All Things Class of 2015 Recruiting - Class Finally Complete? Nope Chris Obekpa visit

Donate To GopherHole

Might be noteworthy that Jamall Gregory committed to South Carolina today. Werent him and Ellison throwing around the idea of going to school together?
 

sconnygopher said:
Might be noteworthy that Jamall Gregory committed to South Carolina today. Werent him and Ellison throwing around the idea of going to school together?
Click to expand...
No that was Traci Carter who committed to Marquette a few weeks ago. It wasn't much talk of them going to the same school either Ellison was asked about it in an interview and just said that would be cool and that was about all there was.
 

Recruiting

PTalberg said:
Jarvis, Sacar Anim, Bjorn Broman, and Marshawn Wilson were the others in the top 5.
Click to expand...

People rag on Gopher coaches for not recruiting well and say the state has sooo much talent. These are evidently Minnesota's 5 best seniors. The Minnesota pool of talent is typically very thin. Last year Minnesota happened to have 4 really nice once in a 100 year recruits in the same class. This year...not so much even if you add the Wisconsin commit. A group of players with limitations either academically, or size, or can't shoot ... for the most part. And the winner is going to Nebraska Omaha.
 

60's Guy said:
People rag on Gopher coaches for not recruiting well and say the state has sooo much talent. These are evidently Minnesota's 5 best seniors. The Minnesota pool of talent is typically very thin. Last year Minnesota happened to have 4 really nice once in a 100 year recruits in the same class. This year...not so much even if you add the Wisconsin commit. A group of players with limitations either academically, or size, or can't shoot ... for the most part. And the winner is going to Nebraska Omaha.
Click to expand...

Illikainen and Johnson are top recruits in any class, i wouldn't consider this a bad class at all, the top players in the next couple of years are very good.
 


jovs said:
Illikainen and Johnson are top recruits in any class, i wouldn't consider this a bad class at all, the top players in the next couple of years are very good.
Click to expand...


I don't know that much about the 2015 Minnesota class because I don't pay attention to high school ball, but I have watched Vaughn, Jones, and Travis in college this year. Do you really think Illikainen and Johnson are as good as those three?
 



Frink said:
His name does seem to get buried. We've certainly been on him for a long time so who knows? Maybe that will pay off for us.
Click to expand...

I would personally like us to get this kid. Feel like Cincinnati or Xavier will be tough to beat out though. Who knows thought, biggest thing is getting him here on a visit
 



cjbfbp said:
I don't know that much about the 2015 Minnesota class because I don't pay attention to high school ball, but I have watched Vaughn, Jones, and Travis in college this year. Do you really think Illikainen and Johnson are as good as those three?
Click to expand...

Not nearly as good as last years but not mince meat either, at this point Minnesota just isn't going to get top 25 recruits in state or not, I think they are both very solid high division 1 players though, if you have two of that caliber every year I don't think you can call the talent pool bad.
 

Compared to what?

jovs said:
Not nearly as good as last years but not mince meat either, at this point Minnesota just isn't going to get top 25 recruits in state or not, I think they are both very solid high division 1 players though, if you have two of that caliber every year I don't think you can call the talent pool bad.
Click to expand...

Indiana 14, Illinois 15, Wi 9, Maryland 8, Ohio 9, Pennsylvania 8, D1 recruits in those states and just because there are ONLY 2 or 3 each year in Minnesota almost means you HAVE to recruit them, even if you don't like their abilities for what you look for or need. And if you miss you are villified. And, If you do get a guy from MN you aren't that excited about because he is local and but you needed a precedence for future recruits that's an issue....does it help? So, 2 or 3 in a pool has lot's of issues. Your percentage has to be 50% to get one of two. Not a likely closing rate.

If we live here we generally like it here but we still complain. But to recruit someone to endure winter can't be easy.
Florida 32, TX 22, GA 22, Tenn 10, AL 9 D1 recruits...I'd think the thought is "I believe in my abilities to recruit...I can out recruit the competition" if I coached in those states versus first out recruiting the competition and then convincing the recruit MN is a great place to live on top of that and oh by the way after you graduate we'll have a new practice facility and oh, we like our arena the way it is here.

