Kansas coaching search: Les Miles and 5 candidates (5. Tracy Claeys)

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Bob_Loblaw said:
2.5 years?

Claeyes was fired in January of 2017, and Kaler announced he was *ahem "stepping down" in July of 2018. So 1.5 years.

Are you really arguing that Kaler just naturally drifted away from the position and it had nothing to do with his mismanagement of the situation?

Obviously you realize it's absurd, it's why you had to fib a bit on the timing.
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Hate to break it to you, but the football situation in December of 2016 had nothing to do with Kaler announcing his retirement in June of 2018. Zero.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Love ya Bob, but you are incredibly off base here. The original 2.5 years was correct. Claeys was fired in January 2017, and Kaler is stepping down as U of M President in July 2019. That's 2.5 years. He is voluntarily leaving a very demanding position, one that he will have held for 8 years by the time he steps down. In modern times, you will rarely find a major university president who lasts longer than 5-6 years in the position.

Moreover, he announced his planned departure from the position a year in advance. When is the last time you heard of someone who was fired for malfeasance and said, "Hey, is it cool if I stick around for another year?"

Additionally, he is not leaving the U. He is serving in an emeritus fundraising role for a year, then serving on the CSE faculty after a sabbatical. Again, when is the last time someone fired for malfeasance was allowed to stay on with the organization?

Your notions are silly and absurd. You're better than this.
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This doesn't hit the nail on the head ... it blasts the nail through the plank with a single swing of the hammer.

Kaler very publicly and very loudly dared the U to fire him for refusing to reinstate the players. They didn't, and he didn't. And we won the game anyway. And then Coyle had the ammo he needed to dismiss Claeys because of the tweet.


Would've been very, very interesting to see how Coyle would've done it without that Tweet. He would've still done it, and it would've involved the scandal. Just would've had to be more crafty about it.
 

tjgopher said:
This is the correct answer. People may want to blame the tweet for the reason TC was fired and certainly that was part of it. But, the complete and utter lack of leadership was the problem. There is zero chance that a Jerry Kill or a Barry Alvarez or a Kirk Ferentz or even a PJ Fleck would let that boycott go public. No chance. It would have been stopped long before anyone left that locker room. To stand by and think he would lose the team if he stopped the boycott was his undoing, plain and simple. It is too bad, too. The players were always going to get due process, that was in the protocol. They got it and five were cleared. That was going to happen whether the team boycotted or not. Literally, the boycott had no effect on the situation other than to paint the U in a bad light and cost TC his job.

Players were given some horribly bad advice by some advisers who completely miscalculated the situation and TC stood by and let them walk the plank for him.
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I believe the team did win some concessions from the school as far as the demographic make up of the hearing panel and they raised a lot of awareness around the issue of lack of due process at the school. They ended up doing a lot of good. Your opinion is valid but at times there are two sides to these types of issues.

I won’t argue Claeys made some missteps and isn’t a strong leader in the typical mold of a Kill, Patterson, Alvarez, et al but I respect his explanation on why the coaches supported the players. Like I said they ought to have made more diplomatic statements regarding the feelings of accusers and victims but the team was in fact ultimately vindicated and the school was found by the student panel to have overstepped.
 

tjgopher said:
This is the correct answer. People may want to blame the tweet for the reason TC was fired and certainly that was part of it. But, the complete and utter lack of leadership was the problem. There is zero chance that a Jerry Kill or a Barry Alvarez or a Kirk Ferentz or even a PJ Fleck would let that boycott go public. No chance. It would have been stopped long before anyone left that locker room. To stand by and think he would lose the team if he stopped the boycott was his undoing, plain and simple. It is too bad, too. The players were always going to get due process, that was in the protocol. They got it and five were cleared. That was going to happen whether the team boycotted or not. Literally, the boycott had no effect on the situation other than to paint the U in a bad light and cost TC his job.

