What if we had been 9-3 (5-3) this year?

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harrys ghost

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Suppose we get the sack on third down against Cal instead of a penalty and pull out the game. If we eliminate the two first half penalties in the Wisconsin game that caused us to kick two field goals instead of scoring touchdowns we could have won that game. And, if we don't take the sack on second and goal inside the one in the Illinois game we could have won that one too.

In the above scenario, is Brewster a hero or goat? If he is a hero what about next year? If we went from 9-3 to 8-4 (or 7-5) should he be fired? If he is a goat, why?

My personal opinion is that improving the team is a continual on on-going process. People have complained about Brewster not playing more freshman. If he does, how does this affect our performance downstream?

Maybe I am drinking too much kool-aid, but it looks to me like Brewster has done a good job of setting up the personnel so that we have a progression going. We are losing seven starters on defense next year yet our line could improve and we should have more flexibility at line backer (some bigger guys and some faster guys). Both starting safeties return. The real question mark is CB but we return two guys that have started there (and we have a bunch of newcomers).

Success, at least to me, is not measured by a year or a game but a succession of years. Right now, it doesn't look like 2010 should be any worse than 2009. And, 2011 looks like it could be better than 2011. In Mason's third year he was 8-4. He followed that up with 6-6 and 4-7, respectively. Anything is possible, but I don't really see us doing as poorly as 4-7 (2-6) in either of the next two years.
 

I'll take it back a year. I hate to keep harping on this, but if Joel Monroe doesn't miss a 20-yd field goal, the Gophers are 8-1 with Michigan in town. That loss against Northwestern took all the wind out of their sails. Not just the loss, but how they lost. No one will ever convince me that they wouldn't have beaten either Michigan or Wisconsin if they win that game. If he makes that kick, Brewster's already been extended and all the B.S. from this year would be peanuts.
 

What if my aunt had a wiener?

Not a Brew hater but the what if game can go on forever.
 


If the Gophers went 8-4, 5-3 this year, of course the outlook on Brewster would be different. What if it isn't quite that easy? What if we had beaten Illinois like we should have -- and could have, despite an awful first half. Then we're 4-4 in the Big Ten and you could point to continued progress in terms of conference record. Yet, no real difference in how good or bad the team really is.

You are what your record says you are, regardless of a bad luck here or good luck there. The schedule seems tougher next year, with the "winnable" games on the road. Too bad. We'll need to win some games people aren't expecting us to. That's what you have to do to prove you're getting better.
 


Gopher07 said:
What if my aunt had a wiener?

Not a Brew hater but the what if game can go on forever.
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I guess you missed the point. If we had caught some breaks and gone 9-3 this last year, we would be in the same place we are now in terms of players and coaches. Is the situation somehow more palatable coming off 9-3 or not? If it changes things, why?
 

What if Paulus didn't throw that dumb INT in OT. What if the Air Force QB secured the ball away and didn't fumble. What if the we didn't score on that fluke TD against Michigan State.
 

harrys ghost said:
I guess you missed the point. If we had caught some breaks and gone 9-3 this last year, we would be in the same place we are now in terms of players and coaches. Is the situation somehow more palatable coming off 9-3 or not? If it changes things, why?
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I got the point -- we'd all be ecstatic to have a 9-3 record and probably overvalue the talent we have and justify why it got us to 9-3, rather than 6-6. But all the things added up over the course of the year and we ended up where we are.
 

Gopher07 said:
I got the point -- we'd all be ecstatic to have a 9-3 record and probably overvalue the talent we have and justify why it got us to 9-3, rather than 6-6. But all the things added up over the course of the year and we ended up where we are.
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So, your view is that we deserve to be at 6-6 and will probably not do better next year? How do you know you are not undervaluing the talent based on 6-6?
 



jjgopher said:
What if Paulus didn't throw that dumb INT in OT. What if the Air Force QB secured the ball away and didn't fumble. What if the we didn't score on that fluke TD against Michigan State.
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beat me to it. Considering the Gophers were BEHIND in every 4th quarter this year, they pretty much ended up where they should have been given their performances... a .500 team.

We can play "what if" every season.
 

harrys ghost said:
So, your view is that we deserve to be at 6-6 and will probably not do better next year? How do you know you are not undervaluing the talent based on 6-6?
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We were 6-6 this year, we easily could have been 3-9 or 10-2. Such is college football.
The fact we were close in so many games(by my count we had a chance against Cal, Wisky, Ill, Iowa), is a good sign, now the next step is to actually win them.
 

Looking back at this year, I think we could have easily won 9 games but also could have just as easily won 3 or 4. A few more breaks go our way and we win a few more of them. A few less breaks go our way and we lose a few more of them.
 

Alright, let's skip the close games (defined by 7 points or less) since they really could've gone either way -- then look at Minnesota's Big Ten record:

2004: 3-3
2005: 2-3
2006: 3-3

2007: 0-5
2008: 2-3
2009: 3-3

Though the improvement is there, the current level is that of mediocrity, thus I think the view of Brewster is still just. Next year is huge...
 



harrys ghost said:
So, your view is that we deserve to be at 6-6 and will probably not do better next year? How do you know you are not undervaluing the talent based on 6-6?
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I don't know. BUT ... we deserve to be 6-7 because we are 6-7. It's not like we were montrously screwed by the officials in one game, or monstrously gifted from them. Talent is one part of the team, a 6-7 team. I hope the talent, coaching, breaks, etc. gel to make us 7-5, 8-4, or 9-3 next year.
 

harrys ghost said:
Suppose we get the sack on third down against Cal instead of a penalty and pull out the game. If we eliminate the two first half penalties in the Wisconsin game that caused us to kick two field goals instead of scoring touchdowns we could have won that game. And, if we don't take the sack on second and goal inside the one in the Illinois game we could have won that one too.

In the above scenario, is Brewster a hero or goat? If he is a hero what about next year? If we went from 9-3 to 8-4 (or 7-5) should he be fired? If he is a goat, why?

My personal opinion is that improving the team is a continual on on-going process. People have complained about Brewster not playing more freshman. If he does, how does this affect our performance downstream?

Maybe I am drinking too much kool-aid, but it looks to me like Brewster has done a good job of setting up the personnel so that we have a progression going. We are losing seven starters on defense next year yet our line could improve and we should have more flexibility at line backer (some bigger guys and some faster guys). Both starting safeties return. The real question mark is CB but we return two guys that have started there (and we have a bunch of newcomers).

Success, at least to me, is not measured by a year or a game but a succession of years. Right now, it doesn't look like 2010 should be any worse than 2009. And, 2011 looks like it could be better than 2011. In Mason's third year he was 8-4. He followed that up with 6-6 and 4-7, respectively. Anything is possible, but I don't really see us doing as poorly as 4-7 (2-6) in either of the next two years.
Click to expand...

The main problem I think people are having with Brewster (and with Mason as well) is that we're always left to ask "what if" at the end of every season. This line of thinking seems to have become synonumus with Minnesota football over the years, which is why certain folks are giving up on Brewster already. Since we almost always have results which are lacking on the field, we engage in questions like "what if this had happened instead?" But at the end of the day, we're still left with what actually transpired, which is often less than desirable. Personally, I'll relish the day when we don't have to ask "what if" after a football season.
 

That's easy....

harrys ghost said:
I guess you missed the point. If we had caught some breaks and gone 9-3 this last year, we would be in the same place we are now in terms of players and coaches. Is the situation somehow more palatable coming off 9-3 or not? If it changes things, why?
Click to expand...

I'll tell you exactly where we'd be right now if the Gophers had gone 9-3. With an even MORE difficult schedule next year, most of the schleps on this board would be expecting to win 10-11 games next year.

And when the Gophers win 6 or 7 like they more than likely will (perhaps if they're lucky?), the fans would be back asking for Brew's head on a platter, just a year later than they are now....
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
I'll tell you exactly where we'd be right now if the Gophers had gone 9-3. With an even MORE difficult schedule next year, most of the schleps on this board would be expecting to win 10-11 games next year.

And when the Gophers win 6 or 7 like they more than likely will (perhaps if they're lucky?), the fans would be back asking for Brew's head on a platter, just a year later than they are now....
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Sad, but very, very true.

My only "what if" invoves the partial punt block near the end of the Wisconsin game. If Royster gets his full hand on the ball rather then the partial block they score. That only would have meant a much happier season!
 

harrys ghost said:
So, your view is that we deserve to be at 6-6 and will probably not do better next year? How do you know you are not undervaluing the talent based on 6-6?
Click to expand...

Are you taking any prescription medication? The scoreboard never lies.........
 

MRJ said:
The main problem I think people are having with Brewster (and with Mason as well) is that we're always left to ask "what if" at the end of every season. This line of thinking seems to have become synonumus with Minnesota football over the years, which is why certain folks are giving up on Brewster already. Since we almost always have results which are lacking on the field, we engage in questions like "what if this had happened instead?" But at the end of the day, we're still left with what actually transpired, which is often less than desirable. Personally, I'll relish the day when we don't have to ask "what if" after a football season.
Click to expand...

Right. If the Gophers played hard in every game, like they did against Cal -- we'd not only win a couple of those close losses, but people would be far less critical of the team.
 



As others have said, almost any team can play "what if". The problem is not "what if", its WHY you failed to succeed when the opportunities presented themselves. Why did we have to dig out of a hole versus Illinois? Why were we never able to stop 3rd down conversions? Why did an offense that played so well against MSU play so poorly against SDSU and Iowa? Etc, etc, etc. So "whys" are easier than others.

The reason people are going after Brewster is that we've been able to say "what if" for 3 seasons. In season 1, you convert the "what ifs" and its a 5 win season probably. Not great, but not horrific. Last season, you convert the "what ifs" and you have a 9 win season (at least). Convert this year, another 9 win season.

I don't blame people for going all Occam's razor and seeing a simple explanation in all of this. Maybe Brew isn't a good coach. I'm not giving up on the guy (and anyone who start's blasting me as a Masonite hasn't been paying attention). But he certainly hasn't proved otherwise. I think firing him now would be a mistake. But that doesn't mean you can't look at the poor finishes of the past two seasons and the multitude of missed opportunities and go "hmmmm..."
 

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