The 'coaching is irrelevant' Thread

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EasyThere Pilgrim

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No...wait. This thread is a good thing.

Because I will try to limit all of my 'coaching is irrelevant' posts to this thread only. Seriously. I don't want to inject that into every conversation...or even into several. Only here.

If others are starting to have this opinion...they can join me if they want.

Because I really feel bad for the owners of this board...Tony Leibert...etc...who want us to have hope that a coaching change will make things better. I don't want to be a downer.
 

I never say much after bad things happen.

I was against Kill & Claeys. But I never said anything after losses.

Yes I ranted recently about BB coaching being irrelevant...which was in opposition to many opinions. But that was when there was a chance that we could all come together soon...when there was hope.

So now...I'm not saying anything. Except in this thread.
 



I wanted to not reply because you just torpedo every topic here but I think this topic is interesting so here we are.

Where I think you are correct. You could have a high end coach at a great program and you are 100% going to lose kids to money at some point. There is not a coach out there immune to this. Long gone are the days a kid stays 4 years with a Knight, Izzo, Smith , K. No doubt that's frustrating.

Where you are wrong, or at least not willing to see. A new coach often brings excitement. Excitement tends to bring money. Money is the biggest draw. Right now we have maybe the least exciting coach in college. He isn't rah rah like PJ, he hasn't had success and he doesn't ooze confidence. Hard to get excited when the head of your program has seemingly nothing to offer. Again, it is 100% possible new coach X is awful, stumbles and in 3 years we are back to square 1. I get the idea that sucks and we don't want to do it, but you have to take that chance. Don't keep throwing Zach Wilson out there, admit it didn't work and move on like the Jets did! Rodgers didn't work out year 1, doesn't mean getting him was the wrong idea.

Second, not to keep ragging on CBJ but again he has no history of success or adapting quickly. In today's day and age you better be able to shift hard quick. That is where again a different coach may be able to do that. I think of a Dutcher who lost guys to the portal and still has solid teams. Or Howard, they lost Hawkins the year before late, still won their league.

The right coach still matters, no the right coach won't solve all your issues, or keep every player in the roster or guarantee anything. But they would certainly give you a better shot than a poor coach would.
 


leib0039 said:
I wanted to not reply because you just torpedo every topic here but I think this topic is interesting so here we are.

Where I think you are correct. You could have a high end coach at a great program and you are 100% going to lose kids to money at some point. There is not a coach out there immune to this. Long gone are the days a kid stays 4 years with a Knight, Izzo, Smith , K. No doubt that's frustrating.

Where you are wrong, or at least not willing to see. A new coach often brings excitement. Excitement tends to bring money. Money is the biggest draw. Right now we have maybe the least exciting coach in college. He isn't rah rah like PJ, he hasn't had success and he doesn't ooze confidence. Hard to get excited when the head of your program has seemingly nothing to offer. Again, it is 100% possible new coach X is awful, stumbles and in 3 years we are back to square 1. I get the idea that sucks and we don't want to do it, but you have to take that chance. Don't keep throwing Zach Wilson out there, admit it didn't work and move on like the Jets did! Rodgers didn't work out year 1, doesn't mean getting him was the wrong idea.

Second, not to keep ragging on CBJ but again he has no history of success or adapting quickly. In today's day and age you better be able to shift hard quick. That is where again a different coach may be able to do that. I think of a Dutcher who lost guys to the portal and still has solid teams. Or Howard, they lost Hawkins the year before late, still won their league.

The right coach still matters, no the right coach won't solve all your issues, or keep every player in the roster or guarantee anything. But they would certainly give you a better shot than a poor coach would.
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I might add I can guarantee you agents are using this against us at every possible turn.

It is hard not to feel right now like we are in a world of shit. I realize it is happening everywhere, but we don't have a lot of success or history of success as a fall back position. Hope he can pull a rabbit out of the hat. Time will tell.
 

[insert obligatory Wingspan comment]
 

leib0039 said:
I wanted to not reply because you just torpedo every topic here but I think this topic is interesting so here we are.

Where I think you are correct. You could have a high end coach at a great program and you are 100% going to lose kids to money at some point. There is not a coach out there immune to this. Long gone are the days a kid stays 4 years with a Knight, Izzo, Smith , K. No doubt that's frustrating.

Where you are wrong, or at least not willing to see. A new coach often brings excitement. Excitement tends to bring money. Money is the biggest draw. Right now we have maybe the least exciting coach in college. He isn't rah rah like PJ, he hasn't had success and he doesn't ooze confidence. Hard to get excited when the head of your program has seemingly nothing to offer. Again, it is 100% possible new coach X is awful, stumbles and in 3 years we are back to square 1. I get the idea that sucks and we don't want to do it, but you have to take that chance. Don't keep throwing Zach Wilson out there, admit it didn't work and move on like the Jets did! Rodgers didn't work out year 1, doesn't mean getting him was the wrong idea.

