NCAA Tournament team?

[WanderingGopher]

I think you make the point about the actual talent on the team.

Based on how the conference appears this season yes the could make the NCAA tournament but I don't think that should be expected.

Mason and Morris good players added to the talent that returned but overall looks like a team that is talented enough to win the NIT again.

I don't think this makes sense. A team talented enough to win the NIT one year, that returns 5 of its top 6 players (and the sixth being at least adequately replaced thus far) the next year, should be expected to improve enough to at least make the tourney.

We added two good players to last year's core. The problem is that the guys who returned have not (at least against the high level competition) performed any better than they did last year. Arguably worse. That's unexpected.

 

[John Galt]

With the excitement this board had over winning the NIT last year, I'm surprised that's not the goal...

 

[cjbfbp]

I don't think this makes sense. A team talented enough to win the NIT one year, that returns 5 of its top 6 players (and the sixth being at least adequately replaced thus far) the next year, should be expected to improve enough to at least make the tourney.

We added two good players to last year's core. The problem is that the guys who returned have not (at least against the high level competition) performed any better than they did last year. Arguably worse. That's unexpected.

Definitely agree with the first statement (although I still think I'd rather have Austin), not so much the second. I reserve judgment on the conference season play until I see a little more. Remember that we started off at home last year and started on the road this year and one of those games was against what looks like the second best team in the conference. As far as returning players improving I think on the whole they have. DeAndre was inconsistent earlier in the season last year as well but he's been mostly good this year despite some down games. Mo is much better, Joey is better, Buggs is better, Eliason is no worse and he is fouling less. Andre is not better but I don't think he is much worse.

 

[march madness]

memory refresher.

I agree about the B1G schedule start, last year we lost at home to Michigan by 3, won by 3 at home to Purdue, then won by 3 at Penn St. We start at Purdue, @ #12 Maryland, and at home against Ohio ST. The only ranked team we play is Wisconsin the rest of the year! let's try and be patient! Michigan ST and Michigan are definitely down from last year.

Remember that we started off at home last year and started on the road this year and one of those games was against what looks like the second best team in the conference. As far as returning players improving I think on the whole they have. DeAndre was inconsistent earlier in the season last year as well but he's been mostly good this year despite some down games. Mo is much better, Joey is better, Buggs is better, Eliason is no worse and he is fouling less. Andre is not better but I don't think he is much worse.

 

[gogopher]

Gonna be tough,hopefully NIT champ title holds a lot of weight

 

[SelectionSunday]

Gonna be tough,hopefully NIT champ title holds a lot of weight

The one title in sports no team wants to defend.

 

[Ope3]

Rest of the way

I agree about the B1G schedule start, last year we lost at home to Michigan by 3, won by 3 at home to Purdue, then won by 3 at Penn St. We start at Purdue, @ #12 Maryland, and at home against Ohio ST. The only ranked team we play is Wisconsin the rest of the year! let's try and be patient! Michigan ST and Michigan are definitely down from last year.

Playing only 1 more ranked team the rest of the year is a problem when one's nonconference resume is devoid of any signature wins.

 

[60's Guy]

right now we have one player playing well - MO! Andre cant shoot - I thought our guards were one of the best in the conference but they have been mediocre or worse. Joey had a nice 3 before half but missed 3 straight to help us lose that momentum in the 2nd half... We give up too many 3's, miss too many fts and foul too much. And I just hate it when we talk about how hard it is to win on the road. There have been lots of road victories already. Losing at Purdue will haunt us this year.

Yup. And when you EMPHASIZE Home games you have to be an idiot not to question winning on the road. Just play the game. Where doesn't matter. The difference home or away truly is what you make it. If you don't think is any difference, there isn't. Focus on home gamea and you're gonna lose road games. jmo

And let me add: Our non-conference schedule did not help us improve one tiny bit. You learn from adversity. We had it twice and lost.
The other games were not helpful other than to record wins.

