Rules of the Game

[Full Speed Ahead]

I saw this while watching the Tulane/Tulsa game, but it happens quite a bit in other games. What's the right rule:

1. After a Tulane basket, Tulsa inbounds the ball and a a player starts dribbling it up the court.
2. While still in his defensive end of the court, he passes the ball to a teammate who initially is standing just beyond the over-and-back line with both feet in Tulsa's offensive side of the court.
3. As the pass is in the air, the player jumps from the Offensive side of the court into the Defensive side, but catches the pass while he is in the air - so before the pass he was on the offensive side of the line, he catches the ball in the air, and then lands with both feet in the defensive side of the court.
4. Should this be an over-and-back call?

 

[CentralGopher]

I’ve seen it passed to a player in the air that lands on the offense side of the court as well with no over and back call. I think the refs call it where the player lands when they catch the ball but no idea how the rule is actually written.

 

[Full Speed Ahead]

Is this legit?
Say there are three seconds left in the game, sort of like the end of our Ohio State game. You have a one-point lead and are inbounding the ball. Can I have my teammate line up right in front of me on the inbounds, I drop the ball into his hands (it has to be a pass, not a handoff) and he just launches it into the air. The clock starts as soon as my teammate touches the ball, and runs out the game clock. I think this is legit, but I've never seen it used in a game. Seems like it'd be a good way to burn those final seconds, vs getting fouled and going to the line.

 

[MaxyJR1]

I believe all three points (dribbling with ball and 2 feet) have to be in front court for it to be over and back. So if he jumps and lands in the back court, no points were ever in possession in the front court so you can't have over and back.

 

[Some guy]

No it shouldn’t be.

 

[Full Speed Ahead]

I believe all three points (dribbling with ball and 2 feet) have to be in front court for it to be over and back. So if he jumps and lands in the back court, no points were ever in possession in the front court so you can't have over and back.

If I'm reading you right, does that mean a player could initially catch the ball in the front court, and still dribble the ball in the backcourt, and not be over-and-back (initial dribble in this case is in the backcourt, vs initially dribbling in the front court and then dribbling it in the backcourt)?

 

[MaxyJR1]

Is this legit?
Say there are three seconds left in the game, sort of like the end of our Ohio State game. You have a one-point lead and are inbounding the ball. Can I have my teammate line up right in front of me on the inbounds, I drop the ball into his hands (it has to be a pass, not a handoff) and he just launches it into the air. The clock starts as soon as my teammate touches the ball, and runs out the game clock. I think this is legit, but I've never seen it used in a game. Seems like it'd be a good way to burn those final seconds, vs getting fouled and going to the line.

Chances are you're still going to get fouled and shoot bonus in a bang bang play, but it can be done.

 

[howeda7]

I believe all three points (dribbling with ball and 2 feet) have to be in front court for it to be over and back. So if he jumps and lands in the back court, no points were ever in possession in the front court so you can't have over and back.

Yeah, I've always interpreted it kind of the same as the rule in football about an illegal forward pass. If any part of you wasn't in the front court, it's not a violation.

 

[MaxyJR1]

If I'm reading you right, does that mean a player could initially catch the ball in the front court, and still dribble the ball in the backcourt, and not be over-and-back (initial dribble in this case is in the backcourt, vs initially dribbling in the front court and then dribbling it in the backcourt)?

No because it's caught in front court. (2 or 1 feet if not dribbling) But if you dribble and are dribbling backwards or sideways and have two feet over and the ball is still in back court, you can go back in the back court.

 

[howeda7]

A rule they hardly ever enforce is the inbounder having to have both feet behind the line. Teams violate this multiple times per game and they almost never call it. But I do remember the Gophers getting screwed on it a time or two. Either get rid of the rule if the inbounds is not contested or enforce it.

 

[MaxyJR1]

A rule they hardly ever enforce is the inbounder having to have both feet behind the line. Teams violate this multiple times per game and they almost never call it. But I do remember the Gophers getting screwed on it a time or two. Either get rid of the rule if the inbounds is not contested or enforce it.

Not sure that's the rule, they just can't be touching inbounds when they throw it and it has to be out of their hands when they do touch inbounds.

 

[Full Speed Ahead]

A rule they hardly ever enforce is the inbounder having to have both feet behind the line. Teams violate this multiple times per game and they almost never call it. But I do remember the Gophers getting screwed on it a time or two. Either get rid of the rule if the inbounds is not contested or enforce it.

It's really common for the head coach to step onto the court during play, which I believe should be a technical. It's never called, but happens a lot.

 

[howeda7]

Not sure that's the rule, they just can't be touching inbounds when they throw it and it has to be out of their hands when they do touch inbounds.

If both your feet aren't behind the line, aren't you touching inbounds?

 

[MaxyJR1]

If both your feet aren't behind the line, aren't you touching inbounds?

One is in the air, throwing off one foot.

 

[howeda7]

One is in the air, throwing off one foot.

As one does.

 

[Some guy]

If I'm reading you right, does that mean a player could initially catch the ball in the front court, and still dribble the ball in the backcourt, and not be over-and-back (initial dribble in this case is in the backcourt, vs initially dribbling in the front court and then dribbling it in the backcourt)?

I don’t remember the rule. I don’t know if the ball has to bounce.
If I catch it with my feet in the front court but the ball never crosses, my feet can go into the back court I think.

