Who should be on the list?

[CentralGopher]

Now, I don't want Pitino to be fired and I don't think there is any chance he gets fired. That said, this is a crazy emotional response.

#1: Haskins era? Yep, he cheated and that stunk. But I still remember that Final Four run, I'd take another Final Four run that is later wiped off the books over this dumpster fire.
#2: Monson era? Yeah, there was less splash. But was it really worse than it is now? Really?
#3: Tubby era? How is it possible that you are arguing that there was never potential in the Tubby era? This year feels so much like the Tubby year that went sideways (Royce's nonsense, Mbakwe's nonsense, injuries).

This year feels like a lot of the same disappointment that we went through with Tubby. Our lack of depth being exposed because injuries (Al Nolen/Mbakwe = Curry/Coffey) and off-the-court issues (Mbakwe/White = Lynch/Dorsey).

I might be remembering things wrong and this is totally off topic but this whole thread has gone that way. The monson era seemed worse to me. I recall the team plain quitting on him in his final season leading to his dismissal following many, many losses. Did he have 1 or two tourney appearances?. Other than that recruiting was a dud and really never competing for b10 titles much less even in consideration or even hope of doing so. Not sure how anyone can even compare this team to that.


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[rivergopher]

While I agree the Monson era was nothing to write home about and very underwhelming, his conference winning percentage will be better after 5 years than Pitino's and he took over a far worse situation, obviously with the academic scandal. Competing for conference championships? They were 11-7 last year that is not competing for conference championships. Fun and exciting year but it appears to be the exception. As for quit lets see how these last 8 games go but their body language and defensive effort does not appear to be a team that is really playing hard for their coach or each other currently.

I might be remembering things wrong and this is totally off topic but this whole thread has gone that way. The monson era seemed worse to me. I recall the team plain quitting on him in his final season leading to his dismissal following many, many losses. Did he have 1 or two tourney appearances?. Other than that recruiting was a dud and really never competing for b10 titles much less even in consideration or even hope of doing so. Not sure how anyone can even compare this team to that.


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[CentralGopher]

While I agree the Monson area was nothing to write home about and very underwhelming, but his conference winning percentage will be better after 5 years than Pitino's and he took over a far worse situation obviously with the academic scandal. Competing for conference championships? They were 11-7 last year that is not competing for conference championships. Fun and exciting year but it appears to be the exception. As for quit lets see how these last 8 games go but their body language and defensive effort does not appear to be a team that is really playing hard for their coach or each other currently.

Fair enough


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[KillmeNow]

Now, I don't want Pitino to be fired and I don't think there is any chance he gets fired. That said, this is a crazy emotional response.

#1: Haskins era? Yep, he cheated and that stunk. But I still remember that Final Four run, I'd take another Final Four run that is later wiped off the books over this dumpster fire.
#2: Monson era? Yeah, there was less splash. But was it really worse than it is now? Really?
#3: Tubby era? How is it possible that you are arguing that there was never potential in the Tubby era? This year feels so much like the Tubby year that went sideways (Royce's nonsense, Mbakwe's nonsense, injuries).

This year feels like a lot of the same disappointment that we went through with Tubby. Our lack of depth being exposed because injuries (Al Nolen/Mbakwe = Curry/Coffey) and off-the-court issues (Mbakwe/White = Lynch/Dorsey).

No, the Monson years were not horrible. But I think we were just hoping each year to make the tourney. Last year we got a #5 seed and were talking about a possible Conf Title this year. And also compared to the Tubby years, again, it seemed like there was some potential, to get into the tourney and maybe get lucky, win a couple games, but Tubby was getting older and I don't think anyone believed he was going to, or could have brought us a title. But Pitino is younger, more time to build something. That is where you get depth, from building your roster

Oh, and I guess, to be honest, from my skewed rose colored glasses, I can admit that I did have high hopes for Tubby, but where I notice the difference is in how outsiders perceive us now, as compared to when Tubby was here. I think outsiders truly feel we are turning a corner.

 

[Go Gophs]

They were pretty good defensively last year. Obviously Lynch being out hurts right now but the effort isn't there either.

I think alot of that was because of 2 players. Springs, he defended very well on the perimeter and was a great on the ball defender. Lynch, if someone got beat, he was able to erase that pretty quickly and might have led
the nation in blocks.(don't know exact stats, but he had lots of them)

 

[WindyCityGopher]

I hear Izzo is going to be available at the end of the year...

 

[Go Gophs]

I'd love to see some of you critics try to coach this team this year.

Curry out the whole year.
McBrayer missed a few games early, which almost directly coincided with their early losses and/or less than stellar performances.
When McBrayer returned, we did better.

