Things people are discounting and/or ignoring:

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mcrow said:
If you're a coach you have to look at UNLV and other low end FBS programs that way.
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Sorry, but I'm beyond glad you are not our coach. You are 100% wrong on this. Looking at UNLV and other "low end" FBS/FCS programs that way is how Michigan loses to Appalachian St. It's how USC loses to Stanford (a conference oppoent, nonetheless) despite being favored by 7 TDs. You MUST take every opponent seriously. The only teams who can get away with not doing that are teams that are so good, and are playing teams so bad, that it doesn't really matter whether they show up or not. We are nowhere near that good. UNLV is nowhere near that bad. Hopefully we will be that good sooner rather than later, but we aren't now.

mcrow said:
However, any team that's even mediocre in the SEC and Big Ten should soundly beat UNLV....period.
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You are free to think that way, but you are ignoring recent history. In terms of what happens between the white lines, conference affiliation is almost meaningless.

mcrow said:
If the Gophers play to potential they should be UNLV by 20.
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Did you watch the Gophers until 1967, and then just start watching again this year? This comment is literally jaw-dropping assuming you've been watching the Gophers teams of recent years.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Sorry, but I'm beyond glad you are not our coach. You are 100% wrong on this. Looking at UNLV and other "low end" FBS/FCS programs that way is how Michigan loses to Appalachian St. It's how USC loses to Stanford (a conference oppoent, nonetheless) loses despite being favored by 7 TDs. You MUST take every opponent seriously. The only teams who can get away with not doing that are teams that are so good, and are playing teams so bad, that it doesn't really matter whether they show up or not. We are nowhere near that good. UNLV is nowhere near that bad. Hopefully we will be that good sooner rather than later, but we aren't now.
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You totally misunderstood what I said. I was agreeing that if you are the coach you have to look at every team as being a solid threat.

You are free to think that way, but you are ignoring recent history. In terms of what happens between the white lines, conference affiliation is almost meaningless.
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I didn't say that they win because of the conference is better. Look, do we agree or disagree that the SEC and Big 10 are the best conferences? If so, why? That should clear this up.

Did you watch the Gophers until 1967, and then just start watching again this year? This comment is literally jaw-dropping assuming you've been watching the Gophers teams of recent years.
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Well since my mother wasn't born until 1960, no.

2006:
Kent State 44-0
Temple 62-0

2005:
Tulsa 41-10
Florida Atlantic 46-7

2004:
Toledp 63-21
Illinios State 37-21

2003:
Tulsa 49-10
Troy 48-7
Ohio 42-20
L-L 48-14

2002:
Texas State 42-0
L-L 35-11
Toledo 31-21
Buffalo 41-17


As you can see, up until Brewster we destroyed teams like UNLV. I think something similar isn't unrealistic to expect IF this team is a bowl team.
 

mcrow said:
You totally misunderstood what I said. I was agreeing that if you are the coach you have to look at every team as being a solid threat.



I didn't say that they win because of the conference is better. Look, do we agree or disagree that the SEC and Big 10 are the best conferences? If so, why? That should clear this up.



Well since my mother wasn't born until 1960, no.

2006:
Kent State 44-0
Temple 62-0

2005:
Tulsa 41-10
Florida Atlantic 46-7

2004:
Toledp 63-21
Illinios State 37-21

2003:
Tulsa 49-10
Troy 48-7
Ohio 42-20
L-L 48-14

2002:
Texas State 42-0
L-L 35-11
Toledo 31-21
Buffalo 41-17


As you can see, up until Brewster we destroyed teams like UNLV. I think something similar isn't unrealistic to expect IF this team is a bowl team.
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Cherrypicking to frame an arguement is fun. Let me try to find one:

2006
North Dakota State 10-9
Remember that game? We should have lost that one. Fortunately, Matt Spaeth grew to be 6'7" and not any shorter and was able to block a FG.

Use the word "should" carefully. We should beat teams like UNLV soundly. We should be patient while our coaches attempt to rebuild a program that was burned to the ground, salted, and urinated on by their predecessors. We should hold the team to a higher standard, but realize that it's a work in progress. The only thing that happened last night that should prove difficult to correct is the special performance of the punt teams.
 

GophBen said:
Cherrypicking to frame an arguement is fun. Let me try to find one:

2006
North Dakota State 10-9
Remember that game? We should have lost that one. Fortunately, Matt Spaeth grew to be 6'7" and not any shorter and was able to block a FG.

Use the word "should" carefully. We should beat teams like UNLV soundly. We should be patient while our coaches attempt to rebuild a program that was burned to the ground, salted, and urinated on by their predecessors. We should hold the team to a higher standard, but realize that it's a work in progress. The only thing that happened last night that should prove difficult to correct is the special performance of the punt teams.
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I didn't cherry pick just forgot that one came later in the year. Bottom line, with one exception, is that we buried these types of teams.
 

mcrow said:
Maroon kool-aide is strong today.
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I can't imagine why people on a Gophers website would want to look at the good things instead of the bad things after winning on opening night on the road.
 


mcrow said:
Could be right but that remains to be seen. However, we probably got them at their worst given it was the first start for a first year QB, I'm sure that kid will only get better at the season goes on.
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Along with many of the players on our team.
 


Yea we buried these teams in the past, but it has been six years since we have beaten "lower level" teams by that amount. It shouldn't come to surprise most fans that yes we are a completely different team from the previous years, and that it will take some time before we can get back to pounding these types of teams. I know there were some fans last year, including myself, who thought that NMSU would not win another game the rest of the year let alone seeing NDSU win the FCS title. No one knows what kind of season UNLV will have, and we wont know more about our own team until we play more games.
 

Did anyone mention Maye? Looks like he could be a very dynamic player. A few nice plays. On one crossing route, instead of running to the open part of the field past one incoming dback, Maye cut up field for a few extra yards to insure a first down instead of making the gamble. Nice to see that kind of intelligence out of a young players.
 



mcrow said:
I didn't cherry pick just forgot that one came later in the year. Bottom line, with one exception, is that we buried these types of teams.
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In recent years, we've been losing to these type of teams, many times at home.
 

gophers&guns said:
Yea we buried these teams in the past, but it has been six years since we have beaten "lower level" teams by that amount. It shouldn't come to surprise most fans that yes we are a completely different team from the previous years, and that it will take some time before we can get back to pounding these types of teams. I know there were some fans last year, including myself, who thought that NMSU would not win another game the rest of the year let alone seeing NDSU win the FCS title. No one knows what kind of season UNLV will have, and we wont know more about our own team until we play more games.
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I don't expect them to beat teams on the same level as the teams of the early to mid 2000s but we shouldn't need 3xOT to beat them.
 

GophersInIowa said:
In recent years, we've been losing to these type of teams, many times at home.
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I think I know that since I have not missed either going to a game or watching it on TV since probably 2006.

My point is my expectations are better than that and people seem all too happy to accept these sorts of outcomes and use the "we're not at that stage yet" excuse. Seems like we've been at that stage for a good 4 years or more.
 

mcrow said:
I didn't cherry pick just forgot that one came later in the year. Bottom line, with one exception, is that we buried these types of teams.
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Uh, not really. Allow me to expand on a point I believe you missed:

1997
@ Hawaii (3-9) 3-17
@ Memphis (4-7) 20-17
Houston (3-8) 43-35

1998
Arkansas State (4-8) 17-14
@ Houston (3-8) 14-7

2000
Ohio (7-4) 17-23

2001
@ Toledo (10-2) 7-38

The first thing that I'll point out is that we have the benefit of hindsight to know that of these teams, the only one worth a damn was the 2001 Toledo team. We don't know where 2012 UNLV will finish, we just assume that it'll be in the basement because they were crap last year. Other than that every one of them, by your standards, should have been pummeled mercilessly. However it took Glen Mason over 5 years to get the team to get up and running and capable of beating lower-level teams like you expect. Jerry Kill has not had that yet. Wacker, rest his soul, was not good at the job just like Brewster. It takes time to fix bad football.
 



mcrow said:
I think I know that since I have not missed either going to a game or watching it on TV since probably 2006.

My point is my expectations are better than that and people seem all too happy to accept these sorts of outcomes and use the "we're not at that stage yet" excuse. Seems like we've been at that stage for a good 4 years or more.
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You claim you haven't missed a game since 2006, yet the bolded statement says otherwise. Do YOU realize the changes we dealt with the last 4 years, right? Have you forgotten that this is the first year we've had the same coaching staff for more than 12 months since the Mason era?

Patience, Grasshoppa.
 

mcrow said:
I think I know that since I have not missed either going to a game or watching it on TV since probably 2006.

My point is my expectations are better than that and people seem all too happy to accept these sorts of outcomes and use the "we're not at that stage yet" excuse. Seems like we've been at that stage for a good 4 years or more.
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I don't think too many people are satisfied with it, but it is an improvement, and most people know it takes awhile to turn programs around. It's also just how fans are. After a win, especially when we haven't won a whole lot of games lately, most fans tend to by optimistic instead of pessimistic. Most everything you've mentioned are concerns for me as well. Just not everyone wants to be all doom and gloom, especially after a win.
 

GophBen said:
Uh, not really. Allow me to expand on a point I believe you missed:

1997
@ Hawaii (3-9) 3-17
@ Memphis (4-7) 20-17
Houston (3-8) 43-35

1998
Arkansas State (4-8) 17-14
@ Houston (3-8) 14-7

2000
Ohio (7-4) 17-23

2001
@ Toledo (10-2) 7-38

The first thing that I'll point out is that we have the benefit of hindsight to know that of these teams, the only one worth a damn was the 2001 Toledo team. We don't know where 2012 UNLV will finish, we just assume that it'll be in the basement because they were crap last year. Other than that every one of them, by your standards, should have been pummeled mercilessly. However it took Glen Mason over 5 years to get the team to get up and running and capable of beating lower-level teams like you expect. Jerry Kill has not had that yet. Wacker, rest his soul, was not good at the job just like Brewster. It takes time to fix bad football.
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Nice try there buddy but Mason was right to get a couple of building years so 1997 and 1998 are not all that surprising and all of these teams are at least FBS teams. That 2001 Toledo teams was actually pretty good too. This is why I'm not all over Kill for this situation, he should get a few years to turn things around.
 

