TE Nathan Bursch has committed to the Gophers!

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It's pretty naive to think what spoofin is describing doesn't happen. It happens almost every year and at every program. Like he said it's the only way to get the scholarship numbers to work out every single year. It's not magic, a lot of tough decisions go into it. Part of the coaches job.
 

bottlebass said:
It's pretty naive to think what spoofin is describing doesn't happen. It happens almost every year and at every program. Like he said it's the only way to get the scholarship numbers to work out every single year. It's not magic, a lot of tough decisions go into it. Part of the coaches job.
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I like to think the conversations with PJ go like this.


Player: "Hey coach, I was reading online that we might be over on the number of scholarships. I know you recruited me, but I can see playing time might be tough for me. I'm thinking maybe I should transfer out."

PJ: "Don't worry about the scholarships, we'll figure something out. Since you were in my first class, I'd really like to keep you."

Player: "PJ, I know this is a difficult conversation, but with what you have taught me, I'm prepared to make this difficult decision. Even though it's time for me to leave, I'll always be thankful for expanding my life athletically, academically, socially, and spiritually, and you've helped me improve my best every day, I'll always be thankful for everything you've done for me!" (tears flowing).

PJ: "I couldn't be prouder of you right now. Let me make some calls to some contacts to get you in a good spot where you can be a leader ON THE FIELD!" (HUGS ALL AROUND).
 


bottlebass said:
It's pretty naive to think what spoofin is describing doesn't happen. It happens almost every year and at every program. Like he said it's the only way to get the scholarship numbers to work out every single year. It's not magic, a lot of tough decisions go into it. Part of the coaches job.
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JG can't help himself... we're like that hot stove to him.
 

Face The Facts said:
I like to think the conversations with PJ go like this.


Player: "Hey coach, I was reading online that we might be over on the number of scholarships. I know you recruited me, but I can see playing time might be tough for me. I'm thinking maybe I should transfer out."

PJ: "Don't worry about the scholarships, we'll figure something out. Since you were in my first class, I'd really like to keep you."

Player: "PJ, I know this is a difficult conversation, but with what you have taught me, I'm prepared to make this difficult decision. Even though it's time for me to leave, I'll always be thankful for expanding my life athletically, academically, socially, and spiritually, and you've helped me improve my best every day, I'll always be thankful for everything you've done for me!" (tears flowing).

PJ: "I couldn't be prouder of you right now. Let me make some calls to some contacts to get you in a good spot where you can be a leader ON THE FIELD!" (HUGS ALL AROUND).
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I would like to believe that too. I don’t. Not even close, regardless of who the coach is.

Although I have no doubt that any good leader would work to get the player to believe it was their idea, and to take the steps on their own. It’s what good leaders always try to do.


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Hopefully, that means we'll see tight ends worked more into the passing game, which is great, though also a bit of a surprise.
 

bottlebass said:
It's pretty naive to think what spoofin is describing doesn't happen. It happens almost every year and at every program. Like he said it's the only way to get the scholarship numbers to work out every single year. It's not magic, a lot of tough decisions go into it. Part of the coaches job.
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I'm with Galt on this one. If a kid was forced out what would keep him from blasting the coach publicly? This would be a horrible look for a coach. I know players have claimed this at Bama, but there is a reason Saban claims it was due to medical reasons that they were let go. I don't think it's a super common practice.
 



bottlebass said:
It's pretty naive to think what spoofin is describing doesn't happen. It happens almost every year and at every program. Like he said it's the only way to get the scholarship numbers to work out every single year. It's not magic, a lot of tough decisions go into it. Part of the coaches job.
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The numbers don’t always work out though. That’s why teams sometimes award scholarships to walk-ons, possibly for a year or two, like we did with Brock Annexstad, Bailey S and some others over the past few years.

Are certain players encouraged to transfer? Absolutely. Are players told they either need to transfer or their scholarship will be pulled? I doubt it.
 

As I understand it, scholarships are annual agreements, subject to renewal at the head coach's discretion.

The conversation is likely, "I'm sorry son, but I just don't see you making the field here. I'm not going to be able to renew your scholarship. You're welcome to stay and compete as a walk-on, but I see a slim chance of you ever re-gaining a full ride here. If you'd prefer to find a school where you can play, we'd be glad to help. Your call."

Nothing underhanded here at all. That original scholarship offer is not for four or five years, but for a single year. The right things have to happen to keep getting it renewed.

JTG
 

In the BIG the scholarships are guaranteed for the entire time an athlete is enrolled. It is not a year to year renewal


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John Galt said:
That’s a reasonable example - nice job. Walk-ons usually understand their scholarships aren’t guaranteed for 4 years like scholarship players are.
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You really don't think it's common place in the NCAA?
 



What do I think - if a player absolutely refused to give up their scholarship, I do not think the school would force them to leave. too much chance of blow-back if it becomes public. No coach wants to be seen as pulling scholarships from kids.

