Refs according to Rittenberg

Donate To GopherHole
2

2727Gopher

Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2008
Messages
618
Reaction score
9
Points
18
I think Adam Rittenberg is great, but his column has said at least THREE TIMES that the refs in our game were horrible and that it is Michigan State that got the short end of the stick! Did he even watch the game?

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten
 

I know this is a crazy thought, but is it possible that the Gophers actually committed a large percentage of the penatlies that were called on them?

The overturn of the fumble was a huge call that easily could have gone the other way.
 

I thought the refs were bad BOTH ways and each team had potential game changing calls hurt them by going the wrong way (from what should have been called). I noticed the same thing, he said several times that MSU has gripes with the refs bud didn't say a thing abou the Gophs.

And, speaking of refs... when it comes to video reviews, doesn't seem like they have thrown the words "indisputable evidence" out the window? It now seems as though they are using the reviews to make a straight judgement and they are not using it to look for something that obviously would overturn a call. The best evidence of that was the Indiana touchdown being called back (I have seen that replay a bazillion times from every angle and some views look like he comes down out of bounds while others really look like his toe touched in bounds first). If you can still debate it now, shouldn't they have just declared there wasn't enough to overturn the call on the field... which was a touchdown? Same with T/A's fumble in the Gopher game. In the NFL they probably would have called that a fumble but in college they seem to look for more positive evidence a guy has the ball. For that review, it could be argued either way but if that is the case, again, shouldn't they just have gone with what was called on the field (fumble)?
 

The refs were bad both ways, especially in the replay booth. See (A) overturn of Stoudermire's TD and (B) overturn of Tow-Arnett's fumble after the catch. In both cases, the refs on the field clearly had it right the first time.

The team that deserved to win, won. Weber was fantastic.
 

GVBadger said:
I know this is a crazy thought, but is it possible that the Gophers actually committed a large percentage of the penatlies that were called on them?

The overturn of the fumble was a huge call that easily could have gone the other way.
Click to expand...


I don't read anywhere in these posts where someone claims they didn't. This is what I think of as 'trolling'...and just annoying posting in general. Building up straw men, then beating them down.

Good work fighting a point that no one has contested, and doing it in a patronizing, obnoxious way.
 


Personally, I think the refs made very bad calls against us (and non-calls against MSU) for the 1st 50 minutes and then we got the benefit of the doubt in the last 10 minutes. If that is the case, it sure worked in our favor in the end.
 

2727Gopher said:
I think Adam Rittenberg is great, but his column has said at least THREE TIMES that the refs in our game were horrible and that it is Michigan State that got the short end of the stick! Did he even watch the game?

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten
Click to expand...

I've heard this implication a couple times from Rittenberg, and I agree, it is annoying. I'm not saying MSU doesn't have one or two legitimate gripes, but so do we. It's especially annoying because there actually was a Big Ten game with some absurd officiating all in favor of one team, but no one is talking about it for whatever reason (big score difference, maybe, or not wanting to call out the Big Ten).
 

I agree that we got a gift on the T/A (non)-fumble. AS for the immaculate reception, there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it, largely because it happened so fast. If I was Dantonio, I'd be more PO'd at my players than the officials on that one. Maybe they should have been trying to tackle Bennett rather than standing around admiring T/A's corpse?

GVB - Like I said in another thread, after rewatching the game last night, in most of the penalties called against us Saturday we gave the ref an excuse to throw the flag. Whether or not he should have in some cases is very debatable. yeah, if someone moves before the snap, you gotta call it. But some of the holding and PF calls were BS. Its not like they had to start calling ticky-tack penalties because the game was getting out of hand with cheap shots. Luckily for us they were equally bad vs. MSU. And if you look at the Spartantailgate board, they're even more PO'd at the refs than we are.
 

Too Long in the Wasteland said:
I agree that we got a gift on the T/A (non)-fumble. AS for the immaculate reception, there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it, largely because it happened so fast.
.
Click to expand...

I agree with the gift incomplete call. The immaculate play could have only been ruled two ways. Down or TD. However the ground can cause an incomplete pass, so had the ball hit the ground it would have been incomplete. Great bounce for the gophers. That play was ruled correctly in all aspects by the officials.
 



