Will Gray be NFL WR/TE or out of the league?

[Go4theWin]

You can't trust everything ANY coach says. It's their job to instill confidence or develope players by playing them in the games because of upside/ceiling...even when there may be better options.

Again, I love Gray as both a person and NFL caliber athlete but I have never seen him consistently look like a high caliber college QB...even in practice. At the time that was to be expected because IMO he hadn't received adequate coaching. Now? I fully understand why the previous staff had no intent on him ever playing QB after they moved him to WR.

I don't agree that he could NEVER be the big time college QB he was supposed to be. I just think to no fault of his own (multiple coaching and scheme changes)...he ran out of time.

Your absolutely right. I guess I got a little sucked into the coach speak. And got excited about the possibility of him having a Taylor Martinez type passing turnaround.

Well said.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Great sarcasm. And stat, which did nothing to support your view. He's not a running back or a utility player, or some flash in the pan receiver. He's a god damn quarterback.

My opinion was based on the fact that all the reporters and coaches said in fall camp he was accurate with the ball and real decisive. However, this season we haven't see much, if any, change from him on the field. He's a quarterback, he's supposed to throw the football. I'm trusting when Kill says that he looks good in practice running the offense but just doesn't get it done on Gameday. I don't know why he looked so good against Mich State. But's that the kind of game he has to have much more.

And I can't believe people are saying he's a duck out of water in this offense. If this offense isn't the right one for him, maybe he should play for Tubby.

You kinda turned this into a completely different argument. No one projects Gray as a QB in the NFL. "Practice players" don't rush for nearly 1,000 yards on a bad team. They just don't. I don't care what position he plays. Gray is a very good athlete. You don't see players with size and speed very often.

You don't like what the coaches said, and think Gray isn't a very good QB. That's perfectly fine, but has very little to do with the conversation about his chances of making it to the NFL at another position.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

I know you have to get your Gray hatred in, but he was obviously talking about Gray's throwing accuracy. Fumbling has nothing to do with it.

Why do you hate Gray so, so much?

Lighten up, Francis. It was a joke. Nothing wrong with a little levity on a Friday.

I have to admit, I find the criticisms of the two QB's kind of amusing sometimes. Shortell's "dumpster fire" performance that people love to bring up so much from last year:

Mich: 11-for-22 for 104, 0 TD's, 0 INT's, and no turnovers.

Gray had a game very similar to those numbers last year, and it was one of his better ones:

Nebraska: 9-for-18 for 122, 0 TD's and 0 INT's (both games, blow-out losses)

Beside that:

9-for-21 for 124 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT
6-for-14 for 51 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT
8-for-20 for 104 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT

At the end of the day, essentially there's one stat that matters; every one of those games was basically a blow-out loss. Neither QB has led the team to a win on the road against a BCS opponent.

There are 7 games left. I want to see the QB playing who can move the ball, put points on the board, and win games. I don't care which one it is. I would PREFER it was Gray. He's a Senior and supposed to be a team leader. I think his inability to complete forward passes against defenses with BCS talent, paired with an inexperienced O-Line, will make it difficult for him to move the ball consistently.

Gray moved the ball last year, and won two games, when Limegrover basically resigned himself to the fact that Gray has to run to be successful, and all but ditched any effort to move the ball in the air. If that's what has to happen for the Gophers to be successful, I'm TOTALLY AND COMPLETELY fine with that. Perhaps throw enough passes to keep defenses somewhat honest but let's abandon the illusion that he can throw the ball successfully, consistently, against teams with BCS talented players.

I want to see them win games, and I would LOVE it if it were Gray leading the way. He's an enormously gifted athlete, has been a great ambassador for the school during his time there, and it would be awesome to see him lead the team to a bowl game in his last year. That would be PHENOMENAL. Here's hoping it happens. Yes, I will absolutely admit that there's no doubt in my mind that Shortell is a superior QB. That doesn't mean I want Gray to fail. Far from it. I said it before, I would be fine if the team wins enough games to become bowl eligible and Shortell never takes another snap. That would be AWESOME and nothing would make me happier.

 

[dpodoll68]

Lighten up, Francis. It was a joke. Nothing wrong with a little levity on a Friday.

I have to admit, I find the criticisms of the two QB's kind of amusing sometimes. Shortell's "dumpster fire" performance that people love to bring up so much from last year:

Mich: 11-for-22 for 104, 0 TD's, 0 INT's, and no turnovers.