But, in most cases, these players are competitors. they want to play, not just wear a uniform on the sideline at home games. so, given a choice, I suspect the vast majority of scholarship players would want to go someplace where they have a better chance of playing time. Now, if you're talking about some walk-on whose main focus is a degree, and they're playing FB just for fun, that's a different story. But we're talking about scholarship players. I have a hard time imagining a guy who is told "you're not going to play" and is happy to go through practice knowing you'll never see the field.

at the same time, I can see a coach - any coach - telling a player "look, you're not going to play here. If you agree to transfer, I'll help you find another school." with the implied understanding that the player makes it sound voluntary, or the coaching staff may not decide to be so "helpful."
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
You really don't think it's common place in the NCAA?
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Is what common place? That players are buried on the depth chart and encouraged to transfer, or given an ultimatum that their scholarship will be pulled?
 

John Galt said:
Is what common place? That players are buried on the depth chart and encouraged to transfer, or given an ultimatum that their scholarship will be pulled?
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You’re splitting hairs now JG. There are ways someone can essentially force one to leave w/o publicly pulling a scholly. Read SONs post for reference. “Encouraged” sounds so innocent - the process is anything but.


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btowngopher said:
I'm with Galt on this one. <b>If a kid was forced out what would keep him from blasting the coach publicly? </b>This would be a horrible look for a coach. I know players have claimed this at Bama, but there is a reason Saban claims it was due to medical reasons that they were let go. I don't think it's a super common practice.
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Pretty Simple: Lots to lose, little to gain. Not unlike the job market. Are you more likely to land your next job by taking the high road or by bashing your former employer? Now in this case it would be like also needing your former employer’s help to land that next job. What are you going to say?

Some kids leave for the reason stated and on their own. PT can be important to many. All don’t leave because of that. Asking them point blank why they left and them giving the answer they must give doesn’t really prove anything.


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rockford said:
As I understand it, scholarships are annual agreements, subject to renewal at the head coach's discretion.

The conversation is likely, "I'm sorry son, but I just don't see you making the field here. I'm not going to be able to renew your scholarship. You're welcome to stay and compete as a walk-on, but I see a slim chance of you ever re-gaining a full ride here. If you'd prefer to find a school where you can play, we'd be glad to help. Your call."

Nothing underhanded here at all. That original scholarship offer is not for four or five years, but for a single year. The right things have to happen to keep getting it renewed.

JTG
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Bursch scholarship would still be honored if he stayed at the U as a student and it wouldn't count towards the team

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Spoofin said:
Pretty Simple: Lots to lose, little to gain. Not unlike the job market. Are you more likely to land your next job by taking the high road or by bashing your former employer? Now in this case it would be like also needing your former employer’s help to land that next job. What are you going to say?

Some kids leave for the reason stated and on their own. PT can be important to many. All don’t leave because of that. Asking them point blank why they left and them giving the answer they must give doesn’t really prove anything.


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I don't think there would be much to stop them once they are at a new program though.
 

Face The Facts said:
I like to think the conversations with PJ go like this.


Player: "Hey coach, I was reading online that we might be over on the number of scholarships. I know you recruited me, but I can see playing time might be tough for me. I'm thinking maybe I should transfer out."

PJ: "Don't worry about the scholarships, we'll figure something out. Since you were in my first class, I'd really like to keep you."

Player: "PJ, I know this is a difficult conversation, but with what you have taught me, I'm prepared to make this difficult decision. Even though it's time for me to leave, I'll always be thankful for expanding my life athletically, academically, socially, and spiritually, and you've helped me improve my best every day, I'll always be thankful for everything you've done for me!" (tears flowing).

PJ: "I couldn't be prouder of you right now. Let me make some calls to some contacts to get you in a good spot where you can be a leader ON THE FIELD!" (HUGS ALL AROUND).
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Give me a break.
 


Attrition is normal. Some players get homesick. Other players realize that although they may be top dog in HS, in D1 College Football they are just average joes when compared to the competition. Some players truly want playing time.

IMHO, the Gopher coaches are pretty straight forward with kids that are buried in the depth chart like in the case of Nathan Bursch and TEs.

There is no conspiracy here.
 

rockford said:
As I understand it, scholarships are annual agreements, subject to renewal at the head coach's discretion.

The conversation is likely, "I'm sorry son, but I just don't see you making the field here. I'm not going to be able to renew your scholarship. You're welcome to stay and compete as a walk-on, but I see a slim chance of you ever re-gaining a full ride here. If you'd prefer to find a school where you can play, we'd be glad to help. Your call."

Nothing underhanded here at all. That original scholarship offer is not for four or five years, but for a single year. The right things have to happen to keep getting it renewed.

JTG
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That rule changed a few years ago. They are 4 years now.
 

Yep, I think it's fairly clear I was quite wrong. :p

But if anyone else would like to point it out, feel free. :D

JTG
 

rockford said:
Yep, I think it's fairly clear I was quite wrong. :p

But if anyone else would like to point it out, feel free. :D

JTG
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You were wrong! (There, feel better now?). [emoji16]


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caliGopher said:
I would like to believe that too. I don’t. Not even close, regardless of who the coach is.

Although I have no doubt that any good leader would work to get the player to believe it was their idea, and to take the steps on their own. It’s what good leaders always try to do.


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This happens in corporate America too - We call it counseling somebody out. Which really is meant for the betterment of both the employee and the company (when done properly).
 

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