Time to add Grand Canyon to your CBB bucket list

[BleedGopher]

I went to my first GCU home game tonight and I was blown away. This is my 21st different college basketball arena and I would legit put this in the top 3 as far as atmosphere along with Phog Allen and Cameron Indoor. Obviously the importance of the game was not on the same planet (the game itself was just bad basketball), but that made the atmosphere that much more impressive.

ADs and marketing leads should make the trek to Phoenix to attend a GCU game. It was a 2.5 hour party, and I can’t wait to attend again.

They have a pretty new 7,000 arena, perfect size for this program. Going into this game Bryce Drew has his squad 15-8, decent but not great in their conference. They played an awful New Mexico St team.

I arrived 30 minutes before tip and the student section was packed and rocking. The rest of the seats filled in by the 20 minute mark. The entire side of the arena opposite the benches was packed with students, baseline to baseline.

Once the clock hit 15 minutes to tip the party began. Choreographed chants, pep band playing modern music, some piped in current songs that both students and non students were up and rocking to. By the time the teams were announced the crowd was electric.

Once the game started there were choreographed chants, the students were going nuts on each made basket, etc. And in between each timeout the atmosphere was like a Gopher football game in between the 3rd and 4th quarters. Literally, every time out. The only ever time I’ve seen that much energy in every time out is at a Duke game. I’ve seen 40+ games at KU and have never seen sustained crowd and student engagement like this.

And for those that love to give excuses why the Gophers don’t draw well:

- So many other choices in Twin Cities…no city in the world has more sports/entertainment options than Phoenix does over the next 4 days.

- Gophers suck…GCU is so much worse. The actual game product was awful.

- Bad opponent… New Mexico St is brutal.

- Campus is dangerous…GCUs campus is gorgeous, 1 block away is worse than Minneapolis.

- Midweek game…Wednesday night.

The Gopher game day experience is exactly what it was for decades. Literally nothing has changed. Same animal costumes in the front row, same in-game promotions, same Little Chippers halftime game, etc.

There’s no vision, there’s no breaking the mold. Now, I truly haven’t experienced an atmosphere like this before so it’s not as if it’s being replicated across the country, but it made me sad at how far our fan experience has fallen and how little vision we have within our athletic department.

Yes, winning big will fill the place, but even if/when that happens I have a hard time believing it will consistently reach the energy of a random Wednesday night at GCU against an awful opponent.

Go Gophers!!

 

[golfing18now]

My daughter will be a first year student at GCU in the fall. They flew her out there for an "exploratory" weekend where she got to attend a basketball game and see the campus on their dime. Very impressive and the game day experience was awesome as you cite here.

 

[Gopherfan84]

Recruits notice the lack of atmosphere. Mbakwe mentioned it in their pod when talking about why he went to Marquette. Winning would help, but I agree with you that the U doesn’t put much work into making it an experience. I also think they get a lot of feedback from many older fans that they don’t want it either. Double edged sword, but I’m on your side here Bleed.

 

[BarnBurner]

Yet another miss from the U Admin.

 

[Ewert86PC]

Recruits notice the lack of atmosphere. Mbakwe mentioned it in their pod when talking about why he went to Marquette. Winning would help, but I agree with you that the U doesn’t put much work into making it an experience. I also think they get a lot of feedback from many older fans that they don’t want it either. Double edged sword, but I’m on your side here Bleed.

This. This "lack of atmosphere" is the Meta wrapper that is killing basketball, men's and women's, at UMN. The administration wants a compliant and cooperative student body that lives off-campus.

Athletics is not an off-campus element of college life. We found that out with the Metrodump fiasco.

This underscores how disconnected from the city and state administrative focus is. The University of Minnesota is not a private college, but administration wants to run it like so.

Winning is the key because people are attracted, if even out of mere curiosity, to winning. It's easier to change hearts and minds, if you are winning.m

 

[Wet_Blanket_Guy]

Great post. The atmosphere in the arena has been terrible for years. It needs to dramatically change!

 

[Holy Man]

I’ve never been to GCU but have several families with kids there from Minnesota. They all love it including the basketball. I’ve seen their student section on the road in California at a MTE and it is amazing.

GCU has been around for a long time but more recently focused on growing their in person campus (heavily online and correspondence before that). My understanding is that they have used basketball to enhance campus community life and grow their university.

