Maturi scheduled at 12:05pm on ESPN1500.

Everything you say might be true but how would we know because you didn't cite any sources. Furthermore, if you think only a small percentage of high school students and their parents rely on the US News and World Report you are mistaken. Whatever the reality the U's national reputation is extremely mediocre. But it doesn't matter anyway because the U has reached its high water mark as an academic institution. The Republicans in control of the State Legislature hate the people who run the U and they are going to make them pay one way or the other.
Ooh, you caught me. I must have just made it all up. :rolleyes:

http://www.academic.umn.edu/provost/awards/rankings.html
http://www.arwu.org/ARWU2010.jsp

I think that a very small percentage of students and their parents place significant emphasis on US News. They may look at it very generally, but god help the families that make it a major part of the process of one of the biggest decisions in their childrens' lives. The criteria are arbitrary and the rankings of questionable value. Here are a couple good reads on the topic: http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0109.graham.thompson.html
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1316/is_9_32/ai_65160614/

As noted by many others on this board, the national and international reputation of the U is very, very good. Sometimes I wonder if it's better other places than it is here (that whole Minnesota humbleness thing). I think we should do a lot more than we do to talk about the U's past and present achievements.

What has hurt the U in rankings like US News is undergrad graduation rates, which have been improving (not enough, but some). There's a lot of complexity that goes into the graduation rate at a place like the U that I won't bother getting into here, but suffice it to say that's the big one that brings the U to #64 in the eyes of US News.
 

The Republicans in control of the State Legislature hate the people who run the U and they are going to make them pay one way or the other.

Source?????? You mention sources to YOG (which he now provided), would you mind providing some for this comment; and while you're at it, please provide us the USN&WR rankings that you mention in the other post.
 

Whatever the reality the U's national reputation is extremely mediocre.

This statement shows that you know nothing and are just pulling stuff out of your a**. Seriously.

BTW, what really matters is the ranking/reputation of the department. (The department where I did my graduate degree at the U is not only ranked in the top 10; it's also ranked higher than several of the "top 10" schools in the U.S. News overall rankings that prestige whores masturbate to all of the time.)

As far as Maturi goes, he might not be as bad as some of the posters here suggest, but he's not that great and he's certainly on a bad run of late--even if things work out with the Kill hire (and I pray to Goldy that they do).
 

I hate to derail this thread about the U's academic standing... ;)
...but did anyone listen to the Maturi interview? How did it go?
 

Source?????? You mention sources to YOG (which he now provided), would you mind providing some for this comment; and while you're at it, please provide us the USN&WR rankings that you mention in the other post.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's start with the US News and World Report Rankings which cannot be dismissed no matter how badly you want to dismiss them. The question I have is why it bothers Gopher sports fans so much to lose to Wisconsin, Ohio State, Michigan, Purdue, Penn State, Illinois, and Northwestern on the playing field, but it doesn't seem to bother very many people at all when we lose to them in the classroom? I, for one, will never accept that the U has to take an academic back seat to any public university in America. It is only a matter of will and doing whatever is necessary to get to the top. Unfortunately, in Minnesota we are woefully short of people who are willing to compete with other states in areas which really matter. California has no fewer that seven public universities which are higher ranked than the U. WTF? Why does anyone in Minnesota think it is acceptable for the U to be ranked lower than UC Irvine, UC Davis, UC San Diego, and UC Santa Barbara by any measure you want to rank them?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The US News rankings are based upon data which U.S. News collects from each educational institution either from an annual survey or from the school's website. It also considers opinion surveys of university faculty and administrators outside the school. The college rankings were published in all years thereafter, except 1984.

The US News listings have gained such influence that some Universities have made it a specific goal to reach a particular level in the US News rankings. Clemson University made it a public goal to rise to the Top 20 in the US News rankings, and made specific changes, including reducing class size and altering the presentation of teacher salaries, so as to perform better in the statistical analysis by US News. And at least one university, Arizona State, has actually tied the university president's pay to an increase in the school's placement in the US News rankings.