Too Long in the Wasteland said:
I agree that we got a gift on the T/A (non)-fumble. AS for the immaculate reception, there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it, largely because it happened so fast. If I was Dantonio, I'd be more PO'd at my players than the officials on that one. Maybe they should have been trying to tackle Bennett rather than standing around admiring T/A's corpse?

GVB - Like I said in another thread, after rewatching the game last night, in most of the penalties called against us Saturday we gave the ref an excuse to throw the flag. Whether or not he should have in some cases is very debatable. yeah, if someone moves before the snap, you gotta call it. But some of the holding and PF calls were BS. Its not like they had to start calling ticky-tack penalties because the game was getting out of hand with cheap shots. Luckily for us they were equally bad vs. MSU. And if you look at the Spartantailgate board, they're even more PO'd at the refs than we are.
Click to expand...
You're always more PO'd at the refs when you lose. That's just human nature. As far as the calls against us, I'd rather the coaches and players look in the mirror as opposed to blaming the refs. Yes, I agree the officials didn't get several calls right, but penalties have been a problem for the Gophers all year. Since we haven't had the same officiating crew for every game, the only common factor is the Gophers themselves.

Someone mentioned that the better teams have the luxury of benching someone when they commit dumb penalties. Maybe, but I'd rather hurt ourselves short term with the benching of a player without a reliable backup, than continue to let the player commit these idiotic acts without consequence. Obviously, Troy Stoudamire is so secure in his position that he openly argues with the coaching staff on the sideline for all to see. If he can do this without consequence, why would he feel the need to discipline himself from stupid penalties. I blame the coaching staff for this issue about 95%.
 

RedPoo said:
I don't read anywhere in these posts where someone claims they didn't. This is what I think of as 'trolling'...and just annoying posting in general. Building up straw men, then beating them down.

Good work fighting a point that no one has contested, and doing it in a patronizing, obnoxious way.
Click to expand...

Not true at all, there was a three page thread dedicated to how the refs screwed Minnesota. As Selection Sunday pointed out, the right team won the game, what is the problem?

Maybe you missed the post where I said it was a great win by the Gophers. It is my opinion that officiating does not decide football games, the players do. I think whining about the officials is a waste of time. In this case, it is detracting from a great effort by the Gophers.
 

GVBadger said:
Not true at all, there was a three page thread dedicated to how the refs screwed Minnesota. As Selection Sunday pointed out, the right team won the game, what is the problem?

Maybe you missed the post where I said it was a great win by the Gophers. It is my opinion that officiating does not decide football games, the players do. I think whining about the officials is a waste of time. In this case, it is detracting from a great effort by the Gophers.
Click to expand...


I made a post a lot like this one earlier, but here it goes again:

1- None of that is what you actually said in your earlier post.

2- The idea that officiating is only an issue worth discussing if it costs a rightful winner the game is asinine. For better or worse, officials are a part of the game, especially when they make bad calls. The officials in this game made a lot of bad calls. (This is NOT to say that all of their calls were bad, or that either Minnesota or MSU played a mistake-free game. Far from it.)

3- This thread is, as far as I can tell, about the media's reaction to the calls, not about the calls themselves. In my mind, this is an entirely different issue, especially considering the blatantly obvious, horribly slanted officiating that happened in the Iowa/Indiana game, and has not been covered well (if at all) by anyone that I've seen. Probably the right team won that game, too. But wouldn't you rather not have to wonder what would have happened if the right calls had been made?
 

The officials don't decide games, but they can have a significant impact if they give a team obstacles they need to overcome. Like I've said, this isn't a "Gophers got hosed" gripe. It's universal across the conference, it seems like officials are more and more likely to be intimidated by outside influences (crowd, coaches, reputation). Take the play where the Gophers were called for a late hit out of bounds. The two officials directly involved in the play didn't flinch for their hankies. You get hooting and hollering from the Spartans and a flag comes flying in from away from the play. It happens all the time. If that tackle is made on the Gophers sideline, I doubt a penalty is called.
 