In some ways St. Thomas is GCU 2.0 with the intent of using sports to grow the profile on the school. Jury is out on whether it works or is worth it, but at least both of them are trying, unlike our beloved U. It could be easier for schools with more homogeneous student bodies, but it can be done if there is a will to do it.

Thanks for the report on what can be done.

 

[MennoSota]

I went to my first GCU home game tonight and I was blown away. This is my 21st different college basketball arena and I would legit put this in the top 3 as far as atmosphere along with Phog Allen and Cameron Indoor. Obviously the importance of the game was not on the same planet (the game itself was just bad basketball), but that made the atmosphere that much more impressive.

ADs and marketing leads should make the trek to Phoenix to attend a GCU game. It was a 2.5 hour party, and I can’t wait to attend again.

They have a pretty new 7,000 arena, perfect size for this program. Going into this game Bryce Drew has his squad 15-8, decent but not great in their conference. They played an awful New Mexico St team.

I arrived 30 minutes before tip and the student section was packed and rocking. The rest of the seats filled in by the 20 minute mark. The entire side of the arena opposite the benches was packed with students, baseline to baseline.

Once the clock hit 15 minutes to tip the party began. Choreographed chants, pep band playing modern music, some piped in current songs that both students and non students were up and rocking to. By the time the teams were announced the crowd was electric.

Once the game started there were choreographed chants, the students were going nuts on each made basket, etc. And in between each timeout the atmosphere was like a Gopher football game in between the 3rd and 4th quarters. Literally, every time out. The only ever time I’ve seen that much energy in every time out is at a Duke game. I’ve seen 40+ games at KU and have never seen sustained crowd and student engagement like this.

And for those that love to give excuses why the Gophers don’t draw well:

- So many other choices in Twin Cities…no city in the world has more sports/entertainment options than Phoenix does over the next 4 days.

- Gophers suck…GCU is so much worse. The actual game product was awful.

- Bad opponent… New Mexico St is brutal.

- Campus is dangerous…GCUs campus is gorgeous, 1 block away is worse than Minneapolis.

- Midweek game…Wednesday night.

The Gopher game day experience is exactly what it was for decades. Literally nothing has changed. Same animal costumes in the front row, same in-game promotions, same Little Chippers halftime game, etc.

There’s no vision, there’s no breaking the mold. Now, I truly haven’t experienced an atmosphere like this before so it’s not as if it’s being replicated across the country, but it made me sad at how far our fan experience has fallen and how little vision we have within our athletic department.

Yes, winning big will fill the place, but even if/when that happens I have a hard time believing it will consistently reach the energy of a random Wednesday night at GCU against an awful opponent.

Go Gophers!!

So... you're saying those christians are "filled with the spirit" at the basketball game. Perhaps we need the UMN theology department to attend Gopher games.

 

[forever a gopher]

Super interesting, thanks for the write-up, Bleed. I would agree, there is a lot the U could be doing to amp up the ambiance at the games. Currently, it is very much geared towards the blue hairs.

As an aside, if you're unaware of GCU (I was until I found out last year that a neighbor down the street has two kids going there), they are mired in a legal battle over whether they are a for-profit or not-for-profit institution (linked below). Frontline did a really interesting piece on places like this, and GCU is featured heavily. GCU admitted themselves the campus was created/expanded solely to drive up interest in the online portion of the school, which is obscenely profitable. Of course, those profits then go to shareholders. If you get to the part in the Frontline doc where they talk about how the for-profit schools develop courses, it's quite eye-opening (I watched it a while ago, but I think the example is from University of Phoenix).

https://www.highereddive.com/news/j...-university-for-profit-status-lawsuit/637913/

 

[Gophers_4life]

Not to put things too indelicately ... but GCU very much akin to Liberty University.

And it is for-profit (even though they try to lie about that), to boot.


So, I'll let you decide if you care enough about such things to let them bleed over into your decision to just focus on sports for the sake of sports, or not.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Super interesting, thanks for the write-up, Bleed. I would agree, there is a lot the U could be doing to amp up the ambiance at the games. Currently, it is very much geared towards the blue hairs.

As an aside, if you're unaware of GCU (I was until I found out last year that a neighbor down the street has two kids going there), they are mired in a legal battle over whether they are a for-profit or not-for-profit institution (linked below). Frontline did a really interesting piece on places like this, and GCU is featured heavily. GCU admitted themselves the campus was created/expanded solely to drive up interest in the online portion of the school, which is obscenely profitable. Of course, those profits then go to shareholders. If you get to the part in the Frontline doc where they talk about how the for-profit schools develop courses, it's quite eye-opening (I watched it a while ago, but I think the example is from University of Phoenix).

https://www.highereddive.com/news/j...-university-for-profit-status-lawsuit/637913/

Bolded: *cough*the Church*cough*


But anyway, to the rest of it: yep. For-profit diploma mill. You too can have a nice piece of paper with your name on it. Just give us 5-10x the money you'd give to a public college in your state of residence, and we'll ship it out to you right away!

Don't have the cash and of course can't qualify for Federal Aid?? No problem! We can get you hooked up with high-interest loans from private banks!

 

[Gophers_4life]

- So many other choices in Twin Cities…no city in the world has more sports/entertainment options than Phoenix does over the next 4 days.

- Gophers suck…GCU is so much worse. The actual game product was awful.

- Bad opponent… New Mexico St is brutal.

- Campus is dangerous…GCUs campus is gorgeous, 1 block away is worse than Minneapolis.

- Midweek game…Wednesday night.

Now do the weather in Dec, Jan, Feb.


Also interesting that you say NM State is brutal (this year). I thought they had been one of the best programs in the WAC.

 

[gopheraddict]

I went to my first GCU home game tonight and I was blown away. This is my 21st different college basketball arena and I would legit put this in the top 3 as far as atmosphere along with Phog Allen and Cameron Indoor. Obviously the importance of the game was not on the same planet (the game itself was just bad basketball), but that made the atmosphere that much more impressive.

ADs and marketing leads should make the trek to Phoenix to attend a GCU game. It was a 2.5 hour party, and I can’t wait to attend again.

They have a pretty new 7,000 arena, perfect size for this program. Going into this game Bryce Drew has his squad 15-8, decent but not great in their conference. They played an awful New Mexico St team.

I arrived 30 minutes before tip and the student section was packed and rocking. The rest of the seats filled in by the 20 minute mark. The entire side of the arena opposite the benches was packed with students, baseline to baseline.

Once the clock hit 15 minutes to tip the party began. Choreographed chants, pep band playing modern music, some piped in current songs that both students and non students were up and rocking to. By the time the teams were announced the crowd was electric.

Once the game started there were choreographed chants, the students were going nuts on each made basket, etc. And in between each timeout the atmosphere was like a Gopher football game in between the 3rd and 4th quarters. Literally, every time out. The only ever time I’ve seen that much energy in every time out is at a Duke game. I’ve seen 40+ games at KU and have never seen sustained crowd and student engagement like this.

And for those that love to give excuses why the Gophers don’t draw well:

- So many other choices in Twin Cities…no city in the world has more sports/entertainment options than Phoenix does over the next 4 days.

- Gophers suck…GCU is so much worse. The actual game product was awful.

- Bad opponent… New Mexico St is brutal.

- Campus is dangerous…GCUs campus is gorgeous, 1 block away is worse than Minneapolis.

- Midweek game…Wednesday night.

The Gopher game day experience is exactly what it was for decades. Literally nothing has changed. Same animal costumes in the front row, same in-game promotions, same Little Chippers halftime game, etc.

There’s no vision, there’s no breaking the mold. Now, I truly haven’t experienced an atmosphere like this before so it’s not as if it’s being replicated across the country, but it made me sad at how far our fan experience has fallen and how little vision we have within our athletic department.

Yes, winning big will fill the place, but even if/when that happens I have a hard time believing it will consistently reach the energy of a random Wednesday night at GCU against an awful opponent.

Go Gophers!!

See:

Global Credit Union Arena at GCU - Facilities - Grand Canyon University Athletics

The official facilities page for the Grand Canyon University Lopes

gculopes.com

 

[forever a gopher]

Bolded: *cough*the Church*cough*


But anyway, to the rest of it: yep. For-profit diploma mill. You too can have a nice piece of paper with your name on it. Just give us 5-10x the money you'd give to a public college in your state of residence, and we'll ship it out to you right away!

Don't have the cash and of course can't qualify for Federal Aid?? No problem! We can get you hooked up with high-interest loans from private banks!

To me, this is the real problem with the for-profit places. All they care about is admissions and revenue, so they'll admit anybody. Of course, a good chunk of admissions to these places are working adults that start but never finish their degree, or people lower on the socio-economic status or didn't have the grades to get admitted to a non-profit 4-year institution and is going this route instead of community/technical college. They then accumulate a bunch of debt, and often have nothing to show for it.

Not to say this can't happen elsewhere. I knew two women from my freshman year in the dorms, and got to know them reasonably well. I firmly believe they were both given admittance under the guise of "diversity" (one was Vietnamese, the other low-income white). We all had a class together, and we would study for the tests. Those two women had no business being there. Both about as dumb as a box of rocks. Unsurprisingly, they both dropped out by the end of their first year. So they accumulated 2 semesters worth of debt, and had less than nothing to show for it. Getting into debt with no benefit when you're already poor is how you keep poor people poor. It wasn't good for the school, and it wasn't good for them.

Sorry for absolutely derailing this thread...

 

[Gophers_4life]

To me, this is the real problem with the for-profit places. All they care about is admissions and revenue, so they'll admit anybody. Of course, a good chunk of admissions to these places are working adults that start but never finish their degree, or people lower on the socio-economic status or didn't have the grades to get admitted to a non-profit 4-year institution and is going this route instead of community/technical college. They then accumulate a bunch of debt, and often have nothing to show for it.

Not to say this can't happen elsewhere. I knew two women from my freshman year in the dorms, and got to know them reasonably well. I firmly believe they were both given admittance under the guise of "diversity" (one was Vietnamese, the other low-income white). We all had a class together, and we would study for the tests. Those two women had no business being there. Both about as dumb as a box of rocks. Unsurprisingly, they both dropped out by the end of their first year. So they accumulated 2 semesters worth of debt, and had less than nothing to show for it. Getting into debt with no benefit when you're already poor is how you keep poor people poor. It wasn't good for the school, and it wasn't good for them.

Sorry for absolutely derailing this thread...

I think it's important for people to know about these places, when they are absolutely, 100% trying to "sportswash" away what they are.

That doesn't mean it isn't an absolutely terrific college basketball environment, as the OP suggest.

 

[fan of Ray Williams]

Holy smokes. This didn’t take long.

 

[bc2211]

I went to the Barn for an MSU game (I think) a few of years ago. We weren’t yet all the way in the gutter as a program, but the atmosphere started out stale, and the gophers fell to an uninspired 8-12 point deficit. Something clicked and we went on a run, crowd finally woke up and people were on their feet. MSU got bailed out by a weak foul and the crowd ramped it up even more. Izzo called a 30 second timeout, the band immediately launched into the M-I-N… chant, and when it was over, people sat down like they were conditioned to do so. MSU player walked to the free throw line out of the time out and the place was silent.

Not only is everything stale, our chants, bands, music work against the crowd.

 

[Lou Hudson]

Just to piggy-back on the comment about the U being out of touch with today's fanbase, and not really trying very hard to create the "experience." During the pre-game player introductions, they play an NBA-style video, trying to remind us that the U has a huge, long-standing tradition of basketball excellence. The video is well produced, but I cringe every time I hear it. I want to yell - "Win some games!!" Then you might have the right to play the flashy video. As it stands, the video just seems out of sync with what's happening on the court.

 

[upnorthkid]

students in the building is the key. then they need to be encouraged to be loud while they're there (not just by a group of 10 students dressed in animal costumes, but from the atmosphere that is encouraged by the institution). there is next to no incentive for them to go. atmosphere starts there, always. the U has long prioritized corporate donors who don't even go sit in the actual seats as their target market. On top of that, they clearly have not figured out how to make the gameday atmosphere better. Gopher football has come some distance, but still isn't there yet either. The whole department needs a revamp.

GCU succeeds because it is the atmosphere they breed (and make a shit ton of money off of). You can do the same thing, it just takes changing the priorities from an institutional standpoint.

 

[combes1]

I went to Illinois/Grand Canyon several years ago. Not my video but it shows the atmosphere.

 

[bc2211]

students in the building is the key. then they need to be encouraged to be loud while they're there (not just by a group of 10 students dressed in animal costumes, but from the atmosphere that is encouraged by the institution). there is next to no incentive for them to go. atmosphere starts there, always. the U has long prioritized corporate donors who don't even go sit in the actual seats as their target market. On top of that, they clearly have not figured out how to make the gameday atmosphere better. Gopher football has come some distance, but still isn't there yet either. The whole department needs a revamp.

GCU succeeds because it is the atmosphere they breed (and make a shit ton of money off of). You can do the same thing, it just takes changing the priorities from an institutional standpoint.

The barn animals thing needs to retire. Bring it back on occasion, but it’s hard to look at the forced enthusiasm when we are losing by 35. Not even the cow believes.

 

[Gophers_4life]

So the main question, posed on the OP, has really has gone unanswered:

how did they do it? And how did they do it so quickly??

Should it surprise anyone that the answer is quite simply: truckloads of money dumped into the school? And in ways that most schools would not be able/allowed to do?

Check out this article from 2016: bleacherreport.com/articles/2680626-grand-canyon-has-found-the-secret-to-rapid-division-i-basketball-success

For GCU, the move was part of a long climb out of the gutter that began when it resorted to a for-profit model in order to avoid bankruptcy. That was back in 2004, when the Christian university had about 900 students on an aging 95-acre campus that hadn't changed much in its 50-plus-year history.

"We were in a bad spot," said Mueller, who came on board in June 2008, when the school was in much better financial shape.

A few months later, an initial public offering on the NASDAQ exchange raised $254 million in capital. Most of that went toward establishing a massive online curriculum that now caters to the more than 40,000 students who make up more than two-thirds of the school's total enrollment, which includes 17,500 non-online students.

Once expansion of the physical campus began, so did the discussion about jumping to Division I athletics. GCU was successful in D-II, winning the Directors' Cup—awarded to the most successful athletic program in each division—in each of the final two years before it moved up. But Mueller said part of the push to move to D-I came because "nobody cares" much about D-II, particularly in a market that includes all four major professional sports and a well-established D-I program in Arizona State.

If GCU played in D-I, however, that would be different, even in a crowded market.



So while you obviously can't deny the passion for the fanbase, the way the whole thing was bootstrapped out of nothing makes it feel all artificial, to me.

 

[howeda7]

I think a new, smaller arena is imperative. And with it, some new game day traditions. In the short-term, the best thing the U could do is make student tickets free and get the student section as full as possible (hard to do, even free, when we suck this bad.)

 

[golfing18now]

I went to the Barn for an MSU game (I think) a few of years ago. We weren’t yet all the way in the gutter as a program, but the atmosphere started out stale, and the gophers fell to an uninspired 8-12 point deficit. Something clicked and we went on a run, crowd finally woke up and people were on their feet. MSU got bailed out by a weak foul and the crowd ramped it up even more. Izzo called a 30 second timeout, the band immediately launched into the M-I-N… chant, and when it was over, people sat down like they were conditioned to do so. MSU player walked to the free throw line out of the time out and the place was silent.

Not only is everything stale, our chants, bands, music work against the crowd.

I couldn't agree more. I like having the band at the game but the rouser absolutely kills the organic atmosphere in some of the games when the Gophers make a run. It's bizarre to me.

 

[golfing18now]

I think a new, smaller arena is imperative. And with it, some new game day traditions. In the short-term, the best thing the U could do is make student tickets free and get the student section as full as possible (hard to do, even free, when we suck this bad.)

Even Northwestern giving away chicken sandwiches after x number of missed free throws is a creative way of energizing the student section. Not 8 barn animal costumes. I'm now envious of the Northwestern game day experience. Think about that. The flash mobs at other schools like Maryland are really cool too.

 

[Bad Gopher]

Great thread, but it's frustration fuel because of our lame game-day experience. It feels like the weather: everybody talks about it, but nobody does anything about it. It seems that the U is some combination of ingorance and apathy about whether to do anything different or what to do if they did. Is there anything a fan or booster can do? Obviously, whoever's orchestrating the experience at games isn't very good at what they do. At the same time, I see all kinds of good ideas being voiced, here and elsewhere. Certainly, some of these ideas could make their way into practice if there were a mechanism for implementation.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Great thread, but it's frustration fuel because of our lame game-day experience. It feels like the weather: everybody talks about it, but nobody does anything about it. It seems that the U is some combination of ingorance and apathy about whether to do anything different or what to do if they did. Is there anything a fan or booster can do? Obviously, whoever's orchestrating the experience at games isn't very good at what they do. At the same time, I see all kinds of good ideas being voiced, here and elsewhere. Certainly, some of these ideas could make their way into practice if there were a mechanism for implementation.

One has to remember that there is an inordinate amount of people in Academia who firmly and unequivocally believe that sports has no place on a college campus. The real question for Gopher Athletics then becomes, what portion of the school administration are in this camp and how many people that it's vital to the lifeblood of the school?

 

[EasyThere Pilgrim]

I went to my first GCU home game tonight and I was blown away. This is my 21st different college basketball arena and I would legit put this in the top 3 as far as atmosphere along with Phog Allen and Cameron Indoor. Obviously the importance of the game was not on the same planet (the game itself was just bad basketball), but that made the atmosphere that much more impressive.

ADs and marketing leads should make the trek to Phoenix to attend a GCU game. It was a 2.5 hour party, and I can’t wait to attend again.

They have a pretty new 7,000 arena, perfect size for this program. Going into this game Bryce Drew has his squad 15-8, decent but not great in their conference. They played an awful New Mexico St team.

I arrived 30 minutes before tip and the student section was packed and rocking. The rest of the seats filled in by the 20 minute mark. The entire side of the arena opposite the benches was packed with students, baseline to baseline.

Once the clock hit 15 minutes to tip the party began. Choreographed chants, pep band playing modern music, some piped in current songs that both students and non students were up and rocking to. By the time the teams were announced the crowd was electric.

Once the game started there were choreographed chants, the students were going nuts on each made basket, etc. And in between each timeout the atmosphere was like a Gopher football game in between the 3rd and 4th quarters. Literally, every time out. The only ever time I’ve seen that much energy in every time out is at a Duke game. I’ve seen 40+ games at KU and have never seen sustained crowd and student engagement like this.

And for those that love to give excuses why the Gophers don’t draw well:

- So many other choices in Twin Cities…no city in the world has more sports/entertainment options than Phoenix does over the next 4 days.

- Gophers suck…GCU is so much worse. The actual game product was awful.

- Bad opponent… New Mexico St is brutal.

- Campus is dangerous…GCUs campus is gorgeous, 1 block away is worse than Minneapolis.

- Midweek game…Wednesday night.

The Gopher game day experience is exactly what it was for decades. Literally nothing has changed. Same animal costumes in the front row, same in-game promotions, same Little Chippers halftime game, etc.

There’s no vision, there’s no breaking the mold. Now, I truly haven’t experienced an atmosphere like this before so it’s not as if it’s being replicated across the country, but it made me sad at how far our fan experience has fallen and how little vision we have within our athletic department.

Yes, winning big will fill the place, but even if/when that happens I have a hard time believing it will consistently reach the energy of a random Wednesday night at GCU against an awful opponent.

Go Gophers!!

I would NEVER attend a basketball game of another team.

Like I've been saying...this board is full of fans of other teams. Not just you...others in this thread are admitting they have sons & daughters, family, at other schools...and they enjoy blasting away at the Gophers.

Winning cures everything. Although yes, our administration has sabotaged our best teams...so let's hope that doesn't happen again.

 

[Bad Gopher]

I would NEVER attend a basketball game of another team.

Like I've been saying...this board is full of fans of other teams. Not just you...others in this thread are admitting they have sons & daughters, family, at other schools...and they enjoy blasting away at the Gophers.

Winning cures everything. Although yes, our administration has sabotaged our best teams...so let's hope that doesn't happen again.

You would never attend the games of your daughter or son who played in a different NCAA division than the Gophers? Really?

 

[BleedGopher]

I would NEVER attend a basketball game of another team.

Like I've been saying...this board is full of fans of other teams. Not just you...others in this thread are admitting they have sons & daughters, family, at other schools...and they enjoy blasting away at the Gophers.

Winning cures everything. Although yes, our administration has sabotaged our best teams...so let's hope that doesn't happen again.

I'm bolding for emphasis. What an absolutely horrible, brutal and ridiculous post.

Go Gophers!!