You will notice that almost the entire d is frosh/sophs. *&^!#The gophs suck because the d sucks. *&^!#The d sucks because there are no juniors or seniors around to play. *&^!#In d1 football experience counts for a lot and because of the recruiting situation on d before brew got here we have no experience on d. His recruits are young and have the potential to be talented, they are just sorely lacking in experience and that little bit of man-weight that separates 18 year olds from 23 year olds. *&^!#Now I'm not saying that brew shouldn't be show the door, I'm just saying that whoever is coaching next season will have success with these players right away because they will actually be ready for d1 football. *&^!#I honestly think that if we change coaches, the new coach will be impressed with the athleticism and quality of the roster.
The roster on D
- Thread starter LaXGoph
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50PoundHead
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I get what you're saying and agree. The question of "stars" v. "coaching up" gets debated routinely here, but I do believe the players currently playing defense for the Gophers are more athletic than what we've seen in these parts in quite awhile.
The more pertinent questions are "Can they play FBS football?" and "Are their current travails more a function of inexperience, poor coaching, or simply an inability to translate athletic ability to football skill?" We'll probably have a better handle on those questions as the season grinds on.
The more pertinent questions are "Can they play FBS football?" and "Are their current travails more a function of inexperience, poor coaching, or simply an inability to translate athletic ability to football skill?" We'll probably have a better handle on those questions as the season grinds on.
In a perfect world this d shows signs of life and gets significantly better as the season progresses. I think that would start to answer the question of coaching versus athletic ability because it is hard to bring the things you learn in practice to the field when you haven't really been on the field before.
50PoundHead
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That's what I'll be looking for. It is so hard to get a read from the Northern Illinois game, because the frontline was shredded so badly. The two guys who should be doing better right now are Edwards and Kirksey, but maybe what's behind them is what is truly causing the problem. I can't tell.
I think a big problem is guys trying to hard to make plays and putting themselves out of position. Because they lack experience they are trying to cover ground outside of their position to cover what they perceive as a weak spot. By trying to fill a hole in front of them they leave a hole behind them and they are late or at a bad angle for the spot they are trying to cover. A 5-7 yard play turns into a 50 yard td. Even if they are disciplined enough to stay in position 90% of the time they get tempted on two or three plays and the gophs lose by a score.
Ogee Ogilthorpe
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Wasted effort
You're wasting your time.
80-90% of the fanbase (at least on here) will swear to you that the Gophers are 1-3 because of Adam Weber, not because the defense is statistically one of the worst in the NCAA.
You're wasting your time.
80-90% of the fanbase (at least on here) will swear to you that the Gophers are 1-3 because of Adam Weber, not because the defense is statistically one of the worst in the NCAA.
eagangopherfan
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I agree
Parts of this I agree with parts I do not.
The defensive line is mostly players in their third year in the program.
The linebackers are all in their third year in the program.
Defensive backs are mixed, the loss of Royston was probably pretty big.
Third year players are not 18 year old freshman. They are 20-21 year olds that have been around awhile. The lack of playing time and game experience is really taking its toll.
From a preparation perspective they should know their assignments and the system. I understand the drop off, it's the extent that has occured that I do not understand. They might have a hard time competing against Ohio State, they should have no problem with South Dakota. What can possibly explain that.
littlebigboy
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the thing I have noticed since the 1st game is the D is much better about getting in the right position, but they catch blocks instead of tring to beat them or take out the interference to screw up the play. I still can't believe kids at this level can't tackle any better than they did sat.
Frosh and sophs?
Jacobs is in his fourth year with Cross.
Edwards and Kirksey in their third year on-field. Three with Cross.
Wilhite is in third year with Cross.
Tinsley, Cooper are in third year with Butler.
Rallis has been in program three years. Sat one out with injury. Been moved around.
Collado is in fourth year with Lee.
Theret is in fourth year with Lee.
That's nine out of eleven that they could put on field who aren't freshman or sophs. Many saw extended playing time last year and in previous years. Add the juco safety and 10/11.
Manuel is a freshmen, Vereen is a frosh, Carter is a soph (who played quite a bit last year, has gotten a lot of first team reps in practice), Aaron Hill is a redshirt freshman, Chrystin Lewis is a junior but two were in juco.
