Patrick Reusse: Gophers hoops crowd gets annual rip-off notice

[station19]

Combine the two bolded statements.



Just saying that losing a home game and it's income(tik income and concession income) is a big factor for an athletic dept trying to support all the non-revenue sports and balancing the budget. If Football averaged 80-90 k per game it may well be a different story.

As far as Northwestern, I have no idea on their situation.

Bottom Line:

I agree with Reusse that BB STH pay a high price for a poor non con home schedule.

I state that a large part of that is due to $.

As far as was done, wasn't done, should be, shouldn't be, how much exposure, what recruits think, blah, blah, blah..............you guys can have at it.

 

[From the Barn]

So don't buy season tickets?

 

[golfing18now]

What I'm saying is why not take a mild hit or two financially and have that exposure for a couple of non conference games too?

People, If the program can afford to opt out of two UNC football games for $800,000, they can afford taking two home games at 75% capacity off the schedule over two years for better competition & exposure in the non conf schedule...

Last couple points on this....

Don't dismiss the bottom line financial angle to this. I'm still scratching my head regarding the NC buy-out, but in general the other non-revenue sports are always part of this discussion. I agree with station19 regarding a more successful football program would solve much of this problem.

Secondly, you are assuming that ESPN would salivate over the prospect of televising Oklahhoma State at Minnesota. A father/son matchup with Louisville, absolutely. A non-conference game with Oklahoma State. I'm not sure. So you may or may not get the exposure that you desire.

With three possible losses in the Maui tournament and the annual match-up against the ACC, we probably weren't going to see two or three other games with a higher degree of difficulty. At the end of the day, we don't want to be in a situation like Purdue was last year with a very mediocre non-conference record and almost no chance to make the tournament going into the conference season.

 

[GopherDude]

Last couple points on this....

Don't dismiss the bottom line financial angle to this. I'm still scratching my head regarding the NC buy-out, but in general the other non-revenue sports are always part of this discussion. I agree with station19 regarding a more successful football program would solve much of this problem.

Secondly, you are assuming that ESPN would salivate over the prospect of televising Oklahhoma State at Minnesota. A father/son matchup with Louisville, absolutely. A non-conference game with Oklahoma State. I'm not sure. So you may or may not get the exposure that you desire.

With three possible losses in the Maui tournament and the annual match-up against the ACC, we probably weren't going to see two or three other games with a higher degree of difficulty. At the end of the day, we don't want to be in a situation like Purdue was last year with a very mediocre non-conference record and almost no chance to make the tournament going into the conference season.

Everything was a good point you made except the OKst point, simply because Smart & Nash will both be back and they will be a potential Elite 8 / Final 4 team. I'll let the argument fizzle out from afar now.

 

[From the Barn]

If the Gophers played at a middle of the road B12 school, the game would be on B12 network, no one could watch it here, and everyone would whine about not being able to see the game.

 

[jamiche]

Rinse, cycle, repeat. We hear the same excuses every year. New staff ("I'll give him a pass this year, it'll be better next year"), football program doesn't bring in enough dough, Big 10 slate is tough enough, nobody wants to play us at The Barn, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Again, as GopherDude pointed out, not asking for a home-and-home with power-conference brand names like Louisville/UConn (AAC), Duke/North Carolina/Syracuse (ACC), Georgetown/Villanova (Big East), Kansas (Big 12), Arizona/UCLA (Pac 12), or Florida/Kentucky (SEC). That would be great, but I would never expect that, even now with the potential for a future Pitino-Pitino matchup.

Just throw us an occasional bone with a home-and-home vs. (for example) the likes of a Cincinnati/Memphis (AAC), a Providence/Seton Hall (Big East), a Kansas State/Oklahoma State (Big 12), a Colorado/Washington State (Pac 12), or a South Carolina/Vanderbilt (SEC). All programs of similar ilk to the Gophers. It's not that difficult. Since Monson left (at least he scheduled home-and-homes vs. major conferences), the Gopher program is significantly behind most its peers when it comes to scheduling notable home-and-homes.