Players were given some horribly bad advice by some advisers who completely miscalculated the situation and TC stood by and let them walk the plank for him.
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He was also fired because he is really overweight. Not trying to weight shame but public image matters in recruiting, and the fact that he was fat was used against him. Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
 

hello-world said:
I have no patience for PJ's performance this year, but that has no meaning when evaluating Claeys' HC potential.
I don't think Claeys is a good candidate. I think he's a slightly below average candidate with a lot of upside.

I think Kansas would be a good fit for him, but after watching his mismanagement at Minnesota, I don't know that I would feel comfortable with his preparedness at another P5 school.

Whether you think he should have supported the boycott or not, he handled it horribly.

A clumsy Tweet did nothing to advance the players' interest and cost him his own job.

He could have talked the players down, helped them come up with a strategy to address Coyle and the media, and acted like a true head coach, but instead, he Tweeted out an insubordinate and poorly thought out message that escalated the situation.

That was stupid and if you think that was the correct thing to do then I question your judgement as well.

He deserved to get fired and given his clumsy media campaign to recover from it, I don't think he learned much from that situation.

If he ever learns how to lead in crisis then he'll be a great head coach, but, if I was an AD, I would never, ever, take a shot on him.
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I hate to break it to you, but no one cares what he did when it comes to things not on the football field or in the recruiting process. WHO CARES if the University big wheels don't like him tweeting something or sticking up
for his players. I am a FAN and I want WINS. I don't care about anything else. Certainly not what the self important, liberal babies that run the U of M think.

Realize, other programs and their fans feel the same way. No one cares if the players party, or if they do their schoolwork, or if they graduate. They care if they WIN and that's about it.

I don't mind PJ and won't call for his head. But them firing Claeys after winning 9 games was BS. They should have waited to see if he could do it again. If he failed and the team turned back into a pumpkin, fire him then.
 


gopherdudepart2 said:
He was also fired because he is really overweight. Not trying to weight shame but public image matters in recruiting, and the fact that he was fat was used against him. Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
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So sick of this idea that he was fired because he was overweight. Why does it have to be any more complicated then Coyle as a new AD wanted to hire his own guy to run the football program? It happens all the time all over the country.

New AD wants to hire their people, new coaches come in and hire their people, there is no such thing as loyalty to a school in college football anymore.

Take the situation here, keep all other factors the same and just take a bunch of weight off of TC. The end result still would have been exactly the same. The idea that his weight factored into the decision is just stupid. Coyle was going to replace him because he was an inherited head coach who was only in the position because the previous guy had to step down for health reasons.

Coyle wanted to bring in his own guy to run the team and the situation at the time made it easy for him to do that.

The fact that TC is overweight might work against him in trying to land a new HC gig somewhere else but it had nothing to do with why he was let go here.
 

MNVCGUY said:
So sick of this idea that he was fired because he was overweight. Why does it have to be any more complicated then Coyle as a new AD wanted to hire his own guy to run the football program? It happens all the time all over the country.

New AD wants to hire their people, new coaches come in and hire their people, there is no such thing as loyalty to a school in college football anymore.

Take the situation here, keep all other factors the same and just take a bunch of weight off of TC. The end result still would have been exactly the same. The idea that his weight factored into the decision is just stupid. Coyle was going to replace him because he was an inherited head coach who was only in the position because the previous guy had to step down for health reasons.

Coyle wanted to bring in his own guy to run the team and the situation at the time made it easy for him to do that.

The fact that TC is overweight might work against him in trying to land a new HC gig somewhere else but it had nothing to do with why he was let go here.[/Quote.

He was fired because they thought he would not sell tickets or promote the program because he was fat. You might not think it, but him being fat was never going to help his cause. You are right that Coyle wanted to hire his own guy, he was in touch with PJ's agent before the bowel game was even played. Claeys was responsible for his own weak contract and little to no buyout clause. Being fat played a role in his termination.
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gopherdudepart2 said:
MNVCGUY said:
So sick of this idea that he was fired because he was overweight. Why does it have to be any more complicated then Coyle as a new AD wanted to hire his own guy to run the football program? It happens all the time all over the country.

