Judd Zulgad: Gophers making strides but QB position remains a big issue

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There is no doubt that the passing game need improvement. There is no doubt that Maxx is a beast. However, to me it seem like Mitch only looks for Maxx and sometimes other receiver's or open.
 

Using our WR core is not a valid excuse, because it's not like we never have open receivers. The problem is that Mitch just isn't very accurate. And he's even worse when under pressure. Maybe he can become an average QB one day, but right now, he's the weak link on Offense. If you guys haven't noticed, we have a very very limited amount of plays in our arsenal. Most likely because that's all Mitch can handle. The eyes say he's not very good, and the stats back that up. Of course, I have accepted though that he is probably the best option we have at the moment, so we'll have to have do with what we have.
 

RolGnav said:
Using our WR core is not a valid excuse, because it's not like we never have open receivers. The problem is that Mitch just isn't very accurate. And he's even worse when under pressure. Maybe he can become an average QB one day, but right now, he's the weak link on Offense. If you guys haven't noticed, we have a very very limited amount of plays in our arsenal. Most likely because that's all Mitch can handle. The eyes say he's not very good, and the stats back that up. Of course, I have accepted though that he is probably the best option we have at the moment, so we'll have to have do with what we have.
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I couldn't disagree more. It's absolutely a valid excuse. I don't think most are saying it's all on the receivers, just that it isn't all on Leidner.

There are too many plays where there is literally no one open. On some plays, it's Leidner missing the read or throwing a bad pass. On others, he has no options. Blame needs to be spread around.
 

RolGnav said:
Using our WR core is not a valid excuse, because it's not like we never have open receivers. The problem is that Mitch just isn't very accurate. And he's even worse when under pressure. Maybe he can become an average QB one day, but right now, he's the weak link on Offense. If you guys haven't noticed, we have a very very limited amount of plays in our arsenal. Most likely because that's all Mitch can handle. The eyes say he's not very good, and the stats back that up. Of course, I have accepted though that he is probably the best option we have at the moment, so we'll have to have do with what we have.
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So the WR's are never at fault because they get open sometimes? Sorry but that doesn't make much sense. And correct me if I'm wrong, but the deep ball to KJ Maye is the ONLY play I remember where a WR had a step or two on a DB yesterday.
 



I go with the philosophy that the QB gets too much credit for victories, and too much blame for losses.

I also try to remember that Leidner is a redshirt Sophomore who is still in his 1st year as a full-time D1 starter.

Having said that, the major issue I had with Leidner Saturday was the interceptions. On this team, for this offense, they have to avoid turnovers at all cost. Leidner has gotten a little better at throwing the ball away, but until the overall talent level of the team improves, he has to be smart enough to avoid trying to force the ball into tight coverage. If the receiver isn't OPEN - throw it away or tuck and run.

FWIW, on Sid's show today, Kill was talking about the lack of depth at WR. He said next year will be the 1st year they will have solid depth at the position. He also said Gentry would have played except for the injury. (said the other freshmen WR's are still learning - so not worth pulling a redshirt.)
 

Can't wait for Melvin Holland Jr.

Hopefully Demry Croft will push Liedner next year. Liedner has progressed a good amount and looks a lot better from last year. I guess my only problem was the wide open bomb that he overthrew the receiver and missed out on 7 pts. But he is a "dual-threat" QB so isn't expected to be entirely accurate all the time. Like I said, I believe Melvin Holland Jr. is going to be special next year, can't wait.
 

theTurning said:
Leidner is not good. Nothing wrong with admitting that.
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This.
He's a gamer, but doesn't have a lot of over all talent. Wouldn't be a bad idea to
extend a hand towards Braxton Miller.......can you imagine??
 

Gopher028 said:
This.
He's a gamer, but doesn't have a lot of over all talent. Wouldn't be a bad idea to
extend a hand towards Braxton Miller.......can you imagine??
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Great idea! Then let's get Tony Dungy to coach him! Pretty sure he will because he played at Minnesota! I can imagine it!
 



