Lineup Next Year

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scools12 said:
The future is not now for Pitino. Don't have to agree with it but he is going to get plenty of time at Minnesota. His 3rd year yet alone his 4th year are not going to have any effect on whether he gets a 5th year or his attractiveness as a candidate for other jobs.
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Its easy after two years when his seat is not warm to say it will not get warm until 5 or 6 or whatever years. If his next two years are as embarrassing as this one was, his seat will be scalding hot (if he is still employed) by year five. I am hopeful he turns it around next year, but if he doesn't I think he gets another pass because of how many seniors he graduated. However, 6-12 is still crap, and he can't survive too many of those without some much better seasons sandwiched in between.
 

scools12 said:
unless Pitino goes 4-32 over the next 2 conference seasons he will get a 5th season. Yea his seat in the 5th year could be warm but without a complete disaster over the next 2 years don't see how he doesn't get the 5th year.
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Thanks for admitting that your initial statement was ridiculous.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Thanks for admitting that your initial statement was ridiculous.
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I can admit I should have been more clear about what I was saying the first time. The ridiculous statement is the notion that the future is now.
 

scools12 said:
I heard the AD say next season is being viewed as the "reset" year. I am taking him at his word and unless Pitino goes 4-32 over the next 2 conference seasons he will get a 5th season. Yea his seat in the 5th year could be warm but without a complete disaster over the next 2 years don't see how he doesn't get the 5th year.
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Yup. Its all about the expectations. But if he fails to meet the expectations like he did this year, it will get interesting.
 

Winasota Gopher said:
Yup. Its all about the expectations. But if he fails to meet the expectations like he did this year, it will get interesting.
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No it won't, there is no way we are going to fire Pitino in the next two years. Norwood brought him in to get this on a decent track, get some BigTen quality players in here and stabilize a mess. He knew there would be learning curve issues, as there have been, but he made a decision to hire a guy with a high ceiling and tough through the learning curve. How many real candidates did we have the last time? There is no way they get a good coach in here if Pitino is fired after 3 or 4 years. Pitino is a big name in hoops circles, if you are going to fire someone with that name, you better obviously be right. If guys are going to take a turn around job, they want to know they will have time to get it done.
Get over it, he is here for at least 3 or 4 more years and I hope he does well enough that we don't have to waste our time on hot seat discussions with no merit.
 


scools12 said:
I can admit I should have been more clear about what I was saying the first time. The ridiculous statement is the notion that the future is now.
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The future is now. He can't be completely oblivious to wins next year. And he could do significantly better than 4-32 in the conference over the next two years and not get a 5th year. As you said, "you" don't have to agree but I'm pretty sure that you know nothing more about the future than I do despite your foolish sense of certainty.
 

corcoran1 said:
No it won't, there is no way we are going to fire Pitino in the next two years. Norwood brought him in to get this on a decent track, get some BigTen quality players in here and stabilize a mess. He knew there would be learning curve issues, as there have been, but he made a decision to hire a guy with a high ceiling and tough through the learning curve. How many real candidates did we have the last time? There is no way they get a good coach in here if Pitino is fired after 3 or 4 years. Pitino is a big name in hoops circles, if you are going to fire someone with that name, you better obviously be right. If guys are going to take a turn around job, they want to know they will have time to get it done.
Get over it, he is here for at least 3 or 4 more years and I hope he does well enough that we don't have to waste our time on hot seat discussions with no merit.
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1. When did I say we were going to fire him after 3 or 4 years?
2. And if he fails to meet expectations like he did this year in the following years I'm quite certain it "will get interesting"
3. As I've always stated, and have stated in my last 2 posts in this thread, it's about meeting or exceeding expectations.

"Get over it", he doesn't have a free pass to miss expectations year after year, no one has that clout.

Ya feel me?

FWIW - I'm also the guy that says he will/needs to get 6 years minimum to turn this program around. That all said, it's about expectations. If he is expected to win the same amount of B1G games this year as last year, then he better do that. If the goal is to win more B1G games 2 years from now, he better do that. Failing to do so will make "it interesting"
 

Would say with quite a bit of certainty this is the last time we'll hear Papa Pitino publicly criticize the talent on Minnesota's roster as a way to defend his son. Rick knows he can get away with that this year because Richard inherited a lot of these players from Tubby, thus Rick's willingness to publicly criticize/degrade the talent on another program's roster, which by the way usually is frowned upon within the coaching fraternity. But I get it, Rick is trying to protect his son because there are enough people out there who believe his son's team under-performed (for the record, I'm in that group) with an experienced and decent roster.