Washington started out the season throwing up a ton 3s and missing almost all of them. Seemed to me, couple games before Lynch and Coffey went out, he was driving to the basket more and shooting from outside less. He was improving as a player.

Lynch was fouling less than early last year.

Murphy was much better than last year.

And those two were ranked #1 in rebounding and #3 in Blocked shots. Those are considered defense??

Now take out the CONF DEF POY. We're already without Curry to help out. Oh, and same time Coffey goes out.


Now defenses are putting more pressure on our gaurds knowing its just Konate and Gaston on the inside.

Murphy is probably getting double teamed more, his stats are way down since those two went out.

So Mason is left thinking he has to do everything. So yeah, he and others start trying to be the Hero. Is that bad coaching or just freaking out under much increased pressure?


I saw everyone progressing and improving as the season was going along, until Coffey and Lynch went down, combined with Curry already being out. Who was left? 3 of our Top 6? Some young recruits that would have done better if left to progress and improve over time? And 2 relics of Pitino's first recruiting class?

Man, I sometimes wonder if a lot of you never played sports before, and I doubt any of you coached before.

Don't you guys remember how much of a negative impact losing one single player was back in 1996 was it? Was it Sam Jacobsen? We were winning with him, and couldn't without him. It was that simple. Now we've lost 2-3 for much of the season and somehow now its the coaches fault???

I get where you are coming from, but my plan if I am going to play in a conference like the Big Ten, from day 1, would be to establish the fact that this team will play defense better than anyone else in our conference. You have to know that at Minnesota, your talent level will probably not be as high as those of some of the other teams in your league. The only way to combat that at all is to play excellent defense, take care of the ball, and rebound better than everyone.

That should be the foundation from which this program is built. If you aren't going to get top notch talent, you have to lunchpail it or you have no chance. Not sure why Pitino hasn't taken this approach. To me, it seems as this is the only way out of the mess that has been Gopher basketball of the last 10-15 years.

 

[builtbadgers]

No, the Monson years were not horrible. But I think we were just hoping each year to make the tourney. Last year we got a #5 seed and were talking about a possible Conf Title this year. And also compared to the Tubby years, again, it seemed like there was some potential, to get into the tourney and maybe get lucky, win a couple games, but Tubby was getting older and I don't think anyone believed he was going to, or could have brought us a title. But Pitino is younger, more time to build something. That is where you get depth, from building your roster

Oh, and I guess, to be honest, from my skewed rose colored glasses, I can admit that I did have high hopes for Tubby, but where I notice the difference is in how outsiders perceive us now, as compared to when Tubby was here. I think outsiders truly feel we are turning a corner.

The outsiders i know , some of whom are insiders thought little of him at the hire and less now. For every defense i have offered they have 3 reasons to suggest he is not highly respected as a winner and have serious concerns over poor defense, recruiting poor character . They say he got everything on his name just like others but has not proven anything.

 

[rivergopher]

Yeah not sure where these "outsiders" are coming from, I am heading to Raleigh in a few weeks and will be on the campus of 3 major universities for games and will take a straw poll. I dont hear much of this turning the corner anywhere.

The outsiders i know , some of whom are insiders thought little of him at the hire and less now. For every defense i have offered they have 3 reasons to suggest he is not highly respected as a winner and have serious concerns over poor defense, recruiting poor character . They say he got everything on his name just like others but has not proven anything.

 

[KillmeNow]

I get where you are coming from, but my plan if I am going to play in a conference like the Big Ten, from day 1, would be to establish the fact that this team will play defense better than anyone else in our conference. You have to know that at Minnesota, your talent level will probably not be as high as those of some of the other teams in your league. The only way to combat that at all is to play excellent defense, take care of the ball, and rebound better than everyone.

That should be the foundation from which this program is built. If you aren't going to get top notch talent, you have to lunchpail it or you have no chance. Not sure why Pitino hasn't taken this approach. To me, it seems as this is the only way out of the mess that has been Gopher basketball of the last 10-15 years.

But Pitino DID get top notch talent.

Think of what we had coming into this year BEFORE Curry got injured?

A PG some were calling the best in the B1G. 1st Team All-Conf last year.

A Conf Def Player of the Year who led the nation in blocks last year and was leading the nation in blocks for the first 25% of the season, was probably #4 when he got suspended. And not only did he know how to block shots, I often heard him being praised for how he didn't send the ball into the stands to make a statement, but more often than not kept the ball in play with our team sometimes getting it.

Jordan Murphy, who we knew was good but found out was awesome!!! You talk about defense, getting rebounds, well he only led the nation in rebounds before Lynch and Coffey went down.

Coffey made the all Freshman team last year I believe?

Most Gopher fans were very high on Curry and saw good things for him this season and I got the feeling they felt he would be our #1 guy off the bench.

McBrayer may not have been bound for 1st team All-Conf this season, but he was a great compliment to the rest of the starting lineup.


And had Lynch and Curry not been sidelined, guys like Hurt and IW could have been brought along more, I don't know, slowly, carefully, deliberately? And guys like Konate and Gaston could have only been used for short periods and probably would have done fine for the most part. Not sure about Fitz? I had heard Pitino say good things about him, was looking forward to his making a more significant contribution to the team, maybe if he would have also been brought along at a more deliberate pace, who knows? But we would have had the talent, and some depth.

But an injury and then other minor injuries and then a suspension and another injury and the people I talk to understand things like this happen and you can't go around blaming the coach. They do not think we should get rid of him. They think we should hold off and give him another year at least.

 

[JimmyJamesMD]

Even Izzo isnt untouchable

 

[scools12]

But an injury and then other minor injuries and then a suspension and another injury and the people I talk to understand things like this happen and you can't go around blaming the coach. They do not think we should get rid of him. They think we should hold off and give him another year at least.

I don't see anyone in this thread blaming Pitno for injuries and say he should be fired this year. The issues with this team go beyond a suspension and injuries.

As pointed out what is the identity of the program? There isn't one thing this team does well on a nightly basis.

Pitino will get next year but the 3 incoming freshmen and the players returning are not going to make the team much better than it is now.

 

[KillmeNow]

Yeah not sure where these "outsiders" are coming from, I am heading to Raleigh in a few weeks and will be on the campus of 3 major universities for games and will take a straw poll. I dont hear much of this turning the corner anywhere.

They were saying that LAST year. Now, well, they aren't 100% sure, no one knows for sure if Lynch is guilty or not, or what Pitino's part in it all was. But they saw the kind of players he was bringing in and saw potential in the Gopher bb program that they hadn't seen since the fall of the program in 1999.

They understand an pre-season injury combined with a suspension and then another injury, well, injuries can't be blamed on a coach and the suspension? It's easy in hindsight to think you would have known how better to deal with this situation, but we don't know all the details, we don't know whose telling the truth and who is lying, we don't know what Pitino knew or when he knew, etc..


And this straw poll you take, ask at least TWO questions. I'm sure you'll ask if they think Pitino is a great coach. And you suspect they won't say that.

But what I want you to ask them, is... BE HONEST, do you think, the UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA is a prime destination for a mens cbb coach, and do you honestly think we can do better??? And if they say yes, we can do better, ask them how many years it will take this new and improved coach to get us into the, say, Top 4 of the B1G Standings?

Ask them to rank us, say, are we Top 10, 25, 50, 100, 150 as far as being the place a coach would want to come and coach. I'm sure UNC, Duke, NCst fans, or UK or UL or IU fans will rank us REALLY high, lol.

They may not like Pitino or may have issues with him, they may tell you he's not a great coach or has integrity issues or whatever, but they might not tell you their honest feelings about whether or not we can do better. Why would they? Minnesota firing another coach is good for them. They don't want Minnesota to succeed. I mean, there are exceptions to that rule, but for the most part, people out there don't want us to succeed. Partly because we are not them. Partly because we are Minnesota, and partly because we are part of the B1G.

 

[rivergopher]

Considering he is 22 games under .500 and falling fast not hard for one to envision them doing better.

QUOTE=KillmeNow;1510310]They were saying that LAST year. Now, well, they aren't 100% sure, no one knows for sure if Lynch is guilty or not, or what Pitino's part in it all was. But they saw the kind of players he was bringing in and saw potential in the Gopher bb program that they hadn't seen since the fall of the program in 1999.

They understand an pre-season injury combined with a suspension and then another injury, well, injuries can't be blamed on a coach and the suspension? It's easy in hindsight to think you would have known how better to deal with this situation, but we don't know all the details, we don't know whose telling the truth and who is lying, we don't know what Pitino knew or when he knew, etc..


And this straw poll you take, ask at least TWO questions. I'm sure you'll ask if they think Pitino is a great coach. And you suspect they won't say that.

But what I want you to ask them, is... BE HONEST, do you think, the UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA is a prime destination for a mens cbb coach, and do you honestly think we can do better??? And if they say yes, we can do better, ask them how many years it will take this new and improved coach to get us into the, say, Top 4 of the B1G Standings?

Ask them to rank us, say, are we Top 10, 25, 50, 100, 150 as far as being the place a coach would want to come and coach. I'm sure UNC, Duke, NCst fans, or UK or UL or IU fans will rank us REALLY high, lol.