Gray had a game very similar to those numbers last year, and it was one of his better ones:

Nebraska: 9-for-18 for 122, 0 TD's and 0 INT's (both games, blow-out losses)

Beside that:

9-for-21 for 124 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT
6-for-14 for 51 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT
8-for-20 for 104 yards; 0 TD's and 1 INT

At the end of the day, essentially there's one stat that matters; every one of those games was basically a blow-out loss. Neither QB has led the team to a win on the road against a BCS opponent.

We're not talking about last year. We're talking about this year. Gray is undefeated as a starter and his passing numbers are markedly better than last season.

I think his inability to complete forward passes against defenses with BCS talent

How would you know? He hasn't taken a single snap against an AQ team this season. Again, we're talking about this season, not last.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

We're not talking about last year. We're talking about this year. Gray is undefeated as a starter and his passing numbers are markedly better than last season.

How would you know? He hasn't taken a single snap against an AQ team this season. Again, we're talking about this season, not last.

Kudos to you, actually, for NOT wanting to bring up last year. Most people aren't as open-minded.

True, Gray hasn't taken a snap this year against an opponent that could match up well with Winona State. You are correct. I'm anxious to see where Gray is in terms of improvement as we move forward. As Mason noted at the end of the UNH game, we haven't seen it yet. I'll continue to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Both QB's will likely struggle as long as they're trotting out teenagers (minor exaggeration, spare me the correction) on the O-Line. The situation is what it is. Hopefully Northwestern is a defense that they can match up well against. Also wondering what kind of impact the weather will have in the game tomorrow, who it favors, etc.

You mentioned Gray being undefeated as a starter. There is one thing I've been curious about in the last few weeks in that regards. Western Michigan. Gray leaves the game with the team behind, playing less than two quarters. Who should be credited with the "win"?

 

[Go4theWin]

We're not talking about last year. We're talking about this year. Gray is undefeated as a starter and his passing numbers are markedly better than last season.



How would you know? He hasn't taken a single snap against an AQ team this season. Again, we're talking about this season, not last.

What passing numbers are you speaking about???? I've stated in a earlier post about his numbers compared to last season.

Boy, are you calling Gray undefeated as a starter with wins over directional Michigan and New Hampshire? Good argument?

How do we know that he has trouble against BCS talent, because of last year and he had trouble against non-BCS teams THIS year.

Well said Ogee.

 

[dpodoll68]

What passing numbers are you speaking about????

All of them. New Hampshire counts. It's a game, it was on the schedule, and we played them. It counts. Period.

Boy, are you calling Gray undefeated as a starter with wins over directional Michigan and New Hampshire? Good argument?

Who you calling Boy, Boy? Yes, he is undefeated. Spin it any way you want, he is undefeated as a starting QB this year. Period.

he had trouble against non-BCS teams THIS year

Yeah, he threw some poor passes. He threw many more good ones. His numbers are much better than his own numbers last year, or Shortell's last year or this year. He still has yet to play in a loss this season.

 

[50PoundHead]

You aren't going to get an argument from me that Gray is a good passer or has particularly good passing mechanics. Neither does Denard Robinson. You really have to throw as good as someone like Chandler Harnish to play quarterback optimally in this offense and Gray doesn't do that.

I just couldn't believe he was labelled a "practice player" and "not a 'baller." Kid is tough and wants to win. Carp on his passing mechanics, but when those terms are tossed about, it usually means a kid is deficient in the category of mental toughness or aptitude. I don't see Gray as either.

 

[GophersInIowa]

You aren't going to get an argument from me that Gray is a good passer or has particularly good passing mechanics. Neither does Denard Robinson. You really have to throw as good as someone like Chandler Harnish to play quarterback optimally in this offense and Gray doesn't do that.

I just couldn't believe he was labelled a "practice player" and "not a 'baller." Kid is tough and wants to win. Carp on his passing mechanics, but when those terms are tossed about, it usually means a kid is deficient in the category of mental toughness or aptitude. I don't see Gray as either.

Yeah, that was pretty odd. I'm still trying to figure out how this thread went from Gray's chances of playing TE/WR in the NFL to his current passing skills.

 

[dpodoll68]

Yeah, that was pretty odd. I'm still trying to figure out how this thread went from Gray's chances of playing TE/WR in the NFL to his current passing skills.

People will take any and every opportunity to espouse their preconceived notions about Gray despite the fact that all supporting evidence runs exactly counter to their position.

 

[MNVCGUY]

Yeah, that was pretty odd. I'm still trying to figure out how this thread went from Gray's chances of playing TE/WR in the NFL to his current passing skills.

