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BoatRacer said:
Is it too much for fans to expect to have a good season every now and then?
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No, and we had a really good one two years ago (finished the season ranked #10). I still think we can win 8 regular season games this year (at this point, I don't think we can beat Wisconsin). 8 regular season wins is a good year (not really good, but good) in my book especially if a bowl win follows.

I think it is too much at this point for fans to expect the sustained success that Wisconsin, or even Iowa, has experienced this century. We simply haven't established that high of a brand yet. Northwestern has been fairly successful over the last fourteen years or so but they still haven't established that level of brand either.
 


cjbfbp said:
No, and we had a really good one two years ago (finished the season ranked #10). I still think we can win 8 regular season games this year (at this point, I don't think we can beat Wisconsin). 8 regular season wins is a good year (not really good, but good) in my book especially if a bowl win follows.

I think it is too much at this point for fans to expect the sustained success that Wisconsin, or even Iowa, has experienced this century. We simply haven't established that high of a brand yet. Northwestern has been fairly successful over the last fourteen years or so but they still haven't established that level of brand either.
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We are playing with 3 of our top wideouts banged up or missing games for other reasons all year.
We are on 4th and 5th running backs.

we are in 4 way tie for first place and are currently 1-0 against the other teams in the tie

we likely don’t win the division but control our own destiny headed into last 4.

We are 1 win away from having 2 Winning conference seasons in 3 years for the first time since 2014-2016 (15-10 if we finish 5-4 this year) (12-13 during 2014-2016)

we are 1 win away from having 2 winning conference seasons in 3 years for the second time since 1970

Even if gophers don’t win another game…it is the best conference winning percentage in a 3 year stretch since 1967-69
 


I’d say if we beat Iowa and Wisky this would be a “special season”. But at this point Purdue and Maryland are our best wins and the BGSU and IL losses far outweigh that. It is looking a lot more like “major disappointment” than it is “special”.
 


btowngopher said:
I see very little RPO compared to KC. You saying it’s the same doesn’t make it so either.
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KC ran very little RPO and says as much at the clinics he speaks and spoke at. Most of what color commentators call “RPO” is called play action pass.

just because a dumb announcer calls everything RPO doesn’t make everything RPO. We still run RPO. The difference is our play action game isn’t working this year like it worked in 2019.
 

Some guy said:
We are playing with 3 of our top wideouts banged up or missing games for other reasons all year.
We are on 4th and 5th running backs.

we are in 4 way tie for first place and are currently 1-0 against the other teams in the tie

we likely don’t win the division but control our own destiny headed into last 4.

We are 1 win away from having 2 Winning conference seasons in 3 years for the first time since 2014-2016 (15-10 if we finish 5-4 this year) (12-13 during 2014-2016)

we are 1 win away from having 2 winning conference seasons in 3 years for the second time since 1970

Even if gophers don’t win another game…it is the best conference winning percentage in a 3 year stretch since 1967-69
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I'm not sure what any of that has to do with my post.
 




Some guy said:
KC ran very little RPO and says as much at the clinics he speaks and spoke at. Most of what color commentators call “RPO” is called play action pass.

just because a dumb announcer calls everything RPO doesn’t make everything RPO. We still run RPO. The difference is our play action game isn’t working this year like it worked in 2019.
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I’ll take your word for it. So why did the offense go from very good to complete garbage? Does the offense require nfl wrs to function?
 

btowngopher said:
I’ll take your word for it. So why did the offense go from very good to complete garbage? Does the offense require nfl wrs to function?
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The offense requires functional receivers who create seperation.
We have two wideouts that can maybe play outside (Autman bell and Wright) they are both inconsistent due to injury and other factors. The rest of their wideouts are really slot type guys. Not physically gifted enough to play on the edge in two man route combos.

If this team had a wolirarsky caliber wideout who was healthy I think the offense is more dynamic right now. I just don’t think Brown Stephen’s can be a good wide guy consistently because I don’t think he has the physical tools to be much more than an inside wideout.

