What do you think the Lineups should be (staters, 2nd group)

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zambam

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Just thinking about what our best lineups would be. Here are my ideas:

1st Unit:
Dre, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, EE
Group is pretty aggressive with 2 guys that can shoot pretty well with Dre and Austin. I also believe with this group Tubby might be able to put the press on, just keep EE all the way back.
2nd Unit:
Mav, Welch, Chip, Oto, Ralph
With this group we definitely lose toughness and rebounding but I think it is a pretty good shooting group with Oto and Ralph being the bigs out there. Chip can stay aggressive and attack. If this group does a good job moving the ball, and Ralph stays the f*ck out of the post, I think they can get some good open jumpers. Might have a problem matching up on D though.
 

zambam said:
Just thinking about what our best lineups would be. Here are my ideas:

1st Unit:
Dre, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, EE
Group is pretty aggressive with 2 guys that can shoot pretty well with Dre and Austin. I also believe with this group Tubby might be able to put the press on, just keep EE all the way back.
2nd Unit:
Mav, Welch, Chip, Oto, Ralph
With this group we definitely lose toughness and rebounding but I think it is a pretty good shooting group with Oto and Ralph being the bigs out there. Chip can stay aggressive and attack. If this group does a good job moving the ball, and Ralph stays the f*ck out of the post, I think they can get some good open jumpers. Might have a problem matching up on D though.
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Good post. Ralph will continue to start, I think, as much as this pains me. Eliason has so many intangibles that Ralph lacks. I absolutely loved all the NBA-style pick-and-rolling in the middle part of the game. Ever see Ralph execute like that? Nooooooooooo. EE also has a nose for the ball, and plays damn good defense - both man-to-man and help.

Dre v. Welch. Julian is an odd duck. He has a great game one time, then a dud like tonight. Dre has been a turnover machine at times. I say Welch continues to start. If it's a dud, and Dre plays well, stick with Dre, otherwise back to JW.

Maverick should see the floor less than he does.

Oto has played well of late - today being his best game yet (a la Dre). Chip should play when he's in control, sit when he's wild.

Just my opinions.....
 

GopherJake said:
Good post. Ralph will continue to start, I think, as much as this pains me. Eliason has so many intangibles that Ralph lacks. I absolutely loved all the NBA-style pick-and-rolling in the middle part of the game. Ever see Ralph execute like that? Nooooooooooo. EE also has a nose for the ball, and plays damn good defense - both man-to-man and help.

Dre v. Welch. Julian is an odd duck. He has a great game one time, then a dud like tonight. Dre has been a turnover machine at times. I say Welch continues to start. If it's a dud, and Dre plays well, stick with Dre, otherwise back to JW.

Maverick should see the floor less than he does.

Just my opinions.....
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I agree. Especially with Mav seeing the floor less. He is our 3rd PG, he should play minutes as such. But if we want two different units, Mav has to play. I went with Dre starting because I feel like he needs to play more to develop.
 


zambam said:
Dre..... I feel like he needs to play more to develop.
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Agree with this a lot. I just re-watched the game and they were talking about Coleman playing looser and letting things come to him more, now that he is starting. The same could be said about Dre, if he were starting, I think.
 


scher215 said:
I like the current lineups.
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+1

They don't need to, and, shouldn't change the starting line-up when they have won 4 of their last five and are playing well as a team. The starters collectively played poorly tonight, other than Austin and Coleman, and the second unit picked them up well. Last week the second unit was almost non-existent. Off-nights happen. Stick with what's working until it isn't, and give some of the second unit more PT when appropriate.
 

I wouldn't change it, I feel the more important thing is who finishes and whoever the best5 are that's who has to be out there. I think were finding a rotation that gells, now we just need to make our damn free throws
 

zambam said:
Just thinking about what our best lineups would be. Here are my ideas:

1st Unit:
Dre, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, EE
Group is pretty aggressive with 2 guys that can shoot pretty well with Dre and Austin. I also believe with this group Tubby might be able to put the press on, just keep EE all the way back.
2nd Unit:
Mav, Welch, Chip, Oto, Ralph
With this group we definitely lose toughness and rebounding but I think it is a pretty good shooting group with Oto and Ralph being the bigs out there. Chip can stay aggressive and attack. If this group does a good job moving the ball, and Ralph stays the f*ck out of the post, I think they can get some good open jumpers. Might have a problem matching up on D though.
Click to expand...

I think your lineups are unbalanced as I don't like a Ralph/Oto frontcourt for rebounding purposes and Mav/Welch is too slow a combo in the backcourt. I think I would stick with Welch, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, and Ralph as the starting lineup for the following reasons:

1. I legitimately worry that you lose Ralph completely (mentally) if he loses his starting spot to a freshman. I think Ralph can still be effective in spots and I'd rather keep him as a starter and look to Elliott to provide a boost off the bench. I'd certainly be in favor of increasing Eliason's minutes as long his play continues to warrant it.

2. I like Welch as the savvy guy who can keep the team settled down early in games. I don't think this team would fare too well (especially on the road) if it gets down by 8-10 early because their freshman PG is throwing the ball all over the place. Let Julian start and the team get in to a rhthym and let 'Dre observe from the bench. Play the more effective player to close out the game, but I favor the "safer" choice to start the game.
 

EG#9 said:
I think your lineups are unbalanced as I don't like a Ralph/Oto frontcourt for rebounding purposes and Mav/Welch is too slow a combo in the backcourt. I think I would stick with Welch, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, and Ralph as the starting lineup for the following reasons:

1. I legitimately worry that you lose Ralph completely (mentally) if he loses his starting spot to a freshman. I think Ralph can still be effective in spots and I'd rather keep him as a starter and look to Elliott to provide a boost off the bench. I'd certainly be in favor of increasing Eliason's minutes as long his play continues to warrant it.

2. I like Welch as the savvy guy who can keep the team settled down early in games. I don't think this team would fare too well (especially on the road) if it gets down by 8-10 early because their freshman PG is throwing the ball all over the place. Let Julian start and the team get in to a rhthym and let 'Dre observe from the bench. Play the more effective player to close out the game, but I favor the "safer" choice to start the game.
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+1
 



EG#9 said:
I think your lineups are unbalanced as I don't like a Ralph/Oto frontcourt for rebounding purposes and Mav/Welch is too slow a combo in the backcourt. I think I would stick with Welch, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, and Ralph as the starting lineup for the following reasons:

1. I legitimately worry that you lose Ralph completely (mentally) if he loses his starting spot to a freshman. I think Ralph can still be effective in spots and I'd rather keep him as a starter and look to Elliott to provide a boost off the bench. I'd certainly be in favor of increasing Eliason's minutes as long his play continues to warrant it.

2. I like Welch as the savvy guy who can keep the team settled down early in games. I don't think this team would fare too well (especially on the road) if it gets down by 8-10 early because their freshman PG is throwing the ball all over the place. Let Julian start and the team get in to a rhthym and let 'Dre observe from the bench. Play the more effective player to close out the game, but I favor the "safer" choice to start the game.
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Yeah, I agree. They can't lose Ralph completely. I know, a person can say he's lost mentally already after the last foul he committed last night. They're going to need him. They have to squeeze whatever is left out of him the rest of the way. Not deep enough up front for any other option.
 

Someone mentioned the intangibles of EE...I agree completely. Seems to have a more competitive edge than 3.0. Either way, Leonard is a much more refined player than either and would love to have him on my team.

After watching the last few games, I wish Colt was still around. I think he brought some nastiness out on the floor that they need from time to time on the floor.
 

Iverson was a lazy and stupid player

Who quit on his team half-way through last season. EE is twice the player and its a blessing that Iverson is off the team.
 

A game like last night shows just how unimportant a starting line-up is.
 



EG#9 said:
I think your lineups are unbalanced as I don't like a Ralph/Oto frontcourt for rebounding purposes and Mav/Welch is too slow a combo in the backcourt. I think I would stick with Welch, Coleman, Austin, Rodney, and Ralph as the starting lineup for the following reasons:

1. I legitimately worry that you lose Ralph completely (mentally) if he loses his starting spot to a freshman. I think Ralph can still be effective in spots and I'd rather keep him as a starter and look to Elliott to provide a boost off the bench. I'd certainly be in favor of increasing Eliason's minutes as long his play continues to warrant it.

2. I like Welch as the savvy guy who can keep the team settled down early in games. I don't think this team would fare too well (especially on the road) if it gets down by 8-10 early because their freshman PG is throwing the ball all over the place. Let Julian start and the team get in to a rhthym and let 'Dre observe from the bench. Play the more effective player to close out the game, but I favor the "safer" choice to start the game.
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Totally agree with point 1. As much as i can't stand RS3, we still need him.
 

I would keep line up just as it is...finally it is right.

Welch, Austin, Coleman, Ralph and Rodney

Dre, Mav, EE, Oto, Chip
 

The fact that we have a first and second group is my biggest gripe about tubby. 7th grade traveling teams sub 5 for 5. There can't be more than a dozen college teams that do it consistently.

Welch
Austin Hollins
Joe Coleman
Rodney Williams
Ralph Sampson

Signifcant minutes off the bench:
Eliason (should get more minutes that Ralph when Ralph plays like he ha the last two games but fewer minutes in most cases)
Chip Armelin (when he's hot I'd like to see him get as many as 20 minutes...when he isn't minutes should be limited because he is a defensive liability off the ball)
Dre hollins (should be backup point guard and should also get some time at the two, freshman and inconsistent but minutes should vary)


Limited role off the bench:
Oto (does some nice things off the bench but really shouldn't ever see more than ten per game in my opinion)


Emergencies only: (I get angry any time these two are on the floor
Maverick
Ingram
Anyone else on the roster that never gets minutes anyways.


We have a roster that could be a really good 8-9 man rotation and we play 10-11 guys.
 

+2

Is Maverick not the most frustrating play on this team? I want to throw something at the TV everytime I see him on the floor.
 


zambam said:
I agree. Especially with Mav seeing the floor less. He is our 3rd PG, he should play minutes as such. But if we want two different units, Mav has to play. I went with Dre starting because I feel like he needs to play more to develop.
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Just rewatched the Indiana win...without Mav we lose that game badly...and earlier this year when both Welch and Dre were hurt...Mav carried the load to a one lose pre-season. He will never be a all big ten type...but he is a serviceable PG and at times plays extremely well.

Remember that Mav, not Welch or Dre, was leading the charge at PG when we turned a 7 pt deficit into a 4 point lead midway through first period. Stop hating...remember last season how badly we all missed Cobbs...when the year before this board wouldn't lay off the kid.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
Just rewatched the Indiana win...without Mav we lose that game badly...and earlier this year when both Welch and Dre were hurt...Mav carried the load to a one lose pre-season. He will never be a all big ten type...but he is a serviceable PG and at times plays extremely well.

Remember that Mav, not Welch or Dre, was leading the charge at PG when we turned a 7 pt deficit into a 4 point lead midway through first period. Stop hating...remember last season how badly we all missed Cobbs...when the year before this board wouldn't lay off the kid.
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Great points, GiP. We have definitely needed Mav at times. I am not in the camp that says put him at the end of the bench with Mo Williams :)cool: CRG) and TM. I think he should get 5 minutes in the first half and not play in the 2nd, unless a) he earns it (e.g., last night) or b) JW & Dre don't earn it.
 

StCroix said:
+2

Is Maverick not the most frustrating play on this team? I want to throw something at the TV everytime I see him on the floor.
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I think Ralph is the more frustrating player due to higher expectations. I've seen Maverick to not expect anything more than getting the ball 50 feet up the court-- anything more than that is gravy. Ralph, for some reason, I still expect to make some great plays. But I really only remember about 10 aggresive plays all year and the soft plays stand out in my mind.
 

People always talking about Ralph and expecting more. Start expecting what Ralph is. A finesse power forward who is gonna give you 10 and 6 unless he's playing a physical opponent and then he disappears.
I know he has size and athleticism. But he is not an attacker. That's not his game. He is a role player and a pretty good one if put in the position to play his role.

He has been awful for two games, but I think he is key to the rest of the season.
 

So many experts, so little expertise.

It's Tubby's job to put the right guys together at the right time through the course of a game.

It's worked 4 of the last 5 games.
 

Julian Welch has been one of our better players this year. No way he doesn't start. He's had two tough games in a row, that's all.
 

I don't think it matters who starts, as long as they come out with good energy. Just be glad you have other options on the bench if the starters suck. I like EE but he has to get stronger, he commits too many fouls at this point. He does a lot of good things though. I think he is a diamond in the rough. Who has potential to put on 10 more pounds of muscle by next season. Kid plays with tremendous effort though. I like Andre off the bench as well, he commits too many turnovers but he's going to be a really good player and ditto on the effort. He keeps playing like he did last night he'll play a lot. The good thing the gophers have going is, that Mbakwe, Williams and Big Mo are most likely going to be back next year and with this quintet of guards you're going to be in great shape!! Seems people who have criticized Tubby's recruiting are eating more and more crow by the week.
 

Just thankful that Tubby is willing to mix and match a little more in the second half. At least the last couple of games he's been paying attention to who is clicking and who isn't (although sometimes I think it's also foul trouble that forces his hand with substitutions) and not sticking with the platoon system down the stretch.
 


FanSinceTheFifties said:
When did this given-name rage start?
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Ha! I noticed you posted on this before: calling players by their first name. All I can say is let it go and accept it. I have a pet peeve also, I just can't get myself to call it The Ohio State University. I did my rant to no avail. Just let it go my friend, tis the internet.
 

Not pretention at all to call it THE Ohio State University since folks from Montreal and even Portland, Oregon are always musing, "Was that Ohio U or THE Ohio State University?" Ray Williams friend, you rant is validated.
 


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