Tre' Williams enters the Portal

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eker0016 said:
The order of players I wanted to keep:
1. Liam Robbins
2. Jamal Mashburn
3. Gabe Kalscheur
4. Brandon Johnson
5. Tre Williams
6. Isaiah Ihnen
6. Both Gach
7. Martice Mitchell
8. Sam Freeman

I’ve always assumed Carr was gone after this year.
Losing Williams is disappointing. He really started to improve, I thought. I guess Ben Johnson has one more spot to work with now.
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Mine is similar,
Liam
Gabe
Mitchell
Isaiah
Johnson
Mash
Tre
Gach
Freeman
 

leib0039 said:
This isn't great. I know it's year 1 so we expected bumps, but when you hire someone completely out if the blue due almost entirely based on his recruiting chops, he better figure that out ASAP. Landing guys from D2 and low majors isn't generally a recipe for success in the B1G
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PJ says it's year zero.
 

hungan1 said:
"If you can shoot the basketball, I am going to love you" - Ben Johnson.

Doesn't tre Williams love to shoot the basketball?



Is it panic time yet?
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He didn't say he likes players who love to shoot the basketball. He said he loves players who CAN shoot the basketball.

As far as your question, "no." We're not nearly in as bad of shape as Penn State. Just means our coach will have a busy recruiting summer like lots of other coaches.
 

goldengophers said:
Crazy, going to be like watching an expansion team next year.
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If our team was one of the few experiencing that, then the situation would be very frustrating but that's not going to be the case.
 

UpAndUnder43 said:
I didn't saw ALL the guys you named. And El Amin and Fox are huge question marks. El Amin is really inefficient in a weak conference. Fox is a D2 kid who can't shoot
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I don't have any opinion on Fox. However, I think you're being a bit harsh to El Amin. His PER in each of the last two years is 16.0 (not great but solid) and his win shares per 40 minutes was over .10 (again, not great but decent). His True Shooting Percentage was .523 (not bad).

Now, those numbers aren't as good as Brandon Johnson's last year at Western Michigan (PER 21.8, WS/40 .141). As to the point that you would expect slippage moving to the Big Ten Conference, well sure. Johnson's numbers did slip a bit but not that much. He had very respectable numbers here and he likely was our 3rd best player.

Even if Al Amin's numbers slip a bit here, he's likely to be better than either Williams or Mashburn were this past season.
 


As the season went on and the wheels came off, I started to appreciate his “don’t give a F” attitude. He would throw up some bad shots, but it usually came after a few terrible consecutive possessions from someone else. He actually started to knock some of them down and was figuring out how to score. Feel like he will be or could have been a great third scorer for a team that had an offensive system. Put him in an offense with action that creates cutting lanes and he’d be on the scouting report.
 

whalenfan said:
Theres plenty of guards in the portal that take terrible shots and shoot 30% from the ft line. He has talent but his basketball IQ is low.
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Well, true, but given the expectedly fierce competition for the good ones, we may end up taking one of those flawed ones. Hopefully, we at least avoid the terrible free throw shooters.
 

eker0016 said:
The order of players I wanted to keep:
1. Liam Robbins
2. Jamal Mashburn
3. Gabe Kalscheur
4. Brandon Johnson
5. Tre Williams
6. Isaiah Ihnen
6. Both Gach
7. Martice Mitchell
8. Sam Freeman

I’ve always assumed Carr was gone after this year.
Losing Williams is disappointing. He really started to improve, I thought. I guess Ben Johnson has one more spot to work with now.
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Not bad but if you want better rebounding move Ihnen and Freeman up the list.
 






I will just say this:

IF anyone believes that the Gophers cannot find two players who are equal to or better than Williams and Freeman, then this program truly has no hope.

This board has a habit of falling in love with players who show a little flash of potential in limited playing time, or have one or two good games.

When you have guys who are equivalent to Williams and Freeman, you know what happens - you finish in 13th place in the conference.

I thought the goal was to do better than that.

"Hey, we had a really disappointing year. We need to keep the same players who allowed us to have a disappointing year."

If the Gophers wind up replacing every player on the roster, so be it. Sure, I would like to see Robbins stay - but considering he joined the Gophers based on his uncle and cousin being part of the program, I think the odds of Robbins leaving are pretty bleepin' high. Unless Uncle Ed stays as part of Johnson's staff, which I think is a really long shot.
 

Ozzy&Ray said:
He loves to shoot it but not well. I’m sure Ben is sitting around his hotel with a beer and some chips waiting for someone to tell him what to do. Probably hasn’t even thought yet about assistant coaches, just waiting for apps, you know?

Really? Why are you panicking? He hasn’t even been the coach a week. Some of the asst coaches he is interested in and has probably talked to are likely still coaching. You don’t sacrifice who you want on your staff just to appease some fans in the short-term.
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I don't know when a good time to fire coaches is. But, at least he has time to ruminate. The key is that he hires the right assistant coaches. Preferable ones with head coaching experience who have played basketball.

