Spencer says Gophers job is no better than 9th in the Big Ten

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BleedGopher said:
per a USA Today article titled "Minnesota's Tubby Smith on the hot seat vs. Florida in NCAAs" - per the article:

The job is a good one, but not necessarily a destination job for coaches. Gopher Radio Network analyst Spencer Tollackson, who played his last season at Minnesota during Smith's first year, said the job is no better than the ninth-best in the league based on challenges related to resources and support.

"Other than when Clem (Haskins) cheated his ass off, what have they done (before Smith)?" Tollackson said. "Maybe it's not the head coach. Maybe these problems are deeper. If they think just getting another guy in place is the answer, I think people are severely naïve."

As an example of the gulf between the Minnesota program and some of its peers, Tollackson said he recalls waiting for a flight to another Big Ten school in recent months when he saw a private jet land, a woman and two kids get off. Then out walked Michigan State coach Tom Izzo, Tollackson said, who went to see highly touted point guard Tyus Jones play before getting back on the plane in time to be home for dinner.

"Until Minnesota has that, it will be very difficult to compete," Tollackson said. "You hear about keeping up with the Joneses. If you don't, you have no shot at surviving."

And now Smith's future could hinge on Sunday's NCAA tournament game against Donovan's Gators.

"I'm never surprised with anything," Smith said. "In this business? Are you kidding me, I'm too old to be surprised anymore."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...olden-gophers-basketball-tubby-smith/2013975/

Go Gophers!!
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I didn't realize that private jets landed where the general public is waiting for the large airlines, I have been to that airport and the only private jets I have seen are to far away to make out the person climbing aboard or out of them. But then he knew Izzo was going to see Tyus play and not just flying in to shop at the Mall of America because Izzo stopped to chat with him?
 

Has anyone here ever been to Champagne? Iowa City? Lincoln? I'd think that quality of life would play some role in determining which job is best. 6th or 7th seems about right. Just because Tubby is the 9th best coach in the conference doesn't make UMN the 9th best job in the conference.
 

skoalvikings said:
Has anyone here ever been to Champagne? Iowa City? Lincoln? I'd think that quality of life would play some role in determining which job is best. 6th or 7th seems about right. Just because Tubby is the 9th best coach in the conference doesn't make UMN the 9th best job in the conference.
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A lot of college kids / coaches may prefer that smaller town feel. No one would say MN is a better job than UK because Minneapolis is better than Lexington. I do agree though that for some the city atmosphere could be a plus. It was for me in where I attended college at least. That more so depends on the person.
 

howeda7 said:
The facilities issue is valid. But Minnesota is in major metro area and the only school in a state of 5 million people. Wisconsin has to compete with Marquette (and UW Milwaukee, GB, etc.) Iowa is in the middle of nowhere and has to be compete with ISU (and Drake, NIU, etc.). Illinoi probably is a better job. Chicago certainly produces more talent. But Northwestern is also there. And Depaul. And UIC. etc. Missouri and Kansas certainly have as much claim to St. Louis talent as Illinois does.

Minnesota also has good fan support. Look up national attendance #'s. We're usually in the top 25. The Barn still provides a pretty good home court advantage. Revenue should not be a disadvantage. There's been articles posted recently about the 'most valuable' programs. We're in the top 10 (the B1G does well in these lists). If we're funneling that money elsewhere and being cheap with the program, we can fix that. There are a lot of positives. The facilities are the main negative. But that is a fixable problem.
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While Wisconsin does compete with Marquette they produce about twice as much top 150 talent than MN does. Even if they only get half of the top 150 every year they still have a better class than what all of MN produced. Luckily, since Tubby was hired they haven't really been able to dip into the top 150 talent MN produces as well.

The Big3 year and the Royce White year have been exceptions to the rule. I believe Gophersiniowa has done some checking on this, but the lack of talent MN produces compare to other big 10 states is very significant.
 

Atl Gopher said:
I don't know if you noticed it or not but the Minnesota press tends to be pretty negative and non-supportive when it comes to both our basketball and football programs. The word tends is a gross understatement. Add to that how a small percentage of our fan base can now easily communicate their constant negativity on forums such as Gopher Hole and various social media formats.


The fact is that one key recruit in basketball can make a huge difference. Look at the many small programs (after last night you can throw in Wichita State in as an example) In Minnesota almost every year we have some special basketball talent. What makes this a less than attractive job as the Minnesota coach is how hard we make it for our coach to recruit even in his own state. If you were Tyus and the other top recruits in 2014 and you keep reading that the coach is not going to be around, what would you think.