Instead of saying Leidner is "not good," I would say he is inconsistent. I thought he was very good against IA - for what this team needs from him. The knee-jerk reactions on this board drive me nuts.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
Instead of saying Leidner is "not good," I would say he is inconsistent. I thought he was very good against IA - for what this team needs from him. The knee-jerk reactions on this board drive me nuts.
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If I had to go game by game, I would rate him as follows:

Eastern Carolina: Acceptable
Middle Tennessee: Bad
TCU: Bad
Michigan: Good
Northwestern: Acceptable
Purdue: Acceptable
Illinois: Bad
Iowa: Great
Ohio State: Bad

We're the kind of team that will win some great games if our quarterback gives us something, but it's really a coin toss of what Mitch Leidner will show up. Mitch recognizes that, and I think if he can turn those bad games into acceptable games, he can be a pretty decent Big Ten quarterback. But it remains to be seen whether or not he can do it.
 




Leidner is a RS soph QB in his first year as a full time starter. Our OL is inconsistent in pass pro. Of the B10 teams we've played this year I don't know if I can say we have a better WR core than any of them. We may be equal or slightly better than IL/IA/NW but not by much. WRs getting separation has long been an issue and part of the reason why we struggle on obvious passing downs without the threat of PA. Truth is Mitch is inconsistent and has some really good days and some poor day. He's been solid off of PA but needs to work on his drop back game. He's learning to manage his emotions to find a consistent level of play. We compare him to the best and that's fine but we also need to realize that not every incomplete pass is because Leidner made a poor play. I'm excited to see what he can do next year. He'll have a full year under his belt of ups and downs, B10 road trips, fan critiques, sacks, TDs and picks. He'll also have what I think can be a better OL and way more talent on the outside than we've seen here in a while with the influx of 4 tall and fast RS frosh WRs. I've seen enough from him that I think he has the potential to be good enough for us to beat the top teams. He's not an NFL QB but he can do what we need him to do to win. Will he can be a guy we can have drop back 35 times and pass us to victory consistently? I doubt that. Can he become a guy that is consistent enough in 15-25 passes a game for us to move the ball? I think so.
 

GophersInIowa said:
How is it an excuse? Our receivers are not that great to begin with, then you take away two of our best ones.

Leidner didn't play well, no doubt about it. But neither did the receivers. Williams was double-teamed all game long and the other guys just couldn't get any separation most of the time. Not sure what a guy is supposed to do when no one is open.

Everyone wants to point the finger solely at Leidner. The whole passing game needs to get a lot better.
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I don't know a lot about football, but there is another component here that is often left out of the discussion. It seems to me that Ohio State's receivers as well as other receivers are more open more often than our receivers. I would guess that what plays/routes you call against which coverages and at what times can determine how open your receivers are. I don't recall Mitch missing any wide open receivers Saturday. His pass to KJ Maye under those circumstances was pretty dang good. OSU had our receivers covered very tight. Can play calling and pass route design make a difference? I have no idea to be honest.
 

EG#9 said:
It's tough to know how much is the QB, how much is the skill position guys, and how much is simply this offense. There have been very few instances, no matter who has been under center, where the passing game has been good in anything other than the play action game. Leidner's decision making and touch leave a lot to be desired, but he seems to be respected by his teammates and a good leader. Mitch wasn't the reason the Gophers lost to Ohio State, but the passing game as whole has to be much better for this program to take another step.
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At least this comment should be one we can all agree on. I believe the improvements we've made from last year to this are evident. Pretty much everyone associated with the program recognized it was an area in need of improvement and it was a point of emphasis. I expect an even greater jump next year.
 

jaymil said:
When WR's have gotten open and Mitch is given a clean pocket he has looked very good. See the Michigan, Purdue, and Iowa games. When passing windows are small and he gets pressured he's not nearly as good. The best QB's can get it done without much help, Mitch clearly isn't to that level yet. He's still a solid QB though. He'll keep getting better. No Wolitarsky or Jones, playing from behind, against one of the best pass-rushing defensive lines in the country. Anyone expecting him to look great in those conditions is clearly delusional.
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Even the very best NFL QBs struggle sometimes. See Peyton Manning. It's the most difficult position in sports, and one of the most visible to the average