Which player over or under-achieved this year? Breakdown

Donate To GopherHole
Winnipegopher

Winnipegopher

Wag more, bark less
Joined
Jan 5, 2009
Messages
3,582
Reaction score
108
Points
63
I think we all agree that the Gophers over-achieved based on pre-season expectations. What is interesting to me is how much we over-achieved considering how few of our players had overachieving seasons based on pre-season expectations.

My rankings, and remember, this rating is based on what we (I) thought they would do prior to the season and which our ranking would be based on.

Over achievers:
1. Matthieu. A huge add and the main reason we didn’t end up at the bottom of the conference. The Gophers MVP out of nowhere.
2. Maurice Walker. Finally contributed. Last summer losing weight, this summer gaining strength, I am hopeful for a big year next year.
3. Joey King. Takes a lot of heat, but for a guy taking up the last scholarship, played well, played a lot and played hard. Hopefully can build strength and have a solid final 2 years. I think he will.
4. McNeill. Played meaningful minutes and didn’t look lost. That is more than I thought he would bring.
Neutral:
1. Oto. Prior to injury looked like a competent Big Ten player.

Under-achievers:
1. Andre. Injured or not, any hope that the Gophers had for making the NCAAs were based on him having a huge year. He didn’t and was actually less effective than as a sophomore.
2. Austin. Sometimes very good, often invisible. Needed to step up but didn’t.
3. Elliott Eliason. Decent start, pretty terrible Big Ten season. Have trouble believing he will get many minutes ahead of Mo next year. Looking much like a more agile poor- man’s Colton Iverson.
4. Buggs. Has flashes but a redshirt freshman should be part of the rotation. He wasn’t, at a position of need, and that tells you a lot.
5. Malik Smith. Three point shooters have to be able to make threes. Saw what he could do against Nebraska but terrible the rest of the year. Makes me miss Steve Esselink.
6. Mav. Mav is Mav. One wonders if he couldn’t have taken a few more shots and Malik Smith a few less. A scholarship senior needs to play more minutes (not his fault but the fact remains).
7. Wally. Probably didn’t have the ability but mid-season departure leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
Interesting that the Gophers over-achieved with their three “best” (based on pre-season thoughts) players under-achieving. That tell you how important Little Dre was. Next year, if both Little and Big Dre have big years and Mo Walker continues to develop, and there is a useful addition or two, this could be quite a good team.

Thoughts?
 

A really good and fair analysis. I would probably have grouped the players exactly the way you did.

Most top tier Big Ten players make a big jump from their sophomore to junior year and we just didn't see that out of Andre Hollins, with our without the injury (and I don't think he ever got back to 100%, but he didn't make the jump prior to the injury either). He's a consistent scorer but I'd love to see him take a big step as a senior next year and put us on his back in a few big games like he's previously done.

Obviously we need significant help at PF, with our without Joey King being forced to jump from seldom used freshman at Drake to a Big Ten starter in less than a year.

Looking forward to the rest of this season and a really productive off-season both on the recruiting front and in the player development front.

Go Gophers!!
 

I agree with your breakdown. It is tough when you have more players disappointing than pleasantly surprising. The one big positive jumping out at me is that 3 of your 5 pleasant surprises were Pitino recruits, and Mo should count too since Pitino shaved 60 pounds off of him (an entirely different Mo than we saw before). Conversely, only one Pitino recruit was an under-achiever in Malik. If Lil' Dre, Joey, and McNeil were what Pitino could find in 15 minutes of recruiting after pretty much everyone had already committed, I'm excited to see what a full class looks like.
 

I agree with you all. I would like to see Andre and McNeil shed some weight (or tone up) in order to add speed and quickness. Maybe because of his injury, Andre did not look as quick as last year. Hopefully with another strong off season, Mo can do the same as he lacks lateral movement and gets burnt on defense way to much and remains a defensive liability. Niguel Hayes made Mo look silly as Hayes consistently drove around Mo with ease. EE needs to improve is offensive game but still is our best option on defense.
 

Pretty much spot on with the OP.

Very disappointed with Andre Hollins.

With his late season surge Austin had a decent year but still maybe under expectations.

Buggs would still not be seeing the court if Oto was healthy. Don't see him as more than a part-time role player.

McNeil - serviceable but don't see him as more than a role player either.

Still amazed with mid-Mo(he was big Mo but he isn't little Mo either). With another off season he could improve that much more.