They may not like Pitino or may have issues with him, they may tell you he's not a great coach or has integrity issues or whatever, but they might not tell you their honest feelings about whether or not we can do better. Why would they? Minnesota firing another coach is good for them. They don't want Minnesota to succeed. I mean, there are exceptions to that rule, but for the most part, people out there don't want us to succeed. Partly because we are not them. Partly because we are Minnesota, and partly because we are part of the B1G.[/QUOTE]

 

[KillmeNow]

I don't see anyone in this thread blaming Pitno for injuries and say he should be fired this year. The issues with this team go beyond a suspension and injuries.

As pointed out what is the identity of the program? There isn't one thing this team does well on a nightly basis.

Pitino will get next year but the 3 incoming freshmen and the players returning are not going to make the team much better than it is now.

When you are Duke or UK, you can pick an identity and then get the best players to fit that identity. When you are a program that has been considered a joke for almost 2 decades now, and you can't have whoever you want, you get the best players you can, and you figure out the identity thing later.

Last year the team had a great year, and this year was supposed to be better. If we should have had an identity this year, it could or should or would have been, WE OWN THE PAINT. With Lynch and Murphy and Curry, etc.. We could have. Even without Curry Murphy became the #1 ranked rebounder in the country AND Lynch was near #1 in shots blocked. And when you own the paint, teams don't get to focus on stopping the gaurds from making plays, getting great shots. Mason and as the season developed, IW, and Harris, their shooting would have improved simply because of the respect teams would have to pay our inside guys.

Were we still missing what Springs brought to the table last year? Yes, we were. But with everything else working well, Pitino could have focused on that. I saw a lot of progress in IW's game leading up to Lynch's suspension, and without the suspension, maybe his defense would have improved? I bet Mason would be playing better without feeling the pressure of now having to do everything himself. Should he feel that way? Probably not, but that's what happens when you end being left as the best remaining player and one of the only really good ones.


You don't think next year's squad will be any better than it is RIGHT NOW???

We lose really only 1 legit contributing player, since Lynch doesn't count, since he's not playing for this team RIGHT NOW.

And ADD 3 incoming freshman & Curry & is that it? Don't we have 4 openings? Is there a transfer coming in?

 

[KillmeNow]

Considering he is 22 games under .500 and falling fast not hard for one to envision them doing better.

QUOTE=KillmeNow;1510310]They were saying that LAST year. Now, well, they aren't 100% sure, no one knows for sure if Lynch is guilty or not, or what Pitino's part in it all was. But they saw the kind of players he was bringing in and saw potential in the Gopher bb program that they hadn't seen since the fall of the program in 1999.

They understand an pre-season injury combined with a suspension and then another injury, well, injuries can't be blamed on a coach and the suspension? It's easy in hindsight to think you would have known how better to deal with this situation, but we don't know all the details, we don't know whose telling the truth and who is lying, we don't know what Pitino knew or when he knew, etc..


And this straw poll you take, ask at least TWO questions. I'm sure you'll ask if they think Pitino is a great coach. And you suspect they won't say that.

But what I want you to ask them, is... BE HONEST, do you think, the UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA is a prime destination for a mens cbb coach, and do you honestly think we can do better??? And if they say yes, we can do better, ask them how many years it will take this new and improved coach to get us into the, say, Top 4 of the B1G Standings?

Ask them to rank us, say, are we Top 10, 25, 50, 100, 150 as far as being the place a coach would want to come and coach. I'm sure UNC, Duke, NCst fans, or UK or UL or IU fans will rank us REALLY high, lol.

They may not like Pitino or may have issues with him, they may tell you he's not a great coach or has integrity issues or whatever, but they might not tell you their honest feelings about whether or not we can do better. Why would they? Minnesota firing another coach is good for them. They don't want Minnesota to succeed. I mean, there are exceptions to that rule, but for the most part, people out there don't want us to succeed. Partly because we are not them. Partly because we are Minnesota, and partly because we are part of the B1G.

[/QUOTE]

Well, I for one think that Pitino had built a good foundation and was building it up, and I hope he's given the chance to stick around and I believe he'll make us better, a lot better. The kind of better than lasts a long time.



LAST YEAR, was the first time fans of other programs, were actually worried, or impressed with UMn's bb team.

Monson? No one feared he'd ever make Minny great.

Tubby? Well, he was a maybe? If he had had a little better luck early on, he may have kept the fire burning and done a great job. But this IS Minnesota we are talking about. The only luck we know about is BAD luck.