U.S. News precise methodology has changed many times, and the data are not all available to the public. The actual presentation of rankings has changed as well. For many years, the magazine divided each category of post-secondary institutions into quartiles, with the schools in the highest quartile ("First Tier") ranked from 1 to about 50. All schools in the lower three quartile were merely identified as being in the "Second Tier", "Third Tier", and "Fourth Tier".

However, for the 2011 rankings, this system was dramatically changed; now all the schools in the top three quartiles are ranked (from 1 to 191], and the bottom quartile—the schools in the bottom 25%—are now labeled "Second Tier".

The following are elements in the US News rankings.

Peer assessment: a survey of the institution's reputation among presidents, provosts, and admissions deans of other institutions (15%)

Guidance Counselor assessment: a survey of the institution's reputation among approximately 1,800 high school guidance counselors (7.5%)

Retention: six–year graduation rate and first–year student retention rate (20%)

Faculty resources: average class size, faculty salary, faculty degree level, student-faculty ratio, and proportion of full–time faculty (20%)

Student selectivity: standardized test scores of admitted students, proportion of admitted students in upper percentiles of their high school class, and proportion of applicants accepted (15%)

Financial resources: per–student spending (10%)

Graduation rate performance: difference between expected and actual graduation rate (7.5%)

Alumni giving rate (5%)

Research at the University of Michigan analyzed the effects of the U.S. News & World Report rankings, showing a lasting effect on college applications and admissions by students in the top 10% of their class. In addition, they found that rankings influence survey assessments of reputation by college presidents at peer institutions, such that rankings and reputation are becoming much more similar over time.


#1 Harvard University
Cambridge, MA

#2 Princeton University
Princeton, NJ

#3 Yale University
New Haven, CT

#4 Columbia University
New York, NY

#5 Stanford University
Stanford, CA

#5 University of Pennsylvania
Philadelphia, PA

#7 California Institute of Technology
Pasadena, CA

#7 Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Cambridge, MA

#9 Dartmouth College
Hanover, NH

#9 Duke University
Durham, NC

#9 University of Chicago
Chicago, IL

#12 Northwestern University
Evanston, IL

#13 Johns Hopkins University
Baltimore, MD

#13 Washington University in St. Louis
St. Louis, MO

#15 Brown University
Providence, RI

#15 Cornell University
Ithaca, NY

#17 Rice University
Houston, TX

#17 Vanderbilt University
Nashville, TN

#19 University of Notre Dame
Notre Dame, IN

#20 Emory University
Atlanta, GA

#21 Georgetown University
Washington, DC

#22 University of California--Berkeley
Berkeley, CA

#23 Carnegie Mellon University
Pittsburgh, PA

#23 University of Southern California
Los Angeles, CA

#25 University of California--Los Angeles
Los Angeles, CA

#25 University of Virginia
Charlottesville, VA

#25 Wake Forest University
Winston-Salem, NC

#28 Tufts University
Medford, MA

#29 University of Michigan--Ann Arbor
Ann Arbor, MI

#30 University of North Carolina--Chapel Hill
Chapel Hill, NC

#31 Boston College
Chestnut Hill, MA

#31 College of William and Mary
Williamsburg, VA

#33 New York University
New York, NY

#34 Brandeis University
Waltham, MA

#35 Georgia Institute of Technology
Atlanta, GA

#35 University of California--San Diego
La Jolla, CA

#37 Lehigh University
Bethlehem, PA

#37 University of Rochester
Rochester, NY

#39 University of California--Davis
Davis, CA

#39 University of California--Santa Barbara
Santa Barbara, CA

#41 Case Western Reserve University
Cleveland, OH

#41 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
Troy, NY

#41 University of California--Irvine
Irvine, CA

#41 University of Washington
Seattle, WA

#45 University of Texas--Austin
Austin, TX

#45 University of Wisconsin--Madison
Madison, WI

#47 Pennsylvania State University--University Park
University Park, PA

#47 University of Illinois--Urbana-Champaign
Champaign, IL

#47 University of Miami
Coral Gables, FL

#50 Yeshiva University
New York, NY

#51 George Washington University
Washington, DC

#51 Tulane University
New Orleans, LA

#53 Pepperdine University
Malibu, CA

#53 University of Florida
Gainesville, FL

#55 Syracuse University
Syracuse, NY

#56 Boston University
Boston, MA

#56 Ohio State University--Columbus
Columbus, OH

#56 Purdue University--West Lafayette
West Lafayette, IN

#56 Southern Methodist University
Dallas, TX

#56 University of Georgia
Athens, GA

#56 University of Maryland--College Park
College Park, MD

#63 Texas A&M University--College Station
College Station, TX

#64 Clemson University
Clemson, SC

#64 Rutgers, the State University of New Jersey--New Brunswick
Piscataway, NJ

#64 University of Minnesota--Twin Cities
Minneapolis, MN
 



And the topic was?

So what did Maturi have to say? Did anyone listen?

Nice try to get us back on topic! I guess nobody listed to the program. It seems that the popular sport here is pissing matches.
 

He was also on with Barriero today, basically saying word for word (literally) the same drivel he told Reusse. He did talk a bit about being Chris Farley's high school football coach, which was interesting, and which I didn't know.
 

Nice try to get us back on topic! I guess nobody listed to the program. It seems that the popular sport here is pissing matches.


And as per my signature, you see that I refuse to Referee them anymore, due to too much pi$$/$hit going on. I know my place in life...I am #69.
 



He was also on with Barriero today, basically saying word for word (literally) the same drivel he told Reusse. He did talk a bit about being Chris Farley's high school football coach, which was interesting, and which I didn't know.

So it was drivel but you listened to it twice? Wow!

Didn't listen to Reusse. Nothing earth-shattering, but certainly not drivel unless you know it all because of your vast administrative background. I thought Barriero did a pretty good job asking questions showing he's still a journalist, and I thought Maturi did a pretty good job answering what he wanted to answer showing he's an administrator.

Barriero started out on the fluff Farley stuff buttering up Maturi. Then he went on to praise the Kill hiring. Maybe just me, but when Barriero starts on Kill, I wonder, "Okay, I know you killed Barriero, and are pretending to be him, but why are you so positive?"

Lot of time spent on Tubby. There is no buyout any more; the extension has been in the works for over a year; and lawyers seem to be the reason it hasn't been done. Didn't get specific, but said there are all sorts of little issues that can hang these things up. Said Tubby has told him repeatedly he's happy here and is planning on coaching here next year. Barriero did try to get at why Tubby always leaves the wording a bit vague. Maturi didn't have a real good answer but pointed out a question on Tubby's show was worded, "Do you expect to be back next year?" Tubby answered, "Yes, I expect to be back." Barriero asked directly what Tubby was promised about a practice facility. He was told they had just finished the funding on a new football stadium. The baseball stadium and the practice facility would be attended to next. They have been working on both, but donors had been generous on the football stadium and the economy had gone bad since then. They were continuing to work on both, but it's slow. If Barriero was better informed, he might have asked why there has been no big drive on the practice facility, but he didn't. Maturi said a couple of times that he would be surprised if Tubby didn't come back, but he wouldn't be shocked. That's simply how it is in this day and age.

Barriero asked about Lucia then. Maturi said that Lucia hasn't forgotten how to coach. He alluded to other issues which I assume was Lucia's illness. Said Lucia does a lot of things right. Academics and compliance were specifically mentioned. Barriero should have pressed him on players leaving early and the knock that they don't improve. Maturi was happy to let that slip.

Unlike the Pope, I do care about women's basketball. He said Borton's team improved this year; they played hard; and she has a good recruiting class coming in. Those were all reasons he still has faith in her, and, since I do care and follow the team, I can't argue any of those things he said weren't true. Maturi used some of the same language with both Borton and Lucia. He still has faith, but winning is the bottom line, and those issues are being addressed for next year. Obviously, "How are they being addressed?" should have been asked but wasn't.

Finally, Barriero asked Maturi about his own status. Maturi repeated what already had been told. He was offered an extension but felt that the new president should have the option of picking his own director. They'll visit that in the near future. Just so howda can sleep tonight, Maturi very pointedly said he's 66 and something like he's been doing this for a long time.

Have no idea what Barriero said after Maturi was gone. Not sure I could do what these guys do. Rip someone constantly and then pretend it didn't happen or be ripped constantly and then pretend it didn't happen.
 

The Barreiro interview was good. Asked the important questions without totally alienating Maturi. I suffered through Fat Reusse, who asked some of the questions, but lobbed more softballs.

It's remarkable how much tougher it is to rip someone in person. Maybe if Maturi has more access - was he EVER on WCCO? - we can get more of the story and maybe get a better chance to understand both sides.
 

I actually thought the two interviews were remarkably similar, and it felt like Maturi was reading from a script. Most notably, he used the same "surprised but not shocked, because nothing shocks me" line in both interviews. As to why I listened to him twice, I specifically went to lunch so I could hear the Reusse interview (which I learned of here on the Hole), and happened to turn on Dan's show when I came out of Home Depot on my way home. I didn't know he'd be on both shows.

Much as I agree with the Maturi critics, I will say this in his defense. I agree that the revenue sports should be most important, but I also think a new baseball facility should be a priority over a basketball practice building. John Anderson has been a top notch coach for decades here, and must be the most patient man alive. Siebert Field has been condemned (and it was in terrible shape in the early 90's when I played softball on the Bierman Fields next door). He runs a good to great program despite being a northern school. A real baseball field to play games on should be more important than a gym that would only be used for basketball practices. Hell, even TCF bank stadium is used for things other than football.
 

As to why I listened to him twice, I specifically went to lunch so I could hear the Reusse interview (which I learned of here on the Hole), and happened to turn on Dan's show when I came out of Home Depot on my way home. I didn't know he'd be on both shows.

Any good deals at Home Depot?
 



Any good deals at Home Depot?

Actually, I was buying boxes. We're moving next month, and HD seems to have the best deals on moving boxes. What an exciting life I lead - spending St. Pattys day packing up things and posting on Gopher Hole. :confused:
 

Who ARE you?
Holy crap, if maturi said these things I'd hope the interviewer slapped the bejesus out of him.
He's a failure, period, quit defending him, or quit trolling with his apparent success as your bait.
99% of University alums want him gone 3 years ago.

The nuns taught you to act this way toward people? :cool02:
 

Get a clue, huh?

Ah yes, that esteemed source of information on academia, U.S. News & World Report. Nobody who actually knows anything about colleges gives a rip about US News other than that some small percentage of ignorant parents will look at the rankings when thinking about undergrad choices for their kids. And despite that the U is in the top 20 in the country in national merit scholars admitted and has continued to see its freshman admissions statistics (high school rank, GPA, ACT scores) shoot through the roof to the point that some Minnesotans complain that it's too exclusive.

And as for the real economic driver, research, the U is ranked 14th among all universities (9th among public) in science and engineering research spending, 8th among public universities in total research expenditures, and 6th in the world among all universities in technology transfer (i.e., turning research into actual products for actual business).

Well stated and factual.
 

Go4Broke said:
California has no fewer that seven public universities which are higher ranked than the U.

No, they don't.
 

Ooh, you caught me. I must have just made it all up. :rolleyes:

http://www.academic.umn.edu/provost/awards/rankings.html
http://www.arwu.org/ARWU2010.jsp

I think that a very small percentage of students and their parents place significant emphasis on US News. They may look at it very generally, but god help the families that make it a major part of the process of one of the biggest decisions in their childrens' lives. The criteria are arbitrary and the rankings of questionable value. Here are a couple good reads on the topic: http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0109.graham.thompson.html
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1316/is_9_32/ai_65160614/

As noted by many others on this board, the national and international reputation of the U is very, very good. Sometimes I wonder if it's better other places than it is here (that whole Minnesota humbleness thing). I think we should do a lot more than we do to talk about the U's past and present achievements.

What has hurt the U in rankings like US News is undergrad graduation rates, which have been improving (not enough, but some). There's a lot of complexity that goes into the graduation rate at a place like the U that I won't bother getting into here, but suffice it to say that's the big one that brings the U to #64 in the eyes of US News.

Actually, I think low graduation rates overall is not necessarily a bad thing. Admit many to give them a chance, and let them see if they can tread water. If they can, then they are of quality caliber, and if not, they likely didn't belong at a school of the U's quality.

Getting through Chem E at the U was no picnic. There are some majors at the U where getting good grades is not difficult, but the Institute of Technology was certainly not one of them. They didn't coddle you, or cry for you when you did poorly. You EARNED your grades there, and they weren't very shy about giving you bad grades (C or worse) if you didn't EARN higher. I learned a lot there, even if sometimes it didn't seem like it.

The U has plenty of prestige attached to its academic programs.
 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's start with the US News and World Report Rankings which cannot be dismissed no matter how badly you want to dismiss them.

I'm dismissing them as junk journalism. A bunch of people who rank on arbitrary, and bad data. Did you read either of the critiques of US News rankings that I linked earlier? Those would explain to you why they should be dismissed.


The question I have is why it bothers Gopher sports fans so much to lose to Wisconsin, Ohio State, Michigan, Purdue, Penn State, Illinois, and Northwestern on the playing field, but it doesn't seem to bother very many people at all when we lose to them in the classroom? I, for one, will never accept that the U has to take an academic back seat to any public university in America. It is only a matter of will and doing whatever is necessary to get to the top. Unfortunately, in Minnesota we are woefully short of people who are willing to compete with other states in areas which really matter. California has no fewer that seven public universities which are higher ranked than the U. WTF? Why does anyone in Minnesota think it is acceptable for the U to be ranked lower than UC Irvine, UC Davis, UC San Diego, and UC Santa Barbara by any measure you want to rank them?



Again, I don't believe we do lose to most of those schools in the classroom when you look at meaningful data. As overall institutions, Northwestern, Michigan, and Wisconsin have better reputations than the U when it comes to the whole package (teaching, research, public service), but it's highly variable from program to program. You won't get any argument from me about the need for Minnesota to more strongly support the U. We have some people who just don't get the importance of the U to our state's economy. But despite getting less than 20% of its funding from the state, the U is still providing a high level of excellence in teaching, research, and public service.

Research at the University of Michigan analyzed the effects of the U.S. News & World Report rankings, showing a lasting effect on college applications and admissions by students in the top 10% of their class. In addition, they found that rankings influence survey assessments of reputation by college presidents at peer institutions, such that rankings and reputation are becoming much more similar over time.

This shows what a farce this is. Peer opinions are part of the ratings process; they also appear to affect the ratings themselves. It seems a vicious cycle that will not enable schools to improve their standing much. Again, take a look at the articles I linked that offer a critique of US News.
 

Actually, I think low graduation rates overall is not necessarily a bad thing. Admit many to give them a chance, and let them see if they can tread water. If they can, then they are of quality caliber, and if not, they likely didn't belong at a school of the U's quality.

Getting through Chem E at the U was no picnic. There are some majors at the U where getting good grades is not difficult, but the Institute of Technology was certainly not one of them. They didn't coddle you, or cry for you when you did poorly. You EARNED your grades there, and they weren't very shy about giving you bad grades (C or worse) if you didn't EARN higher. I learned a lot there, even if sometimes it didn't seem like it.

The U has plenty of prestige attached to its academic programs.

Agreed. The whole concept of getting everyone to graduate, in 4 years much less, requires some level of grade inflation that the U has fought off better than most schools in my opinion. I do think the U has some more work to do to create an environment more conducive to graduating within a reasonable 4-6 year time frame; that has been a major area of focus for 10 years now and progress has been made, but improvement takes time. One big positive is the increasing number of students living on or near campus. Statistics bear out that students living on campus are less likely to transfer and more likely to graduate.
 




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