(When and if Royston returns; five years Big Ten experience)
They have had a freshman/soph at corner. They have had a frshman/first year juco at safety. They have had a rs frosh in Garin/Hageman/KGM at DE. They have had a rs frosh fill in for Rallis.
Jacobs is in his fourth year with Cross.
Edwards and Kirksey in their third year on-field. Three with Cross.
Wilhite is in third year with Cross.
Tinsley, Cooper are in third year with Butler.
Rallis has been in program three years. Sat one out with injury. Been moved around.
Collado is in fourth year with Lee.
Theret is in fourth year with Lee.
That's nine out of eleven that they could put on field who aren't freshman or sophs. Many saw extended playing time last year and in previous years. Add the juco safety and 10/11.
Manuel is a freshmen, Vereen is a frosh, Carter is a soph (who played quite a bit last year, has gotten a lot of first team reps in practice), Aaron Hill is a redshirt freshman, Chrystin Lewis is a junior but two were in juco.
(When and if Royston returns; five years Big Ten experience)
They have had a freshman/soph at corner. They have had a frshman/first year juco at safety. They have had a rs frosh in Garin/Hageman/KGM at DE. They have had a rs frosh fill in for Rallis.
WHB Brewer
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This makes absolutely no sense. I think 90% of the people on this board would take "option B" in your analogy. If the Gophers were 1-3 and only losing by "a score" I think the hatred directed toward Brewster would be much less. You are basically saying the same thing as Brewster when he says we could be 4-0.
The fact is that we got EMBARRASED by South Dakota and N.Illinois. The USC game was only as close as it was because Brewster played to not let the game get out of hand, and we scored a cheap garbage TD at the end.
If it was truly as simple as getting the players to be in position 90% of the time, and only lose by a score, I would count that as improvement at this point!
Ogee Ogilthorpe
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Soooooo, not really sure what your point is?
I was watching a few other Big Ten games this weekend and I always like to see what year the players for other teams are in, which teams will be losing a lot of players to graduation next year, etc.
I only caught two teams, Northwestern and Iowa. Both Iowa and Northwestern (arguably one very good team and one average team) had just ONE player that was not a Junior or Senior starting on defense. Ohio State is the same.
The Gophers have five; two TRUE freshmen and then you can sprinkle in some jucos that are in their first year of playing D-1 ball. Most even decent programs are concerned when they have more than 2-3 players starting that have never started before. The Gophers opened up with 11 new full-time starters.
It only TAKES one or two guys making a mistake to give up 30-50 yard plays on defense. The linebackers played mostly special teams last year, finding spot duty on defense later in the year.
Just being in the PROGRAM for a few years is all they need? Really? Game experience not important apparently. That's good to know.
Downplay it and sugarcoat it with any type of statistic that you can find, the Gophers defense is arguably one of the most inexperienced in the nation this year. And it's showing.
Bob_Loblaw
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For someone to be in their third year in the program isn't a ton of experience. At most programs that is a RS Sophomore. I think ideally, most programs wouldn't want players starting until their 4th year in the program (RS Jr). That doesn't always happen, but like I said, it's ideal. But that point is probably debateable.
Now if you look at the amount of young players who are getting significant playing time, that is problematic. B. Vereen, M. Carter, J. Manuel, M. Garin, R. Hageman, KGM, Wilhite(you can keep him or add him), Rallis, etc., is far too large of a number to not see some problems. There are obviously other issues, I don't think Cooper, Edwards, Theret and Kirksey have stepped up, but youth has also played a problem.
I'm not saying this to cut Brewster any slack. I would use the youth argument to cut Brew slack if we were 2-2 or 3-1 in the non-conference and finished at our usual 6-6 mark. In his 4th year, there is no reason why you should lose to northern illinois and south dakota.
Now if you look at the amount of young players who are getting significant playing time, that is problematic. B. Vereen, M. Carter, J. Manuel, M. Garin, R. Hageman, KGM, Wilhite(you can keep him or add him), Rallis, etc., is far too large of a number to not see some problems. There are obviously other issues, I don't think Cooper, Edwards, Theret and Kirksey have stepped up, but youth has also played a problem.
I'm not saying this to cut Brewster any slack. I would use the youth argument to cut Brew slack if we were 2-2 or 3-1 in the non-conference and finished at our usual 6-6 mark. In his 4th year, there is no reason why you should lose to northern illinois and south dakota.