Pitino? The first 3 years? Probably not. But last year did it. Got their attention and made them look twice. They open their eyes and saw what a lot of Gopher faithful saw, that he had built up a great team. This was supposed to be his banner year, the season that launched us up into legitimacy.

But we are Minnesota, apparently we don't get nice things lol.

 

[builtbadgers]

When you are Duke or UK, you can pick an identity and then get the best players to fit that identity. When you are a program that has been considered a joke for almost 2 decades now, and you can't have whoever you want, you get the best players you can, and you figure out the identity thing later.

Last year the team had a great year, and this year was supposed to be better. If we should have had an identity this year, it could or should or would have been, WE OWN THE PAINT. With Lynch and Murphy and Curry, etc.. We could have. Even without Curry Murphy became the #1 ranked rebounder in the country AND Lynch was near #1 in shots blocked. And when you own the paint, teams don't get to focus on stopping the gaurds from making plays, getting great shots. Mason and as the season developed, IW, and Harris, their shooting would have improved simply because of the respect teams would have to pay our inside guys.

Were we still missing what Springs brought to the table last year? Yes, we were. But with everything else working well, Pitino could have focused on that. I saw a lot of progress in IW's game leading up to Lynch's suspension, and without the suspension, maybe his defense would have improved? I bet Mason would be playing better without feeling the pressure of now having to do everything himself. Should he feel that way? Probably not, but that's what happens when you end being left as the best remaining player and one of the only really good ones.


You don't think next year's squad will be any better than it is RIGHT NOW???

We lose really only 1 legit contributing player, since Lynch doesn't count, since he's not playing for this team RIGHT NOW.

And ADD 3 incoming freshman & Curry & is that it? Don't we have 4 openings? Is there a transfer coming in?

I think they will be better next year and your right, maybe they can not get a better coach. UVA and UW AND HELL FOR THAT MATTER what Bennett got done at WSU of all places was establish a identity on day one. Butler did it. Nova did it. They hung their hat on defense and discipline and eventually fundamentled you to death. No one here is hoping for Duke or UNC. People here would have a parade if it was .500 after 5 years and better than 6-25 against ranked teams.

 

[bizzle22]

When you are Duke or UK, you can pick an identity and then get the best players to fit that identity. When you are a program that has been considered a joke for almost 2 decades now, and you can't have whoever you want, you get the best players you can, and you figure out the identity thing later.

Last year the team had a great year, and this year was supposed to be better. If we should have had an identity this year, it could or should or would have been, WE OWN THE PAINT. With Lynch and Murphy and Curry, etc.. We could have. Even without Curry Murphy became the #1 ranked rebounder in the country AND Lynch was near #1 in shots blocked. And when you own the paint, teams don't get to focus on stopping the gaurds from making plays, getting great shots. Mason and as the season developed, IW, and Harris, their shooting would have improved simply because of the respect teams would have to pay our inside guys.

Were we still missing what Springs brought to the table last year? Yes, we were. But with everything else working well, Pitino could have focused on that. I saw a lot of progress in IW's game leading up to Lynch's suspension, and without the suspension, maybe his defense would have improved? I bet Mason would be playing better without feeling the pressure of now having to do everything himself. Should he feel that way? Probably not, but that's what happens when you end being left as the best remaining player and one of the only really good ones.


You don't think next year's squad will be any better than it is RIGHT NOW???

We lose really only 1 legit contributing player, since Lynch doesn't count, since he's not playing for this team RIGHT NOW.

And ADD 3 incoming freshman & Curry & is that it? Don't we have 4 openings? Is there a transfer coming in?

You say in your own post that Mason is our best remaining player, and then wonder why we shouldn't expect to be much better next year.

So you pretty much already answered your own question. Mason is gone next year -- that's why. We do bring in three freshmen, but as we have seen this year -- you can't count on freshmen to lead your team. (Unless of course you bring in a Marvin Bagley III type guy which is not going to happen anytime soon.)

There is no obvious replacement for Mason. Kalscheur is the only one of the freshmen who is a guard, but he's the lowest ranked of all of them so I really don't think we should expect major contributions from him in year 1. Washington has not looked good this year. McBrayer is what he is -- gets hot every now and then, but wildly inconsistent. Harris has shown flashes, and IMO is probably the best bet to replace at least some of Mason's production.

 

[scools12]

When you are Duke or UK, you can pick an identity and then get the best players to fit that identity. When you are a program that has been considered a joke for almost 2 decades now, and you can't have whoever you want, you get the best players you can, and you figure out the identity thing later.


You don't think next year's squad will be any better than it is RIGHT NOW???

You know what you want the identity of your team to be day one not on the fly and certainly not trying to figure it out year 6.