That class has the ability to make their home school one of the top coaching jobs in the county and begin to build that Gopher legacy. Those kids would most likely love to be home town heroes and have their friends and families come to every game. I think we need the new facility and the funds to make it as easy as possible for our coach to visit key prospects, but to me it is not the biggest issue.
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I think Rick Pitino said it best. The negativity in this town sucks. It's just an attitude of Minnesotans. I went to college in Iowa during a time when they had Stokes, Payne, Marble, Horton, Gamble, Armstrong, and in football Ronnie Harman, Chuck Long and Larry Station. In Iowa, it is the only show and it is so much different than Minnesota. In my opinion it is quite a bit bigger than what Wisconsin has now because Wisconsin has the Bucks, Packers and Brewers. Iowans support the Hawks like we support the Vikings and Twins. Does Minnesota have potential to be an attractive job? Yeah, but we have talked about a practice facility for 7 years at least now and still have not broken ground. The attitude of the fan base is that if our coaches don't win as many games as Wisconsin do, they are failures and need to be fired. It took Wisconsin a long time to build what they have now. If you don't believe me look up how many times Wisconsin beat us in basketball and football in the 70's and 80's and in basketball through the '90's. Starting in '71 I think we beat Wisconsin 17 straight times in basketball or something close to that. In the 80's and 90's we beat them quite a bit more than they beat us too (in basketball).
 


Atl Gopher said:
I don't know if you noticed it or not but the Minnesota press tends to be pretty negative and non-supportive when it comes to both our basketball and football programs. The word tends is a gross understatement. Add to that how a small percentage of our fan base can now easily communicate their constant negativity on forums such as Gopher Hole and various social media formats.

The fact is that one key recruit in basketball can make a huge difference. Look at the many small programs (after last night you can throw in Wichita State in as an example) In Minnesota almost every year we have some special basketball talent. What makes this a less than attractive job as the Minnesota coach is how hard we make it for our coach to recruit even in his own state. If you were Tyrus and the other top recruits in 2014 and you keep reading that the coach is not going to be around, what would you think.

That class has the ability to make their home school one of the top coaching jobs in the county and begin to build that Gopher legacy. Those kids would most likely love to be home town heroes and have their friends and families come to every game. I think we need the new facility and the funds to make it as easy as possible for our coach to visit key prospects, but to me it is not the biggest issue.
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Not sure how the press plays into it as many schools have high pressure media. Granted, they have other factors making them attractive as well (weather, history, facilities, talent pool, etc. )

Do agree though that if the Big3 committed to MN that'd be a HUGE step towards starting to build some great tradition. They literally could make Minnesota move up a few spots if they won. However, their success would have to be parlayed into further success.
 

skoalvikings said:
Has anyone here ever been to Champagne? Iowa City? Lincoln? I'd think that quality of life would play some role in determining which job is best. 6th or 7th seems about right. Just because Tubby is the 9th best coach in the conference doesn't make UMN the 9th best job in the conference.
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Have you been to those cities? In Iowa City and Lincoln, Iowa and Nebraska are the only shows in town. If you are playing for those colleges it is like you are playing for the Vikings in Minnesota...maybe bigger because there is so much more to keep people distracted in the Twin Cities.
 

ethomasp31 said:
I think Rick Pitino said it best. The negativity in this town sucks. It's just an attitude of Minnesotans. I went to college in Iowa during a time when they had Stokes, Payne, Marble, Horton, Gamble, Armstrong, and in football Ronnie Harman, Chuck Long and Larry Station. In Iowa, it is the only show and it is so much different than Minnesota. In my opinion it is quite a bit bigger than what Wisconsin has now because Wisconsin has the Bucks, Packers and Brewers. Iowans support the Hawks like we support the Vikings and Twins. Does Minnesota have potential to be an attractive job? Yeah, but we have talked about a practice facility for 7 years at least now and still have not broken ground. The attitude of the fan base is that if our coaches don't win as many games as Wisconsin does they are failures and need to be fired. It took Wisconsin a long time to build what they have now. If you don't believe me look up how many times Wisconsin beat us in basketball and football in the 70's and 80's and in basketball through the '90's. Starting in '71 I think we beat Wisconsin 17 straight times in basketball or something close to that. In the 80's and 90's we beat them quite a bit more than they beat us too (in basketball).
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I think that the pro sports play a big part of that though too. Our media who covers the Wolves and Vikings don't realize that college sports are different and they criticize and treat them the same way. Iowa only knows college sports. If the media treated the Gophers like they do the Vikings and Twins. It'd be a completely different world here.
 

