Video: P.J. Fleck is BEST Minnesota Gophers coach in 75 years!

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Great Plains Gopher said:
PJ is a 60% winner, the best since pre-WWII Bierman. But a national championship will never happen. With no divisions to win, we should be happy with what we have.
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The program has come so far......

This is the same argument for not firing Mason. It was time to fire Mason. It is not time to fire Fleck - Mason had reached his ceiling here and it wasn't changing. Fleck has consistently dribbled chances down his leg, so there is still potential upside.

But yeah, if the ceiling is Meh, Good Enough, be happy with what we've got, warts and all.
 

why you wouldn't just say 50 and make it way more accurate is impressively dumb, but I guess what do you expect out of these guys?

Tough to make generation comparison given the Nebby add in 2011 and the MD/Rutgers add in 2014, all of which made the conference worse in terms of average strength of opponent. unfortunately PJ hasn't gotten us all the way over the Kill/Claeys years hump like it looked like he may early in his tenure.

Biggest thing for PJ is that he's going to need spikes like 2019 or it will get stale and he'll get fired eventually. Humans are comparison animals and when you see IU and Illinois putting seasons together that may make the playoffs, people will get restless eventually. It's actually become easier to make the playoff so the bar should become (for all B10 teams tbh) to occasionally flirt with that. You only have to be 4th best in the conference to do so.
 



Comparing any college coach today to previous generations is an apples/oranges endeavor. The portal, NIL, revenue sharing and conference realignment has changed everything. The dust still hasn't firmly settled.
 



caliGopher said:
The program has come so far......

This is the same argument for not firing Mason. It was time to fire Mason. It is not time to fire Fleck - Mason had reached his ceiling here and it wasn't changing. Fleck has consistently dribbled chances down his leg, so there is still potential upside.

But yeah, if the ceiling is Meh, Good Enough, be happy with what we've got, warts and all.
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That's sad when you look at what Curt Cignetti has done at Indiana in less than 2 years. Im starting to think that most Minnesota Gopher football fans have accepted mediocracy as the peak.
 



BleedGopher said:

Go Gophers!!
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The University of Minnesota Gopher Athletics must stop settling for mere "competitive" seasons. With a substantial, nine-figure operating budget and elite administrative compensation, the financial resources already committed to this program justify demanding Big Ten championships.

The case of Indiana University is a direct call to action. As a traditional peer with similar resources, IU recently made the deliberate and dramatic choice to aggressively invest in football, backing its demand for excellence with significant institutional financial support and eight-figure coaching contracts. While Minnesota’s budget ranks in the same Big Ten tier as Indiana's, only IU has demonstrated the willingness to make the bold spending choice necessary to break the cycle of mediocrity and genuinely contend.

We must collectively reject competitive anonymity. It is time to demand what the program’s resources are paying for: Big Ten Championships and a culture of sustained excellence comparable to any peer that chooses to invest.
 



FanSinceTheFifties said:
National championship? A coach needs to win one to be recognized?
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To be honest, I don't think Fleck has the killer mentality to get a team to a title game. Even if the NIL donations start flowing in at a higher mark and his recruiting eclipes the top "20" on a regular basis. It all comes down to his coaching mentality/strategy, which has been super conservative since day 1.

I know it's a total different scenario, but watching the Bengals take it to the Steelers last night with a 41 yr old vet slinging the ball all over the place, is exactly what needs to be done with this team. I'm not equating Zac Taylor to Fleck or vice versa, but he went into that game with an agressive gameplan and it worked. Granted having a WR like Chase doesn't hurt, but they had nothing to lose against the number 1 team in their division. I approach every Gopher game, with the hope that Fleck will come out with the "win at all costs" mantra, instead of this "play not to lose" crap. I truly don't think this will ever change with Fleck and feel that it has cost him some good to very good coordinators along the way. If the university and fanbase are happy with 7 - 8 win seasons every other year, then start allocating more revenue to basketball. We play in the premiere league, where countless schools would love to be in our situation. So why not take the next step and find a coaching staff that is hungry and won't settle for mediocrity...
 

gopherguy said:
The University of Minnesota Gopher Athletics must stop settling for mere "competitive" seasons. With a substantial, nine-figure operating budget and elite administrative compensation, the financial resources already committed to this program justify demanding Big Ten championships.

The case of Indiana University is a direct call to action. As a traditional peer with similar resources, IU recently made the deliberate and dramatic choice to aggressively invest in football, backing its demand for excellence with significant institutional financial support and eight-figure coaching contracts. While Minnesota’s budget ranks in the same Big Ten tier as Indiana's, only IU has demonstrated the willingness to make the bold spending choice necessary to break the cycle of mediocrity and genuinely contend.