New AD wants to hire their people, new coaches come in and hire their people, there is no such thing as loyalty to a school in college football anymore.

Take the situation here, keep all other factors the same and just take a bunch of weight off of TC. The end result still would have been exactly the same. The idea that his weight factored into the decision is just stupid. Coyle was going to replace him because he was an inherited head coach who was only in the position because the previous guy had to step down for health reasons.

Coyle wanted to bring in his own guy to run the team and the situation at the time made it easy for him to do that.

The fact that TC is overweight might work against him in trying to land a new HC gig somewhere else but it had nothing to do with why he was let go here.[/Quote.

He was fired because they thought he would not sell tickets or promote the program because he was fat. You might not think it, but him being fat was never going to help his cause. You are right that Coyle wanted to hire his own guy, he was in touch with PJ's agent before the bowel game was even played. Claeys was responsible for his own weak contract and little to no buyout clause. Being fat played a role in his termination.
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Sorry, I'm an old man and still find this kind of stuff funny....
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bleedsmaroonandgold said:
I don't think that what drives these conversations is some great love for Claeys, it is the comparison between Claeys'only full year at the helm vs the two under Fleck. If Fleck beats Claeys' 9 win total, I dont think you will see more than a few Claeys' devotees still clamoring for him.
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For the record, I am not clamoring for Claeys, I hope Fleck wins a lot of games at Minnesota, but so far that hasn't happened and until it does, Fleck is going to continue to be scrutinized. I liked Claeys and thought he got screwed, but I 100% hope Fleck can start winning and start winning soon!
 



tjgopher said:
This is the correct answer. People may want to blame the tweet for the reason TC was fired and certainly that was part of it. But, the complete and utter lack of leadership was the problem. There is zero chance that a Jerry Kill or a Barry Alvarez or a Kirk Ferentz or even a PJ Fleck would let that boycott go public. No chance. It would have been stopped long before anyone left that locker room. To stand by and think he would lose the team if he stopped the boycott was his undoing, plain and simple. It is too bad, too. The players were always going to get due process, that was in the protocol. They got it and five were cleared. That was going to happen whether the team boycotted or not. Literally, the boycott had no effect on the situation other than to paint the U in a bad light and cost TC his job.

Players were given some horribly bad advice by some advisers who completely miscalculated the situation and TC stood by and let them walk the plank for him.
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Wasn't Claeys in San Diego doing some obligatory meetings for the Holiday Bowl when the boycott occurred? I think if he had been in town a closed door meeting with his captains could have put an end to the issue before it ever happened. On the other hand, don't you think Coyle and Kaler took advantage of the situation knowing the head coach was out of town? I sure as hell do. Claeys was set up and the win over WSU blew up in Coyles face a bit.
 

gopherdudepart2 said:
He was also fired because he is really overweight. Not trying to weight shame but public image matters in recruiting, and the fact that he was fat was used against him. Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
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I agree and have said so several times in past threads. TC was not what Coyle thought the face of the football team and for that matter the University was supposed to look like.
 

gopherdudepart2 said:
He was also fired because he is really overweight. Not trying to weight shame but public image matters in recruiting, and the fact that he was fat was used against him. Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
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Oh boy, this again.
 

HoustonTXGopher said:
I agree and have said so several times in past threads. TC was not what Coyle thought the face of the football team and for that matter the University was supposed to look like.
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That is such a load of BS. New AD, new coach, happens all the friggin time. Claeys was easy to fire because he had a weak contract and the situation lent itself for an easy switch. He wasn't a well established coach with a long track record of success, he was an interim guy who was handed the position due to the old coach having health problems. Add in the controversy and the way he handled it publicly and there was no doubt Coyle was going to make the change. Claeys could have looked like friggin Fabio and he still would have been fired. People just want to go with the weight thing because they don't like Coyle so it gives them another way to make him look evil claiming he fired a coach for being fat.

As I said in the other post the place where his weight might hurt him is in trying to get another head coaching job. That is where an AD might look at him and use that against him.

That didn't happen here, Coyle was going to make the change no matter who was the coach. It didn't matter what Claeys looked like and the fact that some still want to imply that his firing had anything to do with his weight is just sad.
 



tjgopher said:
Hate to break it to you, but the football situation in December of 2016 had nothing to do with Kaler announcing his retirement in June of 2018. Zero.
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Neat. Another one of those coincidences. I am sure it was just weird timing with Kim Hewitt too.
 

tjgopher said:
Hate to break it to you, but the football situation in December of 2016 had nothing to do with Kaler announcing his retirement in June of 2018. Zero.
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Wrong. Otherwise a great post.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

dpodoll68 said:
Love ya Bob, but you are incredibly off base here. The original 2.5 years was correct. Claeys was fired in January 2017, and Kaler is stepping down as U of M President in July 2019. That's 2.5 years. He is voluntarily leaving a very demanding position, one that he will have held for 8 years by the time he steps down. In modern times, you will rarely find a major university president who lasts longer than 5-6 years in the position.

Moreover, he announced his planned departure from the position a year in advance. When is the last time you heard of someone who was fired for malfeasance and said, "Hey, is it cool if I stick around for another year?"

Additionally, he is not leaving the U. He is serving in an emeritus fundraising role for a year, then serving on the CSE faculty after a sabbatical. Again, when is the last time someone fired for malfeasance was allowed to stay on with the organization?

Your notions are silly and absurd. You're better than this.
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And I love ya DPO, but a U President announcing their resignation the month after the U is named in a lawsuit is way too coincidental to not be related. On a scale of 1 to 10 I would say a 37 that I’m not buying it. Everything else listed are concessions.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

gopherdudepart2 said:
He was also fired because he is really overweight. Not trying to weight shame but public image matters in recruiting, and the fact that he was fat was used against him. Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk
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Disagree completely


He was fired because he publicly went against both of his bosses


Prior to going against his bosses he let an unfortunate incident become a major national sports story by losing control of his team.




Both of those are fireable offenses IMO.

There isn’t a head coach in the country with a small buyout that would’ve survived that. He completely misplayed the entire incident.




I think if he ever wants a p5 head coaching job again this might be his best shot, however, I would advise anyone to stay away.
Kansas is probably the worst p5 football job in the country and if their basketball program gets hit with sanctions at some point they’ll also be cash-poor.
 

Spoofin said:
And I love ya DPO, but a U President announcing their resignation the month after the U is named in a lawsuit is way too coincidental to not be related. On a scale of 1 to 10 I would say a 37 that I’m not buying it. Everything else listed are concessions.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Back on your horse, Sir Spoofin? Glad to see you're better. After your pathetic farewell, some people grieved for your well being, but some were confident you would return with your well honed instincts. After you get to the bottom of the mystery surrounding Kaler's departure could you look into the second gunman on the grassy knoll?
 

The administrators at the University of Minnesota have gotten exactly what they deserve for doing everything they do at the University of Minnesota. They get credit for what ever results they have gotten for firing TC & the STAFFERS the way they fired them in 2017. They get credit for what ever results they have gotten for paying 3.5 million plus to Fleck to bring his boat and culture ski-u-mah show to the U. They are financially making it in football and men's hoops as long as the Big Ten Conference splits total profits equally with all Big Ten Schools regardless of how the schools compete on the football field and on the men's basketball playing courts. IF the teams at the top of the standings ever start demanding a BIGGER share of the profits based upon the Big Ten Won/Loss records and percentages, theadministrators at the U of M will also be totally deserving of what ever they get. Right now, Rutgers, Illinois and Minnesota get just as much as Michigan, tOSU, Penn State, MSU, wisky, iowa, et al who finisher higher than the GOPHER does.

The administration has given us EVERYTHING we so richly deserve in the eyes of the people who run the University of Minnesota...no more...no less. In essence, we all deserve what prexy k and coyle did to TC & the STAFFERS...and what Dick Pitino and PJ Fleck give us as fans.

The administrators can do what ever they want to do when ever they want to do it...and the results be damned, we the fans get what the administrators have done to us, for us and they deserve everything they get as a result of their actions. And attendance is just one to the factors they can totally change any time they want, in any number of ways. It is what it is. We are what we are. Nothing more...nothing less. The buck stops here. We have gotten what we deserve.

And, right now, prexy k and coyle are giving we fans and the kids playing the games a .200 Big Ten winning percentage with the efforts fo Coach Fleck...yet they get 100% as much Big Ten Network income as Michigan, tOSU, MSU, Iowa, Wisky, PSU, et al. There is no incentive for coyle and prexy k to be concerned what ANY fan thinks about anything. So, right now, coyle's efforts have produced just as much as tOSU, Michigan, PSU, MSU, et al.

Why are GOPHER fans complaining...or defending...or calling each other names in defense of or condemning anything about the U of M? It all IS...what it IS. The Big Ten still shares tv money with us. So it has been...so it will be...
 
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Mulligan said:
Back on your horse, Sir Spoofin? Glad to see you're better. After your pathetic farewell, some people grieved for your well being, but some were confident you would return with your well honed instincts. After you get to the bottom of the mystery surrounding Kaler's departure could you look into the second gunman on the grassy knoll?
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It’s reasonable to think that after his emotions got the better of him during his public relations crusade vs the team, and the SMSS panel rebuked him, and the football staff he helped to oust was replaced with highly paid charlatans, and former players are suing the school for malice, these stressors played a small part of his decision to step back from the spotlight.

Unrelated to the team but during his tenure was there an effort to reduce the top heavy nature of the U? IIRC the U had one of the worst administrative to faculty ratios in the nation a few years back. This relates to tuition, etc. what’s going on in that arena? Tuition going down?
 

Pompous Elitist said:
It’s reasonable to think that after his emotions got the better of him during his public relations crusade vs the team, and the SMSS panel rebuked him, and the football staff he helped to oust was replaced with highly paid charlatans, and former players are suing the school for malice, these stressors played a small part of his decision to step back from the spotlight.

Unrelated to the team but during his tenure was there an effort to reduce the top heavy nature of the U? IIRC the U had one of the worst administrative to faculty ratios in the nation a few years back. This relates to tuition, etc. what’s going on in that arena? Tuition going down?
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There have been attempts to do that, but I don't know what the results have been. I think what has happened to some extent is that there has been a re-classification of a lot of staff so that while they are doing the same thing, they are no longer viewed as administrators. But that is just a guess on my part.
 






bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Games aren't won at the podium or on social media. Charisma is one of the coaching qualities I care about least.
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Exactly. He is a great recruiter so it will be interesting to see how he goes about filling the KU 2019 class...only one commit right now.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Exactly. He is a great recruiter so it will be interesting to see how he goes about filling the KU 2019 class...only one commit right now.
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Every LSU football coach is a great recruiter with the talent they have in that state.
 

I hope and still believe that Fleck will take us to a higher level of winning than our previous coaches. I think the Gophers would have taken a major step backwards with Miles based on his age and the lack of demand for his services. Thankful that he was not hired here.
 

WorkingMyTailOff said:
I hope and still believe that Fleck will take us to a higher level of winning than our previous coaches. I think the Gophers would have taken a major step backwards with Miles based on his age and the lack of demand for his services. Thankful that he was not hired here.
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I'm not. I was not-so-secretly hoping that the U would hire him. Then we'd be hearing a lot less about culture and a lot more about wins.
 

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