Pitino's recrutiing so far

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El Amin Fan

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In less than 18 months:

McNeil - suspended from all team activities, facing some legit jail time if true
Lofton - his best moment was an interview where he proclaimed his dream coming true as a Gopher. Never sees a minute, kicked off the team
Gaston - not eligible first semester. Hope he gets eligible soon, we obviously need him.
Martin - decides to transfer before Christmas

Obviously we have some really nice additions in Mathieu, Mason and Morris and hopefully next years class is legit, but wow, this is not a good start. Obviously I'm not panicking, but you also can't look at these situations in a vacuum and wonder if our talent evaluation is legit, or if our ability to judge character is up to par.
 

Very fair post. Tubby went through this same issue and never recovered.

How Pitino recovers from this can define his career with the gophers
 

There go our graduation numbers...
 


Gaston wasn't entirely on him, but yeah he has made some misfires which could have cost us that Ilk kid
 



Shows the challenges of building a program; recruiting class to come improved over 2014; 2016 should improve on 15; take a look at Nebraska; two top 100 recruits in their 2015 class. It appears ultimately there was a reason why josh Martin was as low as a 2 star recruit. Disappointing.
 

Gotta be concerned.

A young coach learning quickly about today's youth and how being able to relate is overrated.

I'd be more comfortable if it was Tubbys guys being unable to cope, not his own recruits.
 

Well at least we likely don't have to worry about pitino bolting to a new job.

Would not be shocked if Lofton came back.
 



El Amin Fan said:
In less than 18 months:

McNeil - suspended from all team activities, facing some legit jail time if true
Lofton - his best moment was an interview where he proclaimed his dream coming true as a Gopher. Never sees a minute, kicked off the team
Gaston - not eligible first semester. Hope he gets eligible soon, we obviously need him.
Martin - decides to transfer before Christmas

Obviously we have some really nice additions in Mathieu, Mason and Morris and hopefully next years class is legit, but wow, this is not a good start. Obviously I'm not panicking, but you also can't look at these situations in a vacuum and wonder if our talent evaluation is legit, or if our ability to judge character is up to par.
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Fair. Hopefully this isn't a trend like it became with Tubby.
 

El Amin Fan said:
In less than 18 months:

McNeil - suspended from all team activities, facing some legit jail time if true
Lofton - his best moment was an interview where he proclaimed his dream coming true as a Gopher. Never sees a minute, kicked off the team
Gaston - not eligible first semester. Hope he gets eligible soon, we obviously need him.
Martin - decides to transfer before Christmas

Obviously we have some really nice additions in Mathieu, Mason and Morris and hopefully next years class is legit, but wow, this is not a good start. Obviously I'm not panicking, but you also can't look at these situations in a vacuum and wonder if our talent evaluation is legit, or if our ability to judge character is up to par.
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None of them have to do with talent evaluation, outside of maybe Martin. Those guys all had talent.
 

joshvanklomp said:
None of them have to do with talent evaluation, outside of maybe Martin. Those guys all had talent.
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King is also a Pitino pickup.

I'm not worried in the least about their recruiting. I think the one big mistake is Lofton-even though they thought he had big potential the history was there. With Martin there was nothing to indicate he wouldn't last and Mcneil was out of the blue.

Pitino has picked up 4 guys who have come in and played well in key roles. Mason is going to be a GREAT player here and a guy you can build a team around. We have atop 25 class coming in and there will be more added. No one knows on Gaston but you can be sure Martin did and he may have felt Gaston was just another guy who was going to be in front of him on the depth chart. Guys are going to watch this offense and style of play and want to come here. I'd guess we bring in a Juco wing and considering Morris and Matheui, Pitino certainly has a track record to sell.
 

bga1 said:
I'd guess we bring in a Juco wing and considering Morris and Matheui, Pitino certainly has a track record to sell.
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I agree, let's go pick up another Bobby Jackson.
 



Slow down

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10702122/tracking-every-transfer-2014-offseason-college-basketball
El Amin Fan said:
In less than 18 months:

McNeil - suspended from all team activities, facing some legit jail time if true
Lofton - his best moment was an interview where he proclaimed his dream coming true as a Gopher. Never sees a minute, kicked off the team
Gaston - not eligible first semester. Hope he gets eligible soon, we obviously need him.
Martin - decides to transfer before Christmas

Obviously we have some really nice additions in Mathieu, Mason and Morris and hopefully next years class is legit, but wow, this is not a good start. Obviously I'm not panicking, but you also can't look at these situations in a vacuum and wonder if our talent evaluation is legit, or if our ability to judge character is up to par.
Click to expand...

