RandBall: Will St. Thomas and the Gophers develop a sports rivalry?

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BleedGopher

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per RandBall:

They probably won't vie for the exact same recruits in most sports — particularly football — but as St. Thomas grows into Division I the school will at least nudge into the Gophers' territory.

Perhaps an instructive best-case scenario in terms of basketball can be found with our neighbors to the east. In Wisconsin, Marquette — a private school in Milwaukee that is similar in enrollment to St. Thomas — has a strong (albeit perhaps a little one-sided) rivalry with the much larger and public UW-Madison.

www.startribune.com

Will St. Thomas and the Gophers develop a sports rivalry?

With St. Thomas' move to Division I now just a handful of months away, let's take a look at this question.
www.startribune.com www.startribune.com

Go Gophers!!
 



Would be a great thing if UST eventually built up into a Big East program.
 

Would be great. Depends on who they hire. Get the right guy and anything is possible.
 



MplsGopher said:
Would be a great thing if UST eventually built up into a Big East program.
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If that happened, then it definitely could get to a Wis-Marq like deal. Also, be another school for the Gophers to recruit directly against. Not sure how "great" it would be for the Gophers to have that happen.
 

tjgopher said:
If that happened, then it definitely could get to a Wis-Marq like deal. Also, be another school for the Gophers to recruit directly against. Not sure how "great" it would be for the Gophers to have that happen.
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Marquette is a great program, and Wisc still has done great things.

I don't think IU or OSU complain about Butler or Xavier. And so on. I see way more good overall than bad. That is my opinion. And still obviously a very long way for them to go. But it seems like a no-brainer to me. St Paul/TC is a great Catholic market that makes sense for them to have a team.
 

tjgopher said:
If that happened, then it definitely could get to a Wis-Marq like deal. Also, be another school for the Gophers to recruit directly against. Not sure how "great" it would be for the Gophers to have that happen.
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St Thomas is decades away from being in a conference like the big East. If ever.

they are more likely to join the Missouri valley at some point and be akin to a drake than they are to be a peer to a Marquette
 



It would be good for the community, St. Thomas, maybe college basketball if they became a rival, but it would NOT be good for the gophers.

If they are deemed rivals it means St. Thomas is good and if they're good it means they are likely out recruiting the Gophers for recruits.
 

tmvander said:
It would be good for the community, St. Thomas, maybe college basketball if they became a rival, but it would NOT be good for the gophers.

If they are deemed rivals it means St. Thomas is good and if they're good it means they are likely out recruiting the Gophers for recruits.
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I think it is possible for them both to be good (see Marquette and Wisconsin in a similar state)
(See n Iowa, drake, Iowa state, Iowa in a smaller state)

But I tend to agree with you. I don’t think st Thomas reaches Marquette level success in the next 20 years.
They’re gunning to be a drake school....even copying their football conference
 

tmvander said:
It would be good for the community, St. Thomas, maybe college basketball if they became a rival, but it would NOT be good for the gophers.
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Has Marquette's success limited the success of Wisconsin?

I just don't see it.
 




Way off in time if ever
 

The media culture here would be a disaster if St. Thomas ever became competitive with the Gophers. It is cynical and anti-Gopher enough without adding the "they are so bad, St. Thomas can compete with them" narrative.

Other small/instate/city rivalries are mentioned as examples of no big deal take on St. Thomas, but there are plenty of examples the other way. When was the last time OSU played either Xavier or Cincinnati? They don't want to be compared to them or give any evidence that their big program is something less than the smaller schools. Indiana is a different animal. They have enough respect for the game in that state to not make playing each other a political game.

If the Gophers were on stronger footing, this would be no big deal. It would be like Michigan and Michigan State playing Detroit and Oakland each year. This is not the case in the Twin Cities.
 

MplsGopher said:
Has Marquette's success limited the success of Wisconsin?