All I'm saying is...history says it's hard to recruit here for the last 20 years. I respect the people picking Mr Basketball...how "high division 1" can you be if you are not the MR Bkb winner in the state of MN in 2015? Neither
of those guys is going to turn the program around. Last years 4 guys had that ability in helping Minnesota rise up.
Coffey might, but that's one guy again in the state. Limited choices...if it's 1,2 or 3 players and even more so if those players have limitations. Difficult place to recruit history says.
 


60's Guy said:
Indiana 14, Illinois 15, Wi 9, Maryland 8, Ohio 9, Pennsylvania 8, D1 recruits in those states and just because there are ONLY 2 or 3 each year in Minnesota almost means you HAVE to recruit them, even if you don't like their abilities for what you look for or need. And if you miss you are villified. And, If you do get a guy from MN you aren't that excited about because he is local and but you needed a precedence for future recruits that's an issue....does it help? So, 2 or 3 in a pool has lot's of issues. Your percentage has to be 50% to get one of two. Not a likely closing rate.

If we live here we generally like it here but we still complain. But to recruit someone to endure winter can't be easy.
Florida 32, TX 22, GA 22, Tenn 10, AL 9 D1 recruits...I'd think the thought is "I believe in my abilities to recruit...I can out recruit the competition" if I coached in those states versus first out recruiting the competition and then convincing the recruit MN is a great place to live on top of that and oh by the way after you graduate we'll have a new practice facility and oh, we like our arena the way it is here.

All I'm saying is...history says it's hard to recruit here for the last 20 years. I respect the people picking Mr Basketball...how "high division 1" can you be if you are not the MR Bkb winner in the state of MN in 2015? Neither
of those guys is going to turn the program around. Last years 4 guys had that ability in helping Minnesota rise up.
Coffey might, but that's one guy again in the state. Limited choices...if it's 1,2 or 3 players and even more so if those players have limitations. Difficult place to recruit history says.
Click to expand...

Good info there 60's. The one thing that is different about Minnesota is that it is the only major basketball program in the state.Divide those recruits in other states by the number of D1 programs and you have a fairer comparison. This could be a great job-easily top 20 even for recruiting if someone can get this thing rebuilt in the right way. Part of the recruiting issue is that the program has taken so many black eyes over the past 50 years. Every time it builds a head of steam- something happens. Put the facility in place, with a coach who can recruit and this is a great job. Pitino is capable of it and I hope he stays.
 



<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Go Gophers!!
 

60's Guy said:
Indiana 14, Illinois 15, Wi 9, Maryland 8, Ohio 9, Pennsylvania 8, D1 recruits in those states and just because there are ONLY 2 or 3 each year in Minnesota almost means you HAVE to recruit them, even if you don't like their abilities for what you look for or need. And if you miss you are villified. And, If you do get a guy from MN you aren't that excited about because he is local and but you needed a precedence for future recruits that's an issue....does it help? So, 2 or 3 in a pool has lot's of issues. Your percentage has to be 50% to get one of two. Not a likely closing rate.

If we live here we generally like it here but we still complain. But to recruit someone to endure winter can't be easy.
Florida 32, TX 22, GA 22, Tenn 10, AL 9 D1 recruits...I'd think the thought is "I believe in my abilities to recruit...I can out recruit the competition" if I coached in those states versus first out recruiting the competition and then convincing the recruit MN is a great place to live on top of that and oh by the way after you graduate we'll have a new practice facility and oh, we like our arena the way it is here.

All I'm saying is...history says it's hard to recruit here for the last 20 years. I respect the people picking Mr Basketball...how "high division 1" can you be if you are not the MR Bkb winner in the state of MN in 2015? Neither
of those guys is going to turn the program around. Last years 4 guys had that ability in helping Minnesota rise up.
Coffey might, but that's one guy again in the state. Limited choices...if it's 1,2 or 3 players and even more so if those players have limitations. Difficult place to recruit history says.
Click to expand...