That will no longer be the case starting in 2015-16. Charles Buggs will be the only holdover from the Tubby era. Next season (and presumably 2016-17) it's all Richard's guys except for Buggsy. Rick probably won't be quite so willing to point out Minnesota has/had no 1st, 2nd, or 3rd-team All-Big Ten players if it's a roster his son mostly constructed.
 

It was a long season no two ways around that but for the future it is the three mid season departures that are the most problematic, it forces you to go to spring recruits and we all know how that turned out for Tubby. If Pitino can retain and develop the talent coming in and currently on the roster I think he'll be around for year five even without a top 7 finish in the B1G in the next couple of years.
 



corcoran1 said:
No it won't, there is no way we are going to fire Pitino in the next two years. Norwood brought him in to get this on a decent track, get some BigTen quality players in here and stabilize a mess. He knew there would be learning curve issues, as there have been, but he made a decision to hire a guy with a high ceiling and tough through the learning curve. How many real candidates did we have the last time? There is no way they get a good coach in here if Pitino is fired after 3 or 4 years. Pitino is a big name in hoops circles, if you are going to fire someone with that name, you better obviously be right. If guys are going to take a turn around job, they want to know they will have time to get it done.
Get over it, he is here for at least 3 or 4 more years and I hope he does well enough that we don't have to waste our time on hot seat discussions with no merit.
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I remember some young schmuck during Todd Lickliter's third year at Iowa saying the same thing on an Iowa board and insisting that all of us speculating about his possible firing were wasting our time. He also said Iowa wouldn't be able to get a coach if they fired him. He was wrong on both counts. He also insisted that AD Barta's statement that they were in full support of Todd Lickliter a couple of months before firing him was "proof" that he would get an automatic fourth year. By the way, Lickliter was a former national coach of the year prior to coming to Iowa.

I don't know what will happen in the future and neither do you. As others have said, I don't believe that Pitino, despite his name, is automatically entitled to five or six years regardless of the results. Given this school's recent history with coaches, I'm not sure why anyone would be convinced of that. I figure that he's already earned a minimum of four years but he needs to show something in the next two years to be safe. Hopefully he will and this conversation will be moot.
 

Pg- Alvin Ellis forced to be primary ball handler
sg- wally ball
Sf- buggs
Pf- alex foster
c- justin Dahl


Oh whoops was this not supposed to be guess what tubby 2015 opening line up was?
 

Absolutely none of us know the future

So many ways Pitino gets fired: What Norwood leaves and we get a new AD who wants his guy?
What if Pitino says something sarcastically and it turns into a whole politically correct thing?
What if another recruit lands in jail for domestic issues?
What if the grade point averages continue to drop?
What if season ticket holders stay home...don't renew?
But I doubt he gets fired anytime soon for winning 6 Big Ten games when most people thought we could win 8 or 9
in year 2 after over achieving winning 8 in year one. That's not much to be alarmed about if you factor everything. I guess it depends who you blame for Martin, McNeil and Lofton...the coach or the players? For Konate and Gas arriving late...coach or circumstances? For losing close games with wilting seniors...coach or inherited players? For missing free throws in the last four minutes..., for throwing the ball out of bounds in the last four minutes.., for having guys score 20 and following it up with 2 points the next game. Coaching or deficient players? Time will tell but he gets time to see if year four is like year two.
1976,77 might be our best team, 1996,97 might be our 2nd best team. I'm predicting 2016,17 is our third best team
and then all this crying about Pitino not being able to coach will quiet down by most. That's my hope.
 

GoldenGopherFan said:
Pg- Alvin Ellis forced to be primary ball handler
sg- wally ball
Sf- buggs
Pf- alex foster
c- justin Dahl


Oh whoops was this not supposed to be guess what tubby 2015 opening line up was?
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How about this?