Spring signing this year and the full class for next year are extremely important.

Mathieu For Governor.
 


What's going to decide if we go dancing next season is the next 3 recruits and whether Dre can reestablish himself as one of the 10-15 best players in the B1G. I expect incremental improvement from many players, but I'm guessing Mathieau will take the biggest leap.


Side note to Bleed: Players make their biggest jump from freshman to sophomore year dawg gone it!
 

Good analysis. One of the pleasures of this year was Mathieu's besting of some of the BT elite PGs, and scoring over their centers.
As poster above said, it is encouraging to see Pitino's recruits primarily in the 'over-acheiver' status.
Anyone else catch Digger's comments this wkend regarding the Pitinos? He said that the torch has been passed [from father to son], and in a few years, with his own recruits - look out Michigan State...

The first year Tubby was here, we took a friend who actually played pg for the Gophers in the 60's. He was very concerned about the vibe between Tubby and Al Nolen - said Nolen was playing scared & afraid of getting yanked, and that is hard to argue. Without digressing into a lengthy Tubby dissection, I would say that we might see Pitino work some confidence into Dre Hollins. He came out aggressive against Wisconsin, but was ice cold. Hope we can put him in the neutral or above category next year.

What we saw happen with Mo this year is the ability to weather the inevitable challenge to confidence that comes when the BT season grinds on. And we finally saw some emotion and satisfaction as he was able to answer that challenge. This is what I think we can hope to see w/Pitino.
 

I would agree with the top poster's grouping except I would rate Austin a bit better. His offense was less than hoped for but his defense was pretty consistently good all season. I still think Elliott plays a fair share of minutes next year unless Mo improves dramatically on the defensive end. Our interior defense and rebounding are better with Elliott on the court. If they can find a real power forward to play next to Mo, then maybe Elliott would be less necessary.
 

Basically agree with this, but I would argue that Elliot basically met expectations overall. He was better than expected through about the OSU game and did less the rest of the year, but was not terrible. Also, I don't think you can say Mav under acheived. He got very few chances and was actually decent when he wasn't asked to play PG.
 



I would say that is a pretty fair assessment by the OP overall.

My biggest dissapointment was the play of Dre Hollins this year. Yes, I am sure the injury was a big factor the second half of the year, but to me, he looked slow, out of control and made some awful decsions with the basketball, especially down the strech. I was really, really dissapointed with his play this year. Hoping he "rights the ship", so to speak, next season, because we will certainly need him!
 

I agree with some of op except I would not say Mo overachieved. I think he is a near miss though. He was expected to come in for serious minutes and did contribute but wasn't a double double machine or anything and defensively was suspect. Maybe I'm hard to please or am to high on the big fella and expect more but I don't think he over achieved. To me Buggs was about what I expected from a rFr. that needed some time to put on weight and develop so I wouldn't say he under achieved. Mav is who Mav is and I think he played decent enough when he was asked to so I also wouldn't say he under achieved either. He is limited and was just passed up by better players.
 

I saw an over achievement from the entire team as a group, what with the expectations coming into the season. Individuals??? I don't break them down, I just look at team concerns.
 

CentralGopher said:
I agree with some of op except I would not say Mo overachieved. I think he is a near miss though. He was expected to come in for serious minutes and did contribute but wasn't a double double machine or anything and defensively was suspect. Maybe I'm hard to please or am to high on the big fella and expect more but I don't think he over achieved. To me Buggs was about what I expected from a rFr. that needed some time to put on weight and develop so I wouldn't say he under achieved. Mav is who Mav is and I think he played decent enough when he was asked to so I also wouldn't say he under achieved either. He is limited and was just passed up by better players.
Click to expand...

Fair enough on Mo. After being suspended for the first six games and then not doing too much for most of the non-conference, my expectations were pretty low and he exceeded them but I certainly understand where you are coming from. As for Mav, I also kind of agree. I had him as neutral but dropped him. Aaron Robinson had a similar first three years to Mav and then blew up out of nowhere as a senior, it can happen.
 



Winnipegopher said:
I think we all agree that the Gophers over-achieved based on pre-season expectations. What is interesting to me is how much we over-achieved considering how few of our players had overachieving seasons based on pre-season expectations.

My rankings, and remember, this rating is based on what we (I) thought they would do prior to the season and which our ranking would be based on.

Over achievers:
1. Matthieu. A huge add and the main reason we didn’t end up at the bottom of the conference. The Gophers MVP out of nowhere.
2. Maurice Walker. Finally contributed. Last summer losing weight, this summer gaining strength, I am hopeful for a big year next year.
3. Joey King. Takes a lot of heat, but for a guy taking up the last scholarship, played well, played a lot and played hard. Hopefully can build strength and have a solid final 2 years. I think he will.
4. McNeill. Played meaningful minutes and didn’t look lost. That is more than I thought he would bring.
Neutral:
1. Oto. Prior to injury looked like a competent Big Ten player.

Under-achievers:
1. Andre. Injured or not, any hope that the Gophers had for making the NCAAs were based on him having a huge year. He didn’t and was actually less effective than as a sophomore.
2. Austin. Sometimes very good, often invisible. Needed to step up but didn’t.
3. Elliott Eliason. Decent start, pretty terrible Big Ten season. Have trouble believing he will get many minutes ahead of Mo next year. Looking much like a more agile poor- man’s Colton Iverson.
4. Buggs. Has flashes but a redshirt freshman should be part of the rotation. He wasn’t, at a position of need, and that tells you a lot.
5. Malik Smith. Three point shooters have to be able to make threes. Saw what he could do against Nebraska but terrible the rest of the year. Makes me miss Steve Esselink.
6. Mav. Mav is Mav. One wonders if he couldn’t have taken a few more shots and Malik Smith a few less. A scholarship senior needs to play more minutes (not his fault but the fact remains).
7. Wally. Probably didn’t have the ability but mid-season departure leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
Interesting that the Gophers over-achieved with their three “best” (based on pre-season thoughts) players under-achieving. That tell you how important Little Dre was. Next year, if both Little and Big Dre have big years and Mo Walker continues to develop, and there is a useful addition or two, this could be quite a good team.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

I'll be the voice of dissention. Under achieve means a player didn't play up to his talent/potential/expectations. In that sense I think most of these guys did NOT underachieve:

Dre - I'll give you that one although I think the truth is that Dre isn't as good as some thought he was. He's a good shooter and a good scorer but as a 2 guard he's a good player, not a great player. He is good enough to carry an offense at times but he's not a game changing scorer that can lift a mediocre cast up.
Austin - he is what he is. He didn't underachieve because he's never been a guy with the attacking or aggressive mentality needed to be relied on as a top scoring option. He's a very good complementary player but I wouldn't say he underachieved when he basically played how he always has

EE - he was a middle of the road B10 center. Had some really good moments, hope he gets better. not really an underachiever though

Buggs - classic case of putting blame on a player for a coaches recruiting or having to play too early. Buggs wasn't ready last year and wasn't ready this year. I can't call him an underachiever at this point because he was either recruited to a level above his ability or was forced into action before he was ready.
Mav - similar to Buggs. He didn't have B10 athletic ability or overall skill but he did what he could. Not his fault really
Wally - again similar to Buggs in that he wasn't ready for this level
Smith - Definitely underachieved based on that horrific stretch of Josh Smith level 3 point shooting. Of course before the year started it was clear from his past that the only way he'd benefit the team was by hitting shots and his box scores from FIU showed plenty of cold games. When he was hitting he was a big boost. When he wasn't he was somewhat of a liability out there.
 

oleboy41 said:
I'll be the voice of dissention. Under achieve means a player didn't play up to his talent/potential/expectations. In that sense I think most of these guys did NOT underachieve:
Click to expand...

Right on. Analysis in OP makes some good points but most of these guys played to their level. Just because we expected their level to be different doesn't change the fact they are what we got. Dre might be an exception but that's mainly the injury.
 

GopherCountry said:
I agree with you all. I would like to see Andre and McNeil shed some weight (or tone up) in order to add speed and quickness. Maybe because of his injury, Andre did not look as quick as last year. Hopefully with another strong off season, Mo can do the same as he lacks lateral movement and gets burnt on defense way to much and remains a defensive liability. Niguel Hayes made Mo look silly as Hayes consistently drove around Mo with ease. EE needs to improve is offensive game but still is our best option on defense.
Click to expand...

Mo improved greatly on defense during the course of the season. By the end he was guarding people pretty well, but the guys with good size and quickness like Hayes were too much for him (although Hayes makes a lot of people look bad). If he dedicates himself to improvement over the off season like he dedicated himself to losing weight last off season, he can take that next step.

If Malik Smith had started the season slow and gotten hot late (the inverse of what actually occurred), we might be talking about him overachieving. He was the streakiest of streak shooters. I wonder just what the heck computer virus got into his brain.

Andre Hollins is on the verge of being an enigma. People are making excuses for him, but there's no way a 4* recruit who had the sophomore year he had should look like he did his junior year. It's hard not to suspect something is amiss with his physical, mental or emotional state. And let's be real, he didn't look himself even before the injury.

It's easy to dismiss Elliott as having a "Gilligan, you can't fly; it's impossible" moment at some point in the season and falling back to earth. But I've always felt that if a person has done something, they can do it again. Similar to Malik, what happened to the dude?
 

Winnipegopher said:
I think we all agree that the Gophers over-achieved based on pre-season expectations. What is interesting to me is how much we over-achieved considering how few of our players had overachieving seasons based on pre-season expectations.

My rankings, and remember, this rating is based on what we (I) thought they would do prior to the season and which our ranking would be based on.

Over achievers:
1. Matthieu. A huge add and the main reason we didn’t end up at the bottom of the conference. The Gophers MVP out of nowhere.
2. Maurice Walker. Finally contributed. Last summer losing weight, this summer gaining strength, I am hopeful for a big year next year.
3. Joey King. Takes a lot of heat, but for a guy taking up the last scholarship, played well, played a lot and played hard. Hopefully can build strength and have a solid final 2 years. I think he will.
4. McNeill. Played meaningful minutes and didn’t look lost. That is more than I thought he would bring.
Neutral:
1. Oto. Prior to injury looked like a competent Big Ten player.

Under-achievers:
1. Andre. Injured or not, any hope that the Gophers had for making the NCAAs were based on him having a huge year. He didn’t and was actually less effective than as a sophomore.
2. Austin. Sometimes very good, often invisible. Needed to step up but didn’t.
3. Elliott Eliason. Decent start, pretty terrible Big Ten season. Have trouble believing he will get many minutes ahead of Mo next year. Looking much like a more agile poor- man’s Colton Iverson.
4. Buggs. Has flashes but a redshirt freshman should be part of the rotation. He wasn’t, at a position of need, and that tells you a lot.
5. Malik Smith. Three point shooters have to be able to make threes. Saw what he could do against Nebraska but terrible the rest of the year. Makes me miss Steve Esselink.
6. Mav. Mav is Mav. One wonders if he couldn’t have taken a few more shots and Malik Smith a few less. A scholarship senior needs to play more minutes (not his fault but the fact remains).
7. Wally. Probably didn’t have the ability but mid-season departure leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
Interesting that the Gophers over-achieved with their three “best” (based on pre-season thoughts) players under-achieving. That tell you how important Little Dre was. Next year, if both Little and Big Dre have big years and Mo Walker continues to develop, and there is a useful addition or two, this could be quite a good team.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Agree with most of what you said. I do think we are way too hard on Dre Hollins post injury. Its natural to have our most recent visual percecptions of him taint the entire view of his season. He was our leading scorer before the injury and was putting up 20 now and then. He looks really slow post injury and I think we are generalizing about his quickness using the most recent games as examples. Bottom line, he wasn't averaging 20 a game pre injury but he was effective. I would have had him on the cut line of "meets/doesn't meet expectations before the injury. I cannot fairy judge him as it was painfully obvious he was a shell of his former self post injury.

Regarding making the tournament next year.. I think that is a realistic goal next year. We have 4 good seniors (two guards, two front court) and you would imagine improvement from them. Factor in improvement from King and McNeil plus the new guys (odds are at least one of the 5/6 new guys will add value) and I don't see why we wouldn't improve over this year. We almost made the tourney this year, no reason we shouldn't next year. I think the real transition year will be 2015. Hopefully, lots of potential with a good freshman class.. but lots of growing pains as well.
 

Quick not on Andre Hollins:

Pre injury he was averaging 16.2 ppg post injury 11.8ppg. the 16 ppg was about 1.5 more than last year. Did everyone expect him to be 20+ppg guy, while moving from point to being off the ball? that being said he definitely had some bonehead turnovers that didn't seem very dre like. After the tournament he had last year and a faster system I was hoping for somewhere in the 18 ppg neighborhood so i guess im a little disappointed too.

That being said, im still excited about the direction of this team as a whole (even though we suffered through another disappointing February)..

Go Gophers!
 

I agree. My biggest disappointment was Austin. As a senior, he didn't show any leadership. He played terrible offensively. Defense was good, and usually I'd give him the benefit simply for his defense, he made glaring bone headed turnovers. Ones that shouldn't be made by a senior. He is a good guy, and he's worked his butt off, but still... wished he would have played better. Maybe Pitino's style really wasn't as well suited for Austin as we assumed? One has to wonder if that's the same issue for Big Dre also.
 

Bad Gopher said:
Andre Hollins is on the verge of being an enigma. People are making excuses for him, but there's no way a 4* recruit who had the sophomore year he had should look like he did his junior year. It's hard not to suspect something is amiss with his physical, mental or emotional state. And let's be real, he didn't look himself even before the injury.
Click to expand...

I agree.
 

Who knows.

If we don't sign Matthieu, maybe we finish last and Dre has a great year.
 

I'm glad that "Matthieu" will be around for another so we have someone to replace "Otto" in the misspelled name category.
 

I think Andre Hollins had a solid year pre-injury. Recall that he had poor turnovers last year as well. He is not a slasher, but a post-up shooter and excellent free throw shooter.
Elliot made some progress especially defensively, but struggles offensively.
Joey is tenacious but limited.
Mo improved a lot, but has a ways to go especially defensively.
Little Dre was better than expected but needs to reduce turnovers and how to defeat the high ball screen.
We need a banger who can rebound and play defense at the four (Martin?) and a slasher who can score ( Morris? Piper?).
The team needs to play better defense overall and reduce turnovers and improve 3 point shooting next year if we are to make the NCAA.
 


I agree with the grouping in the original post with the exception of two players: Mav and Elliott

Mav: Not a Big Ten player. He didn't underachieve, because he wasn't worse that what his talent had showed he was over the first three years of his career. Contrast that to Joey King who has similar limitations, but was able to overachieve to the point where he was useful at times (but also a major liability at other times).

Elliott: The kid was overachieving early in the year, and then really struggled as Mo improved. My own opinion is that Elliott forgot what he did well (protect the rim, rebound the ball fairly well, and make good decisions on outlet passes starting transition opportunities) and tried to show he could score like Mo. When his limitations on the offensive end remained, it seemed like his confidence took a hit and he stopped doing the things he was successful at previously.

Couple thoughts on two other players.

Andre Hollins: The frustrating thing to me about Andre is his game doesn't have enough facets to it. He's not a good ball handler, he's not a good defender, he's not a good passer, and he struggles to get all the way to the rim. That's not to say he's awful in all these areas, just that he's not above average for a two guard in any of these areas. He's become a 3 point shooter/mid range shooter who's not an elite shooter, but because of his strength and how high he jumps on his jumper can get his shot off with success. It's up to Andre to add something to his game, but I haven't seen it happen in three years.

Malik Smith: It's underrated how much his regression hurt this team going down the stretch. This already wasn't a deep team, and the team already had issues scoring the basketball, and then Malik became a total liability. At one point, he was not only a threat shooting the three, but started putting the ball on the floor and getting to bucket to draw a foul or creating a scoring opportunity for a big on a dump off. It's really too bad, because Malik one of the few Gophers who was confident in crunch time for much of the season. The only good news is that we won't miss him next season, because we basically played without him for a month or more.
 

I think King will really benefit from a year's worth of off season conditioning within our program and that he'll be a solid 16-18 minute contributor next year. On a good team, he can't play more than that but he has a role here and the kid can knock down the 3 a lot better than he showed overall this year and he should become a solid inside and outside threat and a good sixth man type for the next two years.

Mo did great compared to my expectations; which were low. Let's hope he can take another big step forward.

EE hurts us in so many ways. His reactions after foul calls is basically showing up the refs every single game and puts us behind the 8 ball. If i was a ref and had a kid cry like a baby every time I hit him with a foul call I'd hit him again quickly and that happened a lot this year. I wish Pitino would put him on a zero tolerance policy relative to whining. He also is no threat offensively from more than three or four feet which bogs down our whole O when he's in there; nobody on the other team has to guard him. At least Mo can hit 'em with a nice little baby hook and has a bit of range and is a really good passer. He has work to do, but I hope Mo plays 25 minutes next year and we go small at the 5 some more. I just find watching EE very painful regardless if he can block a shot or two and rebound a bit

Little Dre was great, but he'll be better next year too taking care of the ball and with being a bit more consistent. Fun kid to watch played with huge balls against Wisconsin; particularly compared to Big Dre.

Big Dre seems mentally out of sorts I'm not sure his heart is in it as much as it was; not sure why but he just seemed overall a bit down. He'll have some soul searching to do post this season.

I like our recruits for next year and I think we roll into the tourney in '15. It'll be interesting to see what Pitino does over the next months and years with the wealth of scholarships he'll have at his disposal.
 

EG#9 said:
I agree with the grouping in the original post with the exception of two players: Mav and Elliott

Mav: Not a Big Ten player. He didn't underachieve, because he wasn't worse that what his talent had showed he was over the first three years of his career. Contrast that to Joey King who has similar limitations, but was able to overachieve to the point where he was useful at times (but also a major liability at other times).

Elliott: The kid was overachieving early in the year, and then really struggled as Mo improved. My own opinion is that Elliott forgot what he did well (protect the rim, rebound the ball fairly well, and make good decisions on outlet passes starting transition opportunities) and tried to show he could score like Mo. When his limitations on the offensive end remained, it seemed like his confidence took a hit and he stopped doing the things he was successful at previously.



Couple thoughts on two other players.

Andre Hollins: The frustrating thing to me about Andre is his game doesn't have enough facets to it. He's not a good ball handler, he's not a good defender, he's not a good passer, and he struggles to get all the way to the rim. That's not to say he's awful in all these areas, just that he's not above average for a two guard in any of these areas. He's become a 3 point shooter/mid range shooter who's not an elite shooter, but because of his strength and how high he jumps on his jumper can get his shot off with success. It's up to Andre to add something to his game, but I haven't seen it happen in three years.

Malik Smith: It's underrated how much his regression hurt this team going down the stretch. This already wasn't a deep team, and the team already had issues scoring the basketball, and then Malik became a total liability. At one point, he was not only a threat shooting the three, but started putting the ball on the floor and getting to bucket to draw a foul or creating a scoring opportunity for a big on a dump off. It's really too bad, because Malik one of the few Gophers who was confident in crunch time for much of the season. The only good news is that we won't miss him next season, because we basically played without him for a month or more.
Click to expand...

Good take on Andre H and Malik.
 

I think the whole damn team underchieved. The only bright spot was Mathieu and he is a turnover machine. I never bought in to the preseason speculation that this team was a bottom feeder. They really only lost Mbakwe and Williams and they were both extremely flawed. I actually think this team was deeper than last year's and more talented, Pitino is very green and was outcoached more times than not. He may turn in to a great coach, but if his name wasn't Pitino we would seriously be considering if he was the right hire. Next year's team is going to be even worse and an NIT birth in '15 would be a success.
 

Benadryl Brownies said:
I think the whole damn team underchieved. The only bright spot was Mathieu and he is a turnover machine. I never bought in to the preseason speculation that this team was a bottom feeder. They really only lost Mbakwe and Williams and they were both extremely flawed. I actually think this team was deeper than last year's and more talented, Pitino is very green and was outcoached more times than not. He may turn in to a great coach, but if his name wasn't Pitino we would seriously be considering if he was the right hire. Next year's team is going to be even worse and an NIT birth in '15 would be a success.
Click to expand...

I'm not going to say anything about Benadryl Brownies because my mom told me: "If you can't say anything nice about someone, don't say anything."


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Benadryl Brownies said:
I think the whole damn team underchieved. The only bright spot was Mathieu and he is a turnover machine. I never bought in to the preseason speculation that this team was a bottom feeder. They really only lost Mbakwe and Williams and they were both extremely flawed. I actually think this team was deeper than last year's and more talented, Pitino is very green and was outcoached more times than not. He may turn in to a great coach, but if his name wasn't Pitino we would seriously be considering if he was the right hire. Next year's team is going to be even worse and an NIT birth in '15 would be a success.
Click to expand...

I disagree with just about everything said in this post other than Mbakwe and Williams being flawed. They were still our most talented players last year and were the biggest factors in our teams biggest strength which was being an excellent offensive rebounding team which made up for the general mediocrity of their offense. They also blocked and altered a lot of shots which made up for the mediocrity of the defense. Quite honestly we have exactly 5 Big Ten worthy/ready players this year (Lil Dre, Dre, Austin, Mo and EE). The rest of the roster are guys that either lacked true B10 talent (Smith, Mav, King, Oto maybe although I liked his skill set) or weren't ready to contribute significantly to a B10 team and in a better situation would've either rode the bench or played very limited minutes (Buggs, Wally, McNeil, maybe King should be here as well).
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom