’s way too early to condemn freshmen as not being any good. We are what we are now. No need to be pollyanish, but we can tone down the extreme rhetoric some.

If the portal is stealing players, that’s the name of the game now.
 

Holy Man said:
Stole? Pretty harsh. I don’t think he stole any players and I think he has some good, if inexperienced, players he recruited. It’s way too early to condemn freshmen as not being any good. We are what we are now. No need to be pollyanish, but we can tone down the extreme rhetoric some.

If the portal is stealing players, that’s the name of the game now.
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That was implied in the post Bob was replying to:
MennoSota said:
Clearly Ben isn't doing it your way. If he fails, then perhaps you'll get your wish and someone who comes in can act like a pirate and steal kids from other programs to come join Minnesota.
 

GopherBlood666 said:
That was implied in the post Bob was replying to:
MennoSota said:
Clearly Ben isn't doing it your way. If he fails, then perhaps you'll get your wish and someone who comes in can act like a pirate and steal kids from other programs to come join Minnesota.
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Got it. Previous post was on ignore. Stand corrected.
 

Holy Man said:
Stole? Pretty harsh. I don’t think he stole any players and I think he has some good, if inexperienced, players he recruited. It’s way too early to condemn freshmen as not being any good. We are what we are now. No need to be pollyanish, but we can tone down the extreme rhetoric some.

If the portal is stealing players, that’s the name of the game now.
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I don't think the portal is bad, I was using the other posters word "stole". I'm all for building through the portal and I don't think it's stealing.
 

cheeseheadgophfan said:
They are ranked 18 because they are 11-0.
Of the 11, they've only played 2 road games.
They are 7-0 in quad 4 games (more than any other team on the list).
My point stands.....their schedule has sucked so far.
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They are now 12-0. The Gonzaga of the Mountain West.
 

jblass said:
They are now 12-0. The Gonzaga of the Mountain West.
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He’s got a good team. Lots of free flowing and two really good guards who are allowed a lot of freedom. It’s kind of high risk high reward style though. To make tournament from Mountain West will require a top two finish and for them probably winning either the regular season championship or tournament championship. Still a long way to go.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Ben's only decent players are ones he stole from other programs.
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So you're already giving up on all of our freshmen before the conference season even starts? And you're giving up on Evans, Christie, & Betts?

I seriously think that you (and others) need to quit going-to & watching the games. You need to calm down...just check the box scores, look for progress from the freshmen, and think big picture.
 

SelectionSunday said:
I’m curious what your reasons are for not thinking Johnny Tauer is the right coach for Saint Thomas. Last year you intimated on several occasions that UST should go get someone better. I think you even had someone specific in mind?

I’ve been a season ticket holder at UST these first two years in D1, and what I’ve observed is Tauer knows what he’s doing, there’s a clear plan, his team plays with great effort, and they play a brand of basketball that is fun to watch.
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Actually think and thought Tauer is a really good coach and the perfect coach to transition but to become a Marquette type success I did have someone in mind. Just not at liberty to discuss. Perhaps Tauer can be the one to get them there. He is a fantastic teacher and evaluator. Can he recruit well enough to build a power ? For the record I hope it is him. I do have doubts but have been wrong many times before.
 

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