Other schools somehow manage to pull off the miracle. The tradition of a terrible non con schedule is based on four factors: 1) The incredibly short sighted culture in the athletic dept of not caring about their customers. Teague hasn't changed that. If anything, it appears to be worsening (e.g. trading North Carolina for New Mexico in football); 2) A crappy football program that leaves basketball starved for revenue; 3) Terrible coaching hires compounded by contract extensions that lead to payoffs, leaving the department cash depleted; and 4) The misplaced notion that an easy non con schedule is good preparation for the B1G season. How is playing Coastal Carolina going to get you ready to play Michigan State? It's not.

Do you think that Rashad Vaughn will be jazzed by playing the equivalent of twelve games against Wolford in November and December of 2014? He won't. He wants to be on national or regional TV and he wants to sharpen his skills for the NBA because he's not planning to be in college in the fall of 2015.

 

[Moonlight]

Honestly - we don't even get NDSU this year! I never thought I'd type those words with regret!

I was deeply disappointed with the release of the non-con schedule today. For all the reasons given by SS and Jamiche. Someone's response here was: well, then don't buy a season ticket. In case you haven't noticed, this is the solution that many have chosen. Whoever this was, I suggest I a little experiment. On a non-conference night that I can't make it, with temps 15 degrees or lower, YOU look for someone who will give you $50 for the pair. Try and find someone who will give you $40, $30 - even $20 is unlikely. You might get $10 out front of Williams. Hell, make it a balmy 40 degrees outside and the same economics apply.

Looking at the schedule makes me both glad we didn't upgrade our seats, and frankly, wondering how much longer we want to pony up for this. Perhaps the price isn't significantly off of what other schools charge, but the attitude of the U is so poor. They presume there's someone just waiting to our place if we leave. Bad business.

 

[MadtownGopher]

I wish for one season we would play absolutely stacked nonconference schedule. We'd go .500 and everyone be irate that we decided to play such a brutal schedule effectively killing our tournament hopes.

Also, how many programs outside of the elites (MSU, Duke etc.) actually have "great" nonconference schedules? The nonconference is more or less the preseason of college basketball.

 

[SelectionSunday]

I wish for one season we would play absolutely stacked nonconference schedule. We'd go .500 and everyone be irate that we decided to play such a brutal schedule effectively killing our tournament hopes.

Also, how many programs outside of the elites (MSU, Duke etc.) actually have "great" nonconference schedules? The nonconference is more or less the preseason of college basketball.

Respectfully, I think you're missing the point of Reusse's column, and those of us in agreement with him. It's not about the overall nonconference schedule. It's about the home nonconference schedule. Two different topics of conversation.

 

[underground629]

Don't you think Pitino's schedule is reasonable considering how late to the game he was? I know the excuses are getting old, but that's legit for this year. I think your beef/frustration is with Tubby, Maturi, and Kill. Pat always makes it seem like the other BT teams are playing great home games. I know, we just want one, but give it a year. His historical crap is getting so old. Most teams play cupcakes now, not just us.

Well said, Patrick, and thank you.

 

[underground629]

nvm... need to finish reading through threads before posting...

 

[underground629]

Not exactly related to your point, but I think us fans would certainly salivate over OK State playing here this year. That would be one of the better pg matches in the country.

Last couple points on this....

Don't dismiss the bottom line financial angle to this. I'm still scratching my head regarding the NC buy-out, but in general the other non-revenue sports are always part of this discussion. I agree with station19 regarding a more successful football program would solve much of this problem.

Secondly, you are assuming that ESPN would salivate over the prospect of televising Oklahhoma State at Minnesota. A father/son matchup with Louisville, absolutely. A non-conference game with Oklahoma State. I'm not sure. So you may or may not get the exposure that you desire.

With three possible losses in the Maui tournament and the annual match-up against the ACC, we probably weren't going to see two or three other games with a higher degree of difficulty. At the end of the day, we don't want to be in a situation like Purdue was last year with a very mediocre non-conference record and almost no chance to make the tournament going into the conference season.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Fair question.