I am not going to spend to much of my time disproving this post. Where are you getting your numbers from? For 2015, Wisconsin has four kids committed to high major schools in Stone, Ellenson, and Pritzl according to 247. They will have a 5th if/when someone takes a chance on Noskowiak. This was a unique year for Wisconsin basketball in the manner that last year was a unique one for Minnesota (Big 3 in Minnesota vs Stone/Ellenson in Wisconsin). There's good talent in Wisconsin, but there's also good talent in Minnesota. Both states have done a nice job of producing basketball talent based on the size of the respective states.

I don't think anyone who has said their is good talent in Minnesota ever said that it produces the same amount of talent (or even close) to Illinois, Indiana, Maryland, Ohio, or Pennsylvania. That said, I count 9 players in Indiana that will definitely play high major basketball next year (two more will if they have can qualify which is unknown right now). According to 247, the top kid is undecided, the second kid is going to Illinois and the 4th kid is going to Cal. You have to get down to Ryan Cline who's 6th to find a kid who's staying in Indiana and he's going to Purdue. Cline is ranked similarly to Jarvis Johnson. Now for the sake of argument, lets say that 10 high major kids is about normal for Indiana and 4 high major kids is about where Minnesota is at. In Indiana, you have Indiana, Notre Dame, Purdue, and now Butler who is also recruiting like a high major. The fact that they have more talent than Minnesota is indisputable, but for a kid that wants to stay home..he's got four legit options.

It's also false that Minnesota "has to recruit" any high major kid in the state. It was just a month or so ago that Sacar Anim committed to Marquette without a Gopher offer. In recent history, Wisconsin has taken Jordan Taylor, Mike Buresewitz, and Riley Dearring as Minnesota kids who were not offered by the Gophers. I can remember as far back as the Clem days when the Gophers didn't offer Nick Horvath and he went to Duke!

The state of Minnesota definitely went through a lull post Royce/Rodney, but the Gophers also failed to identify some kids who were definitely high major talents (not that I blame them, but Bo/Wisconsin has been much better in this area of identifying under the radar guys) like Muscala, Wolters, Alec Brown, etc.

It also hasn't always been a lack of talent that's held Minnesota back from being more successful but coaching and other issues. Their was a ton of talent on campus at Minnesota during the Tubby era, that wasn't the issue with why this team struggled during his tenure. It's not remembered as clearly, but their was also talent on the roster at times when Monson was the coach. A front line of Bauer/Rickert/Holman (all Minnesota kids by the way) should have been a tournament team. Monson later took a team with Kris Humphries, Adam Boone, Mo Hargrow (and at this point a limited Mike Bauer) and somehow went 3-13 in conference play.

Not going to respond to the "Mr. Basketball" stuff as I don't find it relevant. It's a high school award that has much more to do with how someone performs in high school than how they will perform in college.
 

Boucher won JUCO player of the year.

<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

You see what you see

EG#9 said:
I am not going to spend to much of my time disproving this post. Where are you getting your numbers from? For 2015, Wisconsin has four kids committed to high major schools in Stone, Ellenson, and Pritzl according to 247. They will have a 5th if/when someone takes a chance on Noskowiak. This was a unique year for Wisconsin basketball in the manner that last year was a unique one for Minnesota (Big 3 in Minnesota vs Stone/Ellenson in Wisconsin). There's good talent in Wisconsin, but there's also good talent in Minnesota. Both states have done a nice job of producing basketball talent based on the size of the respective states.

I don't think anyone who has said their is good talent in Minnesota ever said that it produces the same amount of talent (or even close) to Illinois, Indiana, Maryland, Ohio, or Pennsylvania. That said, I count 9 players in Indiana that will definitely play high major basketball next year (two more will if they have can qualify which is unknown right now). According to 247, the top kid is undecided, the second kid is going to Illinois and the 4th kid is going to Cal. You have to get down to Ryan Cline who's 6th to find a kid who's staying in Indiana and he's going to Purdue. Cline is ranked similarly to Jarvis Johnson. Now for the sake of argument, lets say that 10 high major kids is about normal for Indiana and 4 high major kids is about where Minnesota is at. In Indiana, you have Indiana, Notre Dame, Purdue, and now Butler who is also recruiting like a high major. The fact that they have more talent than Minnesota is indisputable, but for a kid that wants to stay home..he's got four legit options.