This is a high risk/high reward hire if I ever see one. Coyle and Gabel rolled the dice and checked all the boxes except for head coaching experience. He is gambling on those trumping the lack of experience.

Okay, I will panic two to three years from now. What have I got to lose? We were in BB dregs the last decade or so. Any improvements over the last eight years will be quite an accomplishment. The bar has been set too low with the last coach.
 



short ornery norwegian said:
I will just say this:

IF anyone believes that the Gophers cannot find two players who are equal to or better than Williams and Freeman, then this program truly has no hope.

This board has a habit of falling in love with players who show a little flash of potential in limited playing time, or have one or two good games.

When you have guys who are equivalent to Williams and Freeman, you know what happens - you finish in 13th place in the conference.

I thought the goal was to do better than that.

"Hey, we had a really disappointing year. We need to keep the same players who allowed us to have a disappointing year."

If the Gophers wind up replacing every player on the roster, so be it. Sure, I would like to see Robbins stay - but considering he joined the Gophers based on his uncle and cousin being part of the program, I think the odds of Robbins leaving are pretty bleepin' high. Unless Uncle Ed stays as part of Johnson's staff, which I think is a really long shot.
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This team was 11-4 and ranked #16. They fell apart because they lacked an identity and Pitino proved to be a poor game coach. Freeman and williams were effective defenders. Freeman didn't really have an opportunity to do anything offensively and williams was inefficient because the offense rarely set players up for easy baskets. Not saying they are all conference, but very solid role players.
 

We need to stop acting like losing guys such as Sam and Tre are a loss. Tre couldn’t shoot, dribble, pass (effectively). He’s a bench player at best. Sam’s a big body but that’s about it. He has no fluidity, footwork, or finishing skills. He’s a low D-1 player at best.
 

UpAndUnder43 said:
The Madsen's aren't good so I'm happy to read this. Tre Williams is better than either of them. Unless we can stack them on top of each other like a super madsen and have a giant player with 4 arms I don't want them.
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Just to be clear, you’re that confident that Gabe is bad based on a 2 game sample size? The first two games of his college career?
 

GopherBB12 said:
We need to stop acting like losing guys such as Sam and Tre are a loss. Tre couldn’t shoot, dribble, pass (effectively). He’s a bench player at best. Sam’s a big body but that’s about it. He has no fluidity, footwork, or finishing skills. He’s a low D-1 player at best.
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This is pretty hyperbolic
 


cjbfbp said:
I don't have any opinion on Fox. However, I think you're being a bit harsh to El Amin. His PER in each of the last two years is 16.0 (not great but solid) and his win shares per 40 minutes was over .10 (again, not great but decent). His True Shooting Percentage was .523 (not bad).

Now, those numbers aren't as good as Brandon Johnson's last year at Western Michigan (PER 21.8, WS/40 .141). As to the point that you would expect slippage moving to the Big Ten Conference, well sure. Johnson's numbers did slip a bit but not that much. He had very respectable numbers here and he likely was our 3rd best player.

Even if Al Amin's numbers slip a bit here, he's likely to be better than either Williams or Mashburn were this past season.
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IMHO, any of the current players who feel entitled the door is wide open. They have to earn their playing time all over. We don't need a team of elitist/entitled players who don't play team basketball.

I hope that BJ is astute enough to have an exciting brand of basketball with shooters who can shoot and who can play team defense. Up to this day, I can't figure out what Richard's basketball stratagem is. If you want fans back in the stands, put a team together that can score at will. At least make it very competitive. Not this hot/cold team where you upset a rated team one week then get steamrolled by a less talented team the next week. AND we should at least make it very difficult for any team to come to the Barn and win.

Let's rock the Barn!
 
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bc2211 said:
As the season went on and the wheels came off, I started to appreciate his “don’t give a F” attitude. He would throw up some bad shots, but it usually came after a few terrible consecutive possessions from someone else. He actually started to knock some of them down and was figuring out how to score. Feel like he will be or could have been a great third scorer for a team that had an offensive system. Put him in an offense with action that creates cutting lanes and he’d be on the scouting report.
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Potential, yes. But still untapped. My guess is that anyone who shows up in the portal after Ben's hiring has had a conversation with him and made a decision that it is better for him to go. From my view, I think he would have the potential of being a contributor next year, but there is no reason to lose sleep over his departure. He'll do great in the Valley, WAC or MW.
 

PhiloVance said:
Take the perspective of a potential assistant coach or players seeing Gophers jumping ship...aren't you wondering what the heck is going on? You fire your coach, you hire a first time coach, the players who played major minutes during the end of the year are leaving. Just saying from the outside it can't be looking all that good.
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No, I think they most get it. It’s what happens.
 


