The NCAA has opened an investigation into No. 2 Michigan over possible rule-breaking around in-person scouting of opponents

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from the article noted above:

The NCAA presented the University of Michigan with new evidence this week, including that a Michigan booster may have at least partially funded Connor Stalions’ advanced scouting operation and an assistant coach allegedly participated in the destruction of evidence on a computer after the scandal broke, industry sources tell Yahoo Sports.

Multiple sources say that Partridge is not alleged at this time of knowing about the advanced scouting by Stalions, but acted after the fact to cover up evidence. Sources tell Yahoo Sports that a booster — named in the NCAA report as "Uncle T" — helped fund the alleged scheme, giving Stalions thousands of dollars for expenses.

(it would be funnier if his name was Rich Uncle Pennybags....)
 

MplsGopher said:
(Never mind that it’s beyond laughable and silly to say “oh sure, you’re allowed to steal every sign there is so long as you do it from watching tape of past games, and it can be tape of a camera pointed at the other teams sideline too, that’s just fine, but if you actually travel to future opponents games ahead of time …. That’s a SIN!!!”)
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It's against the rules to record signals of opponents. There'd be no logical reason to have a camera pointed at the sideline of an opponent except to record the signals.
 

:rolleyes:

Fine, the camera was recording the All-22 of the field and was angled that way. Couldn’t help but also capture the sideline.

Exactly same thing achieved
 


MplsGopher said:
:rolleyes:

Fine, the camera was recording the All-22 of the field and was angled that way. Couldn’t help but also capture the sideline.

Exactly same thing achieved
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It's clear you don't even understand what was happening. The issue was in games Michigan wasn't playing in. So your whole premise makes no sense. Michigan wouldn't have cameras anywhere at games they aren't playing in.
 


Teams trade film all the time. Every week, every game. You can’t go there in person, but you can get film of the game from someone else. Did you really not know that?

Example: guaranteed that the Gopher staff has film from damn near every game that OSU played this year. Were they at all those games themselves? Nope, but they have the film anyway!

Stallions claimed he studied those and that’s what he told the staff.


You can’t disprove it. Boom
 



MplsGopher said:
Teams trade film all the time. Every week, every game. You can’t go there in person, but you can get film of the game from someone else. Did you really not know that?

Example: guaranteed that the Gopher staff has film from damn near every game that OSU played this year. Were they at all those games themselves? Nope, but they have the film anyway!

Stallions claimed he studied those and that’s what he told the staff.


You can’t disprove it. Boom
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you sound insane
 





Gophers1992 said:
Like I've said before, you could tell the guy it is Tuesday and he would try to argue it's Thursday. Just lives to be a contrarian.
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And, for some reason, the B1G conference is part of some bizarre conspiracy to make it be Tuesday even though it is in the conference's best interest for it to be Thursday.
 

MplsGopher said:
Teams trade film all the time. Every week, every game. You can’t go there in person, but you can get film of the game from someone else. Did you really not know that?

Example: guaranteed that the Gopher staff has film from damn near every game that OSU played this year. Were they at all those games themselves? Nope, but they have the film anyway!

Stallions claimed he studied those and that’s what he told the staff.


You can’t disprove it. Boom
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And you can't disprove Coach Khaki turtled when facing the prospect of testifying under oath.

I'm guessing the All 22 theory is what has prompted the Gophers having staffers holding big cardboard cutouts behind their squad of signal callers.
 



MplsGopher said:
Teams trade film all the time. Every week, every game. You can’t go there in person, but you can get film of the game from someone else. Did you really not know that?
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While this is true, that game film doesn’t have angles of the coaches signs. Many and most of the ones I’ve reviewed when that was part of my life are edited down. Did you really not know that???
 

But Stallions could have claimed that he got access to the unedited original All-22 tape, and that’s what he told the staff.

All I have to do is come up with a reasonable doubt to the idea that the staff for sure knew he was breaking rules to get to the level of proficiency he had in deciphering the signs.

I have achieved that.


Without evidence, you must presume innocence. This is America.

This should be obvious, but just for crystal clarity: I am not proving that Stallions didn’t break rules. Rather, I have proven a reasonable doubt to that the Mich core staff knew that he broke rules.
 
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@Ope3 or maybe he has a conf and then a natty to win and didn’t need a clumsy Big Ten investigation distracting the team, for such a nothing “punishment”.

We’ll never know, but people will read what they want to read.


This all goes away with green dot helmets, as it should. Hopefully including the stupid giant cards.
 

MplsGopher said:
:rolleyes:

Fine, the camera was recording the All-22 of the field and was angled that way. Couldn’t help but also capture the sideline.

Exactly same thing achieved
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They already trade all-22
 

MplsGopher said:
Teams trade film all the time. Every week, every game. You can’t go there in person, but you can get film of the game from someone else. Did you really not know that?

Example: guaranteed that the Gopher staff has film from damn near every game that OSU played this year. Were they at all those games themselves? Nope, but they have the film anyway!

Stallions claimed he studied those and that’s what he told the staff.


You can’t disprove it. Boom
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Sigh. So if he just studied the film that was given to them, why did he have to attend all those games in person?

As already stated by someone else, they would have had the edited versions. They aren't getting a whole lot from those.
 

MplsGopher said:
But Stallions could have claimed that he got access to the unedited original All-22 tape, and that’s what he told the staff.

All I have to do is come up with a reasonable doubt to the idea that the staff for sure knew he was breaking rules to get to the level of proficiency he had in deciphering the signs.

I have achieved that.


Without evidence, you must presume innocence. This is America.

