Kill: changing my grade from B to A

[NIU007]

Bob

this is no time to bring facts into the discussion

He didn't build the program, take it from a fan that's been watching them for a long time. 2007 they were 2-10 due to a ton of injuries. I mean, way more than usual. To the point that coach Novak let a bunch of players keep their redshirts instead of playing them so they would still have 4 years of eligibility, as we were not going anywhere that year. Prior to that we had winning records for several years running.

Kill did NOT build the program. He had one good year against what turned out to be a weaker conference this year. Also, getting into a bowl game doesn't tell you anything now. If there were as many bowl games years ago as there are now, the previous coach would have had us in a bowl game every year from 2002-2006.

Just thought I'd let you know......

 

[Monty519]

No, I agree Kill did not build it, NIU was legit in the mid 2000s. But they were declining, 7-5 in 2005, 7-6 in 2006, then 2-10 in 2007. When previous seasons they were rocking 10-2, 9-3. Kill comes in, and it's 6-7, 7-6, and then 10-3, with numerous beatdowns. He also improved the recruiting from what it was in '06-'08, from like last up to 4th in 2010. Not quite the 1st NIU was pulling in the early-mid 2000s, but a vast improvement.

Kill just made it better than what it was when he left it. That's really my only expectation of the man right now, which really is pretty low, but when I say better, I mean hopefully more than just repeated 3-5 BT records every year. If we could do repeated 4-4 records, that would be nice, especially considering our division. I do cringe a little bit when people say he "built" NIU, that's not completely accurate. He "built" at his other stops, but NIU, he more revived it back to the top, I'd say.

 

[Uffda]

He didn't build the program, take it from a fan that's been watching them for a long time. 2007 they were 2-10 due to a ton of injuries. I mean, way more than usual. To the point that coach Novak let a bunch of players keep their redshirts instead of playing them so they would still have 4 years of eligibility, as we were not going anywhere that year. Prior to that we had winning records for several years running.

Kill did NOT build the program. He had one good year against what turned out to be a weaker conference this year. Also, getting into a bowl game doesn't tell you anything now. If there were as many bowl games years ago as there are now, the previous coach would have had us in a bowl game every year from 2002-2006.

Just thought I'd let you know......

I guess you should be happy he is leaving.

 

[NIU007]

I guess you should be happy he is leaving.

Other than this year his record was about the same as coach Novak's last couple, not counting the injury-riddled season. So it's kind of, take it or leave it. He's a good coach, so was Novak, overall I would rather he stayed because we don't know what we'll get to replace him (we can't afford as much as a Big10 team obviously), though the jury is still out on his recruiting, as most of our best players are still Novak's. I just hope we're able to get another coach that won't let the program sink back down. Don't like the fact that he's leaving us without a HC, OC, or DC for the bowl game. That hurts the players, team, school and even the conference indirectly, and I have a problem with that.

We had it easier this year since we didn't have to beat a Toledo team with Bruce Gradkowski, Ball State with Nate Davis, Central Michigan with Dan Lefevour, or Miami with Roethlisberger, which is what Novak had to beat each year. MAC passing defenses tend to not be good enough to consistently stop efficient QBs like that, if they have good receivers. And NIU was not good enough any of those years (including this year), except 2003, early in the year.

 

[year of the gopher]

Other than this year his record was about the same as coach Novak's last couple, not counting the injury-riddled season. So it's kind of, take it or leave it. He's a good coach, so was Novak, overall I would rather he stayed because we don't know what we'll get to replace him (we can't afford as much as a Big10 team obviously), though the jury is still out on his recruiting, as most of our best players are still Novak's. I just hope we're able to get another coach that won't let the program sink back down. Don't like the fact that he's leaving us without a HC, OC, or DC for the bowl game. That hurts the players, team, school and even the conference indirectly, and I have a problem with that.

We had it easier this year since we didn't have to beat a Toledo team with Bruce Gradkowski, Ball State with Nate Davis, Central Michigan with Dan Lefevour, or Miami with Roethlisberger, which is what Novak had to beat each year. MAC passing defenses tend to not be good enough to consistently stop efficient QBs like that, if they have good receivers. And NIU was not good enough any of those years (including this year), except 2003, early in the year.

Other than Tim Brewster's first year and his last year the Gophers were a middle of the pack team. Does that mean that if Kill is successful he won't have rebuilt the program?

I'ts one thing to say it's not a total ground-up rebuild if there is some talent still around, but it's quite another to refrain from giving him credit when he clearly brought the team back after they had fallen off a cliff.

 

[RodentRampage]

The matter of disagreement seems to be how high the cliff was.

 

[NIU007]

Other than Tim Brewster's first year and his last year the Gophers were a middle of the pack team. Does that mean that if Kill is successful he won't have rebuilt the program?

I'ts one thing to say it's not a total ground-up rebuild if there is some talent still around, but it's quite another to refrain from giving him credit when he clearly brought the team back after they had fallen off a cliff.

Depends on how "successful" Kill is.

It shouldn't be difficult to understand that they had one year with a ton of injuries to key players AND their backups, which resulted in a bad year. It's even worse for a MAC school when that happens, without having the depth of a Big10 school. It is not an indicator of the position the team was in talent-wise. So they had not fallen off a cliff, unless you simply look at the record and none of the actual facts behind it. Thus, he doesn't get a lot of credit for "rebuilding". This year we had very few injuries - in fact, fewer than I've ever seen us have in a couple decades of watching. I may have to credit Kill on the defensive side for rotating a lot of players to keep them fresh. But a lot of it is just luck. Plus, we don't know if it's sustainable once Novak's recruits leave and all we have are Kill's recruits.

I don't have anything against Kill except the manner of his leaving. I'm just telling it like it is.

 

[kittysparrow]

I am still at an F and a press conference won't change that.

No success at a major school
2 wins in 3 years against teams with over .500 records
No experience period at a major school
No reason to believe he will recruit to at least the middle of the Big Ten
His staff has no experience recruiting top tier BCS athletes
Lost one of the biggest games in NIU history as 17.5 point favorites
Sub .500 playoff record in the lower divisions

I thought the administration "got it" this time. I was wrong.

He does have experience recruiting high caliber athletes, but it's a tough sell to go to NIU over Illinois, Iowa and others that raid the chicago area. To not like him is fine, but he is a solid coach.

 

[kittysparrow]

None of those guys were even close to the top of my list, but Edsall has coached and recruited in the Big East. Hoke was the Dline coach for Michigan and has experience at a level above the MAC at San Diego State. Golden was at Virginia in the ACC, so again there's experience at a level above the MAC in both coaching and recruiting. I'd take any of the three above Kill.

Big deal if Hoke was a dline coach in the Big ten. Brewster coached in the NFL. Doesn't mean a thing.

 

[hillbillygopher]

You are an intelligent, well spoken

Depends on how "successful" Kill is.

It shouldn't be difficult to understand that they had one year with a ton of injuries to key players AND their backups, which resulted in a bad year. It's even worse for a MAC school when that happens, without having the depth of a Big10 school. It is not an indicator of the position the team was in talent-wise. So they had not fallen off a cliff, unless you simply look at the record and none of the actual facts behind it. Thus, he doesn't get a lot of credit for "rebuilding". This year we had very few injuries - in fact, fewer than I've ever seen us have in a couple decades of watching. I may have to credit Kill on the defensive side for rotating a lot of players to keep them fresh. But a lot of it is just luck. Plus, we don't know if it's sustainable once Novak's recruits leave and all we have are Kill's recruits.

I don't have anything against Kill except the manner of his leaving. I'm just telling it like it is.

observer of reality. Not everyone on this board likes to deal with that. Thanks for your postings as we need a little perspective. I lived in northern Illinois during the years that Novak was putting the program on the map and know that he laid a good foundation for Kill and company.