We must collectively reject competitive anonymity. It is time to demand what the program’s resources are paying for: Big Ten Championships and a culture of sustained excellence comparable to any peer that chooses to invest.
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In the case of Indiana, I believe their NIL is significantly higher than MN's. I think that plays just as much of a factor in their greater success, if not more, than internal resources. And that gap could get even more significant as it appears Mark Cuban is getting involved with their athletic programs.
 

FanSinceTheFifties said:
National championship? A coach needs to win one to be recognized?
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Recognized?

No.

And Fleck doesn't need to worry about being recognized, he makes sure he's recognized as often as he can with every June press release about the outstanding top 25 recruiting class than ends up in the upper 30 to mid 40s on signing day.

Or the Boast of his 11 win season being the first since 1904. Sounds amazing. Until you realize that 1) We only played in our first bowl game in 1960, so comparing win totals with a bowl game prior to that is apples and oranges. 2) Between 1906 and 1959 we played 10 games only once (1931) which featured a double header against Ripon College and North Dakota Agricultural College (later NDSU) that appear to have been scrimmages, but were counted in the Won/Loss record for the season (we won both).

Or point out that neither Bernie Bierman nor Murray Warmath ever won more than 10/8 games in a season (the figure used to be 10, but was edited recently)

  • In true Millennial fashion, PJ left out the fact that, for Bierman, that would have been some feat as the first 10 years of his tenure, the season was only 8 games long. During that time, all he did was win 5 national titles (3 AP, two others), 7 Big Ten Championships (then the Western Conference), and 4 unbeaten seasons (e.g, 8-0).
  • In his second stint, after his military service (Marine Reserve called up to active duty in the US after the attack on Pearl Harbor), the Gophers played 9 games for the remaining 6 years of his career, where he won 7 games twice. In total Bierman has a winning percentage above Fleck’s best regular season (83.3%) in 5 of his 16 seasons (31.3%).
  • Side note, Bierman also never won a bowl game. Because HE NEVER COACHED IN ONE.

  • Warmath coached in nine regular-season games in his first 11 seasons as coach, and then ten games for the next 6 seasons, and eleven games in his final season. During that time he managed to win a national title, two conference titles, a Rose Bowl Game that he earned (he lost the equivalent of the APR Bowl in the Rose Bowl the following year when tOSU declined to play in it), and had a winning percentage above 83.3% in 2 of his 18 seasons (11.1%)

Note: Fleck only season with a winning percentage above 80% was 2019, 1 of his 7 complete seasons (excluding 2020) to date (14.3%)

Worshipped?

Yes.

A National Title does get you there.

For now, let's set a more realistic next step. Let's start with actually being competitive for the B1G title (and no, we weren't competitive for the title in 2019 or 2022. We may have been one win away from the conference title game in both of those seasons, but we didn't win those games. We were at best between the 5th and 7th team in the conference those seasons, only managing to avoid being the annual sacrificial lamb to the East.
 
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caliGopher said:
Recognized?

No.

And Fleck doesn't need to worry about being recognized, he makes sure he's recognized as often as he can with every June press release about the outstanding top 25 recruiting class than ends up in the upper 30 to mid 40s on signing day.

Or the Boast of his 11 win season being the since 1904. Sounds amazing. Until you realize that 1) We only played in our first bowl game in 1960, so comparing win totals with a bowl game prior to that is apples and oranges. 2) Between 1906 and 1959 we played 10 games only once (1931) which featured a double header against Ripon College and North Dakota Agricultural College (later NDSU) that appear to have been scrimmages, but were counted in the Won/Loss record for the season (we won both).

Or point out that neither Bernie Bierman nor Murray Warmath ever won more than 10/8 games in a season (the figure used to be 10, but was edited recently)

  • In true Millennial fashion, PJ left out the fact that, for Bierman, that would have been some feat as the first 10 years of his tenure, the season was only 8 games long. During that time, all he did was win 5 national titles (3 AP, two others), 7 Big Ten Championships (then the Western Conference), and 4 unbeaten seasons (e.g, 8-0).
  • In his second stint, after his military service (Marine Reserve called up to active duty in the US after the attack on Pearl Harbor), the Gophers played 9 games for the remaining 6 years of his career, where he won 7 games twice. In total Bierman has a winning percentage above Fleck’s best regular season (83.3%) in 5 of his 16 seasons (31.3%).
  • Side note, Bierman also never won a bowl game. Because HE NEVER COACHED IN ONE.

