So which side are you on?

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anonymous

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In the wake of this loss, my question to Gophers fans is whether this is a bad loss or an acceptable loss?

But, at the same time, I think it's kind of more complicated than just good loss or bad loss.

Why?

If you think this is a bad loss, I can totally see your point. Truly good teams don't lose to teams like Portland. Because while the Pilots return a lot of experience, this wasn't a road game and a team that has the kind of aspirations that the Gophers have shouldn't lose.

If you think this is an acceptable loss, I get that as well. The Gophers weren't at full strength, Portland has good players and crushed UCLA, etc. But if you say that, then I don't think you can say that the Gophers have a chance to be a truly elite team.

Why? I just looked back at last season's Elite 8 teams. Seven of those teams did not have anything that resembled a bad loss. The closest thing that there was to a bad loss was Louisville losing to a pretty good Western Kentucky team that finished high in the RPI.

What I don't think you can do is say this was an acceptable loss and say that the Gophers are a great team. I don't think you can have it both ways. I say pick a side. Either the Gophers have a chance to be great and this was awful. Or say it isn't horrible, but the Gophers just might not be all that much better than a year ago.
 

I don't think it was a devastating loss because Portland is a quality team, but its very disheartening to me because I thought we had made strides to be a better than last year.
 

It's a bad loss. The problems we had are eerily similar to last year, which leads me to expect similar results at best. We wont lose every game for the rest of the season, but we will probably be a 1 and done in the tournament or an NIT team this year unless we somehow learn how to shoot, defend the 3, rebound, make a free throw...
 

TubbytownUSA said:
It's a bad loss. The problems we had are eerily similar to last year, which leads me to expect similar results at best. We wont lose every game for the rest of the season, but we will probably be a 1 and done in the tournament or an NIT team this year unless we somehow learn how to shoot, defend the 3, rebound, make a free throw...
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I expect the Gophers to win the next 7 OOC games then win 12 Big 10 games for 23-7 record heading into B10 tourney in Indy next March.
 

I don't like this loss but, I think Porland was a excellent team. We'll have see how they play against W.V. to see how good they are.

I never felt the Gophers were a "great" team. Especially with the suspensions. They don't rebound well. The are a below average shooting team. Still I love watching the defensive effort they make each night. They always have a chance to win.
 


Not a bad loss.

As I have said in other threads, I don't think Portland will be viewed as a bad loss by next March. At this point I expect Portland to be in the NCAA mix.

I like our lads and I like this team. I think it is our best team since the team that did not exist. They had an off night shooting. It happens.

Is it a "great" team? No, and I didnt expect it to be. I do hope it becomes a very good team this year.

The hand-wringing and bedwetting seems pretty silly to me.

Go Gophers :clap: :clap: :clap:
 

not a bad loss

A tired team, after playing a tough game against Butler, ran out of gas in the first half yet stayed with a good Portland squad who had an easy game with a weak UCLA. Legs were gone during the second half and a late second wind ran out at the end when they nearly pulled it out. Clearly a good team that even Lavin said will compete for a B10 title.
 

I consider it a bad loss because we were a lot more athletic and had better talent. But it's really early yet, so nobody can know for sure where we will end up. Are there issues with this team? You bet. But take a look around the Big Ten you'll see that there are issues with just about every other team in the league.
 

depends

if we win the next two - I'm OK with it. Despite some rants about Tubby's bad coaching - we had plenty of open looks and free throws which we could not convert. 3 for 19 on threes and one that went in was a banked one! So beat A&M and Miami and we can forget about it. But I am wary...........
 



I am sure that Michigan State and Michigan looked at their losses at bad losses too! :confused:
 

This team will be ranked by week's end, just hope that they off West Virginia too.
 

Dr.Don said:
I am sure that Michigan State and Michigan looked at their losses at bad losses too! :confused:
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Florida is a good team. MSU sees that loss as a bad loss just because they have very high expectations, and (rightly so) any loss to a not top-25 team is pretty bad for a top-10 team.

Michigan's loss to Marquette is pretty similar to this loss to Portland.
 

Section201 said:
As I have said in other threads, I don't think Portland will be viewed as a bad loss by next March. At this point I expect Portland to be in the NCAA mix.

I like our lads and I like this team. I think it is our best team since the team that did not exist. They had an off night shooting. It happens.

Is it a "great" team? No, and I didnt expect it to be. I do hope it becomes a very good team this year.

The hand-wringing and bedwetting seems pretty silly to me.
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Well stated - I totally agree. As avid followers of our local team, I think we tend to overrate our own team's talent while often overlooking the talent of our opponents. We've all seen what each of our players can do on a given night and have come to expect that high level of talent and execution each and every game. However, the opposition also knows our strengths and tries to take away the things we do well - for example, I thought Portland did an excellent job in taking away our transition game (not an easy accomplishment, so hats off to the Pilots on a job well done).

I thought the effort by our Gophers was there all night, but the execution and shooting were both off - that's a tough combination to overcome against a good opponent. With the talent we have (very good but not elite) and the intensity level we bring every night, I think the Gophers are very capable of making a run come tournament time.

Of course there's still lots of room for improvement before we start thinking of purchasing those Final Four ducats.
- Can't anyone teach RSIII some low post moves to take advantage of his size and agility (calling Kevin McHale..)?
- Did anyone else think that Rodney W looked like a deer caught in the headlights these past 2 games; he doesn't seem to be playing with confidence and almost looks like he's avoiding the ball.
- I'd like to see a little more of Justin Cobbs - he seems to do well when he's in there and is more of an offensive threat than Nolen - I think we'll need that added dimension during B10 play.
 



I think this is an acceptably bad loss that is good for us to get out of the way. Having now covered all the bases, let me just say that this a great team and the greatest since last year's team but not as great as next year's team. It is certainly greater than the team that lost to Winona. It is a greater team than the one that lost to Gardner-Webb (05-06). It is a greater team than those that lost to Nebraska (02-03 and 03-04). It is a greater team than the one that lost to UNC-Wilmington (01-02) ... :eek:

Let the counterpoints resume.
 

I don't think we've heard the last of Portland this year. There's a chance they'll make more teams "look bad" in losses. They still have Gonzaga (conference play), West Virginia and Washington on their schedule and already have victories over Oregon, UCLA, and Minnesota.
 

A question that says a lot about you.

It's sad to see the negative panic on a lot of these threads.

anonymous(uh, nice handle) your particular version of fair-weather-fan is disguised in a ludicrous question. Either they're bad and this is acceptable or they're good and this was impossible...Hmmm. You sound like a zen master.

This is a team being built from the ground up by a Hall of Fame coach. Each year they've improved . This year looks no different. NO, they didn't magically become the Big Ten favorites, or a lock to to go to the Final Four. It seems their offense is still trying to find itself. (The pick and roll stuff and some of the flow during the Butler game is nice to see). Watching young players grow through adversity, making mistakes, coming together as a team, this is fun to watch. I think so anyway.

Soooo, question for you.

Either this team is more enjoyable (remember how sports are supposed to be fun?) to watch now or four years ago....Which side are YOU on?

Or... either you enjoy being happy when they do well or you enjoy being angry when the do poorly... I think you get the idea....
 

It's both.

There's no shame in losing to Portland on a neutral court. They're a very good team who will likely be in the mix for an at-large berth by season's end. This loss will never show up in a "bad loss" category when the Gophers at-large possibilities are discussed.

I do in some ways think it's a bad loss, however, because the Gophers were clearly the better team, I thought, but squandered an opportunity to get a nice win by getting outworked, outsmarted, and outplayed (and by shooting like garbage).

This loss left a very bad taste in my mouth, but it's not a season killer and doesn't necessarily mean the season is going to be a failure. Just beat A&M tomorrow and we can forget all about it.
 

This is not a bad loss. It's a loss. We didn't choke, we were just outplayed. Portland was the better team. If they continue to play this well they will be ranked at the end of the season, they may be ranked next week and will be a lock for ranking next week if they beat West Virginia.

We lost to a top 25-35 team. That's not a bad loss (unless we think we are contending for a national championship or final four, which I do not).

The thing we need the most is a consistent shot maker that can create shots, make the open jump shot, and drive to the basket to pick up the big foul and make the free throws. We don't have a player like that now. Westbrook is too small and/or not fast enough to be a top play maker. He has his moments, but he hasn't shown the ability to consistently take over a game.

This loss was disappointing because it dispelled whatever dreams we had that we were a top 10 team - dreams that were more lofty after the Butler win. We're not not a top ten team, and we also squashed Butler's dreams. I would much prefer to beat Butler and lose to Portland then the other way around.
 

Too Early to Tell

Poor shooting hurt us, and fatigue was likely a factor in that. Two time zones from home and a hard fought game the night before can have that effect. Had we made a couple of more shots we wouldn't be having this discussion. We'll know more in afew days.
 

beowulftom,

I don't think this is a great Gophers team. I think they are above average, but I'll be surprised if they finish in the top 4 in the Big Ten. Because of that, I don't think this is a bad loss.

My point was that elite teams don't lose to teams like Portland on a neutral court. They find a way to grind it out. They find a way to win when they don't play their best. That isn't a dig at Portland, but the top mid-majors do lack something. Sometimes it's size, sometimes it is athleticism. Schools from the top conferences simply have a ton of advantages.

If there is a rub in this, it is that it does hurt the overall strength of the Gophers non-conference resume. Sunday's game against A&M isn't going to excite anyone at the end of the season. And a loss could hurt. We'll see what happens I guess.
 

Portland is better then Iowa, Indiana and probably Penn State. They are probably equal to Northwestern. Would we have seen the same panic on this board if we had lost a neutral site game to one of these teams? I doubt it, because in a tough conference slate sometimes you lose games you ought not have lost. (Okay, if we lose to Iowa, even I will be alarmed.)

Nevertheless, this wasn't a 'bad' loss in any sense of the word. Now if Portland collapses in a heap and finished 7th in the WCC, it will look like one, but that seems pretty unlikely. It was disappointing to lose to a team we were better then. But it happens.
 

anonymous said:
beowulftom,

I don't think this is a great Gophers team. I think they are above average, but I'll be surprised if they finish in the top 4 in the Big Ten. Because of that, I don't think this is a bad loss.

My point was that elite teams don't lose to teams like Portland on a neutral court. They find a way to grind it out. They find a way to win when they don't play their best. That isn't a dig at Portland, but the top mid-majors do lack something. Sometimes it's size, sometimes it is athleticism. Schools from the top conferences simply have a ton of advantages.

If there is a rub in this, it is that it does hurt the overall strength of the Gophers non-conference resume. Sunday's game against A&M isn't going to excite anyone at the end of the season. And a loss could hurt. We'll see what happens I guess.
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Anonymous,

Point taken, I agree that you'd like to see the gophers find a way to exploit the obvious talent difference but I really think that will take time. I'm fine with them being exactly as good as they really are right now, no shame in that. AND... I think Portland may end up not being much of an anchor on our ranking if they continue to do well. Our guys, they're young and improving, the core of this team's frontcourt (Damien Johnson would be best at small forward) is either a sophomore or suspended. Add Mbakwe and possibly White and Eliason (next year) and we'll start to look like a team that will challenge for the big ten title. Even so, I think this year will be fun to watch and if they begin to click offensively they could surprise.

I think your critique is accurate, I'm encouraging you to enjoy the ride, however bumpy it gets.
 

No loss is s good loss

and this was certainly disappointing. And worthy of discussion, anon. But I'm not too concerned at this point. It will be interesting to see how WV fares against Portland. We'll need to be pulling for Butler and Portland to have good seasons!
 

Northwestern beats higher ranked teams every year with this same kind of team. Portland is like some of the old Gonzaga teams. What a fundamentally sound fun team to watch. Portland will be a ranked team and one of the best mid-majors around. 58% on three's? How many teams have even one guy who can shoot that good?
 

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