MV vs BOISE

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began11

began11

GOPHER11
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had a few beers but per rivals since 2006 4* recruits
i know a lot of them let but still

MN 13

BOISE 1

now i know a lot of them left but this has to prove coaching is king. My guess is us vs Iowa we win the recruiting battle the last 4 years but results are golden.............
 

I think we finally have the coaching staff in place and recruiting this year seems to be steady and should provide some depth. If we can get more passing production and have the wide receivers step up, this is top 25 team.
 


began11 said:
now i know a lot of them left but this has to prove coaching is king. My guess is us vs Iowa we win the recruiting battle the last 4 years but results are golden.............
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You'd be wrong if you look at the classes for the players that were actually on the field. 2008 & 2009 were the only recent classes of ours that were ranked higher than Iowa's. We're just now seeing most of our 2008 & 09 classes hit the field for major roles.

It is actually a bit of a fallacy that Iowa recruits poorly. They have had some very good classes mixed in with less impressive ones. Bulaga for instance was a 4* Rivals 250 coming out of high school.
 

Just numbers

Like i said its just numbers. But recruiting is numbers. Stars say why are we not even close to Boise when we have owned them in recruiting.
 


numbers

I never did the math vs IOWA over the last 4 years do you have them? THESE ARE JUST NUMBERS AND I KNOW PLAYERS HAVE LEFT. The thread is based on the coaching of boise and i guess now IOWA. Just saying this star system is for the birds, it is all about coaching.
 

began11 said:
I never did the math vs IOWA over the last 4 years do you have them? THESE ARE JUST NUMBERS AND I KNOW PLAYERS HAVE LEFT. The thread is based on the coaching of boise and i guess now IOWA. Just saying this star system is for the birds, it is all about coaching.
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Off the top of my head their 2005 class was #2 in the Big Ten and #10 overall. That class was actually a big disappointment for them though. They got much more production out of 2006 & 07 which were closer to 5th & 6th or 7th in the conference. Comparatively our 2005-07 classes ranked in the 9-11 range within the conference. It wasn't until 2008 & 09 that our classes were ranked higher. 2010 swung back to Iowa.
 

Just like most things, football is a dynamic thing. Not one factor is sufficient for success. Recruiting is just one element. And even within that people fail to consider the importance of experience, and how long it takes to get a payoff from a recruiting class.

We've been recruiting better but only about 5th (soon to be 6th with Neb.) in the Big Ten. On that basis alone with a mature class whch we won't even see for another year, we are only slightly better than average. But that's how building a program works. We achieve middledom and parlay that growth into better recruits hopefully raising our skill level to the elite.

But to the original post, that's only one component. You also have to consider coaching at the technique level, and the program level. Without developing the talent to it's potential they remain just stars on a page. Creating a crisp repeatable program reduces development time and hopefully then raises the heights to which you can develop the talent.

This is what you see in the great programs.

Where are we? We've got upper mid tier talent still in the process of maturing, good position coaches and a program that took three years to find itself and another to get the ship moving in the right direction.

So there you go. We're essentially a lower mid tier team making the move up to mid tier. It's a frustratingly slow ride, but at least we're moving in the right direction.

But I really like what we've put together now. If we can hold the staff together for a couple of years and develop the repeatable program I think we're going to really like the results of the effort.
 

began11 said:
I never did the math vs IOWA over the last 4 years do you have them? THESE ARE JUST NUMBERS AND I KNOW PLAYERS HAVE LEFT. The thread is based on the coaching of boise and i guess now IOWA. Just saying this star system is for the birds, it is all about coaching.
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You should have just titled this thread "Brewster is a bad coach, Peterson and Ferentz are good coaches" because that's the only point you were trying to make. The "star system" isn't "for the birds" and we've had plenty of threads that did the research to prove that. Texas, Alabama, Penn State, Ohio State, USC etc. aren't doing it with 2 star recruits. Now you didn't really do any research you just don't like Brewster and think he's a bad coach. Your opinion, your right and you could end-up being correct but Boise State is a bad example.

Rather the playing two or three teams of equal or better talent during the year what if Boise State was in the SEC, Big Ten or Big 12 and played 4 or 5 teams every year that had better talent? What if instead of getting weeks to prepare for those games, like the Broncos have in an opener or a bowl game, what if they played those teams back to back? Do you think that superior coaching would stlll take them to an 11-2 or 12-1 season every year?

Now after they've been through that grinder for 2 or 3 years, years that they went 7-5, 6-6 and 8-4 do you think those "low star"kids would still be dominating their league? Iowa was a bad example because, as has been pointed out, over a 4 year period Capt. Kirk, besides being a damn good coach, is also a fine recruiter.

Lastly, Peterson started-out with a hell of a lot of talent, Brewster didn't, something else that has been discussed to death around here many times before. Mason didn't get any job offers "above" the Minnesota job. Hawkins was hired away by Colorado.

They've both had about the same success though haven't they?:eek:

Next time just say "Brewster is a bad Coach and I want somebody else", plenty of people will agree with that and it won't lead to a post full of "boy, was THAT a lame comparison".

Or don't post "after a few beers". :)
 



Iceland12 said:
You should have just titled this thread "Brewster is a bad coach, Peterson and Ferentz are good coaches" because that's the only point you were trying to make. The "star system" isn't "for the birds" and we've had plenty of threads that did the research to prove that. Texas, Alabama, Penn State, Ohio State, USC etc. aren't doing it with 2 star recruits. Now you didn't really do any research you just don't like Brewster and think he's a bad coach. Your opinion, your right and you could end-up being correct but Boise State is a bad example.

Rather the playing two or three teams of equal or better talent during the year what if Boise State was in the SEC, Big Ten or Big 12 and played 4 or 5 teams every year that had better talent? What if instead of getting weeks to prepare for those games, like the Broncos have in an opener or a bowl game, what if they played those teams back to back? Do you think that superior coaching would stlll take them to an 11-2 or 12-1 season every year?

Now after they've been through that grinder for 2 or 3 years, years that they went 7-5, 6-6 and 8-4 do you think those "low star"kids would still be dominating their league? Iowa was a bad example because, as has been pointed out, over a 4 year period Capt. Kirk, besides being a damn good coach, is also a fine recruiter.

Lastly, Peterson started-out with a hell of a lot of talent, Brewster didn't, something else that has been discussed to death around here many times before. Mason didn't get any job offers "above" the Minnesota job. Hawkins was hired away by Colorado.

They've both had about the same success though haven't they?:eek:

Next time just say "Brewster is a bad Coach and I want somebody else", plenty of people will agree with that and it won't lead to a post full of "boy, was THAT a lame comparison".

Or don't post "after a few beers". :)
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Revisionist History, got to love it. Brewster himself said he took the MN job because it wasn't starting over and there was talent left behind. Peterson and his staff are fantastic coaches that have done more with less than Brew ever will. Yes I would agree Boise had time to prepare, but I'm not sure it would matter. If you watched last night, and I watched the entire game, Boise did NOT use one trick play. Not one. They beat Virginia Tech straight up. Both teams had a lot of miscues and both could have won the game. It came down to a 2 minute drill and the Boise QB was up to the task. Something we all know our QB would have no chance at. I don't know how anyone can doubt that Boise belongs now. They haven't lost since the 2008 season.

We're no better than we were when Brew took over in my opinion. We are a lot better on defense but much worse on offense which is a wash. That said, I'll be there Sat to watch us go to 2-0.
 

What Boise tells me once again is how important it is to have consistency in your football program. Consistency over 5, 10, 15, 20 years. We struggled with consistency on the Defense side of the ball in the early 2000's, and we are struggling with consistency on the Offensive side of the ball now. Both of those units have been our bane in their respective time period during the last decade.

I find it faulty to compare us to consistent programs in one breath and then demand a change in the next. It would seem more logical to point to these programs as the reason not to change, or point to other programs that go through coaching carousels and show why we should be more productive.
 


Sparlimb said:
Revisionist History, got to love it. Brewster himself said he took the MN job because it wasn't starting over and there was talent left behind.
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I love when people throw this out there. What was he supposed to say? "Well, we're going to lose a ton of games because the kids here suck and its going to take 4-5 years of recruiting and laying groundwork before we have a top flight Big Ten program"

That certainly would've been more honest, but I'm not sure how well it would play in the locker room.
 



Sparlimb said:
Revisionist History, got to love it. Brewster himself said he took the MN job because it wasn't starting over and there was talent left behind. Peterson and his staff are fantastic coaches that have done more with less than Brew ever will. Yes I would agree Boise had time to prepare, but I'm not sure it would matter. If you watched last night, and I watched the entire game, Boise did NOT use one trick play. Not one. They beat Virginia Tech straight up. Both teams had a lot of miscues and both could have won the game. It came down to a 2 minute drill and the Boise QB was up to the task. Something we all know our QB would have no chance at. I don't know how anyone can doubt that Boise belongs now. They haven't lost since the 2008 season.

We're no better than we were when Brew took over in my opinion. We are a lot better on defense but much worse on offense which is a wash. That said, I'll be there Sat to watch us go to 2-0.
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Weber under the gun is one of his few strengths. He's won several games and pulled us out of the jaws of defeat on many occasions. Good job with your revisionism.

Weber's has problems but clutch throws is not one of them.
 

ruralgopher said:
I love when people throw this out there. What was he supposed to say? "Well, we're going to lose a ton of games because the kids here suck and its going to take 4-5 years of recruiting and laying groundwork before we have a top flight Big Ten program"

That certainly would've been more honest, but I'm not sure how well it would play in the locker room.
Click to expand...

I'm doing my best not to quote is revisionist history and his no chance, and ask him about irony. It is very difficult for me.
 

Sparlimb said:
Revisionist History, got to love it. Brewster himself said he took the MN job because it wasn't starting over and there was talent left behind. Peterson and his staff are fantastic coaches that have done more with less than Brew ever will. Yes I would agree Boise had time to prepare, but I'm not sure it would matter. If you watched last night, and I watched the entire game, Boise did NOT use one trick play. Not one. They beat Virginia Tech straight up. Both teams had a lot of miscues and both could have won the game. It came down to a 2 minute drill and the Boise QB was up to the task. Something we all know our QB would have no chance at. I don't know how anyone can doubt that Boise belongs now. They haven't lost since the 2008 season.

We're no better than we were when Brew took over in my opinion. We are a lot better on defense but much worse on offense which is a wash. That said, I'll be there Sat to watch us go to 2-0.
Click to expand...

Yeah, you're making my point exactly.

":blah: :blah::blah:n Brewster's a bad coach". That's all the OP was about.
 

and if boise played in the big ten, pac 10, big 12, sec, or acc they wouldnt be winning as many games with their "better coaching" and "lower ranked recruits."

this is why i hate boise with a passion. they play 8-9+ soft games and beat 1 team thats decent/legit. i call it the fcs factor! all these d1aa schools seem to put together a decent game agaisnt fbs opponents the reason is, it is easy to play above your ability 1-2 times a year, no one knows what kind of team you have until you do it every saturday!

go gophers!
 

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