 

[60's Guy]

I hear ya, and I don't necessarily disagree, but don't you think players should get better from one year to the next?

Compare it to baseball...guys have career years. Maybe Mathieu had his last year? Maybe he finds himself? He was team MVP last year! I don't think he'd get a vote right now? Andre has proven he is inconsistent. Players should get better and all I know for sure is high school players...they very often do not. Look at lots of teams over 3-4 year stretches. Not too many coaches have kids who increase their scoring average. A freshman, sophomore comes in and adds to the totals but then plateaus so the team averages the same with less points from the returning players. It's rare that many teams consistently have players improve each year.

At both the college level and even the high school level the other team game plans to take away what you did well last year. It's harder.

Pitino is an excellent coach! I am certain coaching is not the issue.

 

[Dano564]

I am convinced this is a NIT team this year. I don't see how they get to ten Big Ten wins realistically.

 

[short ornery norwegian]

Watching this team, I get a strong sense that, for whatever reason, the pieces of the puzzle are just not coming together. It's like baking a cake, and leaving out one ingredient - the cake isn't going to taste right. that's what this team feels like to me right now - there's a missing piece, and I can't tell you what it is, but it's leaving a bad taste in my mouth.

One thought - it's possible they miss Austin Hollins' leadership and big-game ability a lot more than anyone is letting on. Down the stretch last year, every time this team needed a big shot, it was Austin Hollins coming through.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

I agree about the B1G schedule start, last year we lost at home to Michigan by 3, won by 3 at home to Purdue, then won by 3 at Penn St. We start at Purdue, @ #12 Maryland, and at home against Ohio ST. The only ranked team we play is Wisconsin the rest of the year! let's try and be patient! Michigan ST and Michigan are definitely down from last year.

The bold would make me a lot more optimistic if this team over the last few years (I recognize Pitino was only responsible for one) had instilled me with more confidence in their ability to consistently beat weak opponents and struggling teams. Over the years, its seems like our problem hasn't been getting quality wins (which is an area where Tubby excelled), it has been laying too any eggs against bad teams and letting leads that should be secure evaporate.

 

[scools12]

I don't think this makes sense. A team talented enough to win the NIT one year, that returns 5 of its top 6 players (and the sixth being at least adequately replaced thus far) the next year, should be expected to improve enough to at least make the tourney.

We added two good players to last year's core. The problem is that the guys who returned have not (at least against the high level competition) performed any better than they did last year. Arguably worse. That's unexpected.

You're assuming the returning 5 could and would improve. Again these players are what they are and it simply could be a matter of they have reached their potential. So far the only one of the 5 that looks like there was still something to get out of is Walker.

Mason & Morris though good players are not the program changing type that appear to be able to improve the team too much if at all from last year.

Lots of season left but this looks just like the same team from the last few seasons. Score a few upsets, get upset a few times and another 7-9 win conference season.

 

[BOUNDOUTPASSDUNK]

All of the deficiencies cited are real, no doubt. What I see is the Gophers are really committed to pushing the tempo upscale as much as possible. In theory, we have the guards to play fast, particularly if Dre Archibald (I'm naming Lil Dre after Tiny Archibald to send good karma his way) plays his game, dish when appropriate, take your mid range jumper when there.

When you shoot 50% +/- 5% with this style it covers up the team's rebounding deficiency. It can bury an opponent; or, we can shoot 30% and look awful trying. It's on those nights when we shoot 30% that we have those ugly1 shot empty possessions. This style is why coach P says we have to have the right players to employ it effectively. As thin as we are, it's a challenge.

Having said all of this, nothing cures the blues like a hot night or two, or three....

We have 8 more games in January, 5 at home. Sweep the home games and win 2 of three @ PSU, MICH and NEB (we owe them one), and we enter February 7-3. I'm not making that 'call,' but it is achievable. Come out of January 7-3 or 6-4, we're right back in it.

This makes tomorrow's OSU tilt very important as a turn around game.

