***OFFICIAL DEPAUL AT MINNESOTA IN-GAME THREAD!!!***

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Bob_Loblaw said:
Ugh, that was a tough one.

I know it's probably not going to happen, but I think we'd actually rebound better with Battle at 4. Garcia does some things well, but he is getting us killed on the boards.
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Don’t think it’s going to happen either.

I’m in the minority, because Payne did flush a few down offensively and everyone loves that, but Payne really, really needs to pick it up on the boards. Unfortunately he needs to do it in a hurry.
 

When does this team get Battle back? Is there a timeline after the surgery? I thought I read week to week. Anyone heard?
 

XMan said:
When does this team get Battle back? Is there a timeline after the surgery? I thought I read week to week. Anyone heard?
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I thought I heard the TV announcers say last night that Ben was hopeful to get him back after Thanksgiving
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Ugh, that was a tough one.

I know it's probably not going to happen, but I think we'd actually rebound better with Battle at 4. Garcia does some things well, but he is getting us killed on the boards.
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I can't put my figure on it, but something worries me about Garcia. It sticks in my mind that at NC on a great team they didn't seem to feel too bad about losing him. Will he dig and play hard at both ends or is he just looking for his numbers on offense? He's got a ton of talent.
 



fan of Ray Williams said:
Don’t think it’s going to happen either.

I’m in the minority, because Payne did flush a few down offensively and everyone loves that, but Payne really, really needs to pick it up on the boards. Unfortunately he needs to do it in a hurry.
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We have a lot more size and strength inside than last year and are way worse in rebounding. Terrible position. Appearance of not working hard on defense and probably not knowing what is going on.

I’m struggling to find a silver lining in getting waxed by a bottom feeding Big East program.
 

gopherguy15 said:
At the game tonight and I gotta say this... that was the worst attended Gopher student section I've ever seen for a Power-6 opponent. My family has had season tickets my whole life, so I have many games to reference back to. Weather wasn't bad at game time, so that can't be an excuse for all those on campus. Students, I hope some of you are reading this post. Get out there and support your team.
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The basketball team has been bad for 25 years and it’s a crappy arena with high priced tickets. No wonder not a lot of students show up. They are an afterthought on campus.
 

bga1 said:
I can't put my figure on it, but something worries me about Garcia. It sticks in my mind that at NC on a great team they didn't seem to feel too bad about losing him. Will he dig and play hard at both ends or is he just looking for his numbers on offense? He's got a ton of talent.
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Hes very weak and lacks any semblance of vertical athletic ability. For two years hes had 6"2 guys swatting him from behind in the paint cause he cant elevate.

That is not to say hes trash though. He has gifted skills and can shoot well for a college big. Hes just going to be very inconsistent and if you are banking on him getting gritty in the paint, you will be left disappointed.

Having battle should hlep him though. Will create a little more space.

I said it when we were first looking likely to get Dawson, he will be a very welcome addition but any gopher fan who thinks that Dawson and Battle at the 4/5 for extended periods is a good idea, should be examined immediately.

Luckily I think Payne will be the starting 5 by the time battle is back and Garcia/Battle will be the 3/4.
 
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bga1 said:
I can't put my figure on it, but something worries me about Garcia. It sticks in my mind that at NC on a great team they didn't seem to feel too bad about losing him. Will he dig and play hard at both ends or is he just looking for his numbers on offense? He's got a ton of talent.
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Garcia appears to be "soft" and not able to contend with stronger and quicker players. I posted this before but Purdue's Williams totally destroyed him last year. Garcia had no chance. Sure he can do some good things with the ball, but his D and rebounding will be an issue this season.

I still believe that BJ will be forced to play mostly zone with this squad as they lack quickness and strength.
 



MNMaroonMom said:
I thought I heard the TV announcers say last night that Ben was hopeful to get him back after Thanksgiving
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Oh, Lord, so three more games without him at the very least. I would guess that he probably doesn't play in the VA Tech game on 11/28 either. Next game after that is Purdue on 12/4 so maybe he's ready then.
 

This team better hope that Tre Holloman ends up hating MSU and gets homesick so we can get a real point guardwith NBA athleticism / speed. Enough with the slow / chunky guards who can’t create for themselves / their teammates by collapsing the other teams defenses.