No, I don't think next year's squad will be any better than it is now.

 

[GibsonSG]

...but I remember somewhere near the end of the ooc part of the season, or maybe very early in conference play, I looked it up and the Gophers as a team were shooting something like 36 or 38 percent from 3 point land, but several Gophers individually were all in the 40+ percent range, but Washington was 2-28 or something like that. Might be an exaggeration, but my point is, that Washington, all by himself brought the entire team's 3 point shooting percentage down several percentage points.

You claim that they weren't playing defense before? Lynch being Top 5 in the nation in blocked shots and being praised for doing that without sending the ball into the stands, but keeping it in play more than most shot blockers, and Murphy leading the nation in rebounding? Those are not good defense?

No, you aren’t completely wrong in what you are saying but you do like to exaggerate. I never look at the coaches’ poll. It rarely gets mentioned in the television media so I had no idea Miami was still ranked there. I really don’t give a **** about North Carolina. I was only responding to your comment that “they would handle a losing season with more grace and dignity” or some nonsense.

In regards to shooting: If you shoot 12-20 from 3 versus Sister’s of the Poor and then 4-20 against a better team in the Big Ten, you’d have a 40% average from 3. A great overall shooting percentage, right? But if this is the usual result when playing good opponents versus bad, are you really that good of a shooting team despite what the stats say? I remember hearing stories of Al Nolen draining 3 after 3 in the practice gym but we all know what happened come game time. The team percentages have been sinking throughout conference play.

Blocking shots doesn’t always equate to good defense. Sure, a good shot-blocking team can swat away and alter a bunch of potential makes for the opposition. But they can also give up a ton of offensive rebounds and put-backs by not being in position to block out. While Lynch would help, he isn’t the cure-all for this team’s defensive problems.

This team has been fading in the efficiency rankings since nearly the start of the season. Even when they were missing only Curry, the defensive efficiency was barely Top 50. You don’t win Big Ten Championships with that unless you are a Top 10 offensive juggernaut like some of Tom Crean’s recent Indiana teams. I am tired of this discussion and won’t respond anymore. You obviously see things in Pitino and this team that I do not. Have a nice day!

 

[KillmeNow]

You say in your own post that Mason is our best remaining player, and then wonder why we shouldn't expect to be much better next year.

So you pretty much already answered your own question. Mason is gone next year -- that's why. We do bring in three freshmen, but as we have seen this year -- you can't count on freshmen to lead your team. (Unless of course you bring in a Marvin Bagley III type guy which is not going to happen anytime soon.)

There is no obvious replacement for Mason. Kalscheur is the only one of the freshmen who is a guard, but he's the lowest ranked of all of them so I really don't think we should expect major contributions from him in year 1. Washington has not looked good this year. McBrayer is what he is -- gets hot every now and then, but wildly inconsistent. Harris has shown flashes, and IMO is probably the best bet to replace at least some of Mason's production.

Maybe I should have been more precise? I thought I said, "one of" our best remaining players? But maybe I didn't. Not that I forgot about Jordan Murphy, but other teams aren't double teaming Mason, but they probably are double teaming Murphy. Because going into this year, yes, Mason was our best player, but Murphy had, up to our losing Lynch and Coffey, the better season of the two.

So no, we are maybe not losing our best player, but probably one of our two best. But that still leaves us with Murphy coming back, McBreyer and Coffey and the return of Curry. All 4 should form a good chore group of guys. But yes, this year we had 5 of those core guys. So who steps up? I think IW actually showed a lot of promise, when he drives to the basket instead of shooting from outside, he sometimes looks amazing. Now he needs to learn what else to do, meaning passing it sometimes after his drive drew the defenses attention to him, and when to fake the drive and put one up, when simply to just pass, and OF COURSE, to play good hard nosed disciplined defense on the other end. It may not happen by next season, but he'll be a great one for us. But for next year, I agree that Harris may be the best bet to replace some of Mason's production. Will Hurt continue to develop and improve, he also showed some flashes this season.

So next year might NOT be as good as this year COULD HAVE BEEN, but it will easily be better than this year is turning out to be.

Btw, who is this Cashman people keep bringing up?

Oh, and Fitz? Does he have another year left? He's the one player I have not figured out, what is your take on him? Any chance he can contribute next season?

 

[KillmeNow]

No, you aren’t completely wrong in what you are saying but you do like to exaggerate. I never look at the coaches’ poll. It rarely gets mentioned in the television media so I had no idea Miami was still ranked there. I really don’t give a **** about North Carolina. I was only responding to your comment that “they would handle a losing season with more grace and dignity” or some nonsense.

I can admit that I may exaggerate at times, but a lot of times I'm just trying to basically force the other guy to go into further detail so that I can better understand their point. I guess you would call that playing Devil's Advocate? lol But I can admit as much.

And the AP poll, Miami was basically in 26th place, getting the most votes in the RV section. RPI had them at #15 and the Coaches Poll had them at #24. I'd be willing to bet the Ken-Pom and other Ratings out there also have them among the Top 25. But yes, they have dropped some since earlier in the season.

I can't remember for sure, but what games was McBreyer out for in the ooc? I thought Miami might have been one of them?


As for saying UNC or Duke would have handled "a losing season" with more grace and dignity, I wasn't meaning any ole losing season, I was referring to a losing season caused by multiple injuries to key players and/or a suspension or some other kind of circumstance that is out of the control of the coach and/or team, severely shortening their team's bench.

 

[beavergopher]

Tom Izzo might be available soon.

 

[bizzle22]

Maybe I should have been more precise? I thought I said, "one of" our best remaining players? But maybe I didn't. Not that I forgot about Jordan Murphy, but other teams aren't double teaming Mason, but they probably are double teaming Murphy. Because going into this year, yes, Mason was our best player, but Murphy had, up to our losing Lynch and Coffey, the better season of the two.

So no, we are maybe not losing our best player, but probably one of our two best. But that still leaves us with Murphy coming back, McBreyer and Coffey and the return of Curry. All 4 should form a good chore group of guys. But yes, this year we had 5 of those core guys. So who steps up? I think IW actually showed a lot of promise, when he drives to the basket instead of shooting from outside, he sometimes looks amazing. Now he needs to learn what else to do, meaning passing it sometimes after his drive drew the defenses attention to him, and when to fake the drive and put one up, when simply to just pass, and OF COURSE, to play good hard nosed disciplined defense on the other end. It may not happen by next season, but he'll be a great one for us. But for next year, I agree that Harris may be the best bet to replace some of Mason's production. Will Hurt continue to develop and improve, he also showed some flashes this season.

So next year might NOT be as good as this year COULD HAVE BEEN, but it will easily be better than this year is turning out to be.

Btw, who is this Cashman people keep bringing up?

Oh, and Fitz? Does he have another year left? He's the one player I have not figured out, what is your take on him? Any chance he can contribute next season?

Cashman? You mean Gabe Kalscheur? He's a shooter from DeLaSalle in Minneapolis. He's a 200ish ranked recruit. Has been a really good shooter in HS, but like most guys I would expect he will take some time to adjust to the college game so I'm not expecting a ton from him next year. Could be a good player for us in a few years.

Fitz has another year of eligibility if he wants it. I'm not a fan personally. It's possible he opts to go make some money playing overseas so I'm not even 100% sure he will be on the roster next year. He showed some promise early in his college career at A&M, but it appears those knee injuries have taken their toll. Even if he does come back I don't expect a ton out of him other than 10-15 minutes per game he plays right now.

 

[KillmeNow]

Cashman? You mean Gabe Kalscheur? He's a shooter from DeLaSalle in Minneapolis. He's a 200ish ranked recruit. Has been a really good shooter in HS, but like most guys I would expect he will take some time to adjust to the college game so I'm not expecting a ton from him next year. Could be a good player for us in a few years.

Fitz has another year of eligibility if he wants it. I'm not a fan personally. It's possible he opts to go make some money playing overseas so I'm not even 100% sure he will be on the roster next year. He showed some promise early in his college career at A&M, but it appears those knee injuries have taken their toll. Even if he does come back I don't expect a ton out of him other than 10-15 minutes per game he plays right now.

Is Cashman Gabe's nickname or something? I'm sure I've seen several people talk about a Cashman. I assumed he was a Grad Transfer we thought could come in?

And if Fitz leaves, that makes room for another scholarship player, right, like a Grad Transfer. So no offense to Fitz, but maybe it would be good if he left? Another year of playing for the Gophers, especially with more options come next year, probably wouldn't improve his financial situation any, and I'm assuming he'll have his degree by then, and why you said, "if he wants it."??

Edit - Just googled Cashman and there is a Bryce Cashman, 6-10, plays for UND. I'd guess this is the guy they must be talking about? And losing Lynch, Konate & Gaston all at the same time, I'm guessing ppl think another big guy could help? Hopefully as a walk on?

 

[gophereric30]

Is Cashman Gabe's nickname or something? I'm sure I've seen several people talk about a Cashman. I assumed he was a Grad Transfer we thought could come in?

