Mason with Dan B.

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You have to get the good coaches in the first place before pay becomes that relevant.
 

Gopher07 said:
And I'm arguing that if you're a college football fan for the same reasons you're an NFL fan, you don't get it. There are plenty of people in the state that do get it, we just need to give them a taste of success.
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I am arguing that the gophers consistent level of success will never come close to the Vikings consistent level of success. As a result, fan support will never be there on on a regular basis. You just don't get it.
 

raragophers said:
How often do the Vikings seriously compete for a NFC North title on a regular basis? How often do the gophers seriously contend for a big ten champsionship? The opportunity to contend is the underlying difference in fan support.
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1. The Vikes compete with 3 other teams for the NFC North title. The Gophers compete with 10 (about to be 11) for the a BT Championship. The Gophers winning the BT is like the Vikes going to the Super Bowl in terms of quantity of teams competing for those titles. I'm 31 yo and I've never seen the Vikes in the Super Bowl. You're comparing Apples to Oranges. The Vikes only have to beat 3 other teams to make the playoffs and they've won only 2 playoff games the past 10 years. The Gophers have to beat more than 3 times as many teams to win the BT.

2. I cheer for the Gophers because they play for the University and the state and the players choose to play for the University. The Vikings play for an owner and a paycheck and most of them had no choice but to become Vikings because they drafted them.

3. There's a realistic chance the Minnesota Vikings become the Los Angeles Vikings in a couple of years. I'm pretty sure it'll never be the Los Angeles Golden Gophers.

4. Based on your standards, I'd certainly call the Vikes medicore. Only 2 playoff wins in 10 years? Given what they have to beat to get in that position, very medicore. I'd call a team that makes the Super Bowl every 5-6 years anything but. However, it's been 33 years (+-) since the Vikes have done it. Why would you call a team that makes the Rose Bowl every 5-6 years just that? If a college team like that is medicore, what does that make the Vikings?
 

raragophers said:
How often do the Vikings seriously compete for a NFC North title on a regular basis? How often do the gophers seriously contend for a big ten champsionship? The opportunity to contend is the underlying difference in fan support.
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Correct, but your premise is that the gophers cannot obtain the level of support that the Vikings have. I believe this is false.

1) I believe it is much easier to win your division in the NFL than it is to win the BigTen. I think going forward winning an NFC division in equal to winning a BigTen Division. Winning a NFC Championship will be the equivalent of winning the BigTen Championship. Finally, winning your bowl game as the BigTen Champion will be equal to winning the Superbowl. I don't feel that winning the National Championship has an equivalent when comparing to the NFL due to the lack of a playoff in college football.

2) I believe the west division of the BigTen is going to be filled with teams that are strong but not elite. They will ebb and flow over the years. With the right coach hired the U of M can be in contention for the West Division title at a minimum of once every five years.

I think if my second point happens you will see similar if not more support for the Gophers than what the Vikings currently receive.
 

But if we win the Big Ten once every five years, we're mediocre and thus will fail to be successful in the public's eyes :rolleyes:
 


Pewterschmidt said:
1. The Vikes compete with 3 other teams for the NFC North title. The Gophers compete with 10 (about to be 11) for the a BT Championship. The Gophers winning the BT is like the Vikes going to the Super Bowl in terms of quantity of teams competing for those titles. I'm 31 yo and I've never seen the Vikes in the Super Bowl. You're comparing Apples to Oranges. The Vikes only have to beat 3 other teams to make the playoffs and they've won only 2 playoff games the past 10 years. The Gophers have to beat more than 3 times as many teams to win the BT.

2. I cheer for the Gophers because they play for the University and the state and the players choose to play for the University. The Vikings play for an owner and a paycheck and most of them had no choice but to become Vikings because they drafted them.

3. There's a realistic chance the Minnesota Vikings become the Los Angeles Vikings in a couple of years. I'm pretty sure it'll never be the Los Angeles Golden Gophers.

4. Based on your standards, I'd certainly call the Vikes medicore. Only 2 playoff wins in 10 years? Given what they have to beat to get in that position, very medicore. I'd call a team that makes the Super Bowl every 5-6 years anything but. However, it's been 33 years (+-) since the Vikes have done it. Why would you call a team that makes the Rose Bowl every 5-6 years just that? If a college team like that is medicore, what does that make the Vikings?
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I'd call NFC Championship=Rose bowl and Superbowl=National Championship

So, 3 NFC Championships in last 12 years =average?

So, how many years since the Gophers been to a "NFC Championship" or "Superbowl"?
 

Goldteam said:
well no schit

the hilarious part though was mason acted like he implemented this system at minnesota and he did great

and of course penis head just let go right on talking about how he did the job at minnesota

i don't know who the bigger phony was in that interview......mason or penis head?
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lolcat-attack.png
 

raragophers said:
I'd call NFC Championship=Rose bowl and Superbowl=National Championship

So, 3 NFC Championships in last 12 years =average?
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I don't know if it is average, but it's not that hard to do. The Carolina Panthers have only been around since the Mid 90s and they already been to two conference championship games. They actually won one.
 




raragophers said:
I am arguing that the gophers consistent level of success will never come close to the Vikings consistent level of success. As a result, fan support will never be there on on a regular basis. You just don't get it.
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"Never" is a long time. Things can and do change...
 

raragophers said:
I'd call NFC Championship=Rose bowl and Superbowl=National Championship

So, 3 NFC Championships appearances in last 12 years =average?
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First of all, fixed it for you.