Make it happen men!

 

[GopherPop]

You're assuming the returning 5 could and would improve. Again these players are what they are and it simply could be a matter of they have reached their potential. So far the only one of the 5 that looks like there was still something to get out of is Walker.

Mason & Morris though good players are not the program changing type that appear to be able to improve the team too much if at all from last year.

Regarding Mason and Morris, let's remember Mason is a true freshman and Morris is in his 1st year in the BIG, so basically a freshman also. So, to answer your statement, I hardly doubt those two are going to come in and be program changing stars from last year's team. It's not as if we have slew of Pangos' or Trimbels on our team this year.

 

[bga1]

Watching this team, I get a strong sense that, for whatever reason, the pieces of the puzzle are just not coming together. It's like baking a cake, and leaving out one ingredient - the cake isn't going to taste right. that's what this team feels like to me right now - there's a missing piece, and I can't tell you what it is, but it's leaving a bad taste in my mouth.

One thought - it's possible they miss Austin Hollins' leadership and big-game ability a lot more than anyone is letting on. Down the stretch last year, every time this team needed a big shot, it was Austin Hollins coming through.

Missing is a power forward that can rebound with attitude. A lot of us hoped it might be the frosh Martin but that didn't work out. So far it's just a soft team that wins when it is hitting shots and turning the opposition over. They play hard but not tough. Need to find that starting tomorrow.

 

[EG#9]

I didn't watch the Maryland game. I knew I would not handle a third Gopher related disappointment in four days well, so I DVR'd the game and looked at the score later in the day. When I saw they lost, I just deleted the game. Just from looking at the box score, the positive to me is that this team easily could have folded after getting down big in the first half especially after they just melted down at Purdue. The negative is that this team is 0-2 in the conference and we have to get beyond this idea/excuse that it's "tough to win on road in the B1G". At some point, past failures can't excuse current/future results and this program needs to start raising the bar (not just "The Barn") and start putting together winning conference seasons. The NCAA tournament is a very low bar that should be cleared frequently. The B1G is wide open this year beyond Wisconsin and (maybe) Maryland, with every other team being just as flawed, if not more, than the Gophers. I am really concerned right now about this team as everything I worried about possibly hurting this team this year has come to fruition already. Some of these things could change, but the obvious (only having 5 guys for the 1-3 to start the year and Joey King not being a B1G starting PF) and the not so obvious (Mathieu having a Vince Grier like second season, Andre Hollins looking like nothing more than a spot up shooter) have all been issues in the Gophers not winning a really meaningful game in four chances this year. I think Mathieu can turn it around, but I am really worried about Andre Hollins.

It's too early to give up on the season, but I am personally not going to believe in this team again until I see them win on the road. You don't have to be a really good team to make the NCAA tournament, but you do have to be competent and show some composure against other teams around your talent level. So far, we've seen the Gophers not play competent defense when it counts and lose composure on the offensive end in key situations.

 

[Atl Gopher]

Watching this team play, I don't see an NCAA Tournament type team.

Inconsistent guard play, defensive laps, poor FT shooting, and a lack of rebounding are not a formula for success. Gophers need at least 3 road wins to make the NCAA and at this point, I don't see it. I hope I am wrong but unless things dramatically change, we might be looking at another NIT
post season.

What I care most about is not how they started the Big Ten season but how they finish. Look at Michigan State teams as the example. This is a big test for Coach. It is not just about the missed 3 pointers but the missed layups and short jumpers. I believe they will correct those issues. I believe in the potential of this team.

I watched the first half of the Purdue game on my lap top that I attached to the TV in my hotel room at the Hyatt Regency Orlando. They looked great there. Then I took my Ipad with me to the pep rally so it was hard to see what happened in the last 10 minutes but it whatever it was it seems to have carried over to the Maryland game. They are a very good team and our margin for error was small. Let's hope Coach can get them back on track starting tonight against Ohio State.