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bas...ry-transfer-2014-offseason-college-basketball

It is a trend for more and more guys to transfer. Nobody on the list was a starter or significant contributor. Rather than looking at it as a crisis, why not see it as an opportunity to improve the program?
 

Sparlimb said:
I agree, let's go pick up another Bobby Jackson.
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We already did but he's a Freshman & they call him Nate Mason. We're all set at Guard. What we need, and have always needed since Pitino got here is a Trevor Mbakwe. They don't grow on trees, I get it. Still, once we get a stud up front, Pitino will look so much smarter. That guy from Louisville made me really miss Mbakwe.
 

Legit post. I love Pitino, but he's a young coach & he's made some questionable decision so far. I've been blasted for saying this before, but his 1st hire Kimani Young, the guy who did time for getting caught with NINETY SIX POUNDS of weed, was a bold hire, imo.

Then he brought in Malik Smith who really didn't belong in the B1G or seem happy to be here by seasons' end. Then he brought in McNeil, who in my mind is a dead man walking. Then Lofton, who barely made it to practice before getting the boot. Then Martin, who became disillusioned so fast that it makes me a little nervous. I'll cut Coach some slack on Gaston, that was a clearing house issue.

I'm not panicking, but this is a legit topic of conversation & to be fair, when this happened to Tubby it felt like we were much harder on him than we're being on Pitino.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Legit post. I love Pitino, but he's a young coach & he's made some questionable decision so far. I've been blasted for saying this before, but his 1st hire Kimani Young, the guy who did time for getting caught with NINETY SIX POUNDS of weed, was a bold hire, imo.

Then he brought in Malik Smith who really didn't belong in the B1G or seem happy to be here by seasons' end. Then he brought in McNeil, who in my mind is a dead man walking. Then Lofton, who barely made it to practice before getting the boot. Then Martin, who became disillusioned so fast that it makes me a little nervous. I'll cut Coach some slack on Gaston, that was a clearing house issue.

I'm not panicking, but this is a legit topic of conversation & to be fair, when this happened to Tubby it felt like we were much harder on him than we're being on Pitino.
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Mason, Mathieu and Morris seem to make up for it.

I don't think Malik Smith was necessarily a bad player. Better than our walk ons or Ahanmisi
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Legit post. I love Pitino, but he's a young coach & he's made some questionable decision so far. I've been blasted for saying this before, but his 1st hire Kimani Young, the guy who did time for getting caught with NINETY SIX POUNDS of weed, was a bold hire, imo.

Then he brought in Malik Smith who really didn't belong in the B1G or seem happy to be here by seasons' end. Then he brought in McNeil, who in my mind is a dead man walking. Then Lofton, who barely made it to practice before getting the boot. Then Martin, who became disillusioned so fast that it makes me a little nervous. I'll cut Coach some slack on Gaston, that was a clearing house issue.

I'm not panicking, but this is a legit topic of conversation & to be fair, when this happened to Tubby it felt like we were much harder on him than we're being on Pitino.
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Kimani and Malik are not valid. Kimanis issue has yet to come up from anyone other than you, and malik was roster filler, didn't work out. He had nothing to lose there and a little to gain.

You're eight, cause for concern and if we are gonna be fair, we should be concerned a bit louder. However, tubbys didn't come this early and often, his was a yearly debacle that crippled his teams. We still mY get there, but I think we are all experiencing sticker shock right now...
 

bga1 said:
King is also a Pitino pickup.

I'm not worried in the least about their recruiting. I think the one big mistake is Lofton-even though they thought he had big potential the history was there. With Martin there was nothing to indicate he wouldn't last and Mcneil was out of the blue.
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Agree on all points. I don't think "If some b*tch pissed you off, would you rap her good and choke her with a belt?" is, or should be, part of the standard recruit questionnaire.

If Martin was going to transfer, he couldn't have done it at a better time. Just think if he had redshirted, didn't get much playing time next year, and then decided to transfer at the end of his second season.
 