This should be obvious, but just for crystal clarity: I am not proving that Stallions didn’t break rules. Rather, I have proven a reasonable doubt to that the Mich core staff knew that he broke rules.
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OMG. If they for some reason requested the unedited versions, there would be some kind of proof of this. Because that would be highly unusual. There would be no "doubt" involved. Either it happened or it didn't. Easy to prove either way.
 

There would be no valid reason for the core coaching staff to need to prove that he did indeed request the raw A22.

Also, he could simply know their video manager and just asked for it without making a formal request/stink about it. You’re making up that it would be a “big deal”. You didn’t even know that teams traded tapes, but you’re an expert now?

They are allowed to assume he went about things above board and did it according to the rules.


I have achieved reasonable doubt, with respect to the coaching staff.


Go ahead and waive your hands. You’re so busy pushing over small children to declare guilt without evidence, you don’t have time for anything to get in the way of the beliefs you want to force to be true.

You want to force that they knew … because you want that to be true.
 

I mean …… does anyone here think they lose a game this year if they never had Stallions and his laminated sheets?

Goodness gracious. Talk about a mountain out of a molehill.

Maybe they score 7 less per game on average. So???
 

MplsGopher said:
I mean …… does anyone here think they lose a game this year if they never had Stallions and his laminated sheets?

Goodness gracious. Talk about a mountain out of a molehill.

Maybe they score 7 less per game on average. So???
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Losing a game, this year probably not. 2021 & 2022, probably yes. Suspension valid.

Regarding reasonable doubt, nobody cares. Even the Wolverines are not denying they broke the rules, they were relying on a Due Process argument.

They punted when they realized there's insurmountable irrefutable evidence.
 

Reasonable doubt applies to a criminal court of law.

We're in the zone of preponderance of the evidence, meaning 50.1% likelihood is all you need to prove.
 

Someone who has been following this more than me or at least knows football operations better than me tell me if this is a dumb question to even ask, but why is everyone so sure that all the players are 100% innocent? I'm not suggesting that they initiated any of this, but it doesn't seem that far fetched that they were at least well aware of it, no?
 

Gophers1992 said:
Someone who has been following this more than me or at least knows football operations better than me tell me if this is a dumb question to even ask, but why is everyone so sure that all the players are 100% innocent? I'm not suggesting that they initiated any of this, but it doesn't seem that far fetched that they were at least well aware of it, no?
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I don't claim to have memorized the NCAA rulebook, if that is even possible.

as to your question - If a player knew about a rules violation, but took no action, is that a violation in and of itself? on that one, I have no idea.
now if there is direct evidence of a player violating the rules - such as a point-shaving case - then the player can certainly face a penalty such as loss of eligibility.

but of course - if the player in question has already graduated or left school by the time the investigation is concluded - then punishing the player is a moot point.
 

WindyCityGopher said:
No, he really isn't. Payton, Butkus, Ditka, the Fridge, even Jimmy Mac are all Bears gods in this city. Nobody here gives a shit about Harbaugh unless they're Michigan alums.
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I'm certain there are plenty of Bears fans who are pissed about the meltdown he had against the Vikes on a certain Monday night game!
 

highwayman said:
sports.yahoo.com

Sources: NCAA's evidence vs. Michigan included booster involvement in scouting scheme, attempted destruction of evidence

The revelations altered Michigan’s and Jim Harbaugh’s legal approach. Both the school and Harbaugh dropped an attempt to secure a temporary restraining order against a three-game Big Ten suspension.
sports.yahoo.com sports.yahoo.com

Just when you thought it was safe to go in the water.
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This is tasty. I wonder if the cover up will be worse than the actual crime like it is in politics?
 

@Ope3 which game would they lose in 2022? Even if they lose ILL, which as I recall was a ref screw job more than anything, they still beat OSU and win the head-to-head so still go to the champ game, win that, and still to the CFP. 2021 you have more of an argument.

The reasonable doubt proves that the Mich coaching staff didn't know. Can't suspend them -- I'm talking about the NCAA future punishments.

The Big Ten was a literal nothing punishment, so it would cost them more in distraction to the team, not worth it to keep the litigation going when they got what they wanted, for the BT to drop its silly investigation. There was no evidence, though you'll be content to pretend there was.
 

a prominent Michigan booster denies that he is the "Uncle T" referenced in the illegal scouting case. from Yahoo Sports:

Michigan athletics donor Tim Smith denies his involvement in the NCAA’s investigation into the university’s advance scouting scheme and believes that those in power are searching for a “scapegoat” to blame, he told Yahoo Sports.

Smith, a Michigan alum and CEO of a Detroit-based engineering solutions company, said fans and university associates are identifying him as the Michigan booster who allegedly helped fund former UM staff member Connor Stalions’ in-person scouting and sign-stealing scheme.

“I can give you good news,” Smith said during a 30-minute phone call with Yahoo Sports. “I don’t recognize being known as ‘Uncle T’ and I will refute that myself. I never funded Connor. To say I knew him is perhaps overstating it. I said hi to him. I’ve spoken to him more since he left Michigan to make sure the young man is OK.”

Smith has not spoken to anyone at Michigan or the NCAA about the investigation but would be happy to do so, he said. He said he has nothing to hide and he remains convinced that Stalions’ scheme broke no rules.

“If you read the rules, it’s not at all clear that any rules were broken,” Smith said.
 

MplsGopher said:
You don’t need to sign-steal in the NFL. They have green dot helmets. So no, would not have happened with the Vikings.

Not to mention very good chance he had no idea it was even happening.

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The internet never lies
 

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