I don’t know the player’s name, but it looks like we have Andre Miller (current 50 year old ymca version) playing for us.
 

Garcia did have 26 and 8 verse the Purdue front court… when Battle comes back you will see Garcia around the bucket more. Battle will help create space for him… he struggled yesterday BIG time.. on the perimeter too much… Garcia has a little half hook he is decent down low.
 




Wet_Blanket_Guy said:
This team better hope that Tre Holloman ends up hating MSU and gets homesick so we can get a real point guardwith NBA athleticism / speed. Enough with the slow / chunky guards who can’t create for themselves / their teammates by collapsing the other teams defenses.

I don’t know the player’s name, but it looks like we have Andre Miller (current 50 year old ymca version) playing for us.
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Andre Miller was WAC player of the year in 1999,consensus first team All-American and had his number retired. His NBA career featured - 17 seasons and he sits 11th all time for career assists.

I’ll take that him any day - ridiculous comp.
en.m.wikipedia.org

Andre Miller - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

Cooper if anything needs to shoot more threes, he hit 2-4 last night and has a nice release. He had 10 pts, 6 assists, 4 boards & 3 TOs. He is not the issue.

If you or anyone else didn’t expect some rough patches with Battle out and the Freshman getting their feet wet, then I question your understanding of how sports function and the concept of patience.

PS - your moniker is spot on- so you got that going for you Carl.
 

Holy Man said:
I’m struggling to find a silver lining in getting waxed by a bottom feeding Big East program.
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Well, we'll have to see if DePaul is that bad this season. They do have a lot of experience (heavily reliant on seasoned transfers), athleticism, and intensity.

Last season we started strong with a very seasoned group of transfers but you had to suspect that success wasn't sustainable and it proved not to be. This season we're taking lumps right away as a result of youth and missing a key player. Last night was the first time I saw the team and, in some ways, I prefer watching this developmental season over last year. Payne and Ola Joseph need more development but their physical ability and attitude are very welcome. Henley also looks like he will be good in time. Carrington was mostly a non-entity last night but many around here rave about him so I guess we'll see something good sooner or later.

Assuming Battle comes back healthy, we'll have a nucleus of three solid veterans. Cooper looks like he has what it takes to be a capable point guard in the league and he will have more to work with once we have a full team and the freshmen are better acclimated. That may not be enough to elevate us above the bottom four but it can be a compelling journey to follow anyway.
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy said:
This team better hope that Tre Holloman ends up hating MSU and gets homesick so we can get a real point guardwith NBA athleticism / speed. Enough with the slow / chunky guards who can’t create for themselves / their teammates by collapsing the other teams defenses.

I don’t know the player’s name, but it looks like we have Andre Miller (current 50 year old ymca version) playing for us.
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Wut? Cooper is pretty solid. He has a few boneheaded passes from time to time but overall he's going to be an asset for this team.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
Andre Miller was WAC player of the year in 1999,consensus first team All-American and had his number retired. His NBA career featured - 17 seasons and he sits 11th all time for career assists.

I’ll take that him any day - ridiculous comp.
en.m.wikipedia.org

Andre Miller - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

Cooper if anything needs to shoot more threes, he hit 2-4 last night and has a nice release. He had 10 pts, 6 assists, 4 boards & 3 TOs. He is not the issue.

If you or anyone else didn’t expect some rough patches with Battle out and the Freshman getting their feet wet, then I question your understanding of how sports function and the concept of patience.

PS - your moniker is spot on- so you got that going for you Carl.
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Andre Miller was absolutely wonderful. My favorite NBA team is the Sixers and I felt like crying when they let him go after his three season stint with the team earlier this century. He's one of the first people I think of when that cliche "He makes his teammates better" comes to mind.
 