I can't speak for how much of the schedule Pitino inherited from Tubby other than the Maui and Richmond, but on a scale of 1 to 10 I'd probably give the overall nonconference schedule a 4. There are some opportunities for "quality" wins:

Montana (should win, but potentially tricky)
@ Richmond
vs. Syracuse
vs. Cal/Arkansas (moreso Cal)
vs. Baylor/Dayton/Gonzaga (much moreso Baylor or Gonzaga)
Florida State

Absent beating Syracuse, the Gophers would be wise to win 4 of those other 5. If the Gophers beat Syracuse, then the NC sked takes on a whole different flavor. In all likelihood it would guarantee another game vs. a sure-fire top 25-50ish Gonzaga or Baylor.

 

[GopherDude]

Fair question.

I can't speak for how much of the schedule Pitino inherited from Tubby other than the Maui and Richmond, but on a scale of 1 to 10 I'd probably give the overall nonconference schedule a 4. There are some opportunities for "quality" wins:

Montana (should win, but potentially tricky)
@ Richmond
vs. Syracuse
vs. Cal/Arkansas (moreso Cal)
vs. Baylor/Dayton/Gonzaga (much moreso Baylor or Gonzaga)
Florida State

Absent beating Syracuse, the Gophers would be wise to win 4 of those other 5. If the Gophers beat Syracuse, then the NC sked takes on a whole different flavor. In all likelihood it would guarantee another game vs. a sure-fire top 25-50ish Gonzaga or Baylor.

All 5 of those quality games / teams were predetermined and had nothing to do with Pitino or his staff.

 

[Ope3]

New Mexico STATE

Other schools somehow manage to pull off the miracle. The tradition of a terrible non con schedule is based on four factors: 1) The incredibly short sighted culture in the athletic dept of not caring about their customers. Teague hasn't changed that. If anything, it appears to be worsening (e.g. trading North Carolina for New Mexico in football); 2) A crappy football program that leaves basketball starved for revenue; 3) Terrible coaching hires compounded by contract extensions that lead to payoffs, leaving the department cash depleted; and 4) The misplaced notion that an easy non con schedule is good preparation for the B1G season. How is playing Coastal Carolina going to get you ready to play Michigan State? It's not.

Do you think that Rashad Vaughn will be jazzed by playing the equivalent of twelve games against Wolford in November and December of 2014? He won't. He wants to be on national or regional TV and he wants to sharpen his skills for the NBA because he's not planning to be in college in the fall of 2015.

I would have been able to stomach the North Carolina football decision if it really had been replaced by New Mexico (from the Mountain West) instead of the actual foe, New Mexico State (from the crumbling WAC).

If there is cause for optimism for future schedules, the backlash from NC led to TCU being added for football. Hopefully hoops will follow suit.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Did Pitino inherit the Montana game? Not sure if that was one Esposito already had lined up.

Funny thing is, this is a season I wouldn't mind having NDSU on the schedule (in place of SDSU sans Nate Wolters) because they're supposed to be pretty good, but now they've dropped off the schedule. In fairness to Pitino, I think that it was Saul Phillips' idea not to renew the series.

 

[MadtownGopher]

Respectfully, I think you're missing the point of Reusse's column, and those of us in agreement with him. It's not about the overall nonconference schedule. It's about the home nonconference schedule. Two different topics of conversation.

No I hear you season ticket holders' grumbling every year. I'm just saying if you schedule a bunch of home-and-home's with elite programs you are probably going to start racking up a bunch of nonconf L's. I think the time to schedule bluechip home-and-home's is when you go 2-3 years without that elite nonconference tournament, which will probably be the case the next few years because we have hit up all the major ones recently (Maui/Atlantis/Anaheim/Puerto Rico etc.).

 

[Ope3]

No I hear you season ticket holders' grumbling every year. I'm just saying if you schedule a bunch of home-and-home's with elite programs you are probably going to start racking up a bunch of nonconf L's. I think the time to schedule bluechip home-and-home's is when you go 2-3 years without that elite nonconference tournament, which will probably be the case the next few years because we have hit up all the major ones recently (Maui/Atlantis/Anaheim/Puerto Rico etc.).

Hence the title "Annual rip-off notice".

Just fyi, after 4 years teams are eligible to return to exempt Tourneys so they already could return to Disneyland and PR next year.

