whaley/gray?

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doctor j

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Could someone explain to me why 2 of our best players got 1 play each on Saturday? Kevin Whaley, in my view, is the best back we have, and Marqueis Gray should be given AT LEAST 10 plays a game.
 


doctor j said:
Could someone explain to me why 2 of our best players got 1 play each on Saturday? Kevin Whaley, in my view, is the best back we have, and Marqueis Gray should be given AT LEAST 10 plays a game.
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Whaley actually carried the ball twice, but otherwise, your point is valid (and a good one).
 

weber and eskridge are better, but some balance is in time is certainly warranted given the talent both of these kids have-I continue to be at a loss to understand why we don't put our talent on the field more often. Gray ran one play-a hand off which blew up. No chance to run at all-simply one and done is simply unexplainable. Eric Lair gets the rock on an end around (which I loved), but no love for gray. Wow.
 

I don't really understand all this questioning, especially with regards to Gray, who we haven't seen throw the ball at all.

The coaches see these players a LOT more than we do. They also do this for a living. They want to win games as much as we do. If they thought Whaley or Gray was dramatically better than what they were putting out there, they would be getting more time. I'm not saying it's not possible they're wrong, but they're better at this than we are, and they have a lot more information than we do. If they think Weber and Eskridge give us the best chance to win, I'm going to go ahead and give them the benefit of the doubt.
 


Maybe the coaches didn't have confidence in the OL giving Gray enough time to read the Defense and make a play. The speed of play is an adjustment from HS to D-1.
 

RedPoo said:
I don't really understand all this questioning, especially with regards to Gray, who we haven't seen throw the ball at all.

The coaches see these players a LOT more than we do. They also do this for a living. They want to win games as much as we do. If they thought Whaley or Gray was dramatically better than what they were putting out there, they would be getting more time. I'm not saying it's not possible they're wrong, but they're better at this than we are, and they have a lot more information than we do. If they think Weber and Eskridge give us the best chance to win, I'm going to go ahead and give them the benefit of the doubt.
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Considering the ineptitude of Weber, I refuse to accept that a 4* dual threat QB with exceptional talent is worse and riding the bench. There's another reason... and that's what we're all trying to find out.
 

magpie said:
Considering the ineptitude of Weber, I refuse to accept that a 4* dual threat QB with exceptional talent is worse and riding the bench. There's another reason... and that's what we're all trying to find out.
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Why do some act like Weber has been absolutely terrible? He hasn't been great, and I expected more out of him this year but the coaches should know more than anybody if Gray is ready.

The OP says Gray and Whaley are two of our best players yet they've hardly played. How do we know if they are our best players?
 

If you've watched Gray play at all, you can see he is loaded with talent. The problem is, we've not seen him throw -- and he's a QB. At least we know he's taller, faster, and a better scrambler/runner than Weber. I'm under the impression that he either 1) hasn't learned the offense, or 2) throws a lot of picks in practice. If neither of those are true, I think he deserves to throw a few balls in a game -- and we'll see how good he actually is. But for now, he's better than Weber on the comparisons we have seen.

No opinon on Whaley. Looks like he runs hard, but I can't imagine he's the same as he was pre-injury. We've just had bad luck with RB's getting hurt and not returning with the same potential, or not making the grades. I'd like to see more of him -- he seems like a beast. Kind of feels more like a tailback to me though.
 



GophersInIowa said:
Why do some act like Weber has been absolutely terrible? He hasn't been great, and I expected more out of him this year but the coaches should know more than anybody if Gray is ready.

The OP says Gray and Whaley are two of our best players yet they've hardly played. How do we know if they are our best players?
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You answered your own question. Weber has been starting 3 years now. And I have seen little improvement. Take Decker away from his receiving corps and Weber would be awful. Decker is the only reason why Weber looks decent and has decent numbers.

Is Gray better? I don't know, but he can't be worse. I don't understand why Brewster burned his redshirt. He will waste 2 years of eligibility before he gets serious clock. I wouldn't be surprised if he kicks rocks.
 

If the Gophers lose to Purdue it will be tough to reach a bowl game. I think that's what it will take to finally get Brewster to invest in Gray. You'd think it'd be obvious to build chemistry between Gray and the young WR's we've got, but then again he's not really a coach yet...
 

Weber might be better without Decker!?? Maybe he'd have to read quicker if he wasn't so dependent on Decker. Not saying he would be, just saying our other recievers are decent, if he spread it around more effectively it might make things better, and if that's what Weber had to do to be effective I bet he'd learn how.
 

Maybe, but I'd rather have Gray learning that next year, than a senior who wasted 3 years trying to figure that out.
 



I'm pretty comfortable with a QB who is getting to the point that he knows where the ball should be, pre-snap, that people are accusing of him of throwing to his first option to many times.
 

RedPoo said:
I don't really understand all this questioning, especially with regards to Gray, who we haven't seen throw the ball at all.

The coaches see these players a LOT more than we do. They also do this for a living. They want to win games as much as we do. If they thought Whaley or Gray was dramatically better than what they were putting out there, they would be getting more time. I'm not saying it's not possible they're wrong, but they're better at this than we are, and they have a lot more information than we do. If they think Weber and Eskridge give us the best chance to win, I'm going to go ahead and give them the benefit of the doubt.
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I agree, though I would say they want to win a lot more than we do. After all, their livelihood- not just their team pride- is on the line. The best players play. Bottom line.
 

monk10 said:
I'm pretty comfortable with a QB who is getting to the point that he knows where the ball should be, pre-snap, that people are accusing of him of throwing to his first option to many times.
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Well said, i dont know why you would want to throw to one of if not the best wide reciever in colelge football. and for those saying weber would be bad w/o decker.... For the time being we do HAVE decker and might as well use a star like him every pay.
 

monk10 said:
I'm pretty comfortable with a QB who is getting to the point that he knows where the ball should be, pre-snap, that people are accusing of him of throwing to his first option to many times.
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No one is accusing him of throwing too much to Decker. Just pointing out the obvious. Decker won't be here next year. So Weber might want to get comfortable throwing to other receivers.

chri1673 said:
Well said, i dont know why you would want to throw to one of if not the best wide reciever in colelge football. and for those saying weber would be bad w/o decker.... For the time being we do HAVE decker and might as well use a star like him every pay.
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God willing Decker will stay healthy because if he doesn't we are in trouble. This isn't about how good Decker is, no one is saying he isn't. This about Weber's inability to make big plays that don't involve Decker. Because it would be nice to go into next season knowing that with Decker gone, we won't become a 3 or 4 win team.
 

I had this exact conversation with someone today. I agree with those above who basically say that if the coaches thought Gray gave the team a better change to win, he'd be playing...end of story. There's very little loyalty when it comes to playing time in major college football. Jobs are on the line every week, and the best players will play, regardless of seniority. In my humble opinion, Gray should be getting at least one series a half to try and work his way in. That said, the coaches don't see it that way and I trust them.

Now Whaley, OTOH, I really feel is a better player than our other backs. From what I saw in Spring practice/game and his limited action so far this year, he's so much more decisive and explosive than our other backs...it seems fairly obvious to me. IMHO, he must be in the doghouse big time...
 

Bottom line is if Gray is going to get 1-5 plays a game, he should have been be red-shirted.
 

Have any of you guys, in your lifetime, ever seen a guy come off the bench due to injury and just light it up, turn into a star? Have you ever heard of Wally Pipp? Coaches make mistakes in judging talent all the time. Look at the NFL draft. Just because a guy is on the bench does not mean he is inferior to the starter. If Gray just had one series and the chance to throw 3 or 4 passes, at least he'd have some experience should Weber ever get dinged up. I would just love to see the guy get a chance, that's all. In the spring game, he wasn't allowed to run. In the fall, he isn't allowed to pass. COME ON!
 

I have also seen very few freshmen QB's be successful. It's a luxury to be able to groom a QB for two years before he plays. It's a good thing. We're lucky to be in this position.
 

Donovan said:
Bottom line is if Gray is going to get 1-5 plays a game, he should have been be red-shirted.
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We also have a higher-rated QB prospect a year behind Gray. I don't know where to verify this info, but I assume Alipate has a redshirt. I wouldn't be at all surprised if part of what got him here was the assurance that the job would be his to lose for his final two years of eligibility.
 

maybe gray cant pick up the offense fast enough. i expect there will be absoultely no QB controversy with the coaches this year, but with gray having a full extra year for next year i expect weber will still start next year but gray will see some drives(10-15%).
 

chri1673 said:
maybe gray cant pick up the offense fast enough. i expect there will be absoultely no QB controversy with the coaches this year, but with gray having a full extra year for next year i expect weber will still start next year but gray will see some drives(10-15%).
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The thing that gets me is if Gray isn't learning the Offense quick enough I'm fine with that but you can't sit here and expect me to believe that he's not capable of learning a set of 5 plays? Really? Wildcat is it?
 

What happens if we are trailing by 14 going into the 4th Q and Webster has thrown 2 interceptions and lost 2 fumbles? Will Brewster and Fisch feel they have to make a change to Gray? I don't even know if it would be the right move, but facing two losses and upcoming back to back trips to Penn State and Ohio State would ratchet up the pressure to an amazing level.

Let's hope we don't find out.
 

MGGopher said:
I had this exact conversation with someone today. I agree with those above who basically say that if the coaches thought Gray gave the team a better change to win, he'd be playing...end of story. There's very little loyalty when it comes to playing time in major college football. Jobs are on the line every week, and the best players will play, regardless of seniority. In my humble opinion, Gray should be getting at least one series a half to try and work his way in. That said, the coaches don't see it that way and I trust them.

Now Whaley, OTOH, I really feel is a better player than our other backs. From what I saw in Spring practice/game and his limited action so far this year, he's so much more decisive and explosive than our other backs...it seems fairly obvious to me. IMHO, he must be in the doghouse big time...
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To a point I can buy that coaches see the players in practice etc and make the decision to play whose best. But sometimes I think that coaches insecurities don;t allow them to make changes that they should. Dave D'Ellesandro (sp) used to write about this in the Sporting News related to the NBA. He said that Mark Jackson was nearly cut several times before a coach finally let him play and D"Eles... thought that Jackson was near HOF quality at the end of his career. I took a football coaching class at the U of South Carolina in the mid 80's and had the varsity coaches as teachers. The DC was a guy named Tom Gadd (a real hardass) who coached for Gutey later. Gadd told the class that everyone was clammoring for a guy named Rootbeer Johnson to get some playing time because he got 2 or 3 sacks in the spring game. Gadd said to the class that he could not play Johnson because he did not understand the defensive scheme, that Johnson only knew, "get 'em" (meaning the QB). I could care less if Johnson knew the scheme, put him in there in passing situations and let him get the QB. Hell, Johnson was a natural pass rusher, a talent and Gadd might have wasted him. I think that even though Gray does not know offensive scheme and doesn't make correct reads all the time in practice, he's a talented athlete who could/might really make some good things happen, IF our coaches are secure enough to play him.
 

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