It's also false that Minnesota "has to recruit" any high major kid in the state. It was just a month or so ago that Sacar Anim committed to Marquette without a Gopher offer. In recent history, Wisconsin has taken Jordan Taylor, Mike Buresewitz, and Riley Dearring as Minnesota kids who were not offered by the Gophers. I can remember as far back as the Clem days when the Gophers didn't offer Nick Horvath and he went to Duke!

The state of Minnesota definitely went through a lull post Royce/Rodney, but the Gophers also failed to identify some kids who were definitely high major talents (not that I blame them, but Bo/Wisconsin has been much better in this area of identifying under the radar guys) like Muscala, Wolters, Alec Brown, etc.

It also hasn't always been a lack of talent that's held Minnesota back from being more successful but coaching and other issues. Their was a ton of talent on campus at Minnesota during the Tubby era, that wasn't the issue with why this team struggled during his tenure. It's not remembered as clearly, but their was also talent on the roster at times when Monson was the coach. A front line of Bauer/Rickert/Holman (all Minnesota kids by the way) should have been a tournament team. Monson later took a team with Kris Humphries, Adam Boone, Mo Hargrow (and at this point a limited Mike Bauer) and somehow went 3-13 in conference play.

Not going to respond to the "Mr. Basketball" stuff as I don't find it relevant. It's a high school award that has much more to do with how someone performs in high school than how they will perform in college.
Click to expand...

and I don't agree with you...so cool. Just a couple things...Indiana has 9 or 10 candidates...MN has 2,3,4....for me to recruit an Indiana kid in Indiana I have 9 or 10 different families to hear my pitch. In Minnesota, I have 2,3,4. The percentages is less. No matter where the player is from you have to out recruit all the other coaches from every where. No difference. The point is, you should have some inside track on in state players for lots of reasons if you've laid the groundwork. and we only have 2,3,4 to pitch.

And was Tubby criticized for not recruiting some of the players who left the state w/o him recruiting them?
And did he lose his job? Yeah, you don't "have to recruit" them when there's only 2,3,4. Bull

If your logic had any merit...why did 29 coaches turn down the Minnesota job before we got to Richard?

And if the Mr Basketball winner going to Nebraska Omaha isn't relevant then you project him differently than everyone else. Going to Wisconsin is different than going to Marquette. The only Big Ten team to offer Sacar was NW. Marquette was his best offer along with Northern Iowa. It all speaks to original premise that each year our talent pool is amazing...it's not.
 

...why did 29 coaches turn down the Minnesota job before we got to Richard?

Seriously?
 

The best basketball programs do three things. Hire a great coach, he recruits to at least a regional sphere, and he develops them. That last part must be done with the emphasis on fundamentals and defense especially when your building. There just not a brand here. That takes the right Coach some time. we simply do not know about Pitino yet. Great coaches should get their team to the tournament by year 4. Recruiting takes a long time to build a stronghold. The whole time your trying for players many other schools want. Many of those schools have fantastic selling points that others do not. When your building you need to find a few that are under the radar like a Jordan Taylor. or like Bennett found at WSU with Low and Weaver who virtually had no offers and became all pac 10. Or Harris at UVA who had very few schools interested and he becomes a force. Whichita St. does a great job of this. Super hard jobs require extraordinary coaches and you will just have to wait to find out if Pitino is that. IF he can not get a top 5 finish in the conference here by year 4 then he probably is not extraordinary.
 


EG#9 said:
I am not going to spend to much of my time disproving this post. Where are you getting your numbers from? For 2015, Wisconsin has four kids committed to high major schools in Stone, Ellenson, and Pritzl according to 247. They will have a 5th if/when someone takes a chance on Noskowiak.
Click to expand...

The fourth you're not listing above is probably Heldt. Also, there are others who have moved around.. Travon Bunch is committed to South Carolina; Damontrae Jefferson is a stud - what will become of him?

Lots of nice MM 2015's as well.. NIU with Key & Bradley.. Drake has a couple including Billy Wampler.. Cody Schwartz to SJSU.. many others..

Anyway, I agree with your post -- Minnesota doesn't have to recruit any high major kid from the state. They need to bring in great players that fit. Can be done in various ways.
 

