Sid: U averaged 10,675 fans per game last season in 16 games at Williams Arena. This season, it is averaging 9,888.

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I suspect the accuracy in reporting attendance has improved.
 

That is many , many millions of dollars left on the table. Tens of millions.
 



Simple. Loss of revenue, lower donations and slower to pay off facilities debt. Many of the regulars for years notice the lessened atmosphere and compound the problem by not going.
 

builtbadgers said:
Simple. Loss of revenue, lower donations and slower to pay off facilities debt. Many of the regulars for years notice the lessened atmosphere and compound the problem by not going.
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I'm not ignorant, and its not as simple as you seem to wish it was. You may have forgotten that this is an educational venue and endeavor - but if thats the case we better start reimbursing the ones who create the revenue - are you on favor of that? I bet not - that would cut into you business of creating value for investors.
I contend that the actual attendance in the past was worse but hidden by investments of 'fans' who never attended. I could name names but that would be indiscreet
 

That is so weak. The gophers are in the ncaa conversation pretty much every year. Dont make it every year but pretty much in the conversation every year. No reason not to show up. Play in the best conference in college basketball. No excuse not to show up in a city of like 500 thousand.
 

Moonlight said:
I'm not ignorant, and its not as simple as you seem to wish it was. You may have forgotten that this is an educational venue and endeavor - but if thats the case we better start reimbursing the ones who create the revenue - are you on favor of that? I bet not - that would cut into you business of creating value for investors.
I contend that the actual attendance in the past was worse but hidden by investments of 'fans' who never attended. I could name names but that would be indiscreet
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Never said or implied ignorance. Never forgot that it is a educational venue and a business. Winning creates the revenue and the value. Have been to Williams too many times to count when it was packed to the rafters. I will not name all the people i know who will not go now or gift the program because they dislike the product.
 



No one HAS to show up.
The ticket prices are too high for what the general public perceives the product to be.
The Timber Wolves and the Wild are underperforming so the competition for $$ should be less.
 

builtbadgers said:
Never said or implied ignorance. Never forgot that it is a educational venue and a business. Winning creates the revenue and the value. Have been to Williams too many times to count when it was packed to the rafters. I will not name all the people i know who will not go now or gift the program because they dislike the product.
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I can think of a few I sat by and know of that I wouldnt consider a loss as 'supporters'. We could compare names/companies. Some of them sold their tickets to the opposing teams when they were in town - but hey! it's business, right? Otherwise those seats were empty night after night, and I note that have lost control of those highly desirable seats now - and now they are occupied every night.

I appreciate knowing that your whole viewpoint and motivation is busness and profit supported by a winning product. You must have been pleased by Knight's comment that the thing that he valued the most in career is winning.
I'll be careful here. I know that many people with your perspective have embraced the way of profit in winning beyond what I would consider to be desirable. Minnesota is hopefully never going to return your investment in the way you're driving at.
 

builtbadgers said:
Never said or implied ignorance. Never forgot that it is a educational venue and a business. Winning creates the revenue and the value. Have been to Williams too many times to count when it was packed to the rafters. I will not name all the people i know who will not go now or gift the program because they dislike the product.
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The product is fine! Gophers in the conversation of ncaa tournament almost every year. Do they make it every year? No! Play in the best conference every year. On paper why wouldnt you go to games? I love college basketball so I'm different than alot of people, but no reason not to pack the barn!
 

Moonlight said:
I can think of a few I sat by and know of that I wouldnt consider a loss as 'supporters'. We could compare names/companies. Some of them sold their tickets to the opposing teams when they were in town - but hey! it's business, right? Otherwise those seats were empty night after night, and I note that have lost control of those highly desirable seats now - and now they are occupied every night.

I appreciate knowing that your whole viewpoint and motivation is busness and profit supported by a winning product. You must have been pleased by Knight's comment that the thing that he valued the most in career is winning.
I'll be careful here. I know that many people with your perspective have embraced the way of profit in winning beyond what I would consider to be desirable. Minnesota is hopefully never going to return your investment in the way you're driving at.
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Actually my whole picture is complete when players and teams win championships, sell out games, raise money for the general fund, inspire boosters to endow large sums of money, improve the overall experience for the student body, improve the educational experience, graduate with advanced degrees, start fresh water well companies in sub Sahara Africa. That the athletic piece is only part of the experience. That is being done else where, all the while guys are still making the NBA but now equipped to also use that platform to improve society. Full seats and larger donations fueled by winning big can benefit everyone. otherwise we could cut off donations, lower prices, try to be .500 or so every year . Make sure we do not sell out or win championships.
 



gophereric30 said:
The product is fine! Gophers in the conversation of ncaa tournament almost every year. Do they make it every year? No! Play in the best conference every year. On paper why wouldnt you go to games? I love college basketball so I'm different than alot of people, but no reason not to pack the barn!
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Your opinion seems to be a minority one.

They need a better head coach. Its pretty simple. One who has better coaching chops, better recruiting ability, and has some ability to generate wider fan interest.

"In the conversation" for an NCAA bid "almost every year"?? Please.

Pitino is gone. The sooner, the better, for everyone.

Or, take your method of getting more people in the barn...just tell them they should show up, because, hey, you're telling them to.

Which do you think might be more successful?
 
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builtbadgers said:
Simple. Loss of revenue, lower donations and slower to pay off facilities debt. Many of the regulars for years notice the lessened atmosphere and compound the problem by not going.
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The lessoned atmosphere began right after the "cheating" scandal. 2 decades. And counting.

Any additional questions about the impact the NCAA had on MN bb?
 