Formo said:
You claim you haven't missed a game since 2006, yet the bolded statement says otherwise. Do YOU realize the changes we dealt with the last 4 years, right? Have you forgotten that this is the first year we've had the same coaching staff for more than 12 months since the Mason era?

Patience, Grasshoppa.
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No, I remember Weber having something like a new offensive coordinater every year. I'm just sick of always waiting and then getting nothing.
 

I definitely wasn't satisfied with the win last night, but I see it as a small step towards a different game we have witnessed as fans over the last 4 or 5 years. Everyone wants to crush these teams, and after the USC game last year I thought we would roll through the rest of the non-conf games. However I like many believed USC played down to our level and we played at a higher level than what would show during the course of the season. Who knows we have been known to play down to lower teams levels the last couple years, and maybe this game will be the wake up call the team needs to move beyond that.
 

If you can't approach this team with a glass-half-full perspective, I hope you get some Valium, your stomach lining will thank you!

Some additional thoughts:

It is year two. Improvement will take time, and there will be a number of very frustrating setbacks.

Last night was NOT a setback. The Gophers were statistically far superior, and had breakdowns at key moments. But they never gave up and found a way to win. On the road, in the heat, damned late at night.

If MarQueis does not get more consistent and accurate, expectations for this season must be lowered. If his play was where it was at its peak last year, this would not have been a close game.

I fully expect the coaching staff to work on the too-numerous mistakes. I fully expect this young team to keep making more mistakes than we like. I look forward to cringing less as the season progresses.

Finally, this is a rebuilding process. A really hard rebuilding process. last night I saw a team that had the potential to be a lot better, a team that found a way to win despite poor play.
 

Another bright point - the team will work HARD this week.
 

mcrow said:
No, I remember Weber having something like a new offensive coordinater every year. I'm just sick of always waiting and then getting nothing.
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Exactly. This is why I say patience. We haven't been able to enjoy 'W's around here too often, having someone come clomping down on it like we are Alabama that just squeaked by the Louisiana-Lafayette Ragin' Cajuns doesn't jive well. We are a poor team that beat a poor team. Lets just leave it at that for now and hopefully Coach Kill has this sucker turned around in a year or two.
 

dpodoll68 said:
1. UNLV, while they are not a good Division I-A team, is still one of the 200 best football teams on the planet out of thousands and thousands
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You can't be serious. One of the most ridiculous things ever uttered on this board.
 



Guys, it could be worse:


Bigger DERP: The Kent State LB running it or the other team for trying to tackle him?
 

dpodoll68 said:
I thought this was self-evident. Refute the point. Name 200 better. I'll be waiting.
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Well, it's not a matter of whether or not they are in the top 200ish it's the notion that because they are in the 200 that they must be a quality oppoenent.
 

Art Vandelay said:
You can't be serious. One of the most ridiculous things ever uttered on this board.
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I think you can argue with the relevance of the point, but it is hard to argue its accuracy.

And I have have only been on the board for about a year, but this would not even make the top 100 most ridiculous things......
 

Maybe the fact that UNLV has a new DC might have something to do with the struggles of the offense. Limegrover had to guess, what UNLV would do, don't discount the difficulty of preparing for a new system.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Some people want to pretend that UNLV is Eden Prairie HS and that we should pound them accordingly. I'm asking people to keep things in perspective.
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Your comments are correct and balanced. There have been a lot of times in FB and BB where the team looked horrible in a non-conf game and I thought we would get killed in-conference, even when we had decent coaches like Mason and
Stoll, and we improved, amazing enough. Woody Hayes lost to MAc teams almost as a tradition and still had a great team later on. The good news is there is a lot more talent to work with than we had last season, most of the players will improve all season.
 

dpodoll68 said:
1. UNLV, while they are not a good Division I-A team, is still one of the 200 best football teams on the planet out of thousands and thousands.
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Realize this...I've seen UNLV (in the past 10 years or so) destroy a favored Arkansas team in the LV Bowl, and beat Wisconsin at Camp Randall, beat #15 Arizona State (at ASU), beat Iowa State in overtime at home, and so on.....so, even without a good program, and a not very good football team (I believe the bowl victory against Arkansas was the only year we had a winning record out of the games I've listed), you're #1 point is valid. We have D1 talent at UNLV, and on any given Satur...errrrrr....Thursday, anything can happen. Don't think for a second we don't have, at least, a few guys that couldn't start at most Big 10 schools......

Also realize that even though UNLV has a mediocre/bad football program (at best), we've also produced players like Keenan McCardell and Randall Cunningham.....we have a city of 2 million people with over 40 high schools of under recruited talent....the best usually sign somewhere else (Demarco Murray, Steven Jackson, etc...) but the guys that are on that first team, all-state with the best players, can be top notch collegiate talent but are under recruited and many of them end up at UNLV....

Good luck the rest of the year......
 

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