So I was reading a Baylor forum and...

[It's a Pig Man!]

If tOSU played Mississippi State on a neutral field tomorrow, I will take Ohio State. The earlier argument about quality of loss is a little ridiculous IMO. tOSU is a different team than the one that lost to Virginia Tech. Barrett has improved by leaps and bounds. In addition, Alabama is not the Alabama of a few years ago. There is no one dominant team or teams this year.

I would probably take MSU but I think it would be a very good game. That's not really the point. Since I don't think you could very clearly say which team is better you have to look at resumes and the Bulldogs' is clearly better. Did the Va Tech loss still not happen? Should MSU be punished because tOSU is a different team and they lost to a very good (though you are right, not dominant Bama team)? If you ask me who between the two deserves to be in the playoff more I would say Mississippi State without question. Luckily, there is still plenty of season to go.

 

[golden boy]

This whole discussion is sad. Any of the 6-7 teams being thrown around (except maybe FSU IMO) could go on a run and win it all. The beauty of the hoops bubble is that while it's fun for that last team to make it, nobody is being robbed of a legit chance of winning it all on selection day. In football, there will be many years like this where they choose between 2 bubble teams that appear to be good enough to beat anyone. That sucks.

And no, I will not just be grateful that we've come this far. To rebuild the thing and only do a half measure is hardly better. The whole thing is idiotic.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

I would probably take MSU but I think it would be a very good game. That's not really the point. Since I don't think you could very clearly say which team is better you have to look at resumes and the Bulldogs' is clearly better. Did the Va Tech loss still not happen? Should MSU be punished because tOSU is a different team and they lost to a very good (though you are right, not dominant Bama team)? If you ask me who between the two deserves to be in the playoff more I would say Mississippi State without question. Luckily, there is still plenty of season to go.

Sagarin Ratings: Mississippi State #8 / Ohio State #10. I do not think that Mississippi State's resume is clearly better. Mississippi State has the 106th ranked non-conference schedule, how does that translate into a "clearly" better resume? What is Mississippi's best win? At home versus Auburn? At LSU? I think tOSU trouncing Michigan State in East Lansing is a better win than either of those.

However, I agree 100%, we have plenty of games left to be played. Big 12 fans need to relax, there are plenty of games to be played and it will work itself out.

 

[SelectionSunday]

The 11-1 Mississippi State vs. 12-1 Ohio State argument

It both Mississippi State and Ohio State win out, that's where the Selection Committee may have to earn its stripes. (sorry TCU/Baylor, you have zero chance finishing ahead of either a 1-loss MSU-South or 1-loss OSU. No Big XII title game kills your chances, lost opportunity for another quality win). Far from a perfect science, but let's see how a 12-1 OSU would look vs. an 11-1 MSU-South. Final records of opponents are projected, but CFP rankings are current. Wins are listed in estimated order of strength, with game location.

Ohio State (12-1)
1. @ #11 Michigan State (10-2)
2. vs. #16 Wisconsin (10-3)
3. @ #25 Minnesota (7-5)
4. Cincinnati (9-3)
5. @ Maryland (7-5)
6. @ Penn State (7-5)
7. Rutgers (6-6)
8. Michigan (6-6)
9. vs. Navy (7-5)
10. Illinois (4-8)
11. Indiana (3-9)
12. Kent State (1-11)

Likely Top 25 Wins @ End of Season: 2 or 3 (@ Michigan State, vs. Wisconsin, perhaps Cincinnati)
Likely Bowl-Eligible Opponents: 10 (includes Virginia Tech)

Mississippi State (11-1)
1. @ #8 Ole Miss (9-3)
2. @ LSU (8-4)
3. Auburn (8-4)
4. Texas A&M (7-5)
5. Arkansas (6-6)
6. @ Kentucky (5-7)
7. Vanderbilt (3-9)
8. @ South Alabama (6-6)
9. UAB (6-6)
10. Southern Miss (3-9)
11. UT-Martin/FCS (5-7)

Likely Top 25 Wins @ End of Season: 2 or 3 (@ Ole Miss, Auburn, perhaps @ LSU)
Likely Bowl-Eligible Opponents: 8 (includes Alabama)

Ramblings
If who you lost to (and where) is really important to the Selection Committee, then Ohio State would be SOL. Obviously, there's no comparing OSU losing to hoping-to-get-bowl-eligible Virginia Tech in Columbus to MSU-South losing to #1 Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Advantage: MSU-South.

