Let's slow down on the Fire PJ Chatter

[Dakota2]

Yeah, I honestly can't say our problems are the OC's fault. I think there's just so much that breaks down when you can't complete a forward pass, it's hard to even know if it's a good offense.

Start with getting a capable QB. That said, if we can lure a proven OC, I'm all for it.

“We” could lure a proven successful OC. Fleck will not.

 

[theTurning]

Sometimes a coach has a down year. You mentioned Iowa and Wisconsin. Ferentz had a four win season in 2012, Barry Alvarez had a couple down years between his success.

Alvarez won the Rose Bowl in his 4th year and had 3 top-10 finishes in his first decade. I agree PJ should get another year or two but that’s a terrible comparison.

 

[Dakota2]

PJ has a lot of influence on boosters just by speaking to them and giving them hope and also educate why fundraising for NIL important. Also, PJ I am guessing makes more than 99% of anyone on GH- is there anywhere it says a coach can not donate to the DinkyTown Athletes fund?

Kirk Ferentz has given his university childrens hospital a million or more. Would that be a good example?

 

[FredCoxRocks]

I don't even bother saying anything right now because I know he is secure through next year at the very least.

 

[Dakota2]

to me - this is the most important aspect of the Coaching conversation:

the world of college Football has undergone significant change in recent years. The Portal - NIL - major conference realignment.

So the situation Fleck is in today is NOT the situation that he was hired into 7 years ago.

the approach that may have been fine 7 years ago may not be fine today after all of the changes.

SO - Can Fleck Adapt? Can he adjust his approach and his philosophy to the new reality of college Football in 2023?

and I see concerning signs. Fleck this season more than ever has talked - or some might say complained - about the changes in college FB. A fair assumption could be made that he does not like how things have changed.

But if you run a business, it's your job to adapt and adjust to changing conditions. as the CEO of Gopher Football, it is Fleck's job to adapt and adjust to the changing conditions in college Football.

can he adapt? that is the question that Fleck has to answer.

A CEO who moans publicly about his problems is not the one shareholders will trust to adapt and overcome.

 

[A_Slab_of_Bacon]

PJ is the best HC we’ve had in recent memory.... and it isn't even close.

RTB!

 

[Dakota2]

Lol how did he prove to be a better football coach?

He should be BIG COY. If not he will get some votes. He stepped into an incredible mess and chaos and with no head coaching experience took a team with mediocre talent at best and played good football.

He was, this year, an overwhelmingly better coach than Fleck.

 

[Maroon1992]

What a load of bs. You don’t fire the most successful coach we have had here since the 60s after one 5 win season.

Anyone on the fire the coach bandwagon is being foolish.

I think the issue most have is that not only have we had a horrible year, PJ himself has indicated several times about NIL and that this team is not improving and I fact losing its best players going not next year. Sure one bad year, however I don’t think any of us are anticipating any improvement in the new Big Ten next year and beyond based on PJ’s comments and history so far in the portal.

 

[PMWinSTP]

PJ has a lot of influence on boosters just by speaking to them and giving them hope and also educate why fundraising for NIL important. Also, PJ I am guessing makes more than 99% of anyone on GH- is there anywhere it says a coach can not donate to the DinkyTown Athletes fund?

Yes, in very straightforward, plain language. This has come up over and over on threads out here.

 

[fritzdahmus]

Not sure what your point is? What does the NW coaches season have to do with Flecks season?

His point is.........and you know it.......is that if a NW assistant can do it [same division, same kind of schedule as the Gophers]......why can't PJ and his staff with similiar schedule and similar players..

 

[swede2]

Some might be calling for OJ's head but no one should realistically expect PJ to be fired. He'll be the coach next year and, barring a one or two win season, probably in '25 as well.

I've never cared for PJ's schtick. No need to elaborate. But I liked him as a coach because it seemed at one time that good players were buying into it and that's what matters. But I'm not sure that's the case anymore.

If I was told seven years ago that NIL and free transfers would be a thing, I would have thought we were well positioned, H.C. wise, to meet those challenges. I no longer believe that to be the case. In fact, PJ has resigned himself and this team as inevitable losers in this game when he should be attempting to inspire "investors" in the program.

I'm also of the belief that PJ won't bring in the necessary coaching experience necessary to maximize the players who are here. I know coordinator and assistant salaries are lagging. But if PJ identified a proven coordinator willing to come here, would Coyle say no to such an outlay? I doubt it. More likely, PJ would not want a strong coordinator and/or such a candidate would not want to work for PJ.

PJ isn't getting canned this year and probably not next. But a coach who's seemingly thrown in the towel on current rules, is seemingly incapable of embracing change, and unwillingly to hire staff capable of challenging him won't be around long.

 

[Ewert86PC]

If we were Wisconsin, we'd fire Fleck.
If we were Iowa, we'd fire Fleck.
If we were Michigan, we'd fire Fleck.
If we were Penn State, we'd fire Fleck.
If we were Nebraska, we'd fire Fleck.
But we're Minnesota. And we are just fine with a losing record in year 7 of Fleck's tenure. We're just fine with Fleck having the worst Big 10 recruiting class of 2022. We're just fine knowing that 2024 and 2025 will likely result in even worse records and continued bottom-tier recruiting under Fleck.
And that is why we will continue to lose. It's why we haven't had any type of championship since before most of us were born. Because other Big 10 teams expect more from their teams than we do.

It's not a crime ro have high standards, yet we want to be nice and embrace mediocrity so no feelings are hurt.

 

[MNVCGUY]

It's not a crime ro have high standards, yet we want to be nice and embrace mediocrity so no feelings are hurt.

It isn’t about being nice it is about not over reacting to one down year the way some of you are determined to.

 

[Ewert86PC]

It isn’t about being nice it is about not over reacting to one down year the way some of you are determined to.

I'm talking about the mentality that is pushed on the athletic department by the administration. The "Don't Finish a Game" mentality.

PJ has been a follower of that mentality. It is what drives him to be so conservative. Don't call flashy or big plays because it might make the other team feel bad.

He has to change that mentality going into next year. Otherwise, it is the same old song and dance where we keep trying to recruit players into a culture that is mocked in private by the players.

Row The Boat has to change into Row The Boat Over The Opponent.

 

[kg21]

It isn’t about being nice it is about not over reacting to one down year the way some of you are determined to.

True, but I just don't feel there is anything on this roster to look forward, too.

We are so slow and unathletic.

Nubin is our best defender in a secondary that is a mess. He will be gone.

Linebacker is ho-hum

Our defensive line was shoved all over the place this year. Next year is probably more of the same.

Our offensive line is ok, not great......not sure how that changes.

Our wide receiving core is so weak. What if Jackson left, Holy Shit Balls!

Not sure if the running backs all stay. I hope they do.

Fickell, Beilema and Rhule will make their programs better as they are building.

All these new teams coming in that would put up 40 on this defense like a walk in the park.

I'm usually somewhat optimistic heading into next year. Nothing could be further from the truth for next year.

 

[Gopherchase]

Some might be calling for OJ's head but no one should realistically expect PJ to be fired. He'll be the coach next year and, barring a one or two win season, probably in '25 as well.

I've never cared for PJ's schtick. No need to elaborate. But I liked him as a coach because it seemed at one time that good players were buying into it and that's what matters. But I'm not sure that's the case anymore.

If I was told seven years ago that NIL and free transfers would be a thing, I would have thought we were well positioned, H.C. wise, to meet those challenges. I no longer believe that to be the case. In fact, PJ has resigned himself and this team as inevitable losers in this game when he should be attempting to inspire "investors" in the program.

I'm also of the belief that PJ won't bring in the necessary coaching experience necessary to maximize the players who are here. I know coordinator and assistant salaries are lagging. But if PJ identified a proven coordinator willing to come here, would Coyle say no to such an outlay? I doubt it. More likely, PJ would not want a strong coordinator and/or such a candidate would not want to work for PJ.

PJ isn't getting canned this year and probably not next. But a coach who's seemingly thrown in the towel on current rules, is seemingly incapable of embracing change, and unwillingly to hire staff capable of challenging him won't be around long.

Our assistant coaching salary pool is so low because our assistant coaches don’t have any experience to speak of. It’s a simple as that it has nothing to do with us being cheap with our money. These guys don’t command more than we’re paying them. It’s a disaster staff.

 

[Gopherchase]

It isn’t about being nice it is about not over reacting to one down year the way some of you are determined to.

PJ is a weird dude. PJ has never game plan or game coach very well. I don’t think anybody is knee-jerk overreacting to one bad year. Some of us think we saw this shit coming and would like him to change his best going forward.

 

[wdgold]

But, if we go 5-7 again next year, the HC seat will be

I think it will be a little warm at the start of next season.

 

[Dakota2]

It isn’t about being nice it is about not over reacting to one down year the way some of you are determined to.

Is it really solely your responsibility to determine what are appropriate reactions to a terrible season?

 

[btowngopher]

His point is.........and you know it.......is that if a NW assistant can do it [same division, same kind of schedule as the Gophers]......why can't PJ and his staff with similiar schedule and similar players..

If they can do what? Win 7 games one time? Fleck has already done much more than that.

 

[btowngopher]

He should be BIG COY. If not he will get some votes. He stepped into an incredible mess and chaos and with no head coaching experience took a team with mediocre talent at best and played good football.

He was, this year, an overwhelmingly better coach than Fleck.

Ah this year. I’m sure there have been some years where some random failed coach did better than guys like Ferentz as well.

 

[btowngopher]

Good coaches can put together game plans that allow their teams to defeat teams that they have no business beating. Northwestern did that several times this year.

Cool, am I crazy for wanting to see him do it a few more years before anointing him to be better than someone who has taken two different programs to top 25 finishes?

 

[goldengophers]

PJ is a weird dude. PJ has never game plan or game coach very well. I don’t think anybody is knee-jerk overreacting to one bad year. Some of us think we saw this shit coming and would like him to change his best going forward.

He deserves the chance to turn this around but the NIL whining and lack of inventiveness are wearing thin.

 

[PMWinSTP]

I'm talking about the mentality that is pushed on the athletic department by the administration. The "Don't Finish a Game" mentality.

PJ has been a follower of that mentality. It is what drives him to be so conservative. Don't call flashy or big plays because it might make the other team feel bad.

He has to change that mentality going into next year. Otherwise, it is the same old song and dance where we keep trying to recruit players into a culture that is mocked in private by the players.

Row The Boat has to change into Row The Boat Over The Opponent.

You think the administration is influencing Fleck's game plans. Really? Good grief.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

Iowa wins ugly and often. They have that something extra that the Gophers lack. PJ flaunts his culture and overall its a good thing that develop kids into young men. Kuddos and thanks for that. But Ferentz has established a unique culture that is conducive to winning football games. What that entails is anyone's guess but it is working for Iowa and not working for Minnesota. Our 2019 season is one that relates to what Iowa gets most every year. I think the talent level between the two programs is similar and pretty much a non-factor.

BTW, Ferentz went 7-5 in his 7th season then followed up with 6-7 and 6-6.

Alvarez won the Rose Bowl in his 4th year and had 3 top-10 finishes in his first decade. I agree PJ should get another year or two but that’s a terrible comparison.

 

[SeaBee_Gopher]

Would you all agree that a B1G job is an even better job now than it was when PJ was hired? I believe that's true and is why PJ will absolutely feel the heat if he has another down year. This conference is only getting stronger and richer!

I do think I've seen him make changes this year and try to be a little more aggressive. Not a lot, but a little. I have hope!

 

[OddStack]

One ongoing concern for me has been the tone of his interviews this year. I would expect someone in a head coaching role to have the attitude after a season like this of "we got kicked in the teeth this year, and I do not intend to let that happen again next year." Instead it sounds like a lot of "woe is me" and laying the groundwork for excuses next year.

Yep....big ego often leads to thin skin! SON pointed out how the landscape of CFB has changed since his hire; thus, PJ has to follow his mantra and own advice: change his best!

If he doesn't he'll be gone in 2 years max.

 

[OddStack]

Iowa wins ugly and often. They have that something extra that the Gophers lack. PJ flaunts his culture and overall its a good thing that develop kids into young men. Kuddos and thanks for that. But Ferentz has established a unique culture that is conducive to winning football games. What that entails is anyone's guess but it is working for Iowa and not working for Minnesota. Our 2019 season is one that relates to what Iowa gets most every year. I think the talent level between the two programs is similar and pretty much a non-factor.

BTW, Ferentz went 7-5 in his 7th season then followed up with 6-7 and 6-6.

I agree with your point, but I want to point out to those who might point to Iowa as a reason we should tolerate a down 7th year and not question it that Ferentz had more equity in his first six years.

His 7-5 7th year was after winning the B1G Title 2 times and THREE straight years of finishing the year ranked #8 in the country!

 

[BarnBurner]

Yep.....if 2024 is similar to 2023 you start to have some conversations about Fleck's future with the program. But it would be crazy not to give him the opportunity to fix the issues from this year and get the team back on track.

You seem to be ignoring the "issues" that have been consistently on display the past few seasons. He had had how long to fix special teams? He had had how long to change course with respect to run vs throw.

Hasn't changed and I frankly don't think he will.

 

[Mulligan]

I'm talking about the mentality that is pushed on the athletic department by the administration. The "Don't Finish a Game" mentality.

PJ has been a follower of that mentality. It is what drives him to be so conservative. Don't call flashy or big plays because it might make the other team feel bad.

He has to change that mentality going into next year. Otherwise, it is the same old song and dance where we keep trying to recruit players into a culture that is mocked in private by the players.

Row The Boat has to change into Row The Boat Over The Opponent.

Congrats! Might be one of the 10 dumbest statements ever on GH.