It doesn’t require nfl wideouts but it requires wideouts who can do what they are being asked to do. I’m not sure we have that right now and it’s on the coaches for not adjusting.
we were literally running the plays people have been asking for yesterday. We ran a lot of 2 man play action and RPO and the wideouts couldn’t get seperation.

you don’t have to be nfl caliber to get seperation. You have to be more physically gifted than brown Stephens appears to be


to me, the coaches were asking guys to do stuff they weren’t capable of doing yesterday. The common theme of the two worst losses of the season to me, was that the coaches seemed to assuming their guys would win one on one battles at the wideout position and they didn’t.
 
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Wright looked pretty damn good on that 36 yard reception on the last drive.

Of course, Tanner actually threw the ball in front of the receiver for a change. That helped a lot, too.


But I suppose he will continue to not play much and not see many targets. Makes sense.
 



Some guy said:
The offense requires functional receivers who create seperation.
We have two wideouts that can maybe play outside (Autman bell and Wright) they are both inconsistent due to injury and other factors. The rest of their wideouts are really slot type guys. Not physically gifted enough to play on the edge in two man route combos.

If this team had a wolirarsky caliber wideout who was healthy I think the offense is more dynamic right now. I just don’t think Brown Stephen’s can be a good wide guy consistently because I don’t think he has the physical tools to be much more than an inside wideout.

It doesn’t require nfl wideouts but it requires wideouts who can do what they are being asked to do. I’m not sure we have that right now and it’s on the coaches for not adjusting.
we were literally running the plays people have been asking for yesterday. We ran a lot of 2 man play action and RPO and the wideouts couldn’t get seperation.

you don’t have to be nfl caliber to get seperation. You have to be more physically gifted than brown Stephens appears to be
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It's awfully tough to follow a development and growth path with the receivers when the passing system is chaotic and never seeks to establish a rhythm, it's why the prior 4 games were actually harmful
 

goldengophers said:
It's awfully tough to follow a development and growth projection with the receivers when the passing system is chaotic and never seeks to establish a rhythm, it's why the prior 4 games were actually harmful
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We have never really run a 3 step or 5 step passing game in the Fleck era.
I think that is how we had to attack yesterday.

I could say we didn’t develop it the previous 4 weeks but we didn’t even try it yesterday either. So It could be that the coaches know they aren’t that good throwing the ball so they’d rather try to win hiding it than expose it by having it blow up in their face.
 

Some guy said:
We have never really run a 3 step or 5 step passing game in the Fleck era.
I think that is how we had to attack yesterday.

I could say we didn’t develop it the previous 4 weeks but we didn’t even try it yesterday either. So It could be that the coaches know they aren’t that good throwing the ball so they’d rather try to win hiding it than expose it by having it blow up in their face.
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Tanner needs a sped up clock prior to plays, he's actually someone who does worse in a ball control hike the ball with 1 second left in the clock scenario. We all know what sets up Tanner for success and we all know this isn't it.
 

btowngopher said:
Okay you refuse to say it, but clearly you want to move on from Fleck.
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Not really, because I'm not sure the Gophs HC job is all that attractive.

I don't believe I've ever said Fleck should be fired. My only disagreements have been with some of the people that seen enamored with PJ. I've been watching Gophs football for decades. PJ falls somewhere in the middle to slightly above average. But he's the most "media savvy' HC in decades. Probably since Holtz.

For the obvious reason that the TCs are a pro town, get 7-8 wins most years, an occasional 10 win season, and win the Division every 3-4 years.

Oh, and beat your closest rivals 50% of the time.

How's Fleck doing with those expectations?
 
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You'd think $5M per year could attract someone.
 

MplsGopher said:
You'd think $5M per year could attract someone.
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Without knowing the buyout details, Fleck probably isn't too highly sought and Coyle ain't gonna fire a guy and have $$$ on the books for two football coaches.

Looks like Fleck will be here as long as HE wants to be.
 

Boomtime said:
Without knowing the buyout details, Fleck probably isn't too highly sought and Coyle ain't gonna fire a guy and have $$$ on the books for two football coaches.

Looks like Fleck will be here as long as HE wants to be.
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Do you want to fire fleck? If yes, you should maybe take a break from following the team. He is here at least 2 more seasons
 

Some guy said:
The offense requires functional receivers who create seperation.
We have two wideouts that can maybe play outside (Autman bell and Wright) they are both inconsistent due to injury and other factors. The rest of their wideouts are really slot type guys. Not physically gifted enough to play on the edge in two man route combos.

If this team had a wolirarsky caliber wideout who was healthy I think the offense is more dynamic right now. I just don’t think Brown Stephen’s can be a good wide guy consistently because I don’t think he has the physical tools to be much more than an inside wideout.

It doesn’t require nfl wideouts but it requires wideouts who can do what they are being asked to do. I’m not sure we have that right now and it’s on the coaches for not adjusting.
we were literally running the plays people have been asking for yesterday. We ran a lot of 2 man play action and RPO and the wideouts couldn’t get seperation.

you don’t have to be nfl caliber to get seperation. You have to be more physically gifted than brown Stephens appears to be


to me, the coaches were asking guys to do stuff they weren’t capable of doing yesterday. The common theme of the two worst losses of the season to me, was that the coaches seemed to assuming their guys would win one on one battles at the wideout position and they didn’t.
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Hard to swallow idea we don't have guys athletic enough to run good routes and get frequent separation. Fleck was a wide receiver, college and coffee in the NFL. Simon is recognized as a receiver development guru. We are in a lot of trouble if we have ten receivers on the sideline who are just not talented enough to play when this has been thought to be a recruiting strength.
 

goldengophers said:
Tanner needs a sped up clock prior to plays, he's actually someone who does worse in a ball control hike the ball with 1 second left in the clock scenario. We all know what sets up Tanner for success and we all know this isn't it.
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The only time Morgan looked in command was the 4th quarter TD drive where we hurried a bit and didn't waste the play clock. That was also a time Illinois defense was scrambling a bit.
 

Boomtime said:
Not really, because I'm not sure the Gophs HC job is all that attractive.

I don't believe I've ever said Fleck should be fired. My only disagreements have been with some of the people that seen enamored with PJ. I've been watching Gophs football for decades. PJ falls somewhere in the middle to slightly above average. But he's the most "media savvy' HC in decades. Probably since Holtz.

For the obvious reason that the TCs are a pro town, get 7-8 wins most years, an occasional 10 win season, and win the Division every 3-4 years.

Oh, and beat your closest rivals 50% of the time.

How's Fleck doing with those expectations?
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So you want to just stick with a coach you called “not a good coach”? Maybe we couldn’t attract a proven coach, but if I was you I would at least want to hire a lesser known coach and hope to strike gold.
 

Dakota2 said:
Hard to swallow idea we don't have guys athletic enough to run good routes and get frequent separation. Fleck was a wide receiver, college and coffee in the NFL. Simon is recognized as a receiver development guru. We are in a lot of trouble if we have ten receivers on the sideline who are just not talented enough to play when this has been thought to be a recruiting strength.
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Well 3 of our top 4 are having issues staying on the field. Any team in the country save 3-4 teams would have issues playing with wideouts who are injured or backups.

also don’t think the plan was very good and the deficiency was exposed
 

Spoofin said:
I’d say if we beat Iowa and Wisky this would be a “special season”. But at this point Purdue and Maryland are our best wins and the BGSU and IL losses far outweigh that. It is looking a lot more like “major disappointment” than it is “special”.
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Seeing some trophies in the U of M booth at the State Fair next year would at least ease the pain when recalling the Illinois and BG games.
 
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btowngopher said:
So you want to just stick with a coach you called “not a good coach”? Maybe we couldn’t attract a proven coach, but if I was you I would at least want to hire a lesser known coach and hope to strike gold.
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At this point, with the $$$ the B1G generates, an AD just wants a clean program without any bad publicity.

Coyle has that with PJ.
 


Some guy said:
Do you want to fire fleck? If yes, you should maybe take a break from following the team. He is here at least 2 more seasons
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As I've said... the contract extension means Coyle is sticking with Fleck. No one cares what I think.

But the Gophs likely will never be "elite" in the eyes of people outside the program.
 

btowngopher said:
I’m talking about what YOU want. Not Coyle.
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I'd hire a OC/DC from a football power, but those guys are in high demand and most make really good $$$ without the headaches of dealing with press and fans.

And the B1G is still viewed as tOSU and everyone else.

As a program, I'd still take results like Wisconsin and Iowa. Rose Bowl, Orange Bowl, top ten rankings from time to time, a trophy case with something in it, etc.
 


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