 

[Some guy]

Is this legit?
Say there are three seconds left in the game, sort of like the end of our Ohio State game. You have a one-point lead and are inbounding the ball. Can I have my teammate line up right in front of me on the inbounds, I drop the ball into his hands (it has to be a pass, not a handoff) and he just launches it into the air. The clock starts as soon as my teammate touches the ball, and runs out the game clock. I think this is legit, but I've never seen it used in a game. Seems like it'd be a good way to burn those final seconds, vs getting fouled and going to the line.

Yes but one reason you don’t see it a ton is because an nfl punt is 4.4 seconds. So to drain a full 3 seconds you’d have to launch an absolute missile

More likely to see it with 1.5 or 2

 

[UpAndUnder43]

Yes but one reason you don’t see it a ton is because an nfl punt is 4.4 seconds. So to drain a full 3 seconds you’d have to launch an absolute missile

More likely to see it with 1.5 or 2

3 seconds is a very long time for a ball to be thrown in the air without being out of bounds. You are very correct.

 

[GophersInIowa]

A rule they hardly ever enforce is the inbounder having to have both feet behind the line. Teams violate this multiple times per game and they almost never call it. But I do remember the Gophers getting screwed on it a time or two. Either get rid of the rule if the inbounds is not contested or enforce it.

I think even worse is traveling after non baskets inbound plays.

 

[tjgopher]

A rule they hardly ever enforce is the inbounder having to have both feet behind the line. Teams violate this multiple times per game and they almost never call it. But I do remember the Gophers getting screwed on it a time or two. Either get rid of the rule if the inbounds is not contested or enforce it.

Are you claiming that players step over the line when inbounding the ball multiple times per game?

 

[tjgopher]

I think even worse is traveling after non baskets inbound plays.

There is no such thing as traveling after non baskets on inbounds plays.

A player has a three-foot area to move in. He can legally slide his feet as long as he stays in the three foot area. It basically gives the player about a foot of wiggle room each way for each foot. If his feet slide outside of that area, then it is an inbound violation, not a travel.

 

[HitMeAgainIAmStillMoving]

3 seconds is a very long time for a ball to be thrown in the air without being out of bounds. You are very correct.

Interesting, my physics skills are no longer good enough to calculate that but I will get on it non the less. I remember we tested this exact thing with a baseball.

 

[howeda7]

Are you claiming that players step over the line when inbounding the ball multiple times per game?

Yes. Or never bother getting behind it to begin with.

 

[UpAndUnder43]

Interesting, my physics skills are no longer good enough to calculate that but I will get on it non the less. I remember we tested this exact thing with a baseball.

I can barely do basic addition. Will leave that to you.

 

[GophersInIowa]

There is no such thing as traveling after non baskets on inbounds plays.

A player has a three-foot area to move in. He can legally slide his feet as long as he stays in the three foot area. It basically gives the player about a foot of wiggle room each way for each foot. If his feet slide outside of that area, then it is an inbound violation, not a travel.

Well that’s embarrassing. I don’t know why I’ve always thought you could just pivot like on the floor.

 

[MNVCGUY]

Is this legit?
Say there are three seconds left in the game, sort of like the end of our Ohio State game. You have a one-point lead and are inbounding the ball. Can I have my teammate line up right in front of me on the inbounds, I drop the ball into his hands (it has to be a pass, not a handoff) and he just launches it into the air. The clock starts as soon as my teammate touches the ball, and runs out the game clock. I think this is legit, but I've never seen it used in a game. Seems like it'd be a good way to burn those final seconds, vs getting fouled and going to the line.

I think if you tried to position one of your players directly in front of the in-bounder a defensive player would have a right to the space in-between them. Otherwise I see no reason why teams wouldn't just do that all the time to avoid any risk of a turnover.

Maxy is right though that as soon as the ball was given to the guy receiving the pass he would almost certainly be fouled.

 

[tjgopher]

Yes. Or never bother getting behind it to begin with.

That does not happen multiple times per game. Not in college hoops.

 

[howeda7]

That does not happen multiple times per game. Not in college hoops.

I disagree. It's always when it's not being contested but it does happen pretty often. It's just almost never called.

 

[RunGopherRun]

I saw this while watching the Tulane/Tulsa game, but it happens quite a bit in other games. What's the right rule:

1. After a Tulane basket, Tulsa inbounds the ball and a a player starts dribbling it up the court.
2. While still in his defensive end of the court, he passes the ball to a teammate who initially is standing just beyond the over-and-back line with both feet in Tulsa's offensive side of the court.
3. As the pass is in the air, the player jumps from the Offensive side of the court into the Defensive side, but catches the pass while he is in the air - so before the pass he was on the offensive side of the line, he catches the ball in the air, and then lands with both feet in the defensive side of the court.
4. Should this be an over-and-back call?

Yes, this this is a back-court violation. The player that catches the ball has front-court status, and continues to have front-court status while in the air. The "three points" (the ball and both feet) applies to dribbling the ball across the mid-court line to obtain front-court status. But since the catcher already has front-court status, then takes the ball into the backcourt, it is a backcourt violation.
This is a very tricky rule. An exception to this rule (in this case) would be if the ball were being inbounded. Then this play would be legal, since there was no initial status of the ball (out of bounds). Otherwise, since the player catching the ball has front-court status, when he catches the ball and lands, it is a backcourt violation.

 

[tikited]

I think it all depends on the teams playing. For example: If a Badgers player did that... clean play. If a Gopher player did it... over and back for sure.