But if how you finished the season and conference championships are important, advantage OSU. The Buckeyes would be on an 11-game winning streak, including two high-caliber wins (Sparty & Bucky, neither in Columbus) late in the season.

Interestingly, Navy (a team OSU beat at a neutral site) plays @ South Alabama (a team MSU-South beat on the road) on Nov. 28. Do you think OSU, MSU-South, and the Selection Committee would at least have some interest in that game?

There is one thing I'm sure of. ... If Mississippi State loses to Ole Miss, there is no way they'd be selected over a 12-1 Ohio State. No chance. None.

 

[It's a Pig Man!]

Sagarin Ratings: Mississippi State #8 / Ohio State #10. I do not think that Mississippi State's resume is clearly better. Mississippi State has the 106th ranked non-conference schedule, how does that translate into a "clearly" better resume? What is Mississippi's best win? At home versus Auburn? At LSU? I think tOSU trouncing Michigan State in East Lansing is a better win than either of those.

However, I agree 100%, we have plenty of games left to be played. Big 12 fans need to relax, there are plenty of games to be played and it will work itself out.

IMO who each team lost to makes Mississippi State's resume better. I agree that OSU probably has the best win among them but I would easily take wins at LSU, vs. Texas A&M and vs. Auburn over Ohio State's two really good wins (at MSU and at us).

Also, it was a solid, convincing win but to call the Buckeyes' victory over MSU a "trouncing" is hyperbole.

I think a lot of people let their disdain for the SEC cloud their judgement. I would in no way be upset if Ohio State were to make the playoffs over MSU if both were to win out but I would personally take the Bulldogs.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

IMO who each team lost to makes Mississippi State's resume better. I agree that OSU probably has the best win among them but I would easily take wins at LSU, vs. Texas A&M and vs. Auburn over Ohio State's two really good wins (at MSU and at us).

Also, it was a solid, convincing win but to call the Buckeyes' victory over MSU a "trouncing" is hyperbole.

I think a lot of people let their disdain for the SEC cloud their judgement. I would in no way be upset if Ohio State were to make the playoffs over MSU if both were to win out but I would personally take the Bulldogs.

I have no disdain for the SEC. They have 100% earned the respect they get. I think people who complain about SEC Bias are fools. We will agree to disagree on your other points. That is what makes this fun, solid arguments can be made on either side.

 

[upnorthkid]

It both Mississippi State and Ohio State win out, that's where the Selection Committee may have to earn its stripes. (sorry TCU/Baylor, you have zero chance finishing ahead of either a 1-loss MSU-South or 1-loss OSU. No Big XII title game kills your chances, lost opportunity for another quality win). Far from a perfect science, but let's see how a 12-1 OSU would look vs. an 11-1 MSU-South. Final records of opponents are projected, but CFP rankings are current. Wins are listed in estimated order of strength, with game location.

Ohio State (12-1)
1. @ #11 Michigan State (10-2)
2. vs. #16 Wisconsin (10-3)
3. @ #25 Minnesota (7-5)
4. Cincinnati (9-3)
5. @ Maryland (7-5)
6. @ Penn State (7-5)
7. Rutgers (6-6)
8. Michigan (6-6)
9. vs. Navy (7-5)
10. Illinois (4-8)
11. Indiana (3-9)
12. Kent State (1-11)

Likely Top 25 Wins @ End of Season: 2 or 3 (@ Michigan State, vs. Wisconsin, perhaps Cincinnati)
Likely Bowl-Eligible Opponents: 9

Mississippi State (11-1)
1. @ #8 Ole Miss (9-3)
2. @ LSU (8-4)
3. Auburn (8-4)
4. Texas A&M (7-5)
5. Arkansas (6-6)
6. @ Kentucky (5-7)
7. Vanderbilt (3-9)
8. @ South Alabama (6-6)
9. UAB (6-6)
10. Southern Miss (3-9)
11. UT-Martin/FCS (5-7)

Likely Top 25 Wins @ End of Season: 2 or 3 (@ Ole Miss, Auburn, perhaps @ LSU)
Likely Bowl-Eligible Opponents: 7

Ramblings
If who you lost to (and where) is really important to the Selection Committee, then Ohio State would be SOL. Obviously, there's no comparing OSU losing to hoping-to-get-bowl-eligible Virginia Tech in Columbus to MSU-South losing to #1 Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Advantage: MSU-South.