  • Warmath coached in nine regular-season games in his first 11 seasons as coach, and then ten games for the next 6 seasons, and eleven games in his final season. During that time he managed to win a national title, two conference titles, a Rose Bowl Game that he earned (he lost the equivalent of the APR Bowl in the Rose Bowl the following year when tOSU declined to play in it), and had a winning percentage above 83.3% in 2 of his 18 seasons (11.1%)

Note: Fleck only season with a winning percentage above 80% was 2019, 1 of his 7 complete seasons (excluding 2020) to date (14.3%)

Worshipped?

Yes.

A National Title does get you there.

For now, let's set a more realistic next step. Let's start with actually being competitive for the B1G title (and no, we weren't competitive for the title in 2019 or 2022. We may have been one win away from the conference title game in both of those seasons, but we didn't win those games. We were at best between the 5th and 7th team in the conference those seasons, only managing to avoid being the annual sacrificial lamb to the East.
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An impressive recounting of the history of Gopher football. You're right, the Gophers were a national power until 1961 when a new era began in Twin Cities sports.

Fleck has done as well or better than any coach here since the waning years of Warmath as the Gopher fortunes declined. Having been a Gopher fan since I was a youngster, I have no expectation of them being a national power. I hope for an occasional 10 win year with the norm being around 6 to 8 wins. The one thing that could change that is NIL -- if some alum insisted on a no-price-is-too-high for victories, there could be a possibility of UM being in the top 10 maybe. But it's not worth fretting about. There were decades after the 60s that I watched each Saturday with no thought of winning most games. Now, under Fleck, I have reasonable hope of winning most days.

Thank you for the civil discussion.
 

GlobalGopher11 said:
To be honest, I don't think Fleck has the killer mentality to get a team to a title game. Even if the NIL donations start flowing in at a higher mark and his recruiting eclipes the top "20" on a regular basis. It all comes down to his coaching mentality/strategy, which has been super conservative since day 1.

I know it's a total different scenario, but watching the Bengals take it to the Steelers last night with a 41 yr old vet slinging the ball all over the place, is exactly what needs to be done with this team. I'm not equating Zac Taylor to Fleck or vice versa, but he went into that game with an agressive gameplan and it worked. Granted having a WR like Chase doesn't hurt, but they had nothing to lose against the number 1 team in their division. I approach every Gopher game, with the hope that Fleck will come out with the "win at all costs" mantra, instead of this "play not to lose" crap. I truly don't think this will ever change with Fleck and feel that it has cost him some good to very good coordinators along the way. If the university and fanbase are happy with 7 - 8 win seasons every other year, then start allocating more revenue to basketball. We play in the premiere league, where countless schools would love to be in our situation. So why not take the next step and find a coaching staff that is hungry and won't settle for mediocrity...
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An interesting view. I know that passing is exciting for many fans. I think Fleck uses what talent we're able to recruit (and stay) as well as he can. We've seen a big turn toward passing this year at the cost of losing rushing yards. The gophers to me tend to make few stupid mistakes and probably need to keep avoiding them to compete with our schedule.

One final point, I'll watch tonight's Neb game with the hope that we CAN win. For decades I had no such hope against Neb or teams like them.
 


"P.J. Fleck is BEST Minnesota Gophers coach in 75 years!"​

Assuming they are only talking about football - that's a pretty low bar. Overall, I would say Herb Brooks would get my vote
 


I’m not sure he even has been the most successful coach in the last 50 years. Cal Stoll had a conference record of 27-29 in the ‘70’s. PJ’s conference record is similar at 36-37.
 
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caliGopher said:
The program has come so far......

This is the same argument for not firing Mason. It was time to fire Mason. It is not time to fire Fleck - Mason had reached his ceiling here and it wasn't changing. Fleck has consistently dribbled chances down his leg, so there is still potential upside.

But yeah, if the ceiling is Meh, Good Enough, be happy with what we've got, warts and all.
Click to expand...
Gotta disagree that it was time to fire Mason. Mason was working had to get ready for the new stadium. He had some very good recruits committed including an elite linebacker. Mason also lobbied the legislature and was the reason they approved funding for the new stadium.

Maturi also fired Mason late without a plan and ended up with Brewster. Who knows what Gopher football would look like now if Mase would have captained the program in the new stadium.
 

WAGopher said:
Gotta disagree that it was time to fire Mason. Mason was working had to get ready for the new stadium. He had some very good recruits committed including an elite linebacker. Mason also lobbied the legislature and was the reason they approved funding for the new stadium.

Maturi also fired Mason late without a plan and ended up with Brewster. Who knows what Gopher football would look like now if Mase would have captained the program in the new stadium.
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The new stadium… please, everyone was/is getting new stadiums, it doesn’t create the recruiting explosion that people keep throwing out there. Brew recruited well because he was a good recruiter, Kill wasn’t so he didn’t, they both had the benefit of a new stadium.
 


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