PhiloVance said:
Take the perspective of a potential assistant coach or players seeing Gophers jumping ship...aren't you wondering what the heck is going on? You fire your coach, you hire a first time coach, the players who played major minutes during the end of the year are leaving. Just saying from the outside it can't be looking all that good.
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Go to "Verbal Commits Transfers 2021" and sort by school. We've lost 4 players to the transfer portal so far. Indiana and Penn State have each lost 7. George Washington has lost 8. UNLV has lost 6. Wake Forest has lost 6. Tulsa lost 6. Cincinnati lost 6. Pitino's new school has lost 5. Nebraska lost 5. Ole Miss has lost 5. Utah lost 5. Washington lost 5. Pittsburgh lost 5. St. Bonaventure was in the NCAA tournament and they lost 5.

Xavier, Vanderbilt, Texas, Texas A&M, St. John's, Kansas State, Iowa State, Georgia, Boston College, and Auburn each lost the same number as us.

There are plenty of other schools that I didn't mention because they are lesser mid-majors. The champ would seem to be UT-Martin which appears to have lost its entire team.

So, the good news is that we certainly aren't alone or conspicuous in the current environment.

The bad news is that lots of teams need lots of players so the recruiting competition should be very fierce.
 

WriterGoph said:
But to say that Williams "can't do anything" and not acknowledge that Freeman was showing some good defensive skills is a mischaracterization.
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I’m basing my comments of the stand point of everyone wanting our program to elevate to that next level. Based off Tre’s stats and Sam’s “development”, which BIG Team that would have a top 5 finish take these guys? Sure they could make a roster but I doubt they see floor time. I just feel they don’t have the basic fundamentals down. Look at Wisco. Those boys play hard and do the little things right. I’m personally holding a higher standard for this program. Not saying we will be top 10 but a top 25 program consistently is doable. I wish those two nothing but success going forward.
 

GopherBB12 said:
I’m basing my comments of the stand point of everyone wanting our program to elevate to that next level. Based off Tre’s stats and Sam’s “development”, which BIG Team that would have a top 5 finish take these guys? Sure they could make a roster but I doubt they see floor time. I just feel they don’t have the basic fundamentals down. Look at Wisco. Those boys play hard and do the little things right. I’m personally holding a higher standard for this program. Not saying we will be top 10 but a top 25 program consistently is doable. I wish those two nothing but success going forward.
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"Fundamentals" and "do the little things right" are generally products of good coaching. Pitino was fired for being a poor coach. Some would argue any success they did have was in spite of Pitino. I was personally hoping to see them in a new system.
 


cjbfbp said:
I don't have any opinion on Fox. However, I think you're being a bit harsh to El Amin. His PER in each of the last two years is 16.0 (not great but solid) and his win shares per 40 minutes was over .10 (again, not great but decent). His True Shooting Percentage was .523 (not bad).

Now, those numbers aren't as good as Brandon Johnson's last year at Western Michigan (PER 21.8, WS/40 .141). As to the point that you would expect slippage moving to the Big Ten Conference, well sure. Johnson's numbers did slip a bit but not that much. He had very respectable numbers here and he likely was our 3rd best player.

Even if Al Amin's numbers slip a bit here, he's likely to be better than either Williams or Mashburn were this past season.
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I would expect him to slip much more. I’ve been wrong a lot and only way we will ever know is if he lands himself a spot on a big ten team
 

GopherBlood666 said:
This team was 11-4 and ranked #16. They fell apart because they lacked an identity and Pitino proved to be a poor game coach. Freeman and williams were effective defenders. Freeman didn't really have an opportunity to do anything offensively and williams was inefficient because the offense rarely set players up for easy baskets. Not saying they are all conference, but very solid role players.
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Perfectly stated.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
I will just say this:

IF anyone believes that the Gophers cannot find two players who are equal to or better than Williams and Freeman, then this program truly has no hope.

This board has a habit of falling in love with players who show a little flash of potential in limited playing time, or have one or two good games.

When you have guys who are equivalent to Williams and Freeman, you know what happens - you finish in 13th place in the conference.

I thought the goal was to do better than that.

"Hey, we had a really disappointing year. We need to keep the same players who allowed us to have a disappointing year."

If the Gophers wind up replacing every player on the roster, so be it. Sure, I would like to see Robbins stay - but considering he joined the Gophers based on his uncle and cousin being part of the program, I think the odds of Robbins leaving are pretty bleepin' high. Unless Uncle Ed stays as part of Johnson's staff, which I think is a really long shot.
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I think there's a decent chance Conroy is on the staff. Also the NCAA hasn't actually passed the free transfer rule yet and it's not known if players who already got a waiver will get to transfer a 2nd time. So overall there's a decent chance Liam will be on the team.
 

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