But if how you finished the season and conference championships are important, advantage OSU. The Buckeyes would be on an 11-game winning streak, including two high-caliber wins (Sparty & Bucky, neither in Columbus) late in the season.

Interestingly, Navy (a team OSU beat at a neutral site) plays @ South Alabama (a team MSU-South beat on the road) on Nov. 28. Do you think OSU, MSU-South, and the Selection Committee would at least have some interest in that game?

There is one thing I'm sure of. ... If Mississippi State loses to Ole Miss, there is no way they'd be selected over a 12-1 Ohio State. No chance. None.

Yeah this is what I was trying to get at. Given they both win out, OSU will have a seemingly better collection which is why I think MSU stays ahead of them until conference championship week for sure (ie when OSU has one last chance to really impress the committee). If they can dominate in the CC, I think they jump MSU. But, as we've seen thus far, not everyone is taking care of business week-to-week and things could drastically change. Should be fun

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

If Miss. St. loses to Ole Miss, and Alabama loses to Missouri in the SEC title game, does the SEC get shut out? If not, who would go? A 2-loss SEC champ with a loss to a potentially 0-8 Big 10 team? A 2-loss non-champ?

 

[upnorthkid]

If Miss. St. loses to Ole Miss, and Alabama loses to Missouri in the SEC title game, does the SEC get shut out? If not, who would go? A 2-loss SEC champ with a loss to a potentially 0-8 Big 10 team? A 2-loss non-champ?

In that situation, honestly I'd say they get shut out with FSU, Oregon, OSU, and TCU or Baylor sneaking in. The recency of the losses would be rough although I could see Ole Miss theoretically slipping in in that situation especially if they light up Miss St. That's an SEC nightmare if that happens.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

IMO who each team lost to makes Mississippi State's resume better. I agree that OSU probably has the best win among them but I would easily take wins at LSU, vs. Texas A&M and vs. Auburn over Ohio State's two really good wins (at MSU and at us).

Also, it was a solid, convincing win but to call the Buckeyes' victory over MSU a "trouncing" is hyperbole.

I think a lot of people let their disdain for the SEC cloud their judgement. I would in no way be upset if Ohio State were to make the playoffs over MSU if both were to win out but I would personally take the Bulldogs.

Ask a Michigan State fan if they got trounced...

 

[SelectionSunday]

. ... But, as we've seen thus far, not everyone is taking care of business week-to-week and things could drastically change. Should be fun

Yep, it will be. I can't wait for the final 3 weekends. There's still so much that can happen in the next next two weeks, and then on Championship Weekend. ... ACC, Big Ten, Pac 12, SEC title games, + the final games in the Big XII. Still a ton of s*it that can hit the fan. Even 2-loss Ole Miss, UCLA, and Georgia aren't completely out of the picture.

 

[gregbrady]

I'm sure its been mentioned here before, but does anybody remember just a few short years ago both Texas A&M and Missouri were very mediocre Big XII teams (Sorry Aggie). Now that they are in the SEC, they get lots of respect and contend for the conference title right away, hmmm, makes me wonder how good the SEC really is. Yes, I know they've won the NT 400 years in a row, but my goodness. After watching Ohio State last weekend and watching some of the ugly games the SEC has produced the last few weeks (LSU/Alabama was not great football, same with MSU/Alabama), I'd give tOSU a shot at beating them if they get the chance.

 

[It's a Pig Man!]

I have no disdain for the SEC. They have 100% earned the respect they get. I think people who complain about SEC Bias are fools. We will agree to disagree on your other points. That is what makes this fun, solid arguments can be made on either side.

Agreed... on disagreeing haha. There are definitely solid points to be made on both sides.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Ask a Michigan State fan if they got trounced...

Respectfully, I'm one by default (son of a Sparty), and the way I'd describe that game is Ohio State exposed MSU's defense, and totally deserved to win. Sparty absolutely couldn't stop the Buckeye offense.

That said, it was not a trouncing. The game wasn't over until OSU got 2-3 first downs with about 4-5 minutes left in the game. If the MSU D manages just one stop (again, to OSU's credit, it couldn't be stopped), there was plenty of time for MSU to score a TD and get within 5 with 2-3 minutes to go. Still an uphill battle, but down 5 with 2-3 minutes left isn't impossible.