IMO, the refs were terrible both ways, they were obviously trying to control the tempo of the game, calling questionable personal fouls to keep the game less physical. This is a travesty for football, I guess gone are the days when a QB is actually a football player not a pretty pretty princess, and sidelines are places to fear. Some football games have been called like they were in a passing league. The TA fumble reversal was IMO a make up call, which also points to terrible refereeing. Delaney needs to be fired and someone needs to come in and clean house on Big Ten refs and policies.
 

I thought Nick was down on the deflected touchdown to Bennet.
 

Studwell55 said:
I thought Nick was down on the deflected touchdown to Bennet.
Click to expand...

I think the official call on that one was a reception by Duane, not a fumble recovery. I've heard that was the correct call, haven't seen a replay to confirm myself.
 

Studwell55 said:
I thought Nick was down on the deflected touchdown to Bennet.
Click to expand...


I thought the same thing in person but after reviewing the play from several angles, there is one no-question tell-tale view (from the west end zone) where you can CLEARLY see the ball is already out of T/A's hands after being hit and falling to the ground. That call was not only correct on the field, but also correct after review. Although the pass was intended for T/A, he never caught it and if it had bounced to the ground instead of to Bennet, it would have been a FOR SURE slam dunk incomplete pass. All in all a great and very memorable touchdown.

The refs got that one right all around. The rest of the game... not so much.
 

In the end its the same conclusion.

The officials in that game Saturday were terrible plain and simple. They were simply bad both teams got jobbed at times but in the end the game turned out the way it probably should. Tow Arnett sure looked to fumble and it was reversed. Troy S didnt catch the ball in the endzone and it wasn's close. Even on the TV replay you can see the ball roll under his side you have to maintain the catch all the way to the ground.

I actually thought the Gophers did commit a good number of their penalties though I disagreed with one late hit call on Dandridge when he got blocked into the players on the sideline. I had a bigger problem with some of the non calls on MSU that I thought were very clear holding, false start, and a couple other things. That being said it was just poorly officiated both ways. In the end it worked itself out and the team that made more plays one the game. What MSU fans and talking heads should ask is how they lost a game in which they were given that many yards from Gopher penalties and a turnover and still didnt get the win.
 

Schnauzer said:
I thought the same thing in person but after reviewing the play from several angles, there is one no-question tell-tale view (from the west end zone) where you can CLEARLY see the ball is already out of T/A's hands after being hit and falling to the ground. That call was not only correct on the field, but also correct after review. Although the pass was intended for T/A, he never caught it and if it had bounced to the ground instead of to Bennet, it would have been a FOR SURE slam dunk incomplete pass. All in all a great and very memorable touchdown.

The refs got that one right all around. The rest of the game... not so much.
Click to expand...

That was the right call, the TA fumble ehhhh:eek:
It couldn't be incomplete because the ball never touched the ground, so it was either TA down and a catch or Bennett with the catch deflected off TA. Awesome play, Gopher finally got a bounce go their way! A good one for the pregame highlight intro.
 

2727Gopher said:
I think Adam Rittenberg is great, but his column has said at least THREE TIMES that the refs in our game were horrible and that it is Michigan State that got the short end of the stick! Did he even watch the game?

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten
Click to expand...

The 3 worst calls of the game were: there were two "mysterious" late hit out of bounds on the Gophers. One was in front of the MSU bench and the other was after our interception return just before halftime in front of OUR bench. I replayed them over and over and NEVER saw any late hits.

The WORST call, was the pass interference call on Campbell in the second quarter (I believe), when a ref that was 30 yards downfield came in and threw the flag 5 seconds after the play was over. The two refs who were right on top of the play, didn't call a penalty.

I also felt the Goph's DID get a break on the over-rulling of the Tow-Arnett incompletion vs the fumble recovered by MSU. What the heck, after all the ones on us, I'll take it.
 

One non-call that would have made a huge difference was a clip by a MSU player on Cambell on the 84 yard end around that went for a touchdown. If anyone still has that game recorded, go to that play and watch as a MSU player hits Campbell from behind at the knees...a clear clip, but the refs never called it. Had the refs made that call it would have nullified the touchdown and that could have lead to a bigger blow-out by the Gophers. Considering all the tickey tackey calls that went against us, the refs should have called that clip against MSU. That was a huge non-call.
 