Secondly, Apples to Oranges once again.

An NFL team has to finish ahead of 3 teams in the standings and then win 1 or at worst 2 games in the playoffs to get to the Conference Championship game. That isn't nearly as impressive as having to finish ahead of 10 or 11 teams in college football. I'd call going to the conference championship game like going to the Capital One Bowl. Nice season but not close to the Rose Bowl.
 

raragophers said:
I'd call NFC Championship=Rose bowl and Superbowl=National Championship

So, 3 NFC Championships in last 12 years =average?
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The Giants have 2 since 2000 (won 2). The Packers have 4 since 1995 (won 2). The Saints have 2 since 2006 (won 1). Eagles, 3 since 2003 (won 1). Panthers, 3 since 1996 (won 1). Falcons, 2 since 1998 (won 1). Bucs, 2 since 1999 (won 1). That's nearly half of the NFC's teams that have had multiple appearances in the last 15 years, and every one of them has won at least one except the Vikings. So, 3 in 12 years and zero wins is kind of average, yes.
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
I don't know if it is average, but it's not that hard to do. The Carolina Panthers have only been around since the Mid 90s and they already been to two conference championship games. They actually won one.
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"The Giants have 2 since 2000 (won 2). The Packers have 4 since 1995 (won 2). The Saints have 2 since 2006 (won 1). Eagles, 3 since 2003 (won 1). Panthers, 3 since 1996 (won 1). Falcons, 2 since 1998 (won 1). Bucs, 2 since 1999 (won 1). That's nearly half of the NFC's teams that have had multiple appearances in the last 15 years, and every one of them has won at least one except the Vikings. So, 3 in 12 years and zero wins is kind of average, yes. "


god, you people still dont get it. It does not matter if ITS NOT HARD TO DO. The basis of this argument was that parity on a year in/ year out basis creates more interest in cities where college football programs such as the gophers exist.
 



GrayShouldPlayReceiver said:
Miami wanted Alvarez and he declined. Iowa and Wisky do a great job of retaining good coaches. They pay!!!!!!!
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Miami's not as elite as they once were, and I suspect the facilities at Wisconsin are quite a bit better.
 

raragophers said:
I'd call NFC Championship=Rose bowl and Superbowl=National Championship

So, 3 NFC Championships in last 12 years =average?

So, how many years since the Gophers been to a "NFC Championship" or "Superbowl"?
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To take that statement into consideration.

24 teams represented the NFC over that 12 year time frame. 24/3 = 8. One out of 8 chances in a 16 team conference seems rather average to me.

It's even more true if you go back to 1987 when it was the last time since an appearance in the NFC championship. Add in that you have to go back to the 70's for the last SB appearance and it becomes very medicore.
 

Pewterschmidt said:
To take that statement into consideration.

24 teams represented the NFC over that 12 year time frame. 24/3 = 8. One out of 8 chances in a 16 team conference seems rather average to me.
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god, you people still dont get it. It does not matter if ITS NOT HARD TO DO. The basis of this argument was that parity on a year in/ year out basis creates more interest in cities where college football programs such as the gophers exist.
 

raragophers said:
"The Giants have 2 since 2000 (won 2). The Packers have 4 since 1995 (won 2). The Saints have 2 since 2006 (won 1). Eagles, 3 since 2003 (won 1). Panthers, 3 since 1996 (won 1). Falcons, 2 since 1998 (won 1). Bucs, 2 since 1999 (won 1). That's nearly half of the NFC's teams that have had multiple appearances in the last 15 years, and every one of them has won at least one except the Vikings. So, 3 in 12 years and zero wins is kind of average, yes. "


god, you people still dont get it. It does not matter if ITS NOT HARD TO DO. The basis of this argument was that parity on a year in/ year out basis creates more interest in cities where college football programs such as the gophers exist.
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I understand your point, but I believe that if the gophers CAN GET to the same level of competitiveness as the Vikings for a decent level of time (I don't think this would need to be more than 5 years) that they would get about equal if not more support from Minnesotans that the Vikings would. I think as a state as a whole Minnesota would be/is quite comparable to Wisconsin in terms of fans support of various teams once you factor in winning.
 

Silvio said:
I understand your point, but I believe that if the gophers CAN GET to the same level of competitiveness as the Vikings for a decent level of time (I don't think this would need to be more than 5 years) that they would get about equal if not more support from Minnesotans that the Vikings would. I think as a state as a whole Minnesota would be/is quite comparable to Wisconsin in terms of fans support of various teams once you factor in winning.
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So the wisconsin badgers have as much fan support as the green bay packers? are you delusional?

