Sid: Kaler looking into turning the Pavilion into "first class" practice facility

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Here's what I don't get...

With the realization that we have narrow concourses, why do we have cart vendors setting up in the hallway and further cramping the space? Get rid of the Goldy's Room vendor that sets up in front of the water fountains under 114 (yes, there are water fountains there).
 

goldengophers said:
100% agree, it we be incredibly stupid to see Williams imploded as a BWW's operates in a fire station from 1893 across the street.
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Safe to say the fire station was completely gutted and, except for the outer walls, is essentially a new building? Also, logistically, a tad easier.
 


GopherJake said:
Ok, what is the "character" specifically? How are they going to keep the character without tearing the entire thing down (except maybe the facade, which, as mentioned, is lovely - and fairly new).
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???...by not tearing the entire thing down?
 

GopherJake said:
Sounds to me like you want to tear everything down except for the roof and outside walls. So what is left of the character? (I'm not trying to be a Richard.) Below bleedsmaroonandgold says don't change a thing - that's a fair view. BGA says he loves the intimate feel (me too and I agree, my favorite seats are second deck, front row, center court).

You are saying change some (a lot of) things, but keep the character. What is the character you want to keep? And is it logistically possible to change the things you want changed without gutting the place?
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I never said tear down anywhere did I? Please don't try and misrepresent how I feel about Williams, a remodel is completely different than a rebuild. The rafters of Williams is part of the character, the raised floor, the brick construction, the curved roof it just looks and feels completely unlike any arena you've stepped inside. There is a fine line between tradition and making the gameday experience for the fans a pain in the ass, and I don't think any of the things I mentioned previously effect how a fans experience will be. What if they built an atrium out towards BWW? Took the old ticketing area and changed it into more space for concessions and restrooms?

Widen the concourses and entrances to increase traffic in and out. Make all seating seatbacks only. Alter the decks to remove obstructed view seats again. I don't know what part of these is "gutting the place". And like a lot of this thread I'm not an engineer, so there could definitely be more done.

Now let's turn it around, what do you see as Williams' character? Do you think its a unique facility? What do we stand to gain by shattering the link to our past? Remember Memorial Stadium? It seems like we've gone painstaking lengths to try and recapture that old glory in the football program, think of all the Brickhouse references in TCF and even in the jerseys! Instead of discarding Williams as a lost relic let's preserve and enhance it for future generations of Gopher fans to say they saw a game in.


Sidenote:
66-40368-Y.jpg

How cool would it be to have rafters on the backs of new jerseys like this for the basketball team?
 


westcoastgopher11 said:
I never said tear down anywhere did I? Please don't try and misrepresent how I feel about Williams, a remodel is completely different than a rebuild. The rafters of Williams is part of the character, the raised floor, the brick construction, the curved roof it just looks and feels completely unlike any arena you've stepped inside. There is a fine line between tradition and making the gameday experience for the fans a pain in the ass, and I don't think any of the things I mentioned previously effect how a fans experience will be. What if they built an atrium out towards BWW? Took the old ticketing area and changed it into more space for concessions and restrooms?

Widen the concourses and entrances to increase traffic in and out. Make all seating seatbacks only. Alter the decks to remove obstructed view seats again. I don't know what part of these is "gutting the place". And like a lot of this thread I'm not an engineer, so there could definitely be more done.

Now let's turn it around, what do you see as Williams' character? Do you think its a unique facility? What do we stand to gain by shattering the link to our past? Remember Memorial Stadium? It seems like we've gone painstaking lengths to try and recapture that old glory in the football program, think of all the Brickhouse references in TCF and even in the jerseys! Instead of discarding Williams as a lost relic let's preserve and enhance it for future generations of Gopher fans to say they saw a game in.


Sidenote:
View attachment 1502

How cool would it be to have rafters on the backs of new jerseys like this for the basketball team?
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im in the camp of build a new facility. when i was young i loved the raised floor, but as a gopher fan i honestly think kids dont think its cool anymore and a lot of parents think its a safety issue. put those 2 things together and potentially it could hurt recruiting some? i dont know if that has happened, but i dont know if it hasnt happened either. do whatever it takes for the kids to want to come here and im happy.
 

