The NCAA has opened an investigation into No. 2 Michigan over possible rule-breaking around in-person scouting of opponents

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UMwolverine said:
Go ahead a

Please cite the rules.
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The rule was posted. Care to comment about your BS about how "no one knew" yet he was on the sidelines talking to coaches and they had laminated diagrams of the signals teams used? How about the hard drive with all the info he got by going to games and taking video that all the coaches had access to?

Go back to MLive...I bet they believe the diarrhea you are spewing!

The sad thing is...your coach is so patheticly weakminded he actually stole the signs from schools like Minnesota and Rutgers. If you are so worried you have to cheat against teams you should sleepwalk past no wonder he can't beat tOSU.
 

MplsGopher said:
The NCAA allows any school to pay any amount of money they want to, say, purchase the professional scouting services of MplsGopher Scouting Inc.

Mich, Ohio St, Penn St, etc. can all be my customers. I can go to their games, in-person, scout all I want, binoculars, video, whatever I want to do (that is allowed by the stadium for the public). Any number of weeks into the future schedule.

I can charge whatever I want to charge for those services, and those schools can choose to pay it or not. I can provide any number of laminated sheets that they want to pay for, summarizing my findings.

Yep. All good. Above board. In the clear.


But if they make me part of their staff, suddenly it step change switches over into a deadly sin.



Such a joke.
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Do you ever get tired of having such bad takes (under multiple names) that you are out on a island even on a site filled with fans of the same team as you? That has to be quite the ego shot.
 

Dave H said:
The rule was posted. Care to comment about your BS about how "no one knew" yet he was on the sidelines talking to coaches and they had laminated diagrams of the signals teams used? How about the hard drive with all the info he got by going to games and taking video that all the coaches had access to?

Go back to MLive...I bet they believe the diarrhea you are spewing!

The sad thing is...your coach is so patheticly weakminded he actually stole the signs from schools like Minnesota and Rutgers. If you are so worried you have to cheat against teams you should sleepwalk past no wonder he can't beat tOSU.
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Nixon-like.
 

In a sport where the top teams can just go buy the players they want off of other teams, I just have a hard time getting super outraged by this.

The violation is that he did it in person. Why not just do it off of video like every other team? It was extremely stupid to even get close to the rule about being there in person. But I guess I don't understand how being there in person is much more of an effective way of deciphering plays and signals than by watching multiple available video feeds?
 



WoodburyTim said:
In a sport where the top teams can just go buy the players they want off of other teams, I just have a hard time getting super outraged by this.

The violation is that he did it in person. Why not just do it off of video like every other team? It was extremely stupid to even get close to the rule about being there in person. But I guess I don't understand how being there in person is much more of an effective way of deciphering plays and signals than by watching multiple available video feeds?
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Same here. I'm far less outraged by this than I am really, really amused. The whole acting like some kind of CIA spy, writing a manifesto, and disguising himself as a CMU coach is just hilarious.
 

disco said:
Same here. I'm far less outraged by this than I am really, really amused. The whole acting like some kind of CIA spy, writing a manifesto, and disguising himself as a CMU coach is just hilarious.
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What's gonna be hilarious is when the deservedly harsh penalties come out next year they are going to see a big drop in recruiting. Wonder if Stalions ever went to a TCU game?
 

Oh Lawdy - it just keeps getting wackier - now there are allegations about ball-boys spying on other teams. this was in Sports Illustrated:

Multiple sources from one Big Ten school told SI that a coach at a different school called them before playing Michigan to warn them about Wolverines ball boys on their sideline listening to play calls and communicating information to the Michigan sideline—holding the football up in one hand to indicate an expected pass, and in the other hand to indicate a run, for instance. (Sources at the school that was warned said they experienced nothing in the game to implicate the Michigan ball boys.)

meanwhile, The Athletic did an anonymous survey of 50 FBS coaches to get their reaction. Almost all of the coaches said the allegations were either very serious or extremely serious. a number of coaches said that Michigan needs to be punished to prevent other schools from resorting to this type of behavior, with many favoring a post-season ban or loss of scholarships.
 

WoodburyTim said:
In a sport where the top teams can just go buy the players they want off of other teams, I just have a hard time getting super outraged by this.

The violation is that he did it in person. Why not just do it off of video like every other team? It was extremely stupid to even get close to the rule about being there in person. But I guess I don't understand how being there in person is much more of an effective way of deciphering plays and signals than by watching multiple available video feeds?
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I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a video feed of a game publicly where the signals of a given team are visible on every play. You may find a few signals here and there, but every play? Nope. In-person, they'd be able to record every signal from every play, offensive and defensive. With that level of knowledge, it wouldn't be hard to crack the signals to know what's coming. This is where the outrage comes from, at least on my part, that it's a clear competitive advantage IMO from what other teams do within the rules. There's a reason he (and whatever network he had) were going to games in-person.
 





Marooned said:
I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a video feed of a game publicly where the signals of a given team are visible on every play. You may find a few signals here and there, but every play? Nope. In-person, they'd be able to record every signal from every play, offensive and defensive. With that level of knowledge, it wouldn't be hard to crack the signals to know what's coming. This is where the outrage comes from, at least on my part, that it's a clear competitive advantage IMO from what other teams do within the rules. There's a reason he (and whatever network he had) were going to games in-person.
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That's fair. I am just not very sure of what videos a team can get it's hands on to study another or what they can all see. I know it is more than just the base TV video feed, but don't know if they can see the signaling.
 

It's hard to get too invested in this whole thing as this process will take forever and we'll be lucky if we hear anything official until next summer. Pete Thamel was saying the other day that once the NCAA has completed the investigation and officially presented the list of rules violations to Mich they (lawyers of course) will have 90 days to reply to those violations. So, like Thamel said when was the last time the NCAA did anything quickly and expedited an investigation?
 



UMwolverine said:
There's also a provision that allows 3rd parties to be hired to scout opponents. Obviously what this Stalions guy did went beyond that.
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Can you link to the provision?
 

maroonfive said:
This all goes back to when the quarterback from Fairview stole Westdale's playbook from the Brady's family room. It proved Greg right about him being a Fairview fink but it left Marcia devastated.
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Those were the days. I've never recovered.
 

www.espn.com

Sources: Coaches urge Big Ten to act on Michigan

A vast majority of the Big Ten coaches expressed their frustrations with the ongoing signal-stealing investigation at Michigan in a video call with commissioner Tony Petitti on Wednesday that was described as both intense and emotional, sources told ESPN.
www.espn.com www.espn.com
 

short ornery norwegian said:
… meanwhile, The Athletic did an anonymous survey of 50 FBS coaches to get their reaction. Almost all of the coaches said the allegations were either very serious or extremely serious. a number of coaches said that Michigan needs to be punished to prevent other schools from resorting to this type of behavior, with many favoring a post-season ban or loss of scholarships.
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Maybe if those 50 coaches talked to Woodbury Tim they’d settle down and see how silly their position is. I mean if it’s legal to buy over the counter pharmaceuticals, then what’s the big deal over illegally stealing stronger prescription pharmaceuticals? Six of one, half dozen of the other? 🤷🏼‍♂️
 
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Taji34 said:
www.espn.com

Sources: Coaches urge Big Ten to act on Michigan

A vast majority of the Big Ten coaches expressed their frustrations with the ongoing signal-stealing investigation at Michigan in a video call with commissioner Tony Petitti on Wednesday that was described as both intense and emotional, sources told ESPN.
www.espn.com www.espn.com
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Pettiti is a network tv and media guy, not a sports guy. Drama is huge for ratings. Bad Boy Michigan has become must-see TV down the stretch. Will they lose their magic powers? Will Harbaugh go into a catatonic state. Will Michigan fans and the administration circle the wagons or turn on the winningest* program in college football.

IMO they (Pettiti and Co) will look for any way to avoid a post-season ban this year, and shuffle the punishment off into the future when the hit to ratings will be more manageable; allow the bumbling (and slow) NCAA to intervene sometime down the road. It will be shocking if anything comes down now. Surprise me guys!
 

Taji34 said:
www.espn.com

Sources: Coaches urge Big Ten to act on Michigan

A vast majority of the Big Ten coaches expressed their frustrations with the ongoing signal-stealing investigation at Michigan in a video call with commissioner Tony Petitti on Wednesday that was described as both intense and emotional, sources told ESPN.
www.espn.com www.espn.com
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A vast majority of the Big Ten coaches expressed their frustrations with the ongoing signal-stealing investigation at Michigan in a video call with commissioner Tony Petitti on Wednesday, sources told ESPN.

The call, which took 90 minutes, included nearly an hour without Michigan coach Jim Harbaugh, who hung up after the regularly scheduled Big Ten business to allow the conference's coaches to speak freely about the NCAA's investigation into Michigan.

According to five sources familiar with the call, a chorus of voices encouraged Petitti to take action against Michigan in a call that was described as both intense and emotional.

"Collectively, the coaches want the Big Ten to act -- right now," said a source familiar with the call. "What are we waiting on? We know what happened."

www.espn.com

Sources: Coaches urge Big Ten to act on Michigan

A vast majority of the Big Ten coaches expressed their frustrations with the ongoing signal-stealing investigation at Michigan in a video call with commissioner Tony Petitti on Wednesday that was described as both intense and emotional, sources told ESPN.
www.espn.com www.espn.com

Go Gophers!!
 

So which Big Ten coach is going to stand in front of the podium and say Michigan cheated? I don't see Fleck doing it as long as Minn has a chance to win the West and reaching the Big ten title game, and Michigan likely advancing from East.
 

The prez sez said:
So which Big Ten coach is going to stand in front of the podium and say Michigan cheated? I don't see Fleck doing it as long as Minn has a chance to win the West and reaching the Big ten title game, and Michigan likely advancing from East.
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Well nobody has to....


In the meantime:

 

The Las Vegas Raiders have a Head Coaching vacancy. Seems like a perfect match for the Michigan HC to move on to Sin City.
 

once again, there is only so much Petitti can do by himself. Under B1G rules, for a violation of unsportsmanlike conduct - which this would fall under - Petitti can impose a fine of $10,000 and a 2-game suspension. In order to have a stronger penalty, the B1G would have to refer the matter to an executive committee for consideration.

Even if people want to see heads roll at Michigan, it's unlikely that any punishment will be handed down during the season. who knows how long a B1G executive committee would take to issue a decision. and for the NCAA, they have to issue a report first and then the school would have 90 days to respond - so again, nothing is going to happen until after the season is over.

the only question is whether Harbaugh sticks around to face the music, or if he tries to sneak out the door before any penalties (if any) are announced.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
once again, there is only so much Petitti can do by himself. Under B1G rules, for a violation of unsportsmanlike conduct - which this would fall under - Petitti can impose a fine of $10,000 and a 2-game suspension. In order to have a stronger penalty, the B1G would have to refer the matter to an executive committee for consideration.

Even if people want to see heads roll at Michigan, it's unlikely that any punishment will be handed down during the season. who knows how long a B1G executive committee would take to issue a decision. and for the NCAA, they have to issue a report first and then the school would have 90 days to respond - so again, nothing is going to happen until after the season is over.

the only question is whether Harbaugh sticks around to face the music, or if he tries to sneak out the door before any penalties (if any) are announced.
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I believe there was an article that said there was a dude at B1G who can act on these things when it comes to "integrity of the game".

Petitti might not be able to act unilaterally, but he might be able to give someone else the signal to do so.
 


A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
I believe there was an article that said there was a dude at B1G who can act on these things when it comes to "integrity of the game".

Petitti might not be able to act unilaterally, but he might be able to give someone else the signal to do so.
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Yeah, it sounds like Petitti can do more and if he doesn't, quickly, they could go no confidence in him and remove him. Both coaches and ADs believe, amongst all the schools, that this would lead to everyone being able to do whatever they want. 150 scholarships, etc.
 

Regardless of the consequences (or lack of them) Michigan sees, I bet in the off season we see the B1G announce moving to in-helmet signal technology for all the schools.

I read somewhere it was apparently on the table this past off season, but got delayed. I bet it's not gonna get delayed this off season. Might even have them for Spring Ball so coaches and players can get used to using them well before the 2024 season starts.
 


Hey people it’s Michigan, nothing is going to happen.
 


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