Second, not to keep ragging on CBJ but again he has no history of success or adapting quickly. In today's day and age you better be able to shift hard quick. That is where again a different coach may be able to do that. I think of a Dutcher who lost guys to the portal and still has solid teams. Or Howard, they lost Hawkins the year before late, still won their league.

The right coach still matters, no the right coach won't solve all your issues, or keep every player in the roster or guarantee anything. But they would certainly give you a better shot than a poor coach would.
Click to expand...
I completely agree a big name coach would inject, at least temporarily, some excitement and interest into the program.

I personally do not think any well-known, successful coach would take this job at the present time, regardless of money offered. There are several reasons:

* They all have good jobs; this one would not be as good.

* No successful, high profile coach (sitting in a good job) is going to risk his career, reputation, and legacy taking over a struggling program and trying to rebuild it.

* The first question any high profile coach would ask in the interview is, "How much NIL do you have for my players?" If Coyle's answer is, "Oh, we expect you to generate that too ... ", that ends the conversation.

Next, what is your view of the practical timing of making the change? Would you personally (be the AD for a moment) can Ben this week and then start casting around for interested high profile guys?

Realistically, Johnson can be fired sooner or later. His replacement is going to be a young mid-major coach who is not going to come with any big aura and excitement. He is not going to explode willingness to contribute to DA. He's is going to face the same problems Johnson is today.
 

leib0039 said:
I wanted to not reply because you just torpedo every topic here but I think this topic is interesting so here we are.

Where I think you are correct. You could have a high end coach at a great program and you are 100% going to lose kids to money at some point. There is not a coach out there immune to this. Long gone are the days a kid stays 4 years with a Knight, Izzo, Smith , K. No doubt that's frustrating.

Where you are wrong, or at least not willing to see. A new coach often brings excitement. Excitement tends to bring money. Money is the biggest draw. Right now we have maybe the least exciting coach in college. He isn't rah rah like PJ, he hasn't had success and he doesn't ooze confidence. Hard to get excited when the head of your program has seemingly nothing to offer. Again, it is 100% possible new coach X is awful, stumbles and in 3 years we are back to square 1. I get the idea that sucks and we don't want to do it, but you have to take that chance. Don't keep throwing Zach Wilson out there, admit it didn't work and move on like the Jets did! Rodgers didn't work out year 1, doesn't mean getting him was the wrong idea.

Second, not to keep ragging on CBJ but again he has no history of success or adapting quickly. In today's day and age you better be able to shift hard quick. That is where again a different coach may be able to do that. I think of a Dutcher who lost guys to the portal and still has solid teams. Or Howard, they lost Hawkins the year before late, still won their league.

The right coach still matters, no the right coach won't solve all your issues, or keep every player in the roster or guarantee anything. But they would certainly give you a better shot than a poor coach would.
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So win first...and then the money will flow in? Hire an exciting Dusty May type...and then big bosses will come out of the woodwork with money for Gopher men's basketball?
 



Big honchos aren't smart enough to see that we'd already be close with Garcia, Christie, Hawkins, Payne, & Mitchell Jr. as our base?
 

Garcia: 17.6 pts, 6.7 reb, 80% ft

Christie: NBA prospect as a freshman

Hawkins: 2nd most assists per game in the nation

Payne: Athletic C...big potential, worth $500K on this open market

Mitchell Jr: 1st year in B1G...led team in scoring in a few games

Why do we need to start over??
 

EasyThere Pilgrim said:
Garcia: 17.6 pts, 6.7 reb, 80% f
Gone Christie: NBA prospect as a freshman

Gone Hawkins: 2nd most assists per game in the nation

Gone Payne: Athletic C...big potential, worth $500K on this open market

Mitchell Jr: 1st year in B1G...led team in scoring in a few games

Why we need to start over??
Click to expand...

#FIFY
 

Ewert86PC said:
#FIFY
Click to expand...
Well yeah.

But I don't trust a plan that starts out from a false premise. That we need to clean house...reset everything with a new wonderful coach...and then start telling big-wigs that they should buy some new players.

Stupid.
 



If coaching were irrelevant, all of the top programs would get rid of their expensive programs, hire the cheapest coach they can find, and spend the money they currently pay for the coach on something else.

Yes, the Minnesota job has its challenges. If we made a change, I doubt we'd find someone who is going to win a conference title here next year. But I do believe a Big Ten job is still good enough to attract a coach who would have been good enough in the last three years to make at least one NCAA tourney and not have two of the worst seasons in program history.

Maybe our program has a ceiling, but we aren't anywhere near it right now.
 

U
EasyThere Pilgrim said:
Well yeah.

But I don't trust a plan that starts out from a false premise. That we need to clean house...reset everything with a new wonderful coach...and then start telling big-wigs that they should buy some new players.

Stupid.
Click to expand...
Welcome to modern college sports.
 

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