I think we should keep Williams Arena, and should do complete renovation like what we are doing with Northrop auditorium. Completely gutted out and put in the structural reinforcements to get better sighting. Or we could even try to do like Wimbledon center court with retractable roof. I know it is long long shot. We can definitely do amazing things with 100 mils for Williams. Mega Millions anyone? :D
 

Prado89 said:
I think we should keep Williams Arena, and should do complete renovation like what we are doing with Northrop auditorium. Completely gutted out and put in the structural reinforcements to get better sighting. Or we could even try to do like Wimbledon center court with retractable roof. I know it is long long shot. We can definitely do amazing things with 100 mils for Williams. Mega Millions anyone? :D
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Playing on a raised, grass floor would definitely give us home court advantage!;)
 




bga1 said:
Bad- You are right the 4th street side is probably stuck that way. However, you could gain space from the Pavillion side on the west and a lot of space toward University on the south. You gut out the current interior and build out toward the street you could even have concessions and bathrooms on the 2nd floor. So by widening the concourses on the two sides you would to some degree loosen up the space in the whole building by giving people more places to go
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The people on the second deck, 4th Street side, would have to go the ends of the building for restrooms or concessions - if I understand you correctly. Yeah, I can see that.

I wonder, though, once you've gutted it and altered it to the degree necessary, is there much left of the current character?
 

Mulligan said:
Especially if we used spikes and the other team showed up in tennis shoes.
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roger federer and nadal might show up too. lol It always thought playing basketball outdoor is very fun thing to do. Not so professional, but always fun though. While more and more outdoor sports like football, tennis are playing under roof, we could probably try something different with indoor sports. Occasionally there are things like aircraft carrier games. Winter classic. When it was done for Winbeldon, it wasn't outlandishly expensive either. Imagine the impacts of the craziness and will be the talk of the town for years to come. :cool:
 

Bad Gopher said:
I wonder, though, once you've gutted it and altered it to the degree necessary, is there much left of the current character?
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I'd say yes, but the devil is in the details. I'm hopeful that the new AD will do the necessary due diligence to figure that out.
 

I'm pretty surprised this idea hasn't been brought up. I wasn't a huge fan of tunneling to the practice facility and taking out Station19, which I don't think was brought up, but a necessity with that layout.

Doing some quick calcs of the exterior walls and the Sports Pavilion is 88% the size of Williams. Was wondering why they wouldn't buy NW opposed to the SE when the original 3D renderings of the proposed practice facility came out.
 



DLguy said:
In response to what I would change. In the actual seating area of the arena, I would use modern engineering to support the upper decks with minimal beams to reduce obstructed view seats. New scoreboard and sound system, and new signage on the 2nd deck facade. Other than those minor changes, i would not change a damn thing. Love all the seats. The views in there unless obstructed are the best anywhere. You can be last row of the upper deck end and feel closer to the court than last row of the lower deck at Target Center.

Outside of the seating area. Expand on the University Ave side to include a larger concourse, more bathrooms and concessions. And then renovate the current restrooms.

I really dont think anything else is needed. I guess a new roof is needed, but that is standard maintanence.
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Good post. I agree with a lot of this, if they can figure out a way to support the 2nd deck.

GoodasGold said:
???...by not tearing the entire thing down?
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Great point. Horribly worded sentence on my part which changed the meaning from what I meant.

westcoastgopher11 said:
I never said tear down anywhere did I? Please don't try and misrepresent how I feel about Williams, a remodel is completely different than a rebuild. The rafters of Williams is part of the character, the raised floor, the brick construction, the curved roof it just looks and feels completely unlike any arena you've stepped inside. There is a fine line between tradition and making the gameday experience for the fans a pain in the ass, and I don't think any of the things I mentioned previously effect how a fans experience will be. What if they built an atrium out towards BWW? Took the old ticketing area and changed it into more space for concessions and restrooms?

Widen the concourses and entrances to increase traffic in and out. Make all seating seatbacks only. Alter the decks to remove obstructed view seats again. I don't know what part of these is "gutting the place". And like a lot of this thread I'm not an engineer, so there could definitely be more done.

Now let's turn it around, what do you see as Williams' character? Do you think its a unique facility? What do we stand to gain by shattering the link to our past? Remember Memorial Stadium? It seems like we've gone painstaking lengths to try and recapture that old glory in the football program, think of all the Brickhouse references in TCF and even in the jerseys! Instead of discarding Williams as a lost relic let's preserve and enhance it for future generations of Gopher fans to say they saw a game in.
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Good post. What do I think the character is?

