Championship Coaches Know More Than Hack Writer (Reusse)

[alchemy2u]

First off, it's possible for a father to provide a solid analysis of his son's strengths and weaknesses, even when fatherly bias is taken into account. In addition, to use Donovan's connection to Rick Pitino as a reason for him to be disingenuous in his description of Richard Pitino as a coach seems like a cop out from a frustrated fan. Richard is young and relatively inexperienced as a head coach. That doesn't preclude him from being well prepared. He has, and will continue, to make mistakes as he learns on the job.

I didn't see anything that Rick Pitino or Billy Donovan said that I didn't already believe after watching the first two seasons under Richard Pitino. The coach seems to understand the game and has a vision for what he wants from his team. Currently, he is trying to implement a system on the court with (primarily) inherited players who aren't really well suited to that system. He seems to be recruiting new players who will better fit that system (Mason, McBrayer, Konate, etc.), and time will tell if he'll be successful in judging and developing talent and winning games.

In the first two years this team has won some games against superior teams (Michigan State this year is an example), and they've also looked lost on the court at times. I won't give Richard Pitino 100% of the credit or blame for either of these things, as the players are ultimately responsible for how well they execute what the coach is asking of them.

At this point, I'm willing to give Richard Pitino the next 2-3 years to recruit and develop players that fit the type of game and system he wants to play, and determine from there whether he can be successful through how competitive the team is, and overall wins & losses.

Excellent response. We all need to give it some time in order to change direction. Nobody seems to have any patience anymore, quite a few of the great basketball coaches had rough starts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cjbfbp]

First off, it's possible for a father to provide a solid analysis of his son's strengths and weaknesses, even when fatherly bias is taken into account. In addition, to use Donovan's connection to Rick Pitino as a reason for him to be disingenuous in his description of Richard Pitino as a coach seems like a cop out from a frustrated fan. Richard is young and relatively inexperienced as a head coach. That doesn't preclude him from being well prepared. He has, and will continue, to make mistakes as he learns on the job.

Whether it's possible or not is not the point. Those reviews aren't from independent voices, their support is entirely predictable, and these sources should be given little weight. There's is a presidential campaign coming soon and I can assure you that I will take a similar attitude about anything the Clinton or Bush families say about Hillary Clinton or Jeb Bush.

Billy Donovan will always find something good to say about Richard Pitino in public. To do otherwise would show disrespect to the family of a man who has given him a lot. It should also be remembered that Billy Donovan didn't spend this past season watching the Gophers.

 

[Dr.Don]

Everyone wants their team to be undefeated and National Champs, or the Coach is a bum. Sheesh!!!

 

[short ornery norwegian]

Everyone wants their team to be undefeated and National Champs, or the Coach is a bum. Sheesh!!!

Doc - with all due respect - there is still room for a middle-ground approach. I don't think Pitino is the greatest coach of all time, and I don't think he's the worst coach of all time. He's somewhere in the middle, and the next couple of years will tell whether he's above or below the basketball equivalent of the Mendoza line.

All I can offer is my opinion, and I saw a team this season that had a lot of problems. How much of that hangs on the coach, and how much hangs on the players is hard to tell unless you were at every practice or in the locker room. We're all on the outside looking in, and forming our own opinions. I know there are people who think Konate and Gaston have a lot of potential - I'm not as enthusiastic about them, but I'll watch the team play next year and make up my own mind. Likewise about the quality of the incoming recruits.

 

[The Brain Trust]

Bo Ryan does just fine without elite recruits....it is called coaching.

 

[scher215]

Bo Ryan does just fine without elite recruits....it is called coaching.

Yeah Bronson Koening and Sam Dekker weren't elite recruits. I don't think they even played HS basketball. Jon Leur was also a pretty terrible recruit and Nigel Hayes didn't have a single other HM offer. Real magician that Bo Ryan.

 

[Unregistered User]

Yeah Bronson Koening and Sam Dekker weren't elite recruits. I don't think they even played HS basketball. Jon Leur was also a pretty terrible recruit and Nigel Hayes didn't have a single other HM offer. Real magician that Bo Ryan.

Just never respond to Brain Rust. He's a trolling moron.

 

[cjbfbp]

Yeah Bronson Koening and Sam Dekker weren't elite recruits. I don't think they even played HS basketball. Jon Leur was also a pretty terrible recruit and Nigel Hayes didn't have a single other HM offer. Real magician that Bo Ryan.

Actually, Nigel Hayes wasn't a truly "elite" rated recruit. As for the others, you've mentioned three players over about 14 or 15 years. Devin Harris wasn't Bo's recruit. Compare the national recognition of Bo's recruits to Crean's recruits and then compare their respective results with the players they've recruited. So I would say, yes, Bo Ryan is a bit of a magician.

 

[cjbfbp]

He's a trolling moron.

Translation: "I don't like what he says, but I'm too dumb, lazy, and inarticulate to formulate a cogent reply."

 

[scher215]

Actually, Nigel Hayes wasn't a truly "elite" rated recruit. As for the others, you've mentioned three players over about 14 or 15 years. Devin Harris wasn't Bo's recruit. Compare the national recognition of Bo's recruits to Crean's recruits and then compare their respective results with the players they've recruited. So I would say, yes, Bo Ryan is a bit of a magician.

I don't recall if we ever defined "elite" did we? Are we talking one and done players? Well then no, Wisconsin whiffs on those. Or are we talking a minimum of a 4 star rating? Because the Badgers get quite a few of those, despite the fancy narrative folks try to spin about this rag tag group of one star recruits defeating the odds.

I had a thread on here previously that Bo and Tubby were both getting about the same amount of "wins per star" as each other. The difference being, Bo had a lot higher rates recruits to win with. So "Bo coaches up talentless losers" is a complete myth.

 

[El Amin Fan]

Actually, Nigel Hayes wasn't a truly "elite" rated recruit. As for the others, you've mentioned three players over about 14 or 15 years. Devin Harris wasn't Bo's recruit. Compare the national recognition of Bo's recruits to Crean's recruits and then compare their respective results with the players they've recruited. So I would say, yes, Bo Ryan is a bit of a magician.

Butch was McDy's AA and never played like one in college. Does the Magician get heat for that?

Steisma was highly recruited.

 

[dpodoll68]

Translation: "I don't like what he says, but I'm too dumb, lazy, and inarticulate to formulate a cogent reply."

No, it's the fact that most of what he says is either an exaggeration, misleading, or an outright lie, and that he purposefully posts inflammatory nonsense to garner responses.

Also, I'm pretty sure that Unregistered User has the ability to speak.

 

[cjbfbp]

Butch was McDy's AA and never played like one in college. Does the Magician get heat for that?

Steisma was highly recruited.

Of course, everything counts, but no one hits on all players recruited. As far as Steimsma, he did get some NBA time and was a pretty fair blue collar enforcer type, but he was a fairly limited player. Guys his size frequently tend to be highly rated even when they are more limited players than their smaller brethren. Another obvious example would be Adam Woodbury (a top 50 player) although Steimsma was better than him.

 

[cjbfbp]

I don't recall if we ever defined "elite" did we? Are we talking one and done players? Well then no, Wisconsin whiffs on those. Or are we talking a minimum of a 4 star rating? Because the Badgers get quite a few of those, despite the fancy narrative folks try to spin about this rag tag group of one star recruits defeating the odds.

I had a thread on here previously that Bo and Tubby were both getting about the same amount of "wins per star" as each other. The difference being, Bo had a lot higher rates recruits to win with. So "Bo coaches up talentless losers" is a complete myth.

I don't hear anyone saying he transforms "one-star" recruits. Obviously, a coach at this level needs to recruit fairly high level D1 talent to succeed, but Ryan's results probably rank Wisconsin in the top five or six programs in the nation for this century. I don't think he's recruited top five or six talent over that time period.

I'm not familiar with your comparative analysis of Bo vs. Tubby but I suspect it was flawed and didn't cover a very long time period.

As far as "four star" recruits, ESPN claims that we have three of them entering this fall so that rating, at least by ESPN, must not be too parsimoniously assigned. I hope they show that promise as freshman.

 

[Unregistered User]

Translation: "I don't like what he says, but I'm too dumb, lazy, and inarticulate to formulate a cogent reply."

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.

 

[bc2211]

Butch was McDy's AA and never played like one in college. Does the Magician get heat for that?

Steisma was highly recruited.

Considering that Butch was featured on a team ranked in the top ten for much of his junior and senior season, I'm going to say no he does not get heat for that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[scher215]

I don't hear anyone saying he transforms "one-star" recruits. Obviously, a coach at this level needs to recruit fairly high level D1 talent to succeed, but Ryan's results probably rank Wisconsin in the top five or six programs in the nation for this century. I don't think he's recruited top five or six talent over that time period.

Disagree they'd be top 5 or 6, could understand an argument of top 10-15. Too many other schools with multiple final fours and/or titles.

I'm not familiar with your comparative analysis of Bo vs. Tubby but I suspect it was flawed and didn't cover a very long time period.

for your reading pleasure. It isn't perfect, so I appreciate you acknowledging that from the beginning. As far as time frame it covers the years Tubby was a coach at MN. My recollection was a little off, but essentially Bo had a more highly rated team than Tubby every year Tubby was here. Tubby out-coached Bo years 1 and 2, and Bo won years 3-5. We were in the middle of year 6 when I did this. A funny thing though, I used this to project each team's conference record that season (2012-2013) and guess what!

Based on years 1-5, this would project that the Gophers will finish Big10 play with a record of 8-10 and the Badgers will finish with a record of 12-6.

Matched the actual record exactly Sorry, just a little shameless pat on the back for myself where I pretend how all knowing I am.

http://www.forums.gopherhole.com/bo...yth-Busters-Does-Bo-Ryan-REALLY-win-with-less

As far as "four star" recruits, ESPN claims that we have three of them entering this fall so that rating, at least by ESPN, must not be too parsimoniously assigned. I hope they show that promise as freshman.

I typically use Rivals, Badgers will have two 4-star players next year and the Gophers zero.