Sorry it's not 9 it's 10 WI recruits

Gopher Warrior said:
The fourth you're not listing above is probably Heldt. Also, there are others who have moved around.. Travon Bunch is committed to South Carolina; Damontrae Jefferson is a stud - what will become of him?

Lots of nice MM 2015's as well.. NIU with Key & Bradley.. Drake has a couple including Billy Wampler.. Cody Schwartz to SJSU.. many others..

Anyway, I agree with your post -- Minnesota doesn't have to recruit any high major kid from the state. They need to bring in great players that fit. Can be done in various ways.
Click to expand...

And if you add Bunch and Jefferson it's 12 from Wisconsin. I understood EG's main point to be we have ample stellar prospects in Minnesota each year. That's my argument, we don't. Obviously, we need to recruit the world to be successful in Minnesota. Also, my point.
And the Gophers recruited Sacar...they didn't offer...very different than not recruiting him at all. Different than the past.
 

Personally, I like the idea of Pitino going out to the east coast for players. Talent wise, you could compare east coast basketball with the state of hockey. The kids grow up in the sport there, they play on the street there, they compete against the best there. And the east coast, like the state of hockey, produces by far the most collegiate players every year.
If the Gophers can even attract their second tier kids, we'll be pretty good.
 

beat bucky said:
Personally, I like the idea of Pitino going out to the east coast for players. Talent wise, you could compare east coast basketball with the state of hockey. The kids grow up in the sport there, they play on the street there, they compete against the best there. And the east coast, like the state of hockey, produces by far the most collegiate players every year.
If the Gophers can even attract their second tier kids, we'll be pretty good.
Click to expand...



I agree totally....

my 2 cents...
I still contend that Sacar was a big miss and if Marshawn qualifies he is also a huge miss.
Love getting east coast players tho.
 

beat bucky said:
Personally, I like the idea of Pitino going out to the east coast for players. Talent wise, you could compare east coast basketball with the state of hockey. The kids grow up in the sport there, they play on the street there, they compete against the best there. And the east coast, like the state of hockey, produces by far the most collegiate players every year.
If the Gophers can even attract their second tier kids, we'll be pretty good.
Click to expand...

Grasshopper, do you really think recruits from Chicago are any different?
 



Talented but character issues. No one knows exactly what the issues are though.
 


60's Guy said:
And if you add Bunch and Jefferson it's 12 from Wisconsin. I understood EG's main point to be we have ample stellar prospects in Minnesota each year. That's my argument, we don't. Obviously, we need to recruit the world to be successful in Minnesota. Also, my point.
And the Gophers recruited Sacar...they didn't offer...very different than not recruiting him at all. Different than the past.
Click to expand...

I'll make this my last response, because your posts have been at best intellectually dishonest and at worst... I missed on Bunch because he's a 5th year kid who is currently at a prep school in North Carolina as is Jefferson who currently is not committed anywhere and may or may not end up at a high major. I used 247 to look up recruits and as such they have Bunch listed in North Carolina and not Wisconsin, even though he's a Wisconsin kid. I am not going to take my time to find out if there are any kids from Minnesota playing a 5th year at a prep school this year and are going to a high major. Someone like Ryan James probably knows the answer to this.

In your original post, and again in this one, you use numbers like 9,10,11 and 12 for Wisconsin while using numbers like 1,2, and 3 for Minnesota. You did a similar thing with Indiana from my (brief) research as well. The problem here is that you are taking every kid from Wisconsin who has committed to any D-1 school and comparing them to kids from Minnesota who are going to HIGH MAJOR D-1 schools. I was trying to get you down the road of comparing apples to apples, but you haven't acknowledged that. I can name 8 kids off the top of my head that have committed to D-1 schools from Minnesota this year, so the numbers 1,2, or 3 have no validity unless you just want to talk HIGH MAJOR commitments.

My point certainly is not that Minnesota produces talent on the level of an Indiana, Ohio, Illinois, or Maryland (states you mentioned previously) but that it produces a good amount of talent relative to its population similar to a Wisconsin (which also does a good job). The Gophers haven't struggled because the state of Minnesota doesn't produce enough talent and the overall talent that's come through the program (in state and out of state) since Clem left has been good enough to produce much better results than we've actually seen.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom