What are we afraid of?

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Rockraven said:
You just made the point by accident. It isn’t that we need to play weaker teams, it’s that we need to keep getting better. Don’t limit your potential like you limit Gopher football potential. Believe and achieve. Don’t settle for being average. That said the Gophers are taking the next step now.
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I have been saying that for years. It's a catch-22 of sorts. For MN, elevated winning will lead to better recruits, which should equate to more elevated winning. Having said that, recruiting for Gophs drops off rather quickly if consistent 8+ regular seasons can't consistently be maintained, with occasional seasons below and of course above that expectation. The argument is USC adds a program that now will most likely be considered the 3rd/4th best team in the conference, and another program to overcome. With the B1G eliminating divisions, that puts one more team between where the Gophs currently are and the 1st/2nd spot in the conference.
 

PMWinSTP said:
I have been saying that for years. It's a catch-22 of sorts. For MN, elevated winning will lead to better recruits, which should equate to more elevated winning. Having said that, recruiting for Gophs drops off rather quickly if consistent 8+ regular seasons can't consistently be maintained, with occasional seasons below and of course above that expectation. The argument is USC adds a program that now will most likely be considered the 3rd/4th best team in the conference, and another program to overcome. With the B1G eliminating divisions, that puts one more team between where the Gophs currently are and the 1st/2nd spot in the conference.
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Defeatist. Get better faster. We are not as far away as most think.
 

Gophers1992 said:
They did at this time in 2020. That loss in Iowa City apparently ruined any chance we would ever have at a Rose Bowl.
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Well, the Rose Bowl as we know it. and what was left of its allegiance with the B1G is about to go away. so a B1G team in the RB may be even less common than it has become. Not the Jan 1 (or 2) late afternoon fixture preceded by the Rose Parade. Watching the pregame yesterday and the drone shots around the stadium throughout the game, you can tell the traditional RB game is different and has more class and pageantry than playing inside Mercedes Benz stadium.

“After the 2023 season, the Rose Bowl will be a College Football Playoff semifinal. So only by chance will a Big Ten and/or Pac-12 team play in the game. For different reasons, beginning with the debut of the 12-team playoff in 2024, the same circumstances will apply…Beginning in 2026, it will be filled with whatever teams are in the system at whatever date and time the CFP deems necessary.”

www.cbssports.com

Saying goodbye to the 'traditional' Rose Bowl: Penn State prevails over Utah as historic game enters new era

The Rose Bowl will continue to be played, but it's going to take on an entirely different look
www.cbssports.com www.cbssports.com
 


PMWinSTP said:
I have been saying that for years. It's a catch-22 of sorts. For MN, elevated winning will lead to better recruits, which should equate to more elevated winning. Having said that, recruiting for Gophs drops off rather quickly if consistent 8+ regular seasons can't consistently be maintained, with occasional seasons below and of course above that expectation. The argument is USC adds a program that now will most likely be considered the 3rd/4th best team in the conference, and another program to overcome. With the B1G eliminating divisions, that puts one more team between where the Gophs currently are and the 1st/2nd spot in the conference.
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Most everything 😱
 



Catechol said:
Well, the Rose Bowl as we know it. and what was left of its allegiance with the B1G is about to go away. so a B1G team in the RB may be even less common than it has become. Not the Jan 1 (or 2) late afternoon fixture preceded by the Rose Parade. Watching the pregame yesterday and the drone shots around the stadium throughout the game, you can tell the traditional RB game is different and has more class and pageantry than playing inside Mercedes Benz stadium.

“After the 2023 season, the Rose Bowl will be a College Football Playoff semifinal. So only by chance will a Big Ten and/or Pac-12 team play in the game. For different reasons, beginning with the debut of the 12-team playoff in 2024, the same circumstances will apply…Beginning in 2026, it will be filled with whatever teams are in the system at whatever date and time the CFP deems necessary.”

www.cbssports.com

Saying goodbye to the 'traditional' Rose Bowl: Penn State prevails over Utah as historic game enters new era

The Rose Bowl will continue to be played, but it's going to take on an entirely different look
www.cbssports.com www.cbssports.com
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Nothing is set in stone for 2026.

Indeed, everyone will use 2024 and 2025 as a trial run of the new CFP and fix or tweak as needed.

The Rose may not be able to bear the changes and opt out.


Who’s to say that through the quarter finals or even semi finals, it shouldn’t just be at campus sites like in the NFL?? Natty, like Super Bowl, neutral site.
 

we don't know for sure what the situation with the B1G will be going forward.

a lot of people seem to think that there will be no divisions, but as far as I know, that has not been made official yet.

I am more interested in what the B1G does with scheduling. starting in 2024, MN will play 9 (or maybe 10) of the other 15 teams in the conference. so that means 5 or 6 schools that MN will not meet in a given year. that has the potential to swing a schedule from less challenging to extremely challenging, depending on who you play and who you don't play.

if the cards all line up in a particular season, where MN has a good team and draws a less challenging schedule, while other contending teams have stronger schedules, then yes, there is still a path to contend for a conference title.

on the other hand, if MN hits a year where the talent is a little down, and they draw a really tough schedule, well........

so scheduling is going to be very pivotal going forward.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
a lot of people seem to think that there will be no divisions, but as far as I know, that has not been made official yet.
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They don't need to, and won't, announce it until later this year sometime. They only do the conference schedules one year in advance now.
 




Gophers1992 said:
Fickell is a good coach no question, but I don't know that he's any more proven than PJ is, and we have enough resources to compete with Wisconsin. I certainly think he was a great hire for them, but I'm not sure that I'm "afraid" pf Bucky so to speak.
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He is an actual X and O guy (was a coordinator), played at a blue chip, coached a considerable amount of time at a blue chip as an asst., and won as a HC at a higher level. I'd hardly say he's not a more proven coach than PJ.
 

OddStack said:
He is an actual X and O guy (was a coordinator), played at a blue chip, coached a considerable amount of time at a blue chip as an asst., and won as a HC at a higher level. I'd hardly say he's not a more proven coach than PJ.
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Fickell did an excellent job at Cincinnati. In his best season he won 13 games, the same amount PJ won at western Michigan, a G5 with fewer resources than Cincinnati. Fickell has the advantage of showing more sustained success at the G5 level. However he has proven nothing at the big ten level, while PJ has shown an ability to have sustained success at a higher level than Fickell has. Fickell might be a better coach, but he’s not any more of a proven commodity than PJ is.

On top of that Fickell is almost 8 years older.
 

Gophers1992 said:
Fickell did an excellent job at Cincinnati. In his best season he won 13 games, the same amount PJ won at western Michigan, a G5 with fewer resources than Cincinnati. Fickell has the advantage of showing more sustained success at the G5 level. However he has proven nothing at the big ten level, while PJ has shown an ability to have sustained success at a higher level than Fickell has. Fickell might be a better coach, but he’s not any more of a proven commodity than PJ is.

On top of that Fickell is almost 8 years older.
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Fickell was a coach at OSU for 15 years. 23 total coaching in college. Do not underestimate his ability.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Fickell was a coach at OSU for 15 years. 23 total coaching in college. Do not underestimate his ability.
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Im not at all underestimating his ability, I’ve repeated multiple times that he is a great coach. I’m simply saying PJ’s resume stacks up with his just fine.
 

AF_Howie_2180 said:
Everyone keeps saying oh we missed our chance at that spot in the B1G Title game this year, sure is going to get harder with the likes of USC and UCLA joining in 2024.....Well not sure what everyone is afraid of with them joining up? Anything can happen at any point during the season, USC for one is beatable just look at what happened to them playing Tulane last night in the Cotton Bowl, kick returner makes a stupid play with about 3 and half minutes left. Couple plays later there is a safety and look out here comes the Green Wave with a miracle finish. At the end of the day a W is a W no matter how you get it and there is no reason the Gophers can't do some of that themselves moving forward.
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Going to be much harder for a team to duplicate Tulane when their coach doesn’t believe in momentum.
We are 1 and 100 when behind at the half or some such number. So, we also better have been ahead at half time or it’ll be doubly hard for PJ’s Gophers to go Vikings over Colts on any of our opponents. But we could, yes.
 

You want to know how far away the Gophers are from being competitive in Power 5 football in 2023?
Purdue 20 Minnesota 10
LSU 63 Purdue 7
 

roadrunner said:
You want to know how far away the Gophers are from being competitive in Power 5 football in 2023?
Purdue 20 Minnesota 10
LSU 63 Purdue 7
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If we want to use irrelevant transitive property scores, we beat Wisconsin, who beat Maryland, who beat NC state, who beat Florida state, who beat LSU. Checkmate
 



mngg11 said:
Relative to? Throw some objective, quantitative analysis out there and I'll buy what you're selling, brother. Otherwise,
View attachment 22923
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Yes it’s mostly just my opinion but the upper end of the B1G West (Iowa and WI most years, never the Gophs) is nowhere near the upper-end caliber of most other conferences. Maybe our middle-tier teams are “competitive”, but the conference as a whole has been weak. I think most college football fans would rank the B1G west as the weakest or second weakest in all P5 in the CFB era.
 

LSU had 6 starters opt out. Starting RB, RG, WR and 3 DL. So let's not use Purdue's opt outs as a justification.
 


Gophers1992 said:
Fickell did an excellent job at Cincinnati. In his best season he won 13 games, the same amount PJ won at western Michigan, a G5 with fewer resources than Cincinnati. Fickell has the advantage of showing more sustained success at the G5 level. However he has proven nothing at the big ten level, while PJ has shown an ability to have sustained success at a higher level than Fickell has. Fickell might be a better coach, but he’s not any more of a proven commodity than PJ is.

On top of that Fickell is almost 8 years older.
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I'd argue having a front row seat and an integral role at tOSU for so long and then doing what he did at Cincy proves plenty. You are correct, as a HC he hasn't proven anything at the B1G other than holding tOSU together through suspensions as the Interim HC to a 6-7 record and gong 2-3 against top 25 teams. However, as a coach he has a much greater track record of success than PJ!

Fickell coordinated Big Ten teams that played for 2 Natties and won one of them. He also coordinated Big Ten teams that finished the season ranked 4, 2, 5, 9, 5, 5, 3, 12, 1, 4, and 6 consecutively.

Similar G5 resources:
PJ was 2-7 (1 loss in a bowl to #8 WI) against P5 schools at W.M. with no ranked upsets.
Fickell was 7-5 against P5 teams while taking down #9 Notre Dame (2 losses were in bowls #9 GA, #1 Bama in CFP).

While at W.M. PJ finished ranked once (#15); Fickell finished ranked 4 consecutive seasons: 24, 21, 8 and 4.

I hope I'm dead wrong!!!!! I hope this is a laugher in 3, 4, 5 years!!!! However, yes, I fear what Fickell will do with Bucky!


edit: discarded this year's bowl game for Cincy in Fickell's P5 totals.
 
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OddStack said:
I'd argue having a front row seat and an integral row at tOSU for so long and then doing what he did at Cincy proves plenty. You are correct, as a HC he hasn't proven anything at the B1G other than holding tOSU together through suspensions as the Interim HC to a 6-7 record and gong 2-3 against top 25 teams. However, as a coach he has a much greater track record of success than PJ!

Fickell coordinated Big Ten teams that played for 2 Natties and won one of them. He also coordinated Big Ten teams that finished the season ranked 4, 2, 5, 9, 5, 5, 3, 12, 1, 4, and 6 consecutively.

Similar G5 resources:
PJ was 2-7 (1 loss in a bowl to #8 WI) against P5 schools at W.M. with no ranked upsets.
Fickell was 7-6 against P5 teams while taking down #9 Notre Dame (3 losses were in bowls #9 GA, #1 Bama (CFP) and Louisville).

While at W.M. PJ finished ranked once (#15); Fickell finished ranked 4 consecutive seasons: 24, 21, 8 and 4.

I hope I'm dead wrong!!!!! I hope this is a laugher in 3, 4, 5 years!!!! However, yes, I fear what Fickell will do with Bucky!
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Yes Fickell has better track record as a coordinator, PJ has comparable if not better success as a head coach, which to me matters more.
 

People forget that in 2019 we beat Auburn by 7 points, who beat Alabama by 3 points, who lost to eventual national champion LSU by just 5 points. So by that math we were 5 points better than LSU in 2019, a team that is considered one of the greatest in modern CFB history. If just 3 years ago we were one of the best teams in CFB history, I believe we can get back to being close to that level.
 

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Gophers1992 said:
People forget that in 2019 we beat Auburn by 7 points, who beat Alabama by 3 points, who lost to eventual national champion LSU by just 5 points. So by that math we were 5 points better than LSU in 2019, a team that is considered one of the greatest in modern CFB history. If just 3 years ago we were one of the best teams in CFB history, I believe we can get back to being close to that level.
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We will exceed it year in and year out. I did a quick review of the roster yesterday and like what I saw. My key to success is developing the big uglies over 4 or 5 years and reload them yearly. I see that happening and do not worry about the turnover through graduation. Take high 3 stars and put them in the program and take a couple years to teach them the system as they develop Cohen soon practicing together.
 

Gophers1992 said:
People forget that in 2019 we beat Auburn by 7 points, who beat Alabama by 3 points, who lost to eventual national champion LSU by just 5 points. So by that math we were 5 points better than LSU in 2019, a team that is considered one of the greatest in modern CFB history. If just 3 years ago we were one of the best teams in CFB history, I believe we can get back to being close to that level.
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I'm comparing 2 teams that played the SAME TEAM in the SAME YEAR. I'm not sure how your comparison is even relevant.
 

roadrunner said:
I'm comparing
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That is where you started to go wrong, and it just got worse from there.

Apples and oranges.

You aren’t the first person low on college football knowledge attempt to compare your way to some silly conclusions. So it is okay. No worries.
 

roadrunner said:
You want to know how far away the Gophers are from being competitive in Power 5 football in 2023?
Purdue 20 Minnesota 10
LSU 63 Purdue 7
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Yeah, I thought about that when I saw the LSU v Purdue score. Of course comparing scores among three teams isn't a certain measure of their relative strengths, but that pair of games is more than a little telling.
 

There is no doubt that WI has been on the slippery slope for a few years and sliding further down each year.
Fickell has already made significant improvements in areas that he perceived as needing more and better players.
The ill will generated when Leonhard was not named HC has dissipated.
Now, will he have a better conference record over the next few years than PJ will?
We will just have to wait and see.
 

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