Kill blames players in the Startribune today.

[Mick Turition]

I'm not sold on Kill yet either. But on the other hand these players are soft, whiney quitters; especially the upperclassmen. Many will be leaving the program after this year and good riddance. The program has had many low points but this is as low as it has ever been. Good or bad Kill will be cleaning house and that means getting rid of a lot of lousy football players, especially upperclassmen.

 

[MaxyJR1]

But on the other hand these players are soft, whiney quitters; especially the upperclassmen. Many will be leaving the program after this year and good riddance.

Wow- that is quite the blanket assumption. Who is whiny, soft and a quitter? These guys you are talking about have been through so much, we should be thankful they stuck it out this long.

 

[Mulligan]

He does greatly exaggerate his own abilities. It's not the MAC anymore, you're at best a middle of the pack coach.

Ya, he's been quoted many times about how he wasn't the first choice. Basically, he's said he's tough and he's going to work hard and it's going to take him time to get this done. Would much rather have a guy saying he's not too sure if he's good enough to build a winner here. Be upset or concerned over what you've seen on the field, but this crap getting upset over things Kill has said is ridiculous.

 

[Shielder]

Two monumental mistakes being made by too many fans right now:

First; Why would anybody assume that what Kill says in the media is the same message that is being driven home every day in practice, all week long, every week. For the most part, players aren't stupid. They are going MUCH more with what happens in practice than a few blurbs in the media.

Second; People who make comments that basically indicate they are assuming they know what's going on in the locker room couldn't do a more effective job of showing just how ignorant they are. You have no clue what's going on in that locker room. Period. The only benefit of people making statements like these is it makes it a lot easier to know who's comments and opinions should be completely ignored.

Bingo

 

[Fuzzy Rumpton]

Would you want to play for a coach that is constantly throwing you under the bus? And for coordinators that tell you your slow, not fast enough,
not strong enough, not good enough for the Big10 when the coordinators are big and fat and have not missed any meals, and everything they tell the players not to be? Has there game plan
and scheme been good enough against New Mexico State, North Dakota State, and now 58-0 Michigan beat down, no it hasn't. The health factors have compounded the problem.
First and foremost the head coach, he needs to take care of himself, the program may be in trouble but
he needs to get himself squared away first and foremost,health wise before he can even attempt to fix this mess. These coaches seem to forget the part that you have to motivate the existing guy's to want to play, not just tell them they are no good.

That and the head coach constantly points to the one player he recruited Marcus Jones,
and holds him out there like a shiny new " puppy" look at this, this is the one guy I recruited and he is the best player in the program. May be true, but some things should not be constantly blurted out to the media and are not NEED To Know, why create cliques and divides in the locker room if you do not have too. Looks bad to the old dogs even if you think your doing the right thing in sending a message that you want them gone and it especially looks bad to the one dog that might actually be able to elevate you and get you some wins and some credibility.

Coaching is also take bad and and going wrong and make better, incremental improvement, show something, a little extra effort in rewarding extract effort, you can do that with existing players with out breaking them down to the point of blaming them for the entire failure. Coaches have to be better too, not just the players at some point you have to create a relationship that makes them want to play for you and get better. You don't think these players have any PRIDE, BS they have pride, what they don't have is belief right now that what they are doing is right. That is our biggest downfall, we lack belief that what we are practicing and trying will help us win, we don't just lack play makers there are some in the ranks what we lack is belief this is going anywhere.

How about the players get some damn testicles and prove him wrong.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

The play of the Seniors and other veterans has been very poor. Like I posted, the guys need to look at their input in this and either be a part of the problem or a part of the solution.

Coach Kill has been very upfront with his expectations and will play the guys who put forth the effort.

How about the players get some damn testicles and prove him wrong.

 

[Shores Esq]

Yes, he needs to tell the kids how good they are and how if they just tried a little harder, they'd win. What a crock of horse*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#*&^!#. First, you can't lie to a college kid. They know when they are overmatched. Second, handing out treats for motivation isn't going to move this program where it needs to be.

Amazing how many head coaches post on Gopherhole.

 

[denguegopher]

Here's a quote from the Strib. I don't see how this blames the kids:



http://www.startribune.com/sports/gophers/130919998.html

That quote is not that bad. We do have to play with more confidence though. I see that in '86 after losing 63-0 to Oklahoma we came back to beat Michigan. However after the 58-0 rout in '91 at the hands of Colorado we tanked it, winning only one more game. Building confidence after losing huge will be an obvious challenge.

 

[station19]

Coach Kill should contact the Big Ten commish imediately and DEMAND that there will be no score kept during the Gophers remaining games this year. That will help their self-esteem.

 

[Oneoldgopher]

Coach Kill has placed plenty of blame on himself. Just in case you haven't been following things, Coach Kill doesn't sugar coat things and has been very transparent. As I posted in another thread, its time for the players to do a self-analysis with their part in this debacle and get it in gear. Especially the Sr's. Coach Kill has called them out and for a reason.

Transparency? Is self deprecation transparent? It is a form of deflective behavior, like telling falsehoods, except by keeping people off subject. The difference between Brew and Kill is simply that Brew would look away from the person asking the question immediately after completing his answer. Kill looks away from you after he has stared you down. To him it is a contest of will. He will try to subordinate your will to his.

 

[EverTheSkeptic]

I hope we don't have another Jim Wacker on our hands - successful with mid-level programs but in way over his head in the Big Ten.

 

[supadupafly]

some real revisionist history going on here in regards to coach kill. he has essentially said the same thing since day 1 and his message has not changed. he has been honest from the beginning and has not sugarcoated where this current roster of players are at talent wise and toughness/discipline wise.

his message all along has been that he is a tough coach to play for, he expects guys to work hard personally towards becoming disciplined players and students, that there is a lack of true "football players" on this current roster, and that this team and likely teams for the next year or two are going to have to out hustle, outwork and be more disciplined than a number of teams they will play, if they are going to win some games and pull off some upsets.

those of you saying he is throwing people/players under the bus are clueless and have not been paying attention to what he has been saying since he got here on day 1. he is not now throwing players or others under the bus. he has said all along there is a cleaning of the whole house that needs to take place and that it is going to take some time to get there.

 

[Oneoldgopher]

I'll start with this, the staff is absolutely rippable for what's happened. But don't you think that part of Kill's method for "throwing players under the bus" is motivation? If someone told me I wasn't good enough, I'd work my a$$ off to prove them wrong. That's part of being a tough, hard-nosed individual. Unfortunately, our upperclassmen have taken the opposite approach and rolled over.

Kill has taken his share of the blame for what's gone wrong. He's come out and said they've been out-coached in some games. What would you like him to say about the players, that he has all the pieces in place for a Rose Bowl run? That we're "close?" He's calling it like he sees it.

Hey John, if you had given 100% before being thrown under the bus, why would you have to try to prove someone wrong by working even harder? You can't give more than 100%. It is more likely that the coach put you in a position to fail. When a coach says he has been out coached, you don't give the guy a cookie. You find a replacement for him. What are you going to do about a coach who ADMITS he is getting out coached? Admission is guilt. Yet, in the next breath he went after the seniors! The guy is desperate and knows he is over his head. No pass should be given to a guy who takes a job and screws it up worse than it was before.

 

[RodentRampage]

Wacker wasn't successful with level programs. He did well at the NAIA and D-II level, but as a D-I head coach, he had a 40-58-2 record overall, with a 21-48-1 conference record before he took the Minnesota job. He had a total of 2 winning seasons at TCU, and only one season with a winning conference record at TCU.

 

[wait!what?]

Yeah, but Wacker was a country hick...

 

[RodentRampage]

Yeah, but Wacker was a country hick...

Wacker was born and raised in Detroit, Michigan.

 

[denguegopher]

Hey John, if you had given 100% before being thrown under the bus, why would you have to try to prove someone wrong by working even harder? You can't give more than 100%. I'll buy this It is more likely that the coach put you in a position to fail. Maybe, if you consider playing the schedule putting people in a position to fail When a coach says he has been out coached, you don't give the guy a cookie. You find a replacement for him. This is a "no sale." He has coached a total of 5 games and you want to find a replacement for him. If you were the AD would you have offered him a 5 game contract? What are you going to do about a coach who ADMITS he is getting out coached? Admission is guilt. Yet, in thha next breath he went after the seniors! The guy is desperate and knows he is over his head. No pass should be given to a guy who takes a job and screws it up worse than it was before.

Again, he's 5 games into this job. I don't know if Kill will work out, but please relax a little, its still early

 

[Brewscrew]

Sorry, but it IS on the players. Poor execution, mental mistakes etc., are the fault of the players. Show some friggin pride already, these clowns just up and quit yesterday.

Calling kids clowns is taking pride in your team? Way to be a tough guy Dixie. Not every kid quit and they weren't all horrible on every play. Saturday sucked, move on and get over it, the team has 7 games left to show improvement

 

[dpodoll68]

OOG has been singing the same tune since he regrettably started posting here. The gist is that if Kill isn't immediately successful, he's definitely not the right guy and needs to be fired right away. I don't know what jollies he gets from it -probably getting to brag about "how he knew about Kill before anyone else did" or something to that effect. At any rate, it's transparent and pathetic. I can't wait to rub it in his disgustingly old face when Kill turns this thing around. (He is 49, you know - probably hooked up to ventilators just to survive due to his advanced age.)

 

[littlebigboy]

OOG a suggestion, tape the games and go back and watch closely to who is putting out and who is going thru the motions! Then come back here and tell us how many are giving 100% for the whole game! When 8-9 guys give 100% and a couple of old guard guys slack off what happens,the whole play blows up. He will get rid of the dead wood, and I'm sure those that are putting out aren't treated as slackers.

 

[Formo]

OOG has been singing the same tune since he regrettably started posting here. The gist is that if Kill isn't immediately successful, he's definitely not the right guy and needs to be fired right away. I don't know what jollies he gets from it -probably getting to brag about "how he knew about Kill before anyone else did" or something to that effect. At any rate, it's transparent and pathetic. I can't wait to rub it in his disgustingly old face when Kill turns this thing around. (He is 49, you know - probably hooked up to ventilators just to survive due to his advanced age.)

/cheer!!!!!

 

[Iceland12]

OOG has been singing the same tune since he regrettably started posting here. The gist is that if Kill isn't immediately successful, he's definitely not the right guy and needs to be fired right away. I don't know what jollies he gets from it -probably getting to brag about "how he knew about Kill before anyone else did" or something to that effect. At any rate, it's transparent and pathetic. I can't wait to rub it in his disgustingly old face when Kill turns this thing around. (He is 49, you know - probably hooked up to ventilators just to survive due to his advanced age.)

 

[RodentRampage]

Well, he's obviously a time traveler with great attention to detail, as he is able to miss backup quarterbacks who played before he was born.

 

[GopherOhana]

hopefully no clowns and just kids thinking too much as they develop through the j curve

 

[Buttcheeks McGaffigan]

Wacker wasn't successful with level programs. He did well at the NAIA and D-II level, but as a D-I head coach, he had a 40-58-2 record overall, with a 21-48-1 conference record before he took the Minnesota job. He had a total of 2 winning seasons at TCU, and only one season with a winning conference record at TCU.

Off Wiki

After the first game of the season, Wacker discovered that several players, including Davis, had been benefiting from a payment plan in violation of NCAA rules. He dismissed the players from the team and voluntarily reported the infractions to the NCAA, which issued stiff recruiting penalties on his team.

 

[RodentRampage]

After the first game of the season, Wacker discovered that several players, including Davis, had been benefiting from a payment plan in violation of NCAA rules. He dismissed the players from the team and voluntarily reported the infractions to the NCAA, which issued stiff recruiting penalties on his team.

What's your point?

1983 TCU 1–8–2 1–6–1 8th
1984 TCU 8–4 5–3 T–3rd
1985 TCU 3–8 0–8 9th
1986 TCU 3–8 1–7 8th
1987 TCU 5–6 3–4 T–5th
1988 TCU 4–7 2–5 T–5th
1989 TCU 4–7 2–6 T–7th
1990 TCU 5–6 3–5 T–5th
1991 TCU 7–4 4–4 T–5th

He was there for 9 years.

 

[Winnipegopher]

I tihnk the point is people tend to undersell Wacker's success in a very tough conference to win in. The bad records in 1985 and 86 were directly caused by the self reporting of NCAA violations.

Even with those bad years he has a very similar record to Mason.

Wacker, at the time of hire, was a much better hire than Kill at the time of his hire.

 

[RodentRampage]

Even if we throw out the Wacker's early years at TCU, where do we stop? At what point does he own his record? Two winning seasons in 9 years. One winning record in conference play. Since when is a coach with a 40-58-2 record as a D-I head coach a strong hire? Wacker did great at the D-II and NAIA levels. Kill's resume as a D-I coach was more solid.

 

[GopherGod]

I tihnk the point is people tend to undersell Wacker's success in a very tough conference to win in. The bad records in 1985 and 86 were directly caused by the self reporting of NCAA violations.

Even with those bad years he has a very similar record to Mason.

Wacker, at the time of hire, was a much better hire than Kill at the time of his hire.

Not at all suprised that Wacker couldn't win in the most crooked conference ever, the SWC. It is hard to win when you are trying to play by the rules and so many of your conference mates are blatantly cheating. The point is that success at a lower level is not a predictor of success or failure at another level.

 

[Winnipegopher]

Kill's resume as a D-I coach was more solid.

How so? Kill coached three season in the MAC and never won a conference championship. Lasting nine years (and not getting fired) in the SWC seems more impressive than one good year in the MAC (5-3 in conference play twice in the three years he was there).