It kind of got lost in the shuffle because of how impressive OSU was on offense, but MSU's offense didn't exactly get stopped, either. ... 536 yards and 37 points, and they left points on the field.

 

[John Galt]

Remember how a playoff was going to solve everything in college football?

Now instead of talking about who the top two teams are, we're discussing who are the top 4.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

Respectfully, I'm one by default (son of a Sparty), and the way I'd describe that game is Ohio State exposed MSU's defense, and totally deserved to win. Sparty absolutely couldn't stop the Buckeye offense.

That said, it was not a trouncing. The game wasn't over until OSU got 2-3 first downs with about 4-5 minutes left in the game. If the MSU D manages just one stop (again, to OSU's credit, it couldn't be stopped), there was plenty of time for MSU to score a TD and get within 5 with 2-3 minutes to go. Still an uphill battle, but down 5 with 2-3 minutes left isn't impossible.

It kind of got lost in the shuffle because of how impressive OSU was on offense, but MSU's offense didn't exactly get stopped, either. ... 536 yards and 37 points, and they left points on the field.

Fair enough.

 

[TexasAggie11]

I'm sure its been mentioned here before, but does anybody remember just a few short years ago both Texas A&M and Missouri were very mediocre Big XII teams (Sorry Aggie). Now that they are in the SEC, they get lots of respect and contend for the conference title right away, hmmm, makes me wonder how good the SEC really is. Yes, I know they've won the NT 400 years in a row, but my goodness. After watching Ohio State last weekend and watching some of the ugly games the SEC has produced the last few weeks (LSU/Alabama was not great football, same with MSU/Alabama), I'd give tOSU a shot at beating them if they get the chance.

I can't speak for Mizzou (but they are also in the much weaker SEC East with a down Florida and South Carolina and a Georgia without the benefit of their best player), but three things we didn't have in the Big 12 were Kevin Sumlin, Kliff Kingsbury, and Johnny Manziel. The latter of which was a complete game changer, and we have played on a much more mediocre level without him. It absolutely does not speak to a comparison between the Big 12 and the SEC. When we made the conference change, we made changes across the board. The level of competition we faced in our previous conference was nothing like it is today.

 

[Cobra]

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

First of all, if it was BaylorFans, I'm sorry for the viruses your computer just got from all the pop-up ads.

Second of all, allow me to retort to Baylol using the words of Jim Rome:


This is the school who, this year IIRC, posted the absolute LOWEST overnight television ratings EVER in the history of televised college football against Iowa State.

This is the school who just DOWNSIZED their stadium.

Failor only won 16 conference games in their first 15 years in the Big 12, which they forced their way into by political pressure from then Governor Ann "Crypt Keeper" Richards.

Bailer is a school who is run by a guy who made his name from sniffing around the white stains on Monica Lewinsky's blue Gap dress.

Waco is a haven for basketball players who suckerpunch their girlfriends and get away with it, where basketball players are murderers harbored by the coach. and where football players pass out in the Taco Bell drive through high on weed

The women's basketball players have bigger packages than some of the men's team do (and punch competitors on the court).

They will never have what Minnesota has. National Championships - or even three conference wins even in a bad year. Their one shot at relevance, a BCS bowl last year, they crapped the bed against a directional Florida school.

Learn your place, bear cubs.

Remember who you are.

You're Baylor. You'll always be Baylor.

Don't let a recent run of success playing in the weakest P5 conference fool you.

You're Baylor. This is who you are:

 

[maroonfive]

A pseudo religious school in a horrible city in a horrible state suddenly becomes a power overnight? No cheating here.

 

[IAGopherfan]

Baylor has never been relevant in its entire history in college football. Yawn.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

Remember how a playoff was going to solve everything in college football?

Now instead of talking about who the top two teams are, we're discussing who are the top 4.

A 16 team playoff would have solved everything.

 

[Unregistered User]

The 11-1 Mississippi State vs. 12-1 Ohio State argument

Without quoting your whole post to save space, your analysis assumes that tOSU plays whiskey in the B10 conference championship, right? Is that to give them the best possible scenario in this analysis? It is reasonable that our Gophers could supplant whiskey at their current #16 ranking if we win out, but mostly I just hate assuming that the red weasels would be the default opponent because, well...**** wisconsin.

 

[hungan1]

I am in favor of each conference crowing a champion, and switching the playoff format to eight teams. Five champions from power conferences, and three at large from other conference champions and independents.

No one is ever going to be pleased with the current format because some teams will argue they are more deserving.

 

[TexasAggie11]

Elliott, a former Baylor defensive end from Mount Pleasant, is on trial on two counts of sexual assault allegedly involving two separate incidents with an 18-year-old freshman girl on the same night in April 2012. Prosecutors Hilary LaBorde and Robert Moody revealed to 54th State District Court jurors Thursday that five women have reported being sexually assaulted by Elliott, but the fifth is not scheduled to testify.

She said Elliott suddenly swooped her up in his arms and carried her toward a pool house. She told him to put her down, and Elliott pushed her onto a muddy slope and sexually assaulted her, she said.
She said she repeatedly told him to stop, but he continued.

“In his mind, he does not know what rape is,” she said. “To him, it was not rape. To me, it was definitely rape.”

“I felt like he owned me,” she said. “He seemed very sure of himself.”

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/courts...cle_8792a6d7-a9c0-5778-b8a8-4116d3b68816.html

 

[TexasAggie11]

Baylor University students of all backgrounds came to talk about how one group of freshman deciding to name their intramural football team after the Ferguson Police Department could be considered offensive.

“The fact it could go through so many boards and so many undergrads, grads and staff and nobody said 'this is a problem' is shocking,” says Bradley Varnell.

“It's morally wrong, it's ethically wrong, it shouldn't be used as a team name,” adds Esrael Yohannes.

http://www.kcentv.com/story/2685226...s-inter-mural-football-team-after-ferguson-pd

 

[TexasAggie11]

A racist sorority photo may get some female Baylor students in trouble. The Facebook photos deemed by some as “racist” and “offensive” have raised an online firestorm and have prompted a response by officials at Baylor University, a Christian college in Texas. The controversy rages as the nation considers illegal immigration and how to deal with immigration reform.

http://www.inquisitr.com/427156/racist-sorority-photo-baylor-students-dress-mexican-ask-green-card/

 

[TexasAggie11]

Baylor men's basketball thoroughly cleaned housed after murder and scandal tore apart the program in the summer of 2003.

Two years after the killing of former Baylor forward Patrick Dennehy and the resignation in disgrace of former coach Dave Bliss, only one player, senior center Tommy Swanson, remains among those who were there for all the tumult.

The rest of the players, coaches, managers, secretaries and the athletics director? Gone, all of them.

Gone but not forgotten, especially in the case of Bliss. The coach admitted illegally paying two players, including Dennehy. Then, shortly after Dennehy's body was discovered after a six-week search, Bliss attempted to cover up the violations by trying to get assistant coaches and players to participate in a phony story alleging Dennehy got extra cash from dealing drugs.

Bliss' scheme was revealed after he was secretly taped by then-assistant coach Abar Rouse.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/big12/2005-06-08-baylor-changes_x.htm

 

[TexasAggie11]

Two Baylor University football players were arrested on Sunday after marijuana was allegedly found in their vehicle.

Police say they were called out to the Taco Bell at 824 S. 6th St. around 2:15 a.m. where Willie Jefferson was passed out in the driver's seat of a vehicle in the drive thru lane.

When officers arrived, they reportedly saw a bag of marijuana on the center console in the vehicle and Josh Gordon in the passenger seat.

More bags of marijuana were allegedly found in the front driver's side floorboard when officers had Jefferson get out of the vehicle.

http://www.kxxv.com/story/13285050/2-baylor-football-players-found-with-marijuana-at-taco-bell

 

[TexasAggie11]

Baylor University, for instance, essentially bribed its incoming freshmen one year into retaking the SAT. The freshmen were already admitted to Baylor so there was no reason to revisit the test. Baylor’s stunt, which managed to boost the school’s average SAT score by 10 points, triggered a huge outcry.

http://www.thecollegesolution.com/colleges-and-universities-that-cheat/

 

[TexasAggie11]

The question: Who is perceived by college coaches to be the biggest cheater in the sport?

John Calipari (Kentucky): 36 percent
Scott Drew (Baylor): 34 percent

On Scott Drew: "I don't even have to blink when I say the answer. He's despised by a lot of people because he comes off holier than God. Meanwhile, everyone knows he's had to cheat big-time to get the program to where it's at."

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...ceived-to-be-the-biggest-cheater-in-the-sport