PG-Jarvis Johnson
SG-Alvin Ellis/Lofton
SF-Wally/Buggs
PF-Alex I./Foster/King
C-Wally's little brother
 



60's Guy said:
So many ways Pitino gets fired: What Norwood leaves and we get a new AD who wants his guy?
What if Pitino says something sarcastically and it turns into a whole politically correct thing?
What if another recruit lands in jail for domestic issues?
What if the grade point averages continue to drop?
What if season ticket holders stay home...don't renew?
But I doubt he gets fired anytime soon for winning 6 Big Ten games when most people thought we could win 8 or 9
in year 2 after over achieving winning 8 in year one. That's not much to be alarmed about if you factor everything. I guess it depends who you blame for Martin, McNeil and Lofton...the coach or the players? For Konate and Gas arriving late...coach or circumstances? For losing close games with wilting seniors...coach or inherited players? For missing free throws in the last four minutes..., for throwing the ball out of bounds in the last four minutes.., for having guys score 20 and following it up with 2 points the next game. Coaching or deficient players? Time will tell but he gets time to see if year four is like year two.
1976,77 might be our best team, 1996,97 might be our 2nd best team. I'm predicting 2016,17 is our third best team
and then all this crying about Pitino not being able to coach will quiet down by most. That's my hope.
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I'm predicting we squeak into the dance 2016/17 and make a run the following year.
 


GoldenGopherFan said:
Pg- Alvin Ellis forced to be primary ball handler
sg- wally ball
Sf- buggs
Pf- alex foster
c- justin Dahl


Oh whoops was this not supposed to be guess what tubby 2015 opening line up was?
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LOL, so funny because it's likely close to accurate. Except I have to admit we probably would've gotten Henry Ellenson if Tubby were still here, and he'd be the starting C.

Edit: Oops, see that somebody beat me to it.
 

WanderingGopher said:
LOL, so funny because it's likely close to accurate. Except I have to admit we probably would've gotten Henry Ellenson if Tubby were still here, and he'd be the starting C.

Edit: Oops, see that somebody beat me to it.
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Thought about putting Henry in there but I thought I remembered the Ellensons not being particularly happy with how Tubby handled Wally's role/PT his Freshman year? I could be wrong
 

What I'm hoping for:

PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer, Jolly
SF - Ellison /Morris, Buggs
PF - Boucher /King, Buggs
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo

Use all of the scholarships because we'll probably have someone transferring in addition to King and Morris graduating. Seems like we average about one transfer every year.
 

MadtownGopher said:
What I'm hoping for:

PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer, Jolly
SF - Ellison /Morris, Buggs
PF - Boucher /King, Buggs
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo

Use all of the scholarships because we'll probably have someone transferring in addition to King and Morris graduating. Seems like we average about one transfer every year.
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With ~450 college basketball transfers/year and ~350 teams we can easily expect 1 transfer/year. The 450 transfers/year number is about the same percent(10%/year) as regular students who transfer(~30% of all students over the course of an undergrad degree).
 

GoldenGopherFan said:
Thought about putting Henry in there but I thought I remembered the Ellensons not being particularly happy with how Tubby handled Wally's role/PT his Freshman year? I could be wrong
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Wonder how long it will take Wally's Mama to start posting on the Marquette board when he gets buried on the bench.
 

MadtownGopher said:
What I'm hoping for:

PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer, Jolly
SF - Ellison /Morris, Buggs
PF - Boucher /King, Buggs
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo

Use all of the scholarships because we'll probably have someone transferring in addition to King and Morris graduating. Seems like we average about one transfer every year.
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I agree with your line-up except I expect Joey King to start at PF.
 

HOOP DREAMS said:
Wonder how long it will take Wally's Mama to start posting on the Marquette board when he gets buried on the bench.
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Halfway through non-conference schedule. Now that Henry is there they are kind of done with wally I'd assume. Not up to date with Marquettes wings but can't imagine him showering in playing time over there
 

The addition of Murphy changes the outlook a lot to much brighter.
PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer,
SF - Morris, Murphy, Buggs, Gilbert
PF - King, Murphy,
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo

We have Stephon Sharp in the mix as well and Reggie Lynch providing competition in waiting.
The only loose end I'm aware of: Does Lofton walk on?
I don't know what position or the combinations that these guys will play together but we have some competition and we have options.
Excited about the addition of Murphy! That makes us better!
 

I think Gilbert and possibly Nwankwo (doubt that one) would be candidates for redshirts. Especially considering Murphy could play some 3.

Class Breakdown

Seniors:
Morris
King

Juniors:
Buggs

Sophomores:
Lynch (will be a junior next year class wise)
Mason
Konate
Diedhiou

Freshman:
Dorsey
Johnson
McBrayer
Murphy
Gilbert (I'd push him back with a redshirt to even these classes out a bit)
Nwankwo

Really curious how Pitino manages this roster over the next 12-16 months. He's got 2 scholarships available for next year, one commit, and a ton of top level targets he's after. without departures he has 3 scholarships over the next two years....

Will Jarvis and Dorsey be ok fighting for 1st string time their entire careers? McBrayer/Mason same question. Murphy is a shoe in to be a 3 year starter beginning next year barring a talented newcomer. Does Buggs stick around? Definitely going to be some attrition, there always is, just curious where it will come from.
 

Winasota Gopher said:
I think Gilbert and possibly Nwankwo (doubt that one) would be candidates for redshirts. Especially considering Murphy could play some 3.

Class Breakdown

Seniors:
Morris
King

Juniors:
Buggs

Sophomores:
Lynch (will be a junior next year class wise)
Mason
Konate
Diedhiou

Freshman:
Dorsey
Johnson
McBrayer
Murphy
Gilbert (I'd push him back with a redshirt to even these classes out a bit)
Nwankwo

Really curious how Pitino manages this roster over the next 12-16 months. He's got 2 scholarships available for next year, one commit, and a ton of top level targets he's after. without departures he has 3 scholarships over the next two years....

Will Jarvis and Dorsey be ok fighting for 1st string time their entire careers? McBrayer/Mason same question. Murphy is a shoe in to be a 3 year starter beginning next year barring a talented newcomer. Does Buggs stick around? Definitely going to be some attrition, there always is, just curious where it will come from.
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I would expect some natural roster attrition next year no matter what. I don't see Johnson and Dorsey competing for minutes. Both fit well into the system, avoiding the "either/or" problem. It is likely that some players rise to the top, while others plateau and thus make other decisions for college. For my money, I hope no one is "forced" out, but with that crowded a freshman class, it is hard to believe there would not be some movement at least.
 

Winasota Gopher said:
Really curious how Pitino manages this roster over the next 12-16 months. He's got 2 scholarships available for next year, one commit, and a ton of top level targets he's after. without departures he has 3 scholarships over the next two years....

Will Jarvis and Dorsey be ok fighting for 1st string time their entire careers? McBrayer/Mason same question. Murphy is a shoe in to be a 3 year starter beginning next year barring a talented newcomer. Does Buggs stick around? Definitely going to be some attrition, there always is, just curious where it will come from.
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I'm going to go out on a limb(not a very big one) here and say we'll have no fewer than 5 scholarships open in the next 2 years. Transfers will happen no big surprise.

Anyway I'm looking forward to seeing this lineup at some point next year.

Mason
Morris
Murphy (my only concern is Dawson and R. Williams were both PF in HS who said they could play a little 3 and niether did well at SF)
King
Konate

They length that this team now has with the addition of gilbert and murphy is awesome.
But I suspect the starting line up will be Dorsey Mason Morris King Konate with Murphy being the first off the bench.
 

Tim1406 said:
Anyway I'm looking forward to seeing this lineup at some point next year.

Mason
Morris
Murphy (my only concern is Dawson and R. Williams were both PF in HS who said they could play a little 3 and niether did well at SF)
King
Konate
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I hope that some time before next season Morris learns how to play team basketball. He had flashes of brilliance last season, but then often reverted to "it's all about me" with his decision making. He has the talent, I hope he changes his approach.
 

60's Guy said:
The addition of Murphy changes the outlook a lot to much brighter.
PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer,
SF - Morris, Murphy, Buggs, Gilbert
PF - King, Murphy,
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo

We have Stephon Sharp in the mix as well and Reggie Lynch providing competition in waiting.
The only loose end I'm aware of: Does Lofton walk on?
I don't know what position or the combinations that these guys will play together but we have some competition and we have options.
Excited about the addition of Murphy! That makes us better!
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I agree with your line up for the most part. I expect to see

PG - Dorsey /Johnson
SG - Mason /McBrayer,
SF - Morris /Murphy/Gilbert
PF - King / Buggs/ Murphy
C - Konate, Diedhiou, Nwankwo
 

I kind of liked seeing Morris come off the bench last year to bring a little spark
 

The team is way more athletic than last year. Should play Pitino's style much better Pretty raw group with a lot of potential for growth. Murphy could see a lot of minutes if he can be our best rebounder. If Buggs can take a step forward that would be exciting. Also it is time for Konate to take over. tHey will need him big time
 

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