Wow...Happy Valley = Thug Valley!

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dinkything said:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...2073672561402.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopSto ries

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The question I've had remains... if PSU ('win with honor'?) would be willing to look the other way on this horrifically tragic situation since 2002? 1998? 1994? earlier?????....and look the other way on countless other 'stuff', then would they also have been willing to look the other way on a booster's hundred dollar handshake involving a destitute student-athlete from the projects of Philadelphia, or from the rural South?
 

dinkything said:
The question I've had remains... if PSU ('win with honor'?) would be willing to look the other way on this horrifically tragic situation since 2002? 1998? 1994? earlier?????....and look the other way on countless other 'stuff', then would they also have been willing to look the other way on a booster's hundred dollar handshake involving a destitute student-athlete from the projects of Philadelphia, or from the rural South?
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Or rural Pennsylvania?
 

A coach lobbying to minimize the punishments for his players??? Alert the media!!!
 

dpodoll68 said:
A coach lobbying to minimize the punishments for his players??? Alert the media!!!
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Actually, the media was alerted. :cool02:

I never really liked Penn State, and I never really cared about Joe Pa. I always felt kind of bad about it (always felt you were supposed to love Joe and respect the program), but I couldn't shake the feeling that they were always full of it. I never could have imagined the Sandusky situation, but I guess I always felt that they weren't as squeaky clean as "they" always claimed to be.

I know that if you look hard enough every program would look dirty to some extent. But I do feel like my gut feeling was right on the money about them as more news comes to light.
 


With the heads that have already rolled over there I think a lot more stuff like this may come out of the woodwork. I am sure JoePa was basically a god at Penn State and people were probably scared to go up against him in any way. We have all seen how powerful head coaches are and the way they are treated by administrations. Add into that the fact that JoePa had been there forever and you can see how it could lead to a situation where there was very little administrative control over what was happening with the football team.

Penn State has had a very good reputation to this point. It is a shame to see the way it is being torn apart, that being said if all the stuff in regards to Sandusky or the way Paterno was doing things turns out to be true then they deserve to see their reputation ripped to shreds.

Kind of makes me wonder sometimes if there are actually any truly good people left in college athletics. Or have things become so cut-throat that the only way to make it is by being an a-hole?
 

Unhappy Valley:(

I would imagine they all knew once their cat was out of the bag, more would be coming to light.
 

The confrontations came to a head in 2007, according to one former school official, when six football players were charged by police for forcing their way into a campus apartment that April and beating up several students, one of them severely. That September, following a tense meeting with Mr. Paterno over the case, she resigned her post, saying at the time she left because of "philosophical differences."
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Classy.
 

dpodoll68 said:
A coach lobbying to minimize the punishments for his players??? Alert the media!!!
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Kind of my feeling. I hope Sandusky is brought to justice, but we have to recognize that there will be piling on and this (while certainly not a good thing by any stretch) probably happens in every major college football program.

Paterno is/was a great coach, but he always rubbed me the wrong way, as do most public figures when the media elevates them to demi-god status.
 



It seems JoePa was trying to deal with modern problems using old methods, which I don't have a problem with for minor problems, when the issue becomes rape or assault and you are putting other students at risk then you have to come down hard and the administration should have called his bluff long ago on those things.

I also think the point about letting the law runs it course is logical, but like Mbwake's case you have to have certain requirements in place for the period you are waiting for a trial, whatever the rule is publish it, and apply it consistantly. If a normal student charged in these kinds of cases is forced off campus and out of school while awaiting trial the the same should happen for athletes.
 

jovs said:
It seems JoePa was trying to deal with modern problems using old methods, which I don't have a problem with for minor problems, when the issue becomes rape or assault and you are putting other students at risk then you have to come down hard and the administration should have called his bluff long ago on those things.

I also think the point about letting the law runs it course is logical, but like Mbwake's case you have to have certain requirements in place for the period you are waiting for a trial, whatever the rule is publish it, and apply it consistantly. If a normal student charged in these kinds of cases is forced off campus and out of school while awaiting trial the the same should happen for athletes.
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Very pertinent point and I agree.
 

ESPN had a story about this a couple of years ago. Paterno was questioned at length about not punishing the players who were involved in the assault in 2005. His excuse then was that the boosters want to win and getting aggressive players was one way to do it. Scirrotto, their safety and heralded defensive tough guy was the focal point of the thug player reputation at the time. Basically, we know now paterno ran a scum program and when its all over, his former reputation will turn even farther south.
 

That this occurred at a major football program is hardly news. Hell, that it occurs in less than major programs is hardly news. When I was in college at Moorhead State, I attended several parties in Fargo where NDSU players were involved in major brawls and beatings that went unreported. (that always sucked, because then they cleared the place, and you didn't get as much beer as you'd hoped).