I not too worried. Malik and McNeil were holdovers from Florida. Richard didn't know what he was really getting into, so he brought his best player and best recruit with him to the U. Malik wasn't the same in the B1G and McNeil didn't handle his personal issues maturely. Richard also took a chance with a very talented hometown kid that was fulfilling his childhood dreams, but the player didn't blend in. Richard didn't have the track record in his first recruiting class to close the deal on the big time players that listed us as top three. He said himself that he reached for some international talent that year because he couldn't get the US talent without a track record. He found out the hard way that the U can throw a roadblock into the admissions process. Josh was considered a very talented kid, but his stock seemed to drop as he got older. Richard surely knew this, but must have decided that he would still give him a chance. It was obvious that Josh was very nervous when he got on the court and needed some confidence.

The program is going big time, and the days of having a roster full of 2*'s that are content to just sit on the bench are over! Richard will not hit a home run with every recruit, but he will not be afraid to reload every year! It is better that things are resolved quickly and not let players linger for a couple years holding a dead roster spot.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Legit post. I love Pitino, but he's a young coach & he's made some questionable decision so far. I've been blasted for saying this before, but his 1st hire Kimani Young, the guy who did time for getting caught with NINETY SIX POUNDS of weed, was a bold hire, imo. Then he brought in Malik Smith who really didn't belong in the B1G or seem happy to be here by seasons' end. Then he brought in McNeil, who in my mind is a dead man walking. Then Lofton, who barely made it to practice before getting the boot. Then Martin, who became disillusioned so fast that it makes me a little nervous. I'll cut Coach some slack on Gaston, that was a clearing house issue. I'm not panicking, but this is a legit topic of conversation & to be fair, when this happened to Tubby it felt like we were much harder on him than we're being on Pitino.
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Disagree on Kimani, if we want to care about people's rehabilitation someone has to give them a chance. Pitino walked the walk there, I actually really liked it. Especially since it wasn't any type of violent crime. Marijuana is now legal in certain states. Not like he was in a drug cartel kidnapping people.

Malik Smith really fell off at the end of the year, but he did catch on and was drafted by a D-League team. He can't be too terrible?

I think the comparison to Tubby is fair, however Tubby got defenses early too if I recall? It was when it happened year 6 and they became the direct contribution to multiple losses. Pitino is still winning for now. If losses start to come, the criticism will get louder. Personally, I defended Tubby for the most part here and would continue to do so for Pitino. It also hurt Tubby that the guys he lost/nearly lost were 4 or 5 star players. Pitino hasn't lost anyone of that caliber yet. (Mostly because he hasn't recruited it yet being in year 2, but different discussion)
 

I never held the transfers and off-court issues as Tubby's responsibility. These are young MEN not todlers. They should be able to conduct themselves accordingly. My poblem with Tubby was the complee lack of player development with players like Rodey Williams and Ralph Sampson III. Players who displayed pro potential early and then just faded away.

I'm just an outsider but it seems that Pitino has done more with Mo than Tubby ever did for Ralph.
 

scher215 said:
Disagree on Kimani, if we want to care about people's rehabilitation someone has to give them a chance. Pitino walked the walk there, I actually really liked it. Especially since it wasn't any type of violent crime. Marijuana is now legal in certain states. Not like he was in a drug cartel kidnapping people.
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If you have access to 96 pounds of weed, you are very close to some very nasty people.
 


scher215 said:
Disagree on Kimani, if we want to care about people's rehabilitation someone has to give them a chance. Pitino walked the walk there, I actually really liked it. Especially since it wasn't any type of violent crime. Marijuana is now legal in certain states. Not like he was in a drug cartel kidnapping people.

Malik Smith really fell off at the end of the year, but he did catch on and was drafted by a D-League team. He can't be too terrible?

I think the comparison to Tubby is fair, however Tubby got defenses early too if I recall? It was when it happened year 6 and they became the direct contribution to multiple losses. Pitino is still winning for now. If losses start to come, the criticism will get louder. Personally, I defended Tubby for the most part here and would continue to do so for Pitino. It also hurt Tubby that the guys he lost/nearly lost were 4 or 5 star players. Pitino hasn't lost anyone of that caliber yet. (Mostly because he hasn't recruited it yet being in year 2, but different discussion)
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I didn't blame Tubby for losing guys like Royce and Paul Carter, those were basically out of his control in my mind (similar to McNeil and Lofton to an extent). It was the losses of Devoe, Cobbs, and Iverson that could be partially blamed on Tubby as they primarily seemed to be based on playing time and Tubby's coaching style. Devoe and Iverson, in particular, were already solid rotation guys that really hurt the team when they left. There might have been other off-the-court issues with Devoe that contributed to his transfer as well, but that one really killed our backcourt, especially once Nolen became ineligible.