The product is good. This team is so much more fun to watch. They got a terrible draw this season on home dates and times. No Saturday home games where u would normally have the biggest crowds. And of course the price is ridiculous. I don’t except the barn to be sold out anytime soon and it has nothing to do with the product. If that’s what the U wants that is there choice. Not the fans.
 


Attendance is as good of a metric as others. What is the overall attendence trend in the Big Ten and with some of the other schools? I know that Penn State sold out for the first time since 2011 and assume they are trending up. How about other schools?

Also, if the focus is on revenue they may be at an optimal point. There is no rule that filling the Barn will result in more revenue. That is idiotic. Revenue is a factor of ticket cost X number of tickets sold plus consessions and factoring in the loss of potential revenue from those same people NOT viewing via other venues (like TV). It is a pretty standard strategy for sports teams to fill the seats at lower pricing and then raise the prices only after the Stadium is full as ticket holders view the tickets as more "scarce" once there are no more season tickets to be sold and tend to hold on to their tickets if they cannot just re-up in a year or two when the team is doing better. But this results in lower revenue in the short term. Are we sure the Gophers are following this strategy or are they maximizing revenue now?

A better on court product will result in more potential for revenue all other things being equal. Just saying we should put a better product on the court so we can make more money is great... I will shoot Coyle an email to make sure he does not miss that nuance of managing the program.
 
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When I look at buying 5 tickets, thats over $150(cheapest tickets) and I have to drive 3 hours-it would have to be a good product for me to invest that much time and $.
 

Instead of tracking trends track programs who lost, had poor attendance then won and had great attendance, huge gifts, national TV games, larger endowments, new libraries. Yes, Coyle does know this. Empty seats, missed donation opportunities are a concern. He knows the win loss record here.
 

gophereric30 said:
The product is fine! Gophers in the conversation of ncaa tournament almost every year. Do they make it every year? No! Play in the best conference every year. On paper why wouldnt you go to games? I love college basketball so I'm different than alot of people, but no reason not to pack the barn!
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The games are all on TV now. Many years ago they were not. Before the players where here for the long run, today they are not here this year, here next year but not ready to play well, play well the next year and are gone. Look at Oturu as an example. I could give more examples but that would distract from my main two points: all the games are on TV and the fans don't really get to know the players who are only passing through town.
 

Veritas said:
The games are all on TV now. Many years ago they were not. Before the players where here for the long run, today they are not here this year, here next year but not ready to play well, play well the next year and are gone. Look at Oturu as an example. I could give more examples but that would distract from my main two points: all the games are on TV and the fans don't really get to know the players who are only passing through town.
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Great points. All factors. Not that many have left here early but young people get their content easier and have other choices not just in following other brands but activities. Was crazy about the game my whole life but when i was 25 if my friends asked me to go surfing, golfing, playing tennis we would have all picked doing something instead of watching someone else do something. My kids and grandchildren love college basketball but would pick skiing over a game unless it was the final 4 of course.
 

Veritas said:
The games are all on TV now. Many years ago they were not. Before the players where here for the long run, today they are not here this year, here next year but not ready to play well, play well the next year and are gone. Look at Oturu as an example. I could give more examples but that would distract from my main two points: all the games are on TV and the fans don't really get to know the players who are only passing through town.
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Veritas speaks truth.
 

GoodasGold said:
Veritas speaks truth.
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I get what your saying, but how many guys have left early in the existence of this program? I know there are many factors to why people go or not go to gopher games, but to me I look at it as you've got a good product in the best conference in the country.
 

gophereric30 said:
I get what your saying, but how many guys have left early in the existence of this program? I know there are many factors to why people go or not go to gopher games, but to me I look at it as you've got a good product in the best conference in the country.
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A lot of people think it has been below average as a product and it is rarely the best conference in the country.
 

builtbadgers said:
A lot of people think it has been below average as a product and it is rarely the best conference in the country.
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Ok so always top 3 in the country. It's not the horizon league. I'm a huge college basketball fan, so watching a team that is in the conversation for a ncaa tournament appearance that plays in a great conference is a draw for me. Apparently not for some people.
 

builtbadgers said:
A lot of people think it has been below average as a product and it is rarely the best conference in the country.
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It is the best conference in the country this year and usually top 2 every other year. The ACC and SEC can't match the B1G team for team - we have as many NCAA tournament bids as the SEC and ACC have combined this year.
 

builtbadgers said:
A lot of people think it has been below average as a product and it is rarely the best conference in the country.
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I think the issue here is that Pitino has brought a great university in a great city back to relevance but you dont believe he can get them the rest of the way there. We've risen enough for you to want to invest, but a great coach stands between you and the return you are looking for. But how to select the next great coach? Unfortunately, that's a tougher question.
 

BarnBurner said:
The lessoned atmosphere began right after the "cheating" scandal. 2 decades. And counting.

Any additional questions about the impact the NCAA had on MN bb?
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The atmosphere was great even 10 years ago. In Tubby's final season we didn't have a single home game with fewer than 10k, 6/9 B1G home games were sellouts, and no B1G home game had attendance lower than 12,500. (And I'm not blaming that entirely on Pitino. There are a bunch of other factors that have nothing to do with him.)

Blaming something from 20+ years ago is a lazy excuse with zero factual basis.
 

bizzle22 said:
The atmosphere was great even 10 years ago. In Tubby's final season we didn't have a single home game with fewer than 10k, 6/9 B1G home games were sellouts, and no B1G home game had attendance lower than 12,500. (And I'm not blaming that entirely on Pitino. There are a bunch of other factors that have nothing to do with him.)

Blaming something from 20+ years ago is a lazy excuse with zero factual basis.
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What year did they change the program so that you had to donate to have a seat with a back? Trace the attendance trend from there.
 

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