First time getting to watch cooper i was not as impressed as i had hoped. Now 1 game vs an exp P5 PG in Gibson is tough, but I saw a lot of Carr griping and not being real engaged on either end. This team BADLY needs a team first PG who can lead the young guys. Andre Miller is a great comp, not flashy but in game can get guys good shots and when a JOJ or Henley toss up a terrible shot he can just quietly go over and talk with them. Again, one game, but I saw a PG last night who was upset he wasn't getting his stats.
 

leib0039 said:
First time getting to watch cooper i was not as impressed as i had hoped. Now 1 game vs an exp P5 PG in Gibson is tough, but I saw a lot of Carr griping and not being real engaged on either end. This team BADLY needs a team first PG who can lead the young guys. Andre Miller is a great comp, not flashy but in game can get guys good shots and when a JOJ or Henley toss up a terrible shot he can just quietly go over and talk with them. Again, one game, but I saw a PG last night who was upset he wasn't getting his stats.
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Agree on Cooper.
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy said:
This team better hope that Tre Holloman ends up hating MSU and gets homesick so we can get a real point guardwith NBA athleticism / speed. Enough with the slow / chunky guards who can’t create for themselves / their teammates by collapsing the other teams defenses.

I don’t know the player’s name, but it looks like we have Andre Miller (current 50 year old ymca version) playing for us.
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Holloman is getting a few minutes here and there for MSU, not like he's sitting on the bench and looking to leave, yet. Andre Miller? Probably the most underrated point guard in nba history to go along with his college career that was better than any Gopher PG ever... terrible comp.
 

Taking it in from my seats in 101, I thought the biggest issue last night was rebounding. DePaul played like men and we looked like boys on the glass. Henley and JOJ struggled, going up against bigger athletes, but JOJ showed some more fight in the second half. Their shooting guard Gibson did a good job getting down hill, whetner it was Cooper, Carrington, Henley Ramburg or JOJ no one could stay in front of him. Carrington's shot was off, but honestly I think he was rusty, showed some good poise and has a quick trigger with it, think he will be pretty reliable for us. Garcia and Cooper definitely had to earn there's last night, Dawson had a hard 19 pints, Cooper has to be better at the free throw line, can't be a PG and go 2 of 9. When we were trying to rally, we cut it to eight, but there were a lot of missed free throws that killed that rally, they're FREE!, gotta capitalize, especially when you're trailing. Clearly, without Battle this is a brutal out fit against high majors, I don't think it's fair to completely write them off until we see what the roles look like with Battle in there. While I appreciate Ramburg's fight and wouldn't have a problem seeing him for a first half rotation, 27-30 minutes of him is 4v 5 on offense and just night and day compared to 36+ minutes of Battle. Also if Treyton can't figure it out rebounding, he's going to be an end of the bench guy when Evans gets here, Betts is no longer red shirting and if Fox gets healthy. Gotta figure it out sooner or he's not going to have the opportunity later.
 

Wet_Blanket_Guy said:
This team better hope that Tre Holloman ends up hating MSU and gets homesick so we can get a real point guardwith NBA athleticism / speed. Enough with the slow / chunky guards who can’t create for themselves / their teammates by collapsing the other teams defenses.

I don’t know the player’s name, but it looks like we have Andre Miller (current 50 year old ymca version) playing for us.
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Ben loves the potential of Christie at the point.
 

Roland Brooks said:
Garcia needs to play from the elbow in and then step out for a few threes
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Coach Johnson is running a 4 out, 1 in motion offense, which is why he's often around the perimeter when Payne and Thompson are in the game.
 

Dupreefor3 said:
Taking it in from my seats in 101, I thought the biggest issue last night was rebounding. DePaul played like men and we looked like boys on the glass. Henley and JOJ struggled, going up against bigger athletes, but JOJ showed some more fight in the second half. Their shooting guard Gibson did a good job getting down hill, whetner it was Cooper, Carrington, Henley Ramburg or JOJ no one could stay in front of him.
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We had trouble staying in front of St Olaf's guards. Every team so far has beaten us off the dribble.
Dupreefor3 said:
Carrington's shot was off, but honestly I think he was rusty, showed some good poise and has a quick trigger with it, think he will be pretty reliable for us.
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Yep
Dupreefor3 said:
Garcia and Cooper definitely had to earn there's last night, Dawson had a hard 19 pints, Cooper has to be better at the free throw line, can't be a PG and go 2 of 9. When we were trying to rally, we cut it to eight, but there were a lot of missed free throws that killed that rally, they're FREE!, gotta capitalize, especially when you're trailing. Clearly, without Battle this is a brutal out fit against high majors, I don't think it's fair to completely write them off until we see what the roles look like with Battle in there. While I appreciate Ramburg's fight and wouldn't have a problem seeing him for a first half rotation, 27-30 minutes of him is 4v 5 on offense and just night and day compared to 36+ minutes of Battle. Also if Treyton can't figure it out rebounding, he's going to be an end of the bench guy when Evans gets here, Betts is no longer red shirting and if Fox gets healthy. Gotta figure it out sooner or he's not going to have the opportunity later.
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I think it is going to boil down to 7 guys consistently:

Payne
Garcia/Ola Joseph
Battle
Henley/Carrington
Cooper

Ramberg, Samuels and Thompson are 5-10 minute guys depending upon foul trouble

The whole look of this would have changed with Ihnen and Fox. I think they would have played big and gone zone on defense with Battle at the 2 and all of the extra depth at the forward position.