And if Fitz leaves, that makes room for another scholarship player, right, like a Grad Transfer. So no offense to Fitz, but maybe it would be good if he left? Another year of playing for the Gophers, especially with more options come next year, probably wouldn't improve his financial situation any, and I'm assuming he'll have his degree by then, and why you said, "if he wants it."??

Edit - Just googled Cashman and there is a Bryce Cashman, 6-10, plays for UND. I'd guess this is the guy they must be talking about? And losing Lynch, Konate & Gaston all at the same time, I'm guessing ppl think another big guy could help? Hopefully as a walk on?

Also saw cashman got 2 dui's in 52 days back in 2016. Not sure we should be taking that risk! That's all we need right now.

 

[KillmeNow]

Also saw cashman got 2 dui's in 52 days back in 2016. Not sure we should be taking that risk! That's all we need right now.

Well, I'm not trying to make his case, from what I could tell his stats weren't all that impressive, and hence why I said, as a walk on I suppose. As for the DUIs? Well, far more people get 1, than get 2 or 3 combined. They come down pretty hard on you come the 2nd one, and the 1st is no picnic either I've heard. 3 could put you in the poor house if you are not rich. Doubt he's rich. Maybe he's gone into therapy? Pretty sure they require that after the 2nd? And depending on when in 2016, that could be 2 years ago, by start of next season could be 2 and a half years? Like I have said, I'm not trying to make his case, but as a walk on? I don't know. Kind of seems like you said, probably too big of a risk.


I mean, there has got to be some Grad Transfers out there that would be much better options, I would think.

 

[gophereric30]

Well, I'm not trying to make his case, from what I could tell his stats weren't all that impressive, and hence why I said, as a walk on I suppose. As for the DUIs? Well, far more people get 1, than get 2 or 3 combined. They come down pretty hard on you come the 2nd one, and the 1st is no picnic either I've heard. 3 could put you in the poor house if you are not rich. Doubt he's rich. Maybe he's gone into therapy? Pretty sure they require that after the 2nd? And depending on when in 2016, that could be 2 years ago, by start of next season could be 2 and a half years? Like I have said, I'm not trying to make his case, but as a walk on? I don't know. Kind of seems like you said, probably too big of a risk.


I mean, there has got to be some Grad Transfers out there that would be much better options, I would think.

Yeah, by the end of the year there will be hundreds of transfers to pick from. Gotta be a fit out there for us somewhere!

 

[IAgopher11]

The worst 5 year period, including the Monson years???

#1 - Haskins cheated, nothing could be worse than his tenure. He robbed the Gophers of EVERYTHING. They basically lost every game under him, officially.

#2 - Monson?? Seriously? The difference between Monson and Pitino, is POTENTIAL. With Monson, there was never the potential to take the next step.

#3 - Tubby?? Same as Monson, with Tubby, there really was never the potential to move up to the next level.

#4 - INTEGRITY!! Pitino could have shown both Gaston and Konate the door, but he didn't. Short term we are suffering for it now, but only because of extenuating circumstances NOT under his control. Come next year, we'll have a great lineup, Curry will be back, new recruits will come in, we technically will not lose Lynch, he's already gone, so we have to make up for the loss of Mason, but otherwise, we'll gain more than we lose.

#5 - POTENTIAL!!! Pitino brought us hope, once we got past that one bad season, everything was on the upwards climb, until something beyond Pitino's control happened, then Coffey's injury came at the same time, how can you blame Pitino for this?? I mean, come on.


I don't give a rats ash if his first 5 years were the worst EVER, if his 2nd 5 years promise to be the BEST EVER, and they do.



It's that simple.

I would have to agree that Pitino has shown some integrity with Gaston and Konate (you wouldn't see that many places). Coaches usually move guys that can't perform...I wouldn't completely give Pitino credit here though, he knows that these two were placed by the international service and if he ever wants another kid he needs to treat them right. But in the end, he didn't boot them, so props to Pitino.

BUT, I would still question #4 INTEGRITY, and this also is a reason his team is struggling this year with some injuries...look at the kids he recruited to the U and are no longer in the program!!! Multiple guys, multiple issues, abuse, videos, assault, kicked out of school. This list is not impressive, and this list does not show integrity...it shows the inability to recruit quality people that will fit the program and make the university proud. The lack of these players "making it" then becomes magnified when you have injuries and another sexual assault case.

I agree that this year's class is a good one, and the previous class (coffey, curry, hurt) was a good one. And IW and Harris seem like decent people (verdict out on bball), so maybe he's learned his lesson and grown up a little as a coach of a major basketball program....BUT I still cannot say his program has INTEGRITY, too much drama in only 5 years.

 

[howeda7]

It's going to be a shame to miss out on Musselman to drag this out one more year.