The issue here, is that PSU always tried to project themselves as some kind of holier than thou program with none of the undesirable elements that other programs seemed to have (like Miami for example). The truth is, that PSU under Paterno's iron fist was just better at covering it up.
 



Joe

I think the bashing of Joe specifically, is unwarranted. Joe was freakin 74 in 2001, 74! He was running than, and has continued to "run" the football program. I put "run" in quotes because while Joe may have been the head football coach at Penn State during this time, he has actually just been the figurehead of the program for the last 10-15 years. His involvement in the day to day operations has been limited at best. Prior to the last 10-15 years Penn State was everything they were billed as, and that is when Paterno was actually running the ship, and directly involved. I dont think you can blame Joe in this terrible situation, or as much as many are doing.

In continuing on with his age, tell me how a 74 year old would do running a corporation, or even just a typical business at that age. He is going to struggle. Penn State is a big time football program, lets be honest, a 74 year old individual will not run a large program successfully across the board. Yet Penn State had a resurgence in the last 10 years. I guarantee you this resurgence in relevance was not due to Joe Pa, but due to others within the program taking the reigns, and Joe taking a back seat in all areas, expect the role of the figurehead of the program, which he has continued to be.

I just think we should all give Joe a second look before casting him off with the other sick individuals in this episode. And those that are saying they didnt like Joe because he came off as bigger than lifer or what ever, my response is that Joe didnt create this bigger than life persona, it was the media and the fans who did.
 

Whoa!!!!! If that is the case victor04, how many victories should we subtract from Paterno's total and divide among his assistants?

Can't have it both ways. If you're sittin' in the big chair (and continue to sit there), you're responsible for everything both good and bad. I think the other thing in play here is that Paterno rebuffed the PSU administration when they asked him to consider retirement.
 

Isn't it mandatory for every school to have a party-pooper female administrator with a dated haircut on staff to butt heads with the football coaches?
 

If there would have been more "party poopers" at Penn State, Sandusky's party would have ended a lot sooner, and Penn State wouldn't be in this mess.
 

victor04 said:
In continuing on with his age, tell me how a 74 year old would do running a corporation, or even just a typical business at that age.
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Warren Buffet is 81.
John McCain is 75
Walter Zabel is 95 CEO of Cubic
Kirk Kerkorian is 94 President and CEO, Tracinda Corp
Sumner Redstone is 86 Chairman, Viacom, CBS, National Amusements
Alfred Mann is 85 Founder and CEO, MannKind
Bruton Smith is 85 CEO, Sonic Automotive and Speedway Motorsports
T. Boone Pickens is 83
John Bogle is 82 Founder, Vanguard Group
David Murdock is 88 Chairman, Dole Food
Rupert Murdoch is 80
 

victor04 said:
I think the bashing of Joe specifically, is unwarranted. Joe was freakin 74 in 2001, 74! He was running than, and has continued to "run" the football program. I put "run" in quotes because while Joe may have been the head football coach at Penn State during this time, he has actually just been the figurehead of the program for the last 10-15 years. His involvement in the day to day operations has been limited at best. Prior to the last 10-15 years Penn State was everything they were billed as, and that is when Paterno was actually running the ship, and directly involved. I dont think you can blame Joe in this terrible situation, or as much as many are doing.

In continuing on with his age, tell me how a 74 year old would do running a corporation, or even just a typical business at that age. He is going to struggle. Penn State is a big time football program, lets be honest, a 74 year old individual will not run a large program successfully across the board. Yet Penn State had a resurgence in the last 10 years. I guarantee you this resurgence in relevance was not due to Joe Pa, but due to others within the program taking the reigns, and Joe taking a back seat in all areas, expect the role of the figurehead of the program, which he has continued to be.

I just think we should all give Joe a second look before casting him off with the other sick individuals in this episode. And those that are saying they didnt like Joe because he came off as bigger than lifer or what ever, my response is that Joe didnt create this bigger than life persona, it was the media and the fans who did.
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Fine ... but he can't pick and choose. If he's in charge, and his name is at the top then he takes responsibility whether he's 24 or 74 or 104. When he decided he was going to coach this late into life, he assumed responsibility for what those he hired to "run" the program were doing.

On the issue of the thread ... this really is old news. It had been reported several years ago and there had been a fairly substantial media inquiry into the number of arrests at Penn St. And, as posted elsewhere, as disgusting as it may be seeking preferential treatment for college athletes is the norm across college football. I'd wage to say that our very own straight shootin' coach Kill would make a similar lobby if the situation arose. He's principled but not stupid. He and JoePa need(ed) their guys on the field.
 

NateDawgUM said:
Isn't it mandatory for every school to have a party-pooper female administrator with a dated haircut on staff to butt heads with the football coaches?
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Best post I've read in a long time!:clap:
 

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