***OFFICIAL wisconsin AT MINNESOTA IN-GAME THREAD!!!***

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CPTMidnight said:
To win, we needed 3 more points, or to allow 3 less points, or some combination thereof.

1 shot made or 1 shot defended vs. the leader in the B10 conference.

Beyond that it seems a little asinine to point out specific play calling or coaching strategy or "i'm tired of this" or "we should have done that". The sum of the effort was a loss by a bucket and an exciting game. Its on the players and to a greater extent Ben (and to an even greater extent Coyle & company).

That being said I still feel like there is a winning streak in them yet this year.
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Every possession matters against Wisconsin. Players threw some away, Ben threw some away. I think wisco threw fewer away. I think it’s perfectly valid to look at head scratching playcalling when it’s only coming from one bench.
 


Payne looked to be in pain most of the second half and seemed to limp when transitioning up the court. Not sure if anything was mentioned on the telecast.
 

MaxyJR1 said:
Payne looked to be in pain most of the second half and seemed to limp when transitioning up the court. Not sure if anything was mentioned on the telecast.
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Yeah, they mentioned his back
 


CentralGopher said:
When Hawkins is driving and Payne steps out about 3 feet further passing to him is not in the game plan and inexcusable. Also, passing your him when he is about 7-9 feet from the hoop and surrounded by three Wisconsin players is inexcusable. Setting a screen at the top of the key is game plan and used to help facilitate moving the ball and get matchups they like. The rest is just horsecrap play.
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The only guy that sets the pick and rolls to the basket is Fox. Others may do it but at there own speed which is worthless. Maybe it's by design but setting those top of key picks and just standing there doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
 

bc2211 said:
Every possession matters against Wisconsin. Players threw some away, Ben threw some away. I think wisco threw fewer away. I think it’s perfectly valid to look at head scratching playcalling when it’s only coming from one bench.
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Im just sayin you can point to 50 things done differently and any single one wins us the game. The bigger issue these days is how does Ben light a fire before the game (instead of at halftime) so that we are not spotting 10 points each game.

Does any of this remind you guys of Pitino from back in the day - same thing? You bring these young coaches in and they lack skills in the hardest part - the mental side of the game. 18-20 year old's are unprepared mentally when they hit the court and when it is crunch time. This is Ben's big weakness right now - not recruiting or drawing up a single play.
 

CPTMidnight said:
Im just sayin you can point to 50 things done differently and any single one wins us the game. The bigger issue these days is how does Ben light a fire before the game (instead of at halftime) so that we are not spotting 10 points each game.

Does any of this remind you guys of Pitino from back in the day - same thing? You bring these young coaches in and they lack skills in the hardest part - the mental side of the game. 18-20 year old's are unprepared mentally when they hit the court and when it is crunch time. This is Ben's big weakness right now - not recruiting or drawing up a single play.
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Maybe that's right, not sure. I like Ben and have been accused of being an "apologist" at times as I do want to see him make it. Of all of the offensive schemes I have seen this year- his is the worst in my view. The whole thing depends on Hawkins breaking someone down or getting hot from 3 point range. It's not team ball. Oh we racked up a lot of assists against the little teams so it looks statistically like we generate team play...I just don't see that happening in Big Ten play while I do see the other teams doing it to us.

But to your point- we did have a great second half against Nebraska, a really good second half against Wisconsin, a good second half against OSU, a good second half against Michigan and also against Maryland. So there is that. For me it speaks to the guys not giving up and for me Hawkins is the heart of this team.
 





jovs said:
The only guy that sets the pick and rolls to the basket is Fox. Others may do it but at there own speed which is worthless. Maybe it's by design but setting those top of key picks and just standing there doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
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Pitino's teams did that, too.
 

MUgopher32 said:
So....basically youre just adding to why Ben stinks.

He cant recruit shooters and he cant draw up plays or an offense to mitigate that.

Do you have any clue how basketball works?? Haha. Teams win games all the time shooting horrendously at the line. Sometimes barely, sometimes by a lot. Then win games with inconsistent halves shooting the ball too.

That is where coaching comes in. Every post you make seems to imply that all the teams with well regarded coaches actually just shoot well and their coach stood on the sidlines as a mute.

Beard never drew anything up at Texas Tech. Painter does no coaching at Texas. Tommy Lloyd walked into Zona and was fortunate to have players who only make shots.

Im genuinely curious, I dont want to make assumptions. But you are aware that coaches can draw up offensive sets/plays/concepts more efficient looks right? Like the coach isnt required to just sit in a seat and pray Mike Mitchell nails 30 footers. You are aware of that right?
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If you check my original response to this, I said the most important aspect of a coach's job is bringing in talent. The most desired talent is shooting and scoring.

You are quite stupid to ramble on and on as if no one knows there are some coaches who are better in-game, better in teaching a scheme, and better at motivating than others. We know that, crackpipe.

And yet you will bleat again that Beard, Painter, and Lloyd are casual about recruiting talent -- don't even care -- because they are so smart they can draw up a play that any five guys can run like wizzards. Idiot.
 

bc2211 said:
61 was a winnable game.

But not all on players. Rewatch the play of Mitchell dribbling out of bounds (assuming you are talking about play resuming after the under 8). The play that was drawn up was ridiculous. Mitchell runs off picks in two circles then sprints away from the hoop towards the sideline through an elevator screen. Any shot off of that play would have been off balance with a high degree of difficulty. Badgers took the ball down the court and had a wide open look from 3 like 7 seconds into the shot clock. This is why Minnesota loses games and Wisconsin wins them. Call it execution if you want, but CBJ isn’t putting his guys in positions to be successful.
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So it's your belief that the end objective of Mitchell going here and there was to have him shoot an off balance shot while falling off the floor? That was the whole thing they drew up? If you're right, it's a good thing he was standing out of bounds.
 




Dakota2 said:
If you check my original response to this, I said the most important aspect of a coach's job is bringing in talent. The most desired talent is shooting and scoring.

You are quite stupid to ramble on and on as if no one knows there are some coaches who are better in-game, better in teaching a scheme, and better at motivating than others. We know that, crackpipe.

And yet you will bleat again that Beard, Painter, and Lloyd are casual about recruiting talent -- don't even care -- because they are so smart they can draw up a play that any five guys can run like wizzards. Idiot.
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You really are daft. Its incredible really.

Looking around it appears I am not the only one that has to explain basketball for you.

But yes youre right, any time a team misses shots. Coach is exempt. Your words not mine. Idiot
 

MUgopher32 said:
So....basically youre just adding to why Ben stinks.

He cant recruit shooters and he cant draw up plays or an offense to mitigate that.

Do you have any clue how basketball works?? Haha. Teams win games all the time shooting horrendously at the line. Sometimes barely, sometimes by a lot. Then win games with inconsistent halves shooting the ball too.

That is where coaching comes in. Every post you make seems to imply that all the teams with well regarded coaches actually just shoot well and their coach stood on the sidlines as a mute.

Beard never drew anything up at Texas Tech. Painter does no coaching at Texas. Tommy Lloyd walked into Zona and was fortunate to have players who only make shots.

Im genuinely curious, I dont want to make assumptions. But you are aware that coaches can draw up offensive sets/plays/concepts more efficient looks right? Like the coach isnt required to just sit in a seat and pray Mike Mitchell nails 30 footers. You are aware of that right?
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I am missing the Painter part. On Beard, he is two jobs beyond Texas Tech but yes, doing great at Ole Miss. Unreal coaching actually.
 



CPTMidnight said:
That being said I still feel like there is a winning streak in them yet this year.
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I would define a winning streak as 3 in a row. I have a hard time envisioning this team winning 3 straight in the “meat” of the Big Ten schedule. The Gophers don’t protect their home court very well, and we’re all aware of the historical road struggles.

Hope they prove me wrong, starting Saturday in Sleepy Valley, the least daunting atmosphere in the Big Ten.
 
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SelectionSunday said:
Sleepy Valley, the least daunting atmosphere in the Big Ten.
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This is true, and it’s not even close. At least it’s a weekend game - those late weekday games with the stands a quarter filled are so weird that it’s actually hard to play there.
 

bc2211 said:
61 was a winnable game.

But not all on players. Rewatch the play of Mitchell dribbling out of bounds (assuming you are talking about play resuming after the under 8). The play that was drawn up was ridiculous. Mitchell runs off picks in two circles then sprints away from the hoop towards the sideline through an elevator screen. Any shot off of that play would have been off balance with a high degree of difficulty. Badgers took the ball down the court and had a wide open look from 3 like 7 seconds into the shot clock. This is why Minnesota loses games and Wisconsin wins them. Call it execution if you want, but CBJ isn’t putting his guys in positions to be successful.
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Agree that if the play was to shoot from that position, going against momentum to sideline, it would have been tough. Not sure it was designed for him to shoot from there. Probably not imo. His angles were bad. Who knows? It was well defended but Mitchell was sped up and botched it. It is strange how after watching MD go into Iowa and win, this game has stuck with me as a hugely lost home opportunity. Need to get right tonight and all will be forgiven. Go Gophs.
 


jovs said:
Trying to get a shooter a 3 pt shot is my guess. Have to be pretty good to get shots off a screen like that though.
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I just remember passes being available for easy baskets and the ball handler didn't seem to even think of making the pass. I was always like, WTF.
 

SplitDecision said:
Agree that if the play was to shoot from that position, going against momentum to sideline, it would have been tough. Not sure it was designed for him to shoot from there. Probably not imo. His angles were bad. Who knows? It was well defended but Mitchell was sped up and botched it. It is strange how after watching MD go into Iowa and win, this game has stuck with me as a hugely lost home opportunity. Need to get right tonight and all will be forgiven. Go Gophs.
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Perhaps he wasn’t going to shoot. I just haven’t seen elevator screens used to put someone in a corner like that out of an inbounds very often. Just a lot of planning to get Mitchell the ball in a tough spot. And it looked worse when wisco gets exactly what they want on the very next play.

Also kudos for not responding in an adversarial way.
 

Heartbreaking loss. I was there, so watched the DVR replay last night before watching N’W’s amazing overtime win vs Illini. We played good enough to win. Obviously, horrible shooting in the first half, but great D and tremendous shooting in the 2nd. Yes, some silly mistakes. Badgers had some, too. Bottom line: we make 70-80% of our free throws, we win. Need to hit the free throws, and I know both Garcia and Carrington normally do.
 
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Go4POV said:
Heartbreaking loss. I was there, so watched the DVR replay last night before watching N’W’s amazing overtime win vs Illini. We played good enough to win. Obviously, horrible shooting in the first half, but great D and tremendous shooting in the 2nd. Yes, some silly mistakes. Badgers had some, too. Bottom line: we make 70-80% of our free throws, we win. Need to hit the free throws, and I know both Garcia and Carrington normally do.
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Finally was able to watch the game. First half we just didn't play well and Wisconsin took it to us. But we didn't fold and kept it within striking distance. The second half was much better, just didn't very many good plays (both offensively and defensively) down the stretch. FT shooting killed any chance to win that game.
One question for everyone, late in the second half Mitchell had it on the wing and Payne set a screen to free him some towards the baseline where he was cut off and made a pass back to Payne, who got called for traveling right at the rim. I don't think he did. Anyone else think that? (I'm not saying the refs cost us the game, just want to know what others thought of that particular call)
 

GFBfan said:
Finally was able to watch the game. First half we just didn't play well and Wisconsin took it to us. But we didn't fold and kept it within striking distance. The second half was much better, just didn't very many good plays (both offensively and defensively) down the stretch. FT shooting killed any chance to win that game.
One question for everyone, late in the second half Mitchell had it on the wing and Payne set a screen to free him some towards the baseline where he was cut off and made a pass back to Payne, who got called for traveling right at the rim. I don't think he did. Anyone else think that? (I'm not saying the refs cost us the game, just want to know what others thought of that particular call)
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I only saw it once live, but I thought immediately he traveled. Caught it and right away took off without dribbling.

Thats what I saw live.
 

GFBfan said:
Finally was able to watch the game. First half we just didn't play well and Wisconsin took it to us. But we didn't fold and kept it within striking distance. The second half was much better, just didn't very many good plays (both offensively and defensively) down the stretch. FT shooting killed any chance to win that game.
One question for everyone, late in the second half Mitchell had it on the wing and Payne set a screen to free him some towards the baseline where he was cut off and made a pass back to Payne, who got called for traveling right at the rim. I don't think he did. Anyone else think that? (I'm not saying the refs cost us the game, just want to know what others thought of that particular call)
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I didn’t see the travel either. In fact, it felt like they blew the whistle before he even had a chance to do anything.
 

MUgopher32 said:
I only saw it once live, but I thought immediately he traveled. Caught it and right away took off without dribbling.

Thats what I saw live.
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I thought he was moving before he caught the ball, that is why I thought it wasn't traveling.
 


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