I don't know if Tubby Smith is the answer for the Gophers as far as a basketball coach is concerned and my hunch is that he might not be. But until we get some other things fixed it is hard to tell. The main reason I say my hunch is that he may not be the answer is because of the negativity of the fan base. I honestly think that there are some people who post on this board who would want Tubby fired even if we win the National Championship this year. I think the negativity of the fan base has hurt the team, the recruiting and the program a lot more than people think, and quite honestly, that has to be changed just like a new practice facility before this program can move to the next level also. I'm not saying it has hurt Tubby, I'm saying it has hurt MY TEAM. I think it is extremely hypocritical for some fans to minimize the victory over UCLA because of an injury when they didn't give the benefit of the doubt to Tubby when we were 3/4 through a great season when Al Nolen got hurt two years ago (we were 18-4 and 5-3 in the B1G with the most difficult part of that schedule done) or when Trevor Mbakwe got hurt last year. Without those injuries we would probably be on a 5 year run of making the tournament.
 



I wonder how much having a crappy radio color commentator hurts our chances of landing good recruits.
 

ethomasp31 said:
I don't know if Tubby Smith is the answer for the Gophers as far as a basketball coach is concerned and my hunch is that he might not be. But until we get some other things fixed it is hard to tell. The main reason I say my hunch is that he may not be the answer is because of the negativity of the fan base. I honestly think that there are some people who post on this board who would want Tubby fired even if we win the National Championship this year. I think the negativity of the fan base has hurt the team, the recruiting and the program a lot more than people think, and quite honestly, that has to be changed just like a new practice facility before this program can move to the next level also. I'm not saying it has hurt Tubby, I'm saying it has hurt MY TEAM. I think it is extremely hypocritical for some fans to minimize the victory over UCLA because of an injury when they didn't give the benefit of the doubt to Tubby when we were 3/4 through a great season when Al Nolen got hurt two years ago (we were 18-4 and 5-3 in the B1G with the most difficult part of that schedule done) or when Trevor Mbakwe got hurt last year. Without those injuries we would probably be on a 5 year run of making the tournament.
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I would agree with most of this statement. Hey, I'm frustrated too..but before you get rid of Tubby think about it.. we have horrible facilities and no financial support. Good attendance does not matter.. we have perhaps the worst big donor support of any big school in terms of alumni. An annual $250 donation for seats is not big donor support. We need more cash. Also, I was listening to some talking head on ESPN (a columnist from LA) and he was talking about coaching changes and programs..he basically said the same thing Spencer said. He said that to become a Michigan St or KY, your coach needs a private jet. Coach Cal takes his private jet to high school games after practice for cripes sake. Then, the shiny facilities. If it was just one thing, I would say its an excuse, but across the board, the "U" does not support basketball and what is needed to win consistently. In fact, we harvest what we do have in hoops to make up for a piss poor football program (which I support). Hiring a new coach before some of these things are finished will not further the program in my opinion. I think it may provide a quick shot in the arm in terms of excitement (as did Tubby). But I don't see a different coach doing a whole lot better than 50% run rate for making the tourney (like Tubby). You can definitely win here, but to win at the level folks keep harping about.. you need to improve the foundation.

Many on this board complain about settling for being average. Well, if you are not happy with that, you should be routing all this negative energy that you have towards the coach towards the University of Minnesota to start funding hoops. We do not support the program at an elite level. The gap will continue to widen. Minnesota will not improve its current position by just signing 3 Minnesotans each year. In fact, we will get worse. There are some years that works (2014), but most it will be horrible. To bring in 4 star (even high demand 3 stars like Gavin), we need to build the program. The coach is part of that, but there is a lot more involved. I would rather we spend the money that we would have to spend on a Tubby buyout and then a big early buyout for a new coach, spend that on upgrading the facilities. If Tubby doesn't turn it around, then the facilities are in place for a new coach, or at least a concrete plan.
 

We are not going to get any coach to come here until they announce or better yet put a shovel in the ground for a new practice facility.

Gophers will be 5th best job in Big Ten with a new practice facility.
 

Lets be honest...it's all about the perks and the 'tang! Perks = facilities, arena and extra stuff given to the athletes. All those things add up to being a Big Man On Campus = TANG!
 



You know what, Spencer's right. You have to give him credit for speaking up with things that people don't want to hear. The program needs to be upgraded in a number of ways.

The obvious question is how you get there. That's for Norwood to figure out. It starts with making the decision of whether Tubby is the guy or whether someone else gives you a better chance to grow the program going forward. I agree with the posters on here who say it would be difficult to attract an up and comer to the 9th best job in the conference or whatever it is. But you absolutely cannot be satisfied with that as your lot in life. Maybe it starts with upgrading everything you can including facilities and see what dividends it pays. Maybe it starts with hiring some veteran alumni coach who loves the program and would take the job even if we played in an airplane hangar and practiced in someone's garage. It's somewhat of a chicken-and-egg question. The only thing that won't work is to stand pat. You have to have a vision and a strategy and get on with it.
 

Name one city better than Mpls. to live in the big10?????
 


Rouser said:
I would agree with most of this statement. Hey, I'm frustrated too..but before you get rid of Tubby think about it.. we have horrible facilities and no financial support. Good attendance does not matter.. we have perhaps the worst big donor support of any big school in terms of alumni. An annual $250 donation for seats is not big donor support. We need more cash. Also, I was listening to some talking head on ESPN (a columnist from LA) and he was talking about coaching changes and programs..he basically said the same thing Spencer said. He said that to become a Michigan St or KY, your coach needs a private jet. Coach Cal takes his private jet to high school games after practice for cripes sake. Then, the shiny facilities. If it was just one thing, I would say its an excuse, but across the board, the "U" does not support basketball and what is needed to win consistently. In fact, we harvest what we do have in hoops to make up for a piss poor football program (which I support). Hiring a new coach before some of these things are finished will not further the program in my opinion. I think it may provide a quick shot in the arm in terms of excitement (as did Tubby). But I don't see a different coach doing a whole lot better than 50% run rate for making the tourney (like Tubby). You can definitely win here, but to win at the level folks keep harping about.. you need to improve the foundation.

Many on this board complain about settling for being average. Well, if you are not happy with that, you should be routing all this negative energy that you have towards the coach towards the University of Minnesota to start funding hoops. We do not support the program at an elite level. The gap will continue to widen. Minnesota will not improve its current position by just signing 3 Minnesotans each year. In fact, we will get worse. There are some years that works (2014), but most it will be horrible. To bring in 4 star (even high demand 3 stars like Gavin), we need to build the program. The coach is part of that, but there is a lot more involved. I would rather we spend the money that we would have to spend on a Tubby buyout and then a big early buyout for a new coach, spend that on upgrading the facilities. If Tubby doesn't turn it around, then the facilities are in place for a new coach, or at least a concrete plan.
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The whole issue is that the coach we hired hasn't been who we though he would be, nearly everyone thought we were hiring an Izzo, Boeheim, Self, ect; a transformational coach who puts the program on his back and leads it to greater places. Instead we've paid for a guy who makes head scratching coaching decisions, complains about facilites and chronically underperforms.
 

goldengophers said:
The whole issue is that the coach we hired hasn't been who we though he would be, nearly everyone thought we were hiring an Izzo, Boeheim, Self, ect; a transformational coach who puts the program on his back and leads it to greater places. Instead we've paid for a guy who makes head scratching coaching decisions, complains about facilites and chronically underperforms.
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To be fair however, the university hasn't upheld their end of the bargain as well. Tubby was promised a practice facility out of the gate and nothing. They need to do a better job of delivering on what they promised, or else coaching candidates will think of this as a school that promises but doesn't deliver what a coach feels they need to win.
 

GopherGod said:
To be fair however, the university hasn't upheld their end of the bargain as well. Tubby was promised a practice facility out of the gate and nothing. They need to do a better job of delivering on what they promised, or else coaching candidates will think of this as a school that promises but doesn't deliver what a coach feels they need to win.
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Were you privy to the conversations about a practice facility when tubby was hired?
 

goldengophers said:
The whole issue is that the coach we hired hasn't been who we though he would be, nearly everyone thought we were hiring an Izzo, Boeheim, Self, ect; a transformational coach who puts the program on his back and leads it to greater places. Instead we've paid for a guy who makes head scratching coaching decisions, complains about facilites and chronically underperforms.
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Spot.

On.
 

GopherGod said:
To be fair however, the university hasn't upheld their end of the bargain as well. Tubby was promised a practice facility out of the gate and nothing. They need to do a better job of delivering on what they promised, or else coaching candidates will think of this as a school that promises but doesn't deliver what a coach feels they need to win.
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Uh, we don't know that (said in that Garage Logic voice)
 


Spencer was the Rodney of his time.
Big expectations coming in, and then......
 

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