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/5814906/6561726
 

Silvio said:
I understand your point, but I believe that if the gophers CAN GET to the same level of competitiveness as the Vikings for a decent level of time (I don't think this would need to be more than 5 years) that they would get about equal if not more support from Minnesotans that the Vikings would. I think as a state as a whole Minnesota would be/is quite comparable to Wisconsin in terms of fans support of various teams once you factor in winning.
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I agree with this! Just win baby!
 

this thread is destroying my will to live. If the Gophers did become "mediocre" in RaRa's eyes and were competing for a Rose Bowl every 5-6 years the Bank would never be empty like it has been this season.

Mediocre to me is the level that Mason got us too. In hindsight that level of mediocrity was viewed at times as pretty damn awesome. Once the Mason era stalled, and Gopher fans realized that we could have some success it was only fair that we asked for more.

We didn't get more with Brewster, here's hoping we do get more with the next regime.

The Vikings have had a string of good years and star players, that fills the dome. The moment the Vikings lose momentum the dome will empty just like it has in years past.
 

Law_Abiding_Gopher said:
this thread is destroying my will to live. If the Gophers did become "mediocre" in RaRa's eyes and were competing for a Rose Bowl every 5-6 years the Bank would never be empty like it has been this season.

Mediocre to me is the level that Mason got us too. In hindsight that level of mediocrity was viewed at times as pretty damn awesome. Once the Mason era stalled, and Gopher fans realized that we could have some success it was only fair that we asked for more.

We didn't get more with Brewster, here's hoping we do get more with the next regime.

The Vikings have had a string of good years and star players, that fills the dome. The moment the Vikings lose momentum the dome will empty just like it has in years past.
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empty like years past? please elaborate. You are referring to probably a four or five year period in the last three or four decades!
 

raragophers said:
So the wisconsin badgers have as much fan support as the green bay packers? are you delusional?

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/5814906/6561726
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I never said they did. I said that the two fan bases of the two states are similar in general. I would say that the Green Bay Packers are quite a bit more successful than the Vikings, they certainly have a much better history. I would say the Badgers are currently more successful than the Gophers, although the Gophers have a much better overall history.

The Badgers may never be able to supplant the Packers as the Most important team in that state, but to think that is don't support Badger Football in Wisconsin is just delusional (see attendance and travel). From the Wisconsinites I know they support both teams about equally. For all intents and purposes the Packers are just a pro version of the Badgers, they are a state institution that is unique in all of professional sports and will never happen again. The NFL would sell that organization to a billionaire owner is a second if they could. Heck, they probably have spent a pretty penny on legal fees looking into how to make that happen.

However I feel that the Gophers could equal or surpass the Vikings in terms of fan support.
 

I don't agree that we'd have more fans than the Vikes - the NFL is more popular than college, as a whole. There are more Saints fans in Louisiana than LSU fans.

But LSU has no trouble selling out. They have no trouble with fan support. I'm not under the illusion that we'd have MORE fans than the Vikes, unless we went on some insane tear of 2 national championships in 10 years or something, but we have enough support, in relation to other colleges, to do just fine for ourselves. Maybe we'd even be mediocre some day.
 


Silvio said:
I never said they did. I said that the two fan bases of the two states are similar in general. I would say that the Green Bay Packers are quite a bit more successful than the Vikings, they certainly have a much better history. I would say the Badgers are currently more successful than the Gophers, although the Gophers have a much better overall history.

The Badgers may never be able to supplant the Packers as the Most important team in that state, but to think that is don't support Badger Football in Wisconsin is just delusional (see attendance and travel). From the Wisconsinites I know they support both teams about equally. For all intents and purposes the Packers are just a pro version of the Badgers, they are a state institution that is unique in all of professional sports and will never happen again. The NFL would sell that organization to a billionaire owner is a second if they could. Heck, they probably have spent a pretty penny on legal fees looking into how to make that happen.

However I feel that the Gophers could equal or surpass the Vikings in terms of fan support.
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you state that the gophers could get to the same level of fan support as the Vikings if the gophers ever got to the same level as Wisconsin. Thus, by stating this you are implying that the Badgers are on the same level as the Packers. This argument was about how the gophers can't surpass the vikings in popularity due to the parity that exists within the NFL. Don't get off track:)
 


raragophers said:
you state that the gophers could get to the same level of fan support as the Vikings if the gophers ever got to the same level as Wisconsin. Thus, by stating this you are implying that the Badgers are on the same level as the Packers. This argument was about how the gophers can't surpass the vikings in popularity due to the parity that exists within the NFL. Don't get off track:)
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Well have to just agree to disagree. You clearly feel that all NFL teams have the same support and that will always be higher than college football. I hope you really don't think that MN supports the Vikings the way that WI supports the Pack, but I suppose you do since parity is involved.
 



raragophers said:
to a point I agree. However, at what point does pay become irrelevant?
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Never. It doesn't matter if the coach has more than he could ever spend and he knows it, if the best coach isn't being paid as such it becomes an issue of being appreciated, not checkook.
 

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