The Martin transfer to me reminds me a lot of the Cobbs transfer under Tubby. Seemed like a kid that wasn't getting playing time and was home sick, so he bolted early. Hopefully losing Martin doesn't end up being similar to that situation however, because Cobbs turned out to be a helluva player at Cal. For the time being however, losing Martin, Lofton, and McNeil don't seem like a big deal to me in terms of talent. Those guys can be easily replaced by most 3* recruits or a transfer of our own that is brought in.

As far as Pitino's character assessment during recruiting goes, I'm fine with what he's doing. Teams like Minnesota have to take some risks to get high-level talent. We're not at the level of Duke, where we can just avoid all potential toxic issues and recruit only kids with the highest of character.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
And you know this how...because you lived the life?
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Two separate room-mates. One smart and who parlayed his gains into becoming a very successful entrepreneur, one not so smart who eventually ended up in a foreign jail. Both functioned at a level below 96 pounds. Both fully understood that it would not end well if the higher-ups got upset.
 

scher215 said:
Disagree on Kimani, if we want to care about people's rehabilitation someone has to give them a chance. Pitino walked the walk there, I actually really liked it. Especially since it wasn't any type of violent crime. Marijuana is now legal in certain states. Not like he was in a drug cartel kidnapping people.

Malik Smith really fell off at the end of the year, but he did catch on and was drafted by a D-League team. He can't be too terrible?

I think the comparison to Tubby is fair, however Tubby got defenses early too if I recall? It was when it happened year 6 and they became the direct contribution to multiple losses. Pitino is still winning for now. If losses start to come, the criticism will get louder. Personally, I defended Tubby for the most part here and would continue to do so for Pitino. It also hurt Tubby that the guys he lost/nearly lost were 4 or 5 star players. Pitino hasn't lost anyone of that caliber yet. (Mostly because he hasn't recruited it yet being in year 2, but different discussion)
Click to expand...

Imagine you they make you CEO at your company. Would your first hire be a guy who'd been to prison for drug trafficking? I'm not saying Kimani Young is a bad guy, or that he shouldn't be part of the program, but I am saying it was a bold hire. If you think Pitino didn't have to go to Woody's office & explain himself, you're nuts.

Also, no one is more open to legalization of marijuana than I am, but It is not like he was caught with an ounce. It is not now & never will be legal to posses 100lbs of marijuana regardless of what state you're in. Cartel kingpin? He may not have been, but he was certainly doing business with them. You don't just buy 100 pounds of weed on the street corner. Even at wholesale prices that's hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of marijuana. Any way you slice it that's high level drug trafficking.
 

Winnipegopher said:
Two separate room-mates. One smart and who parlayed his gains into becoming a very successful entrepreneur, one not so smart who eventually ended up in a foreign jail. Both functioned at a level below 96 pounds. Both fully understood that it would not end well if the higher-ups got upset.
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Sounds like you've been very close to some nasty people, good luck getting a job a decade plus later.
 

Maximus said:
Sounds like you've been very close to some nasty people, good luck getting a job a decade plus later.
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True that. And stumbled into moving in with them before I knew their back-stories (both times had just moved to a new city).

I should have been clearer, I was merely stating that someone moving 96 pounds of weed is indeed "close to the cartel" as it was originally put.

I have no issue with hiring Kimani Young and in fact think that society really hinders rehabilitation by focusing so much on past mistakes.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Imagine you they make you CEO at your company. Would your first hire be a guy who'd been to prison for drug trafficking? I'm not saying Kimani Young is a bad guy, or that he shouldn't be part of the program, but I am saying it was a bold hire. If you think Pitino didn't have to go to Woody's office & explain himself, you're nuts.

Also, no one is more open to legalization of marijuana than I am, but It is not like he was caught with an ounce. It is not now & never will be legal to posses 100lbs of marijuana regardless of what state you're in. Cartel kingpin? He may not have been, but he was certainly doing business with them. You don't just buy 100 pounds of weed on the street corner. Even at wholesale prices that's hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of marijuana. Any way you slice it that's high level drug trafficking.
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I just think it shows his ambition. Why deal with grams and ounces when you can deal with pounds and kilos.;)
 

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