-I love the brick facade - beautiful.
-The curved roof is "neat" I guess. But I'm not sure what it looks like to a stud 17 year old.
-I do love that the ceiling is very high. That's cool.
-I love the surface of the floor (quiet, old school == good).
-I like the fact that there aren't scoreboards going insane every second of the game. Wraparounds that dance all game suck.
-Stairwells are like a labyrinth, but I actually kind of like it - except for getting out of the place.
-Second level seating is VERY close to the action
-I like the Barn Lofts - cool solution in that building
-Place has a very intimate feel for seating 14,625
-Quirky feel, which I like - as long as I'm not sitting behind a pole or in one of the rows with no legroom

-I hate the raised floor (save the meltdowns, I've heard it all).
-I hate the "Total" category on the side scoreboards ("Hey look, we've got them by 10 in 'Total'!!!!!!!").
-The concourses completely blow chunks.
-Bet the locker rooms and other facilities in the bowels suck. (At least relative to TCF Bank).
-No VIP sideline seating - media gets it all - plus, due to the raised floor, the first 5 or so rows in the first level suck, because you look up. Seats behind the benches are BAD. People are always in your way.
-Many seats do not face the center of the floor
-Many seats are bench seats
-Bathrooms are hideous and tiny
-Place has a generally dirty feel to it
-Second level overhanging first level makes back rows of first level obstructed from the main scoreboard and other things
-Barn lofts overhanging 2nd level has same effect

Bad Gopher said:
I wonder, though, once you've gutted it and altered it to the degree necessary, is there much left of the current character?
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I have had this thought too. Missouri's facility looks real nice as does TCF Bank Stadium. New doesn't have to mean it sucks.
 

The raised floor is our Green Monster on a smaller scale. Historic places should be kept and updated even if challenges remain... I've sat in the last row of the second deck and loved every minute of it, even the inconvience of getting there. Believe it or not sports facilities can be historic places that tell a story.
 


DLguy said:
In response to what I would change. In the actual seating area of the arena, I would use modern engineering to support the upper decks with minimal beams to reduce obstructed view seats. New scoreboard and sound system, and new signage on the 2nd deck facade. Other than those minor changes, i would not change a damn thing. Love all the seats. The views in there unless obstructed are the best anywhere. You can be last row of the upper deck end and feel closer to the court than last row of the lower deck at Target Center.

Outside of the seating area. Expand on the University Ave side to include a larger concourse, more bathrooms and concessions. And then renovate the current restrooms.

I really dont think anything else is needed. I guess a new roof is needed, but that is standard maintanence.

Pav into a practice facility would be awesome. But then you have to make a new arena for volleyball and gymnastics. MIght was well just spend the money on a new practice facility connected via tunnel to the Pav.
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What's the answer to this issue with the restrooms? Well......Depend(s).
 

Tear down the wall between the Pavilion and Williams. Then center the court between the two sections. This would allow additional space on both ends of the building. Add on to the NW for room for a practice facility. IF possible:(create a structure around the current building and use this framework to suspend the upper deck from((like a suspension bridge)). Use Ridder for volleyball and Wrestling unless a major event is needed then use Williams and Mariucci.
 


forestlaker said:
Tear down the wall between the Pavilion and Williams. Then center the court between the two sections. This would allow additional space on both ends of the building. Add on to the NW for room for a practice facility. IF possible:(create a structure around the current building and use this framework to suspend the upper deck from((like a suspension bridge)). Use Ridder for volleyball and Wrestling unless a major event is needed then use Williams and Mariucci.
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Add underground parking with escalators to main level, express elevators to 2nd deck; food court; boutique shops and theme park...but maintain the character of the original.
 

GoodasGold said:
Add underground parking with escalators to main level, express elevators to 2nd deck; food court; boutique shops and theme park...but maintain the character of the original.
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LOL!!!
 


GoodasGold said:
Probably " surrounding". What do you think?
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Well, the height of the structure "around" makes a difference. Because if it surrounds the structure too much then it changes the style of the building too much and becomes pointless. Change the exterior too much and you might as well get a new building.
 

GoAUpher said:
Well, the height of the structure "around" makes a difference. Because if it surrounds the structure too much then it changes the style of the building too much and becomes pointless. Change the exterior too much and you might as well get a new building.
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You sir, are correct on that!
 

As long as Frank G. doesn't touch the design process, I am all for it.
 

GoodasGold said:
Add underground parking with escalators to main level, express elevators to 2nd deck; food court; boutique shops and theme park...but maintain the character of the original.
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LOL

And don't forget the beer garden.
 

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