 

[GopherDude]

Hence the title "Annual rip-off notice".

Just fyi, after 4 years teams are eligible to return to exempt Tourneys so they already could return to Disneyland and PR next year.

Yeah, I don't see the Gophers not joining some exempt tourney every year for the rest of eternity.

 

[MadtownGopher]

Hence the title "Annual rip-off notice".

Just fyi, after 4 years teams are eligible to return to exempt Tourneys so they already could return to Disneyland and PR next year.

If you consider it a ripoff, don't buy the tickets. It's simple as that. You know what you are buying, home games in the best conference in the country with some poor nonconference home games. It's like any other sport, NFL season ticket holders have to pay full value for preseason games which are MUCH worse than nonconference college basketball games.

 

[Chris Monter]

I spoke to Joe Esposito, the former director of operations at Minnesota Wednesday afternoon. The current Texas Tech assistant told me that the games scheduled against Wofford (13-19), New Orleans (8-18), Nebraska-Omaha (11-20) and Texas A&M-Corpus Christi (6-23) were added since the coaching change.

Lehigh was a game that was scheduled two years ago, according to Esposito. They finished 21-10 and were ranked #107 in the RPI. They obviously lost star C.J. McCollum, who was the tenth pick in the NBA Draft by Portland.

South Dakota State has played the Gophers the past four years and has made the NCAA tournament the past two seasons. They were ranked #62 in the RPI and will play Texas Tech, according to Esposito.

Montana was ranked #74 in the RPI and made the NCAA Tournament with a 25-7 record and a 19-1 mark in the Big Sky Conference.

Coastal Carolina was 14-15 last season and is playing Minnesota as a part of a Maui Invitational deal.

The Gophers had a game scheduled with New Mexico State, which was ranked #62 in the RPI. However, they will not be playing the Aggies, a Gopher football opponent, on the hardwood this year. New Mexico State won the Western Athletic Conference Tournament and made it to the NCAA Tournament.

It appears that the Gopher basketball schedule is being done by the athletic department, most likely Mike Ellis, who is well known for his NCAA basketball contacts.

Non-conference schedules are probably never going to please fans who are paying the same price for those games as they do conference contests, but I assume that every teams fans complain about attending non-conference games against “nobodies.”

My philosophy would have be to play teams closer to Minnesota like that Dakota schools, Drake, Northern Iowa, Milwaukee, Green Bay and maybe sprinkle in a contest in a home and away with Iowa State and Marquette. I don’t mind games like Wofford, which has Minnesotan C.J. Neumann on their roster as a way that his family and friends can see him play, However, games like Texas A&M Corpus Christi and New Orleans, do little to excite me.


Chris Monter

 

[jamiche]

Don't you think Pitino's schedule is reasonable considering how late to the game he was? I know the excuses are getting old, but that's legit for this year. I think your beef/frustration is with Tubby, Maturi, and Kill. Pat always makes it seem like the other BT teams are playing great home games. I know, we just want one, but give it a year. His historical crap is getting so old. Most teams play cupcakes now, not just us.

No, it's not reasonable. Outside of the ACC challenge (which is the only game that is close to mediocre), he had control of the game for which the season ticket holders directly pay. Garbage.

 

[jamiche]

So don't buy season tickets?

I can pretty close to promise you that if the season ticket renewals were due after the schedule was released, either the schedule would be much more attractive or the season ticket renewals would drop considerably.

 

[JTristesse]

Please stop giving web hits


Gophers hoops crowd gets annual rip-off notice
Posted by: Patrick Reusse Updated: July 31, 2013 - 9:56 AM

13
comments
print

Share

They are the Twin Cities' hardiest sports consumers. They are older now and getting to the Barn on those cold winter nights is more of a chore. The consistency of the entertainment has waned as the ticket prices have soared. They have been moved to corners, or up flights of stairs, as loyalty has lost all meaning to the University of Minnesota's athletic department.

And yet there still are thousands annually sending in the payment for long-held season tickets, waiting for the announcement of the non-conference schedule, and hoping against hope that this will be the year to get something resembling their money's worth in November and December.

These generational fans jumped on board with their parents, or with a favorite uncle, in the early '70s, when Bill Musselman changed everything and turned their families into lifers for Gophers basketball.

Musselman came crashing down, but things were fine with Jim Dutcher and the Barn was jumping for the next decade. Clem Haskins dug the Gophers out of a hole and became a hero to the masses. He crashed, too, and then Dan Monson was a disappointment, and Tubby Smith was a greater disappointment, and here we are ... hopeful again because a young man with a famous name is now in charge.

There are 20, 25 years worth of ticket buyers who are trained to expect nothing from the non-conference schedule in Williams Arena -- trained to pay high prices for absurd matchups for two months, while waiting for the Big Ten schedule to start.

But the extra-longtimers, the ones brought in by Musselman, or in the early years of Dutcher ... they remember Marquette coming to Williams Arena and the joint rocking like it was Indiana. They remember when 60-65 percent of the home schedule was conference games, and two or three of the non-conference games were worth parking blocks away and trudging over snow and ice to get to the Barn.

Those schedules in modern times? Old ticket buyers, young ones, in-between ... all of 'em are getting ripped off. .

Rich Pitino's first non-conference schedule was announced on Tuesday and, with slight improvement, the home portion could have been lousy.

The basics of the schedule were identical to the Tubby Smith Era:

Play the quality opponents in a late-November tournament in an exotic location. Then, line up the yawners, one after another, in Williams Arena in a December run-up to the conference season.

The visit to the Maui Classic was arranged before Tubby was fired and Pitino was hired. The first of three way out there in paradise will be against Syracuse on Nov. 25.

Fine matchup -- except a matchup in Maui doesn't do diddly for people putting Gophers' season tickets on their Visa cards.

This was the home non-conference schedule presented to the public on Tueday:

Nov. 8--Lehigh. Nov. 12--Montana. Nov. 19--Coastal Carolina. Nov. 21--Wofford.

Dec. 3--Florida State. Dec. 7--New Orleans. Dec. 10--South Dakota State. Dec. 20--Omaha. Dec. 28-Texas A&M.

Don't get too excited about that last one. This A& M is one with an addendum: --Corpus Christi.

Florida State sneaked onto the schedule because the Gophers are a home team this season in the ACC-Big Ten Challenge.

Somehow, the 'Noles end up being the Gophers' Challenge opponent about 50 percent of the time. When do we get North Carolina to come to the Barn in December to see how the other half lives?

Other notes: Lehigh doesn't have C.J. McCollum, so forget that one. South Dakota State doesn't have Nate Wolters, so forget that one.

As for the rest of the November-December schedule, the next-best attraction to Florida State might be the exhibition opener vs. Cardinal Stritch (Milwaukee) on Nov. 1. That outfit is the defending national champ in NAIA Division II. And exhibitions are still half-price, I believe.

The whole danged non-conference schedule (except for the Challenge) should be half-price. That's not happening, because Gophers baskeball fans get spanked in the pocket book every November and December, only to cringe and respond:

"Thank you, Goldy. May I have another.''

 

[matt]

I spoke to Joe Esposito, the former director of operations at Minnesota Wednesday afternoon. The current Texas Tech assistant told me that the games scheduled against Wofford (13-19), New Orleans (8-18), Nebraska-Omaha (11-20) and Texas A&M-Corpus Christi (6-23) were added since the coaching change.

Lehigh was a game that was scheduled two years ago, according to Esposito. They finished 21-10 and were ranked #107 in the RPI. They obviously lost star C.J. McCollum, who was the tenth pick in the NBA Draft by Portland.

South Dakota State has played the Gophers the past four years and has made the NCAA tournament the past two seasons. They were ranked #62 in the RPI and will play Texas Tech, according to Esposito.

Montana was ranked #74 in the RPI and made the NCAA Tournament with a 25-7 record and a 19-1 mark in the Big Sky Conference.

Coastal Carolina was 14-15 last season and is playing Minnesota as a part of a Maui Invitational deal.

The Gophers had a game scheduled with New Mexico State, which was ranked #62 in the RPI. However, they will not be playing the Aggies, a Gopher football opponent, on the hardwood this year. New Mexico State won the Western Athletic Conference Tournament and made it to the NCAA Tournament.

It appears that the Gopher basketball schedule is being done by the athletic department, most likely Mike Ellis, who is well known for his NCAA basketball contacts.

Non-conference schedules are probably never going to please fans who are paying the same price for those games as they do conference contests, but I assume that every teams fans complain about attending non-conference games against “nobodies.”

My philosophy would have be to play teams closer to Minnesota like that Dakota schools, Drake, Northern Iowa, Milwaukee, Green Bay and maybe sprinkle in a contest in a home and away with Iowa State and Marquette. I don’t mind games like Wofford, which has Minnesotan C.J. Neumann on their roster as a way that his family and friends can see him play, However, games like Texas A&M Corpus Christi and New Orleans, do little to excite me.


Chris Monter

Thanks for the info Chris.

 

[SelectionSunday]

I spoke to Joe Esposito, the former director of operations at Minnesota Wednesday afternoon. The current Texas Tech assistant told me that the games scheduled against Wofford (13-19), New Orleans (8-18), Nebraska-Omaha (11-20) and Texas A&M-Corpus Christi (6-23) were added since the coaching change.

Lehigh was a game that was scheduled two years ago, according to Esposito. They finished 21-10 and were ranked #107 in the RPI. They obviously lost star C.J. McCollum, who was the tenth pick in the NBA Draft by Portland.

South Dakota State has played the Gophers the past four years and has made the NCAA tournament the past two seasons. They were ranked #62 in the RPI and will play Texas Tech, according to Esposito.

Montana was ranked #74 in the RPI and made the NCAA Tournament with a 25-7 record and a 19-1 mark in the Big Sky Conference.

Coastal Carolina was 14-15 last season and is playing Minnesota as a part of a Maui Invitational deal.

The Gophers had a game scheduled with New Mexico State, which was ranked #62 in the RPI. However, they will not be playing the Aggies, a Gopher football opponent, on the hardwood this year. New Mexico State won the Western Athletic Conference Tournament and made it to the NCAA Tournament.

It appears that the Gopher basketball schedule is being done by the athletic department, most likely Mike Ellis, who is well known for his NCAA basketball contacts.

Non-conference schedules are probably never going to please fans who are paying the same price for those games as they do conference contests, but I assume that every teams fans complain about attending non-conference games against “nobodies.”

My philosophy would have be to play teams closer to Minnesota like that Dakota schools, Drake, Northern Iowa, Milwaukee, Green Bay and maybe sprinkle in a contest in a home and away with Iowa State and Marquette. I don’t mind games like Wofford, which has Minnesotan C.J. Neumann on their roster as a way that his family and friends can see him play, However, games like Texas A&M Corpus Christi and New Orleans, do little to excite me.


Chris Monter

Thanks Chris. Interesting stuff.

Is it your impression that Pitino backed out of the previously scheduled New Mexico State game? NMSU easily would have been the best or second best game on the Gophers' home schedule.

 

[Moonlight]

My philosophy would have be to play teams closer to Minnesota like that Dakota schools, Drake, Northern Iowa, Milwaukee, Green Bay and maybe sprinkle in a contest in a home and away with Iowa State and Marquette. I don’t mind games like Wofford, which has Minnesotan C.J. Neumann on their roster as a way that his family and friends can see him play, However, games like Texas A&M Corpus Christi and New Orleans, do little to excite me.

Chris Monter

I agree - these are team we have some knowledge of and would at least encourage some interest.

 

[XMan]

How many of you feel ripped off after wasting time reading Reusse's column? Just sayin'.

 

[golfing18now]

I can pretty close to promise you that if the season ticket renewals were due after the schedule was released, either the schedule would be much more attractive or the season ticket renewals would drop considerably.

I don't know that this is true. We certainly have precedent over the last how many years that the schedule will look something like this. You might swap a game or two, but would substituting a mid-level (Oklahoma State, Oklahoma-type) for Coastal Carolina fundamentally change your attitude about buying Gopher tickets? I will grant you that it would for that night, but overall?

 

[GopherJake]

How many of you feel ripped off after wasting time reading Reusse's column? Just sayin'.

^^^ Not a season ticket holder.