Totally agree since the question was never would Gray be a QB at the NFL level. We all know the answer to that one is a resounding no. He will get multiple opportunities to make it in the league though because I said it earlier and I will say it again.....6'4", 240-250 lbs, great athlete, good/great speed for his size, and good hands as demonstrated in his year at WR. Those measurables don't come around everyday.

 

[HutHut]

Actually this would be a good time for Coach Kill to sit down with Gray and talk future. Obviously over here - and there's NO chance NFL teams are looking at him at QB. Would be good timing to line up H/Back - TE role and give teams some tape at those positions. Would help our team as well with a viable red zone target. And then I don't have to keep seeing 3 yds and a cloud of dust on every 1st/2nd down.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Actually this would be a good time for Coach Kill to sit down with Gray and talk future. Obviously over here - and there's NO chance NFL teams are looking at him at QB. Would be good timing to line up H/Back - TE role and give teams some tape at those positions. Would help our team as well with a viable red zone target. And then I don't have to keep seeing 3 yds and a cloud of dust on every 1st/2nd down.

Right now our offense is better with Gray at QB.

 

[Sportsfan24]

I can't post to anything specificly but I gotta say it.....I love the back and forth comments. Folks are passionate and backing it up with examples of why they believe what they believe.

 

[Deleted_User]

Year over year comparisons are tough to analyze when there is such a high turnover of players from year to year. Starters graduate. Replacements can be better or worse. Coaching changes. Changes in philosophy. Personal circumstances change. But, the players remain almost exactly who they were with slightly different measurables.

So, I find it more difficult to filter out the environmental noise to how well MG is actually playing. Here is what I think scouts will consider. He gets injured a lot. He isn't a great QB. He is not a great WO. He has never played tight end. What is he? I don't care what coaches he has had in the past. None have been certain where he best fits. Given that fact, the scouts are going to note that he is a good athlete with no real NFL potential. I have read nowhere but on GH that he is a draftable candidate with a positive upside. I think he is not as good as Ricky Foggy.

Face it, Minnesota has not had a number of decades since we had decent qb play. OMG, don't bring up how stellar Adam Webber played and that he was on a team for a nanosecond.

 

[Sportsfan24]

Year over year comparisons are tough to analyze when there is such a high turnover of players from year to year. Starters graduate. Replacements can be better or worse. Coaching changes. Changes in philosophy. Personal circumstances change. But, the players remain almost exactly who they were with slightly different measurables.

So, I find it more difficult to filter out the environmental noise to how well MG is actually playing.
Here is what I think scouts will consider. He gets injured a lot. He isn't a great QB. He is not a
great WO. He has never played tight end. What is he? I don't care what coaches he has had in
the past. None have been certain where he best fits. Given that fact, the scouts are going to note
that he is a good athlete with no real NFL potential. I have read nowhere but on GH that he is a
draftable candidate with a positive upside. I think he is not as good as Ricky Foggy.

Face it, Minnesota has not had a number of decades since we had decent qb play. OMG, don't bring up how stellar Adam Webber played and that he was on a team for a nanosecond.

Forget about what you read. Most of the writers aren't qualified to have an opinion unless someone gives it to them.

NFL worthy? Forget about trying to figure that one out. It's not a science. That extremely overrated sorry corner from Nebraska was drafted last season after posting pedestrian college career numbers, posting pedestrian measureables and one week after assaulting a cop.

Ahmad Black (college all-American) was drafted after measuring 5'8, 180lbs and running a 4'8 40....as a corner.

What the scouts will note is a 6'4, 250 player who will run a sub 4'65 40. Odds are come late in the draft somebody will take a flier.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news for you....Adam Weber's nanosecond is well into year number two (every since he left college) in collecting NFL checks.

 

[csom_1991]

I don't understand how people still rip on Adam Weber. Weber was/and is a solid QB as shown by his sticking in the NFL going on 2 seasons. He was a victim of horrible coaching - both he and Decker are in the NFL in spite of the coaching staff, not because of it. If Weber was our QB when we had Barber and Maroney - we would be talking about our recent Big Ten title and Rose Bowl rather than relying on those 70 years old to remissness about what a Rose Bowl feels like. Neither Gray or Shortell have shown themselves worthy of carrying Weber's jock.

 

[50PoundHead]

Year over year comparisons are tough to analyze when there is such a high turnover of players from year to year. Starters graduate. Replacements can be better or worse. Coaching changes. Changes in philosophy. Personal circumstances change. But, the players remain almost exactly who they were with slightly different measurables.

So, I find it more difficult to filter out the environmental noise to how well MG is actually playing. Here is what I think scouts will consider. He gets injured a lot. He isn't a great QB. He is not a great WO. He has never played tight end. What is he? I don't care what coaches he has had in the past. None have been certain where he best fits. Given that fact, the scouts are going to note that he is a good athlete with no real NFL potential. I have read nowhere but on GH that he is a draftable candidate with a positive upside. I think he is not as good as Ricky Foggy.

Face it, Minnesota has not had a number of decades since we had decent qb play. OMG, don't bring up how stellar Adam Webber played and that he was on a team for a nanosecond.

It was a different era and Foggie ran a pretty pure option attack so it's really apples-and-oranges for comparison purposes. Foggie was more elusive as a runner than Gray, but not nearly as big and strong and I'd be curious to compare their straight line speeds. Foggie didn't have a pro position. Gray might have one given how the pro game has opened up over the past couple of decades.

I agree with Sportsfan24 that if Gray does well at the combine and/or pro day workouts, someone is going to draft him late. He won't be a QB at the next level.

 

[BleedGopher]

Shooter weighs in: "The best chance for the Gophers' MarQueis Gray to land a job in the NFL is as a wideout, not a quarterback."

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_21767597/smith-relieved-shove-is-behind-him

Go Gophers!!

 

[lakesgopher]

Actually this would be a good time for Coach Kill to sit down with Gray and talk future. Obviously over here - and there's NO chance NFL teams are looking at him at QB. Would be good timing to line up H/Back - TE role and give teams some tape at those positions. Would help our team as well with a viable red zone target. And then I don't have to keep seeing 3 yds and a cloud of dust on every 1st/2nd down.

Kill wasn't hired to develop skill sets for the nfl. Kill was hired to win football games for the gophers no one else. If someone goes to the nfl after the U, great. The theory that kill should sit kids down and move them to positions to help their nfl potential is the dumbest *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!# I have ever read.

 

[Figureitout]

Please trust what you have seen for the past 4 years with Gray. Why on earth is anyone using the NFL and his name in the same sentence.

 

[50PoundHead]

Kill wasn't hired to develop skill sets for the nfl. Kill was hired to win football games for the gophers no one else. If someone goes to the nfl after the U, great. The theory that kill should sit kids down and move them to positions to help their nfl potential is the dumbest *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!# I have ever read.

And that's the only point that matters.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Please trust what you have seen for the past 4 years with Gray. Why on earth is anyone using the NFL and his name in the same sentence.

I see a big guy who runs pretty well, has good hands, can run over guys, and is a very good athlete. I don't know what you see. Maybe open your eyes.

 

[Sportsfan24]

Kill wasn't hired to develop skill sets for the nfl. Kill was hired to win football games for the gophers no one else. If someone goes to the nfl after the U, great. The theory that kill should sit kids down and move them to positions to help their nfl potential is the dumbest *&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!# I have ever read.

I won't say what YOU said is dumb; but I will say you are seriously misinformed. Big time high school football players are more likely to go a college where players are going to the NFL. This should come as no surprise; students wanting to become attorneys are understandable going to favor law schools whose graduates earn a higher starting salary....that pretty much applies to every profession and student.

Back to football. The culture is such that the GA wants to become a position coach, every position coach wants to become a coordinator and every coordinator wants to become a head coach. Yes; it is the responsibility of the boss/head coach to groom them (within reason). Keep in mind, someone did the same for him.

Players and the NFL? That is the type of money that can change a generation; let alone fulfill a dream. Yes, the coach should do whatever he can (again within reason) to help that young man reach the NFL.

Finally; if coach Kill is using it as a selling point to get a player to change positions (which he is), get a player to play better (which he does) or to get a potential recruit to commit (which he has) of course he should be concerned about and do what he can to help his players get to the NFL (which I know he will do).

 

[lakesgopher]

Nothing about the recruitment to Minnesota for gray was to prep him for the nfl. Brewster was going to run a college spread for gray, kill doesn't run anything like a pro style offense. Qbs from high school that are serious nfl talent go to USC, Georgia, etc. the others with similar skill sets like gray play qb and if they flourish maybe go to the nfl and have success. I'm not misinformed, there isn't a school in the country that plays a guy for a year and a half at a position and then moves him to another to show off his nfl potential.

 

[Deleted_User]

If the only thing on MG's resume at the end of 4 is gifted athlete, well, "uncertain" prospect will be an often used term with scouts. At best that means lower level draft choice and uncertain prospects.

As for Adam Weber being on an NFL team. Yes, he is employed with Tampa on the practice squad. He doesn't play on Sunday and he makes the equivalent of minimum wage for the NFL. It helps to have Minnesota coaches down in Tampa. Steve Loney for one.