 

[scher215]

What I care most about is not how they started the Big Ten season but how they finish. Look at Michigan State teams as the example. This is a big test for Coach. It is not just about the missed 3 pointers but the missed layups and short jumpers. I believe they will correct those issues. I believe in the potential of this team. I watched the first half of the Purdue game on my lap top that I attached to the TV in my hotel room at the Hyatt Regency Orlando. They looked great there. Then I took my Ipad with me to the pep rally so it was hard to see what happened in the last 10 minutes but it whatever it was it seems to have carried over to the Maryland game. They are a very good team and our margin for error was small. Let's hope Coach can get them back on track starting tonight against Ohio State.

Agreed. While coming out and dominating would be great for my psyche. Id rather start 0-8 and then win 10 straight than the other way around. Iowa limping in last year was pretty brutal.

 

[BarnBoy]

Win one we aren't supposed to win and we are right back were we need to be.

 

[SelectionSunday]

What's all the fuss about Ohio State?

Thus is not a vintage OSU squad. They're good, but they're not THAT good.

The Gophers are favored by 2.5, and the line opened up at 1.5. I expect the Gophers to win this game. Barring any major injuries the only home game I'd expect the Gophers to lose is Wisconsin, and even then there's always a chance because it's Williams Arena.

 

[station19]

Thus is not a vintage OSU squad. They're good, but they're not THAT good.

The Gophers are favored by 2.5, and the line opened up at 1.5. I expect the Gophers to win this game. Barring any major injuries the only home game I'd expect the Gophers to lose is Wisconsin, and even then there's always a chance because it's Williams Arena.

BINGO

It blow my mind how some people can write off the season after two Big Ten road games.

Go Gophers!*

 

[march madness]

Fan forums are all about over-reaction!

 

[mnsportsgeek]

Thus is not a vintage OSU squad. They're good, but they're not THAT good.

The Gophers are favored by 2.5, and the line opened up at 1.5. I expect the Gophers to win this game. Barring any major injuries the only home game I'd expect the Gophers to lose is Wisconsin, and even then there's always a chance because it's Williams Arena.

We do tend to blow a home game we're supposed to win every year though:

2013-Northwestern
2012-Illinois
2011-Purdue & Iowa
2010-Illinois, Penn State, Northwestern

I'd be shocked if we go 8-1 at home. 7-2 I can get behind. My guess is we blow one of the Iowa, Illinois, or Nebraska game and lose to Wisconsin.

 

[cjbfbp]

We do tend to blow a home game we're supposed to win every year though:

2013-Northwestern
2012-Illinois
2011-Purdue & Iowa
2010-Illinois, Penn State, Northwestern

I'd be shocked if we go 8-1 at home. 7-2 I can get behind. My guess is we blow one of the Iowa, Illinois, or Nebraska game and lose to Wisconsin.

I'd be very surprised if we lost to Nebraska at home. They have less depth than us and they have to work too hard for their points right now. I also think we'll split with Iowa. Our guards are better, their forwards are better, and the center position is neutral. They don't have much depth either, but they do play good defense. Illinois is a wild card and I won't venture to guess about them at this point.

 

[Bad Gopher]

Watching this team, I get a strong sense that, for whatever reason, the pieces of the puzzle are just not coming together. It's like baking a cake, and leaving out one ingredient - the cake isn't going to taste right. that's what this team feels like to me right now - there's a missing piece, and I can't tell you what it is, but it's leaving a bad taste in my mouth.

One thought - it's possible they miss Austin Hollins' leadership and big-game ability a lot more than anyone is letting on. Down the stretch last year, every time this team needed a big shot, it was Austin Hollins coming through.

The downgrade in defense from Hollins to Morris cannot be overestimated. You could put Austin on the other team's best player and, at worst, keep him in check. Taking an all-conference caliber player away from the other team is as good as adding an all-conference player to your own team. I believe that's the difference Dorsey will make next year and why he will start right away.