Go Gophers Rah said:
Personally, I think the refs made very bad calls against us (and non-calls against MSU) for the 1st 50 minutes and then we got the benefit of the doubt in the last 10 minutes. If that is the case, it sure worked in our favor in the end.
Click to expand...

Quite true. On the Brewster show yesterday Sid mentioned to Brewster that the refs seemed to
make " a lot of make-up" against MSU in the Fourth Quarter. Brewster just let the comment sit there.

Indeed.
 

Like in poker...The winners sit and shoot the $hit and the Losers holler "DEAL" :)
 

There was a play that I thought should have been a false start on Michigan St. It was in the 2nd half, don't remember exactly when though. You'll see offensive lineman (when in their stance) turn around when a QB is changing a play or something. That is legal and is not a penalty. But in this instance, the right guard or tackle turned around while the ball was snapped.

Did anyone else see that? I would think that would be a penatly for sure. I still haven't watched the replay of the game, so maybe I'm wrong.
 

Studwell55 said:
I thought Nick was down on the deflected touchdown to Bennet.
Click to expand...

I think the question is whether or not Nick ever had possession fo the ball. I thought it bounced off him more than anything else.
 

I happen to agree with the officials on the Tow-Arnett non fumble. The thing is the rule requires that the ball be possessed and the player make a football move. TA had the ball in his hands and started to make his move before he tucked the ball away. As he completed his turn he started to tuck the ball away was hit and lost it. So far this year the referees have not been ruling possession until the ball is tucked. That's why the Stoudemire celebration penalty was so bogus he never tucked the ball so he held it up to show that he maintained possession.
 

My opinion is that the most of our penalties AND MSU's penalities were the correct calls. With that being said, I certainly think that some refs feel it is their duty to insert themselves in the outcome of the game. I am sure you could call a penalty on most plays. But some refs I feel believe they need to be a part of the game and outcome and therefore make it a point to heard and not just seen. Take the Vikings/Packers game for instance. The refs were more involved in the game in the first half and then decided to swallow their whistles in the second half. They could have called the guy blocking Jared Allen for holding on just about every play but they chose to let it go for the sake of flow and Aaron Rogers life!
 

If you think we got screwed over.....check this out http://www.spartantailgate.com/foru...-minnesota-game-thread-halloween-edition.html <-------michigan state game thread, which was over 102 pages long with over 35,000 views and you will find they got it just as bad as we did. I believe about pages 60 and on are quite comical. I was laughing heavily....and you think gopherhole gets bad. Seriously read through some of that it's great.
 

go4rob said:
The WORST call, was the pass interference call on Campbell in the second quarter (I believe), when a ref that was 30 yards downfield came in and threw the flag 5 seconds after the play was over. The two refs who were right on top of the play, didn't call a penalty.
Click to expand...

That was the worst! Like my son said "If the ref can't throw to where the penalty was, he should not throw it"! It took him 2 throws to get the flag to the spot. No way was he in position to see it, even if it was a penalty.
 

WolfontheProwl said:
The officials in that game Saturday were terrible plain and simple. They were simply bad both teams got jobbed at times but in the end the game turned out the way it probably should. Tow Arnett sure looked to fumble and it was reversed. Troy S didnt catch the ball in the endzone and it wasn's close. Even on the TV replay you can see the ball roll under his side you have to maintain the catch all the way to the ground.

I actually thought the Gophers did commit a good number of their penalties though I disagreed with one late hit call on Dandridge when he got blocked into the players on the sideline. I had a bigger problem with some of the non calls on MSU that I thought were very clear holding, false start, and a couple other things. That being said it was just poorly officiated both ways. In the end it worked itself out and the team that made more plays one the game. What MSU fans and talking heads should ask is how they lost a game in which they were given that many yards from Gopher penalties and a turnover and still didnt get the win.
Click to expand...

I agree on the Dandridge late hit call. Totally blown. Also, IMO Mcknight should have benefitted from a couple of pass interference calls. The ball was well on it's way and the DB's were still clutching and grabbing.

The point about the refs trying to control the game is a great point. Having been at the game, that was my thought as well.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom