P.J. Fleck contract negotiations still ongoing - MLive

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PMWinSTP said:
Oregon never had interest, but his agent sure tried to make it seem that way. There's a reason why no P5 schools with openings took a flyer on him. Unproven. Proactively giving the stiff-arm to Cincinnati was stupid on his part.
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No it wasn't. Cincinnati is no longer as attractive as it used to be because it's in the AAC and not the Big East. Fleck can stay at Western Michigan and land a better job than Cincinnati in the coming years.
 

Dontbeadumbamerican said:
Why did I know you were going to say Jim Harbaugh as a comparison, I don't even know you but can foresee your response. I am aware this is his fourth year, my point is this is his the first year with real success, let's see if he can sustain it. Also, I want to see him coach where he doesn't have the best athletes on the field. He won't against Wisconsin and I want to see how he responds when he is getting physically beat at the line of scrimmage. Because guess what, when you coach at the U, your not going to always have the best athletes and you need to scheme.

First big test is Wisconsin, this will show what sort of coach he is. A lot of schools will be watching to see how he fairs and his value will either skyrocket or plummet.
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He won 8 games the two years before this year. Everyone loves 8 wins around here. He already matched the Gophers best victory in beating Northwestern this year.
 

Some Day...Maybe said:
Ya, Northwestern's not a test. Western Michigan has better players than both NW and Illinois right?


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I would bet and most would agree Western Michigan has comparable talent to NW and Illinois, both teams by the way MN best relatively easily with its current coaching staff. So where is the upside if we have a current coaching staff already doing what Fleck did but better? Claeys is has already started the retooling process on what he wants in his team. It took Fleck fours years to get Western Michigan to beat a decent school in NW.

Why aren't we willing to give Claeys the same opportunity in four years to beat real teams like the Wisconsin's and Nebraska's of the Big10, it's his first full year? Oh, and by the way, we were close in all those games.

But "yeah", (as you like to put it)let's **** can the program and blow it up so we can hire a guy who has had one good year and start all over...again. Genius.


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GopherWeatherGuy said:
No it wasn't. Cincinnati is no longer as attractive as it used to be because it's in the AAC and not the Big East. Fleck can stay at Western Michigan and land a better job than Cincinnati in the coming years.
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Too funny, yes it was. Big East has no football, you did know that, yes? So what powerhouse teams did the old Big East football lose when it essentially reconstituted as the AAC?

Cincinnati has launched many careers. Unless he wants to move more than a state or two away, it was the best opportunity he might have had a chance at, period.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Too funny, yes it was. Big East has no football, you did know that, yes? So what powerhouse teams did the old Big East football lose when it essentially reconstituted as the AAC?

Cincinnati has launched many careers. Unless he wants to move more than a state or two away, it was the best opportunity he might have had a chance at, period.
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Oh really I had no idea the Big East was no longer a conference. :rolleyes:

What careers has Cincinnati launched out of the AAC?

Louisville, West Virginia, Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Rutgers all left the Big East for P5 conferences. Powerhouses? Not necessarily, but they are much better programs than ECU, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, etc.

He'll have better opportunities than Cincinnati.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Oh really I had no idea the Big East was no longer a conference. :rolleyes:

What careers has Cincinnati launched out of the AAC?

Louisville, West Virginia, Pittsburgh, Syracuse, Rutgers all left the Big East for P5 conferences. Powerhouses? Not necessarily, but they are much better programs than ECU, Memphis, Tulane, SMU, etc.

He'll have better opportunities than Cincinnati.
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Wow, you make this way too easy. Butch Jones left after 2012, the year before they moved to the AAC, and they replaced him with Tommy Tuberville. You may have heard of him, he was HC at Auburn and went 85-40 there and had them ranked in the top 25 six of his 10 years. Brian Kelly, Pat Narduzzi, Mark Dantonio, Mike Tomlin...20 former players currently in the NFL.

How about you give Fickell a few years and see where he lands. Maybe PJ will get a second look at that time.
 

Dontbeadumbamerican said:
I would bet and most would agree Western Michigan has comparable talent to NW and Illinois, both teams by the way MN best relatively easily with its current coaching staff. So where is the upside if we have a current coaching staff already doing what Fleck did but better? Claeys is has already started the retooling process on what he wants in his team. It took Fleck fours years to get Western Michigan to beat a decent school in NW.

