Kirk Ciarrocca out at Penn St

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hungan1 said:
If Sanford is offered a head coaching job elsewhere and takes it, will PJ Fleck hire him back? Will KC want to come back to MN?
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IF it were to happen:

PJ doesn't seem like the grudges type. But there's so much to consider. Dude did take off to go be closer to home, he took the job at west virgina for a few hours ... you gotta wonder if he would if he could again. Like I don't blame KC, but PJ might wonder.

On the other hand PJ really seems to think that coaches and everyone moving on is just part of the process.
 


It makes next season interesting with all the moving parts.
 

tjgopher said:
I think it came down to a candidate with strong Pennsylvania ties and a strong resume became available, so they spent the money to get him. If the new guy PSU hired doesn't get fired at Texas and remains employed in Austin, then KC is likely still at PSU.
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Sounds like Franklin may have wanted Texas guy last year. Tough business, but they get paid pretty well.
 



First, I feel absolutely awful for KC. He built an offense at Minnesota that earned him a job a top program near his home. He should not have lost his job over 1 year of performance during COVID when his offense averaged 430 yards per game.

Second, I would love to see him come back to the Minnesota program. As much as I hated his bland running schemes, he worked wonders with the Minnesota offense that I don't think we've ever seen before.

Third, bringing him back might not be a viable option. Minnesota already has two offensive coordinators. I'm not bought in on Sanford, but the people on this forum are right that he probably doesn't deserve to lose his job.

Tough situation all around. Wish him the best, and would be excited to see him come back, but I'm not sure that it's realistic or the best move for the program. Will be interesting to see what Fleck does though.
 
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A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
IF it were to happen:

PJ doesn't seem like the grudges type. But there's so much to consider. Dude did take off to go be closer to home, he took the job at west virgina for a few hours ... you gotta wonder if he would if he could again. Like I don't blame KC, but PJ might wonder.

On the other hand PJ really seems to think that coaches and everyone moving on is just part of the process.
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One more can of fuel I believe on this. If I remember correctly, wasn't Fleck unhappy that he left before our bowl game last year?
 



#2Gopher said:
One more can of fuel I believe on this. If I remember correctly, wasn't Fleck unhappy that he left before our bowl game last year?
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Not sure if that was teh case. IIRC PJ decided Kirk would not coach that game. You could make that call for a number of reasons so I'm not 100% sure we know what the story was there. I think folks interperted in PJ's call being unhappy, but it may have been that PJ just felt that if you're done... yeah you go do your other thing.
 

There has to be more to this this story because it is really rare to fire an OC after one year. Especially when you factor in the messed up off season that would have made it much more difficult for him to install his offensive system.

I don't know what but I will not be surprised to find out there was something behind the scenes above and beyond the on the field struggles they had this year that led to this decision.

I mean for as much as they struggled to start the year they ended the season on a 4 game winning streak so it is not like they were playing badly at the end of the year.

There has to be more to this story then just wanting to make a change.
 





MNVCGUY said:
There has to be more to this this story because it is really rare to fire an OC after one year. Especially when you factor in the messed up off season that would have made it much more difficult for him to install his offensive system.

I don't know what but I will not be surprised to find out there was something behind the scenes above and beyond the on the field struggles they had this year that led to this decision.

I mean for as much as they struggled to start the year they ended the season on a 4 game winning streak so it is not like they were playing badly at the end of the year.

There has to be more to this story then just wanting to make a change.
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As Maxy wondered in post #34, this guy was available last year too, and might have been Franklin's #1 choice, but went to Texas instead. Then Herman gets let go, and he's available again.

If they had won more games, maybe it's harder to let KC go? But at 4-5, especially starting 0-5, I guessing Franklin had to roll some heads just to appease their boosters?
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Not sure if that was teh case. IIRC PJ decided Kirk would not coach that game. You could make that call for a number of reasons so I'm not 100% sure we know what the story was there. I think folks interperted in PJ's call being unhappy, but it may have been that PJ just felt that if you're done... yeah you go do your other thing.
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PJ said leading up to the Outback Bowl that had KC taken a job outside of the Big Ten he would have let him coach in the bowl game, but he felt with him going to a conference opponent, he had to be done when he took the job at PSU.

PJ also said this year that he and KC texted quite a bit during the season, so I don't think there is bad blood there.
 

MNVCGUY said:
There has to be more to this this story
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Probably a lil' of two things... A bit of deflection, since it's easier to blame KC than it is for Franklin to accept the responsibility of what is perceived as a poor season. Also, the thoughts that now Franklin has the OC that he originally wanted in the first place are valid, I think.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Not sure if that was teh case. IIRC PJ decided Kirk would not coach that game. You could make that call for a number of reasons so I'm not 100% sure we know what the story was there. I think folks interperted in PJ's call being unhappy, but it may have been that PJ just felt that if you're done... yeah you go do your other thing.
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IMHO, he gave Matt Simon an opportunity to coach at the Outback Bowl to see if he was comfortable being the OC.
 

hungan1 said:
IMHO, he gave Matt Simon an opportunity to coach at the Outback Bowl to see if he was comfortable being the OC.
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Yeah could just be time to move forward with the coaches who will be there and see how it goes.
 

Sometimes you have to be careful for what you wish for...

Kirk was in a good position here with a HC that was loyal to him. He decided to move on for the bright lights and got burned. I think this is all just an "upgrade" move by PSU. They had the opportunity to get a "better" OC and they took it. Just as Kirk did when he moved to PSU. PSU has no loyalty to Kirk.
 

alchemy2u said:
Sometimes you have to be careful for what you wish for...

Kirk was in a good position here with a HC that was loyal to him. He decided to move on for the bright lights and got burned. I think this is all just an "upgrade" move by PSU. They had the opportunity to get a "better" OC and they took it. Just as Kirk did when he moved to PSU. PSU has no loyalty to Kirk.
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Kirk and PJ Fleck are friends going back to their Rutgers coaching days. Franklin is a different type of head coach. It is neither good or bad. PSU has very high expectations and Franklin made the move for who he thinks will work better with his scheme. Unfortunately, Kirk was the odd man out.
 



hungan1 said:
If Sanford is offered a head coaching job elsewhere and takes it, will PJ Fleck hire him back? Will KC want to come back to MN?
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Sanford is a TERRIBLE offensive coordinator, the job should've been Simon's....
...that said, I wonder, and hope, Kirk comes back here immediately.
 

You guys/gals are forgetting one thing. Franklin is such a jerk. Maybe KC didn’t march to the bosses orders. Big contest - who is the bigger jerk - Halbaugh or Franklin? My money is on Franklin.
 

MNVCGUY said:
There has to be more to this this story because it is really rare to fire an OC after one year. Especially when you factor in the messed up off season that would have made it much more difficult for him to install his offensive system.

I don't know what but I will not be surprised to find out there was something behind the scenes above and beyond the on the field struggles they had this year that led to this decision.

I mean for as much as they struggled to start the year they ended the season on a 4 game winning streak so it is not like they were playing badly at the end of the year.

There has to be more to this story then just wanting to make a change.
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Pure speculation, but Kirk had the reputation of being the introverted technical type. That worked fine with PJ being the polar opposite. He was a QB whisperer for a stoic and humble Morgan. That personality type might not be a good fit for high profile programs where the OC is expected to recruit and more players are prima donnas.
 

Pete smith said:
You guys/gals are forgetting one thing. Franklin is such a jerk. Maybe KC didn’t march to the bosses orders. Big contest - who is the bigger jerk - Halbaugh or Franklin? My money is on Franklin.
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I think Franklin is overrated but I don't know if I have heard he's a jerk.
 

hungan1 said:
Kirk and PJ Fleck are friends going back to their Rutgers coaching days. Franklin is a different type of head coach. It is neither good or bad. PSU has very high expectations and Franklin made the move for who he thinks will work better with his scheme. Unfortunately, Kirk was the odd man out.
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I also believe Fleck has high expectations as well. Franklin should have know better as to what he wants in a OC. If he didn't think that Kirk fits into his scheme, he shouldn't have hired him in the first place.
 

 

Before passing judgement on Franklin and the program he runs, I recommend you watch (if you're able to, it's HBO) the episode on their program from the 2019 season (before they played us at TCF): https://www.hbo.com/specials/247-college-football/247-college-football-penn-state-nittany-lions

When I watched that, I thought he seemed like a wonderful family man and ran a great program.

But I'm also not naive enough to think that Franklin and PSU had no control over how the episode was edited. I'm sure they had to sign off on it, before it aired.
 

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