I just don't see it.
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No I don't see it either as I don't think St. Thomas will get to a Marquette type level, but if they do and they start landing any of the big fish high school kids from MN that will hurt. It may not matter because chances are those kids wouldn't have played for the gophers anyway, but you never know.

These are all hypotheticals of course, but if that started happening it would hurt the gophers more than help them.
 



Holy Man said:
Indiana is a different animal. They have enough respect for the game in that state to not make playing each other a political game.
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No reason Minnesota couldn't be the same, if UST started approaching Butler.

Butler is not a historical member of the Big East, was only added after the breakup, also plays football in the Pioneer, and is located in Indy about 5miles from IU's Indy campus.

No, it is not a perfect match, in several aspects. But it is also a reasonable comparison. Not forgetting that there is some other strong Catholic university located in the state! Forgot the name of it ....
 


BleedGopher said:
per RandBall:

They probably won't vie for the exact same recruits in most sports — particularly football — but as St. Thomas grows into Division I the school will at least nudge into the Gophers' territory.

Perhaps an instructive best-case scenario in terms of basketball can be found with our neighbors to the east. In Wisconsin, Marquette — a private school in Milwaukee that is similar in enrollment to St. Thomas — has a strong (albeit perhaps a little one-sided) rivalry with the much larger and public UW-Madison.

www.startribune.com

Will St. Thomas and the Gophers develop a sports rivalry?

With St. Thomas' move to Division I now just a handful of months away, let's take a look at this question.
www.startribune.com www.startribune.com

Go Gophers!!
Click to expand...

I expected that it would be close to 50/50 ( series is 68-59 Wisconsin) but Wisconsin dominated in the early years, in the 40's then oddly enough for a few years post Al McGuire, but before Dick Bennett.

Wisconsin Basketball was pretty rotten for most of my adult life that I remember until Dick Bennett showed up.

Marquette has had much more success vs UW than Minnesota has in recent years.


All-time seriesWisconsin leads, 68–59
 

MplsGopher said:
No reason Minnesota couldn't be the same, if UST started approaching Butler.

Butler is not a historical member of the Big East, was only added after the breakup, also plays football in the Pioneer, and is located in Indy about 5miles from IU's Indy campus.

No, it is not a perfect match, in several aspects. But it is also a reasonable comparison. Not forgetting that there is some other strong Catholic university located in the state! Forgot the name of it ....
Click to expand...

Everything in Minnesota is political. This will never be like Indiana and basketball. The equivalent here is hockey. No Minnesota teams are afraid to play each other and look forward to it. Cannot see that happening in hoops. Too cynical on the press, and too much PR concern on the part of the U, especially in a down era, like now.
 

MplsGopher said:
Marquette is a great program, and Wisc still has done great things.

I don't think IU or OSU complain about Butler or Xavier. And so on. I see way more good overall than bad. That is my opinion. And still obviously a very long way for them to go. But it seems like a no-brainer to me. St Paul/TC is a great Catholic market that makes sense for them to have a team.
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Marquette has made as many tourneys as us in the last 8 years and we are not great
 

MinnGopher said:
Marquette has made as many tourneys as us in the last 8 years and we are not great
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OK, well I don't need Marquette to be great in order for them to 1) have a rivalry with Wisconsin, and 2) point out that the rivalry hasn't prevented Wisconsin from doing great things.

I was only proposing that UST can be analogous to Marquette, in that sense.
 

Holy Man said:
This will never be like Indiana and basketball.
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I just don't see why.

You say everything in Minnesota is political. But then exempt hockey. I don't see why basketball can't be given the same exemption.
 

There is no argument that St. Thomas becoming a power 5-ish team is helpful to the Gophers. Get real. If they stay in the Summit, it's mostly no harm no foul but if they have to compete with them for recruits/fan interest, it's a negative.
 

Any predictions on the first St Thomas win over the Gophers? I say 2045.
 

Some guy said:
You think they are firing Tauer?
Why?
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No. But i think he will not stay all that long. This will be a whole new job and there is a great up and coming coach that fits that job to perfection.
 



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