Ben obviously wanted to win, but not in a do or die way last night. I think he was okay with taking the L or he wouldn't have player Ramberg 27 minutes and Samuels also got some run. I am done with the Thompson starting experiment...
 

bga1 said:
I can't put my figure on it, but something worries me about Garcia. It sticks in my mind that at NC on a great team they didn't seem to feel too bad about losing him. Will he dig and play hard at both ends or is he just looking for his numbers on offense? He's got a ton of talent.
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I think he is a skilled guy but he is going to be a liability playing next to young C's. He has enough talent where you can definitely hide his shortcomings around experienced bigs (I think he'd be a valuable player once we have Evans, Payne is a bit older, and Fox).

But we're going to struggle inside this year, likely more than last year. I really hope Ben plays Battle significant minutes at the 4 but I don't think it'll happen.
 

bga1 said:
Indeed it does. That said, last year's team looked great in the non-conference games. I'd rather have this team 10 times over.
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I didn't get a chance to watch, but was following on Live Stats. 7 minute scoring drought in first half and free throws seemed to be the real killers offensively. The inability to clear rebounds on defense. 2 of those 3 things are typically an issue for young teams dealing with inexperience and inconsistency.

As the game was winding down, all I could think of was last year's game against Mississippi State where our transfers, with about 20 years of game experience, looked like a well-oiled machine in mid-season form and picked up a surprising early season win. Last night, we were in the opposite situation against a team filled with somewhat experienced transfers.

Short term, this will likely be a tough season, especially when we get to January. But I'm taking the long view and I'm still IN on this club. Will they be improved and competing (if not actually competitive) in Feb.? That will be something to watch for. Then we add more good players to the guys with a year under their belt. The term "Work in Progress" comes to mind.
 

bga1 said:
We had trouble staying in front of St Olaf's guards. Every team so far has beaten us off the dribble.

Yep

I think it is going to boil down to 7 guys consistently:

Payne
Garcia/Ola Joseph
Battle
Henley/Carrington
Cooper

Ramberg, Samuels and Thompson are 5-10 minute guys depending upon foul trouble

The whole look of this would have changed with Ihnen and Fox. I think they would have played big and gone zone on defense with Battle at the 2 and all of the extra depth at the forward position.

Ben obviously wanted to win, but not in a do or die way last night. I think he was okay with taking the L or he wouldn't have player Ramberg 27 minutes and Samuels also got some run. I am done with the Thompson starting experiment...
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Yeah, it's too bad we didn't get to see this team with those two guys. They are precisely what we are missing.

It'll be a fun year to watch the young guys play.
 


Chico Gopher said:
I didn't get a chance to watch, but was following on Live Stats. 7 minute scoring drought in first half and free throws seemed to be the real killers offensively. The inability to clear rebounds on defense. 2 of those 3 things are typically an issue for young teams dealing with inexperience and inconsistency.

As the game was winding down, all I could think of was last year's game against Mississippi State where our transfers, with about 20 years of game experience, looked like a well-oiled machine in mid-season form and picked up a surprising early season win. Last night, we were in the opposite situation against a team filled with somewhat experienced transfers.

Short term, this will likely be a tough season, especially when we get to January. But I'm taking the long view and I'm still IN on this club. Will they be improved and competing (if not actually competitive) in Feb.? That will be something to watch for. Then we add more good players to the guys with a year under their belt. The term "Work in Progress" comes to mind.
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Yep, we looked young last night. It was a lot of little things too. Like Willis was really good at putting himself into position to get a pass from the post.

We are more skilled and athletic this year, but the lack of experience is glaring. We also have a massive lack of grit. Even a guy like Loewe was kind of a pest and played hard on defense.
 


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