Why aren't we willing to give Claeys the same opportunity in four years to beat real teams like the Wisconsin's and Nebraska's of the Big10, it's his first full year? Oh, and by the way, we were close in all those games.

But "yeah", (as you like to put it)let's **** can the program and blow it up so we can hire a guy who has had one good year and start all over...again. Genius.


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I would love to see us give Claeys 4 years....if it were only about his ability to coach like it was 2 weeks ago. Today it is a different ballgame. A 1/2 empty stadium, probable recruiting violation, challenging recruiting with 1 decommit already, and an apparent issue with his AD and President.

If this were just about his performance as a coach, I say keep him. 2 weeks ago, it became more about the public perception of the program, which is a dumpster fire.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Wow, you make this way too easy. Butch Jones left after 2012, the year before they moved to the AAC, and they replaced him with Tommy Tuberville. You may have heard of him, he was HC at Auburn and went 85-40 there and had them ranked in the top 25 six of his 10 years. Brian Kelly, Pat Narduzzi, Mark Dantonio, Mike Tomlin...20 former players currently in the NFL.

How about you give Fickell a few years and see where he lands. Maybe PJ will get a second look at that time.
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You really struggle to comprehend don't ya? Tuberville failed. Cincinnati was a step down from his previous job. The rest of the coaches coached Cincy when it was in the Big East, a better conference than the AAC. It's not difficult to understand. Fickell already failed at Ohio St.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Too funny, yes it was. Big East has no football, you did know that, yes? So what powerhouse teams did the old Big East football lose when it essentially reconstituted as the AAC?

Cincinnati has launched many careers. Unless he wants to move more than a state or two away, it was the best opportunity he might have had a chance at, period.
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No, the AAC is not at all just a reconfiguration of the old Big East. Not only because 5 of the best teams left the conference, but because they lost their status as a "Power 5 Conference". They are on the same level as the MAC, which you seemingly trash every opportunity you get. The AAC is equal with the MAC, and if Fleck is going to jump ship from WMU, it's going to be for far bigger ponds than the ones in Cincinnati, Ohio.

– The highest-ranked conference champion from the American Athletic, Conference USA, MAC, Mountain West and Sun Belt automatically gets one spot in either the College Football Playoff or in the Cotton Bowl.
– Orange Bowl will be ACC vs. Big Ten, Big 12 or SEC
– Rose Bowl will be Big Ten vs. Pac-12
– Sugar Bowl will be Big 12 vs. SEC
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gopherveteran said:
Why would any coach risk his career by working for Coyle and Kaler?
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Boise is thriving with Coyle's hire...and not just his hire, but Coyle guided the program through NCAA sanctions that were placed on Boise just before he got there.

Kill was thriving before his health issues rose up again....multiple raises/extensions in his first four seasons under Kaler....new facilities being built despite not reaching the fundraising goal....Kill's assistant coach salary pool was top six in the Big Ten (the Mase defenders rip the previous admin for not giving him enough money to retain/hire coordinators).
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
You really struggle to comprehend don't ya? Tuberville failed. Cincinnati was a step down from his previous job. The rest of the coaches coached Cincy when it was in the Big East, a better conference than the AAC. It's not difficult to understand. Fickell already failed at Ohio St.
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Fleck is 30-24 at WMU. Tuberville was 29-22 at Cinci. I'd hate to work under your definition of failed...Fleck already has based on that definition.

Fickel makes 3 times what Fleck does, that should tell you something about the teams and the conferences.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Fleck is 30-24 at WMU. Tuberville was 29-22 at Cinci. I'd hate to work under your definition of failed...Fleck already has based on that definition.

Fickel makes 3 times what Fleck does, that should tell you something about the teams and the conferences.
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Tuberville had Cincy trending down. Fleck has Western Michigan trending up. Once again a very easy concept that most people understand...

Fleck is due for a pay raise and Fickell made nearly as much as Fleck at Ohio St. He wasn't going to take the same amount of money to go to Cincinnati.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Fleck is 30-24 at WMU. Tuberville was 29-22 at Cinci. I'd hate to work under your definition of failed...Fleck already has based on that definition.

Fickel makes 3 times what Fleck does, that should tell you something about the teams and the conferences.
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You're kidding right? Tuberville took over a team that was 10-3 and had five 10 win seasons in the previous six years including Orange and Sugar Bowl appearances.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Tuberville had Cincy trending down. Fleck has Western Michigan trending up. Once again a very easy concept that most people understand...

Fleck is due for a pay raise and Fickell made nearly as much as Fleck at Ohio St. He wasn't going to take the same amount of money to go to Cincinnati.
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Easy to trend up when you win one game your first year. You probably should have looked at Tuberville's salary. Heck look at all the salaries in the AAC. FLeck by far has the highest overall comp in the MAC, and that is basically double what he was making before the last redo a couple years ago. You honestly think WMU can find substantially more $$ to pay him?
 

Maximus said:
You're kidding right? Tuberville took over a team that was 10-3 and had five 10 win seasons in the previous six years including Orange and Sugar Bowl appearances.
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Was waiting for that type of response from someone, thanks. You prove my point that Cinci is a very good HC position/program and a big step up from WMU. Thanks again.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Was waiting for that type of response from someone, thanks. You prove my point that Cinci is a very good HC position/program and a big step up from WMU. Thanks again.
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This isn't the first time you've shown that you are clueless. Thanks again for proving that point.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Was waiting for that type of response from someone, thanks. You prove my point that Cinci is a very good HC position/program and a big step up from WMU. Thanks again.
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Cincinnati was a big step up from WMU, when they were in the Big East (the years that Maximus is referring to in the post you quoted). Cincinnati in C-USA was a low-level program that didn't do much of anything. Cincinnati in the Big East won a lot of games and turned out Mark Dantonio, Brian Kelly, and Butch Jones. They're now in the AAC, a slightly better conference than C-USA but a fairly big drop from the Big East. Now it is a very small step up from WMU and not worth moving from a 13-0 team playing in a NYD bowl to a team that won 4 games and lost by 3-4 TDs against every decent team they played. To put it in perspective, using Sagarin ratings, WMU would be about a 26-point favorite over Cincinnati on a neutral field if they played today. Why would anyone pursue that opportunity in Fleck's current circumstances?
 

PMWinSTP said:
Was waiting for that type of response from someone, thanks. You prove my point that Cinci is a very good HC position/program and a big step up from WMU. Thanks again.
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You're welcome! The six years I referenced in a BCS conference with a BCS bowl bid on the line (the same as Ohio State and Oklahoma and Florida State) vs. present when Cincinnati is competing with WMU and 50 plus other schools for one spot in a group of six bowl game....Yep, nothing's changed in the Queen City!
 

Maximus said:
You're welcome! The six years I referenced in a BCS conference with a BCS bowl bid on the line (the same as Ohio State and Oklahoma and Florida State) vs. present when Cincinnati is competing with WMU and 50 plus other schools for one spot in a group of six bowl game....Yep, nothing's changed in the Queen City!
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Yep, same one's I referenced. So argue one side to say Tuberville screwed it up and then the opposite side to say the program and conference is not clearly at a different level compared to WMU and the MAC. GH logic at it's best.

Guess that's why they hired Fickell and paid him 3 times what the highest paid HC (by a long shot) in the MAC is paid.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Yep, same one's I referenced. So argue one side to say Tuberville screwed it up and then the opposite side to say the program and conference is not clearly at a different level compared to WMU and the MAC. GH logic at it's best.

Guess that's why they hired Fickell and paid him 3 times what the highest paid HC (by a long shot) in the MAC is paid.
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Do you realize that programs aren't always as good as they once were? No one is arguing that Cincy was a clear cut better job when Tuberville took over. But since then, they've been relegated to an inferior conference, played lesser teams on a regular basis, and lost MANY more games per year. That job is no where near what is used to be. Not sure why you can't grasp that.

By your logic, the Purdue job must be a better job than Wisconsin and Nebraska, being they paid their coach more, right?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
This isn't the first time you've shown that you are clueless. Thanks again for proving that point.
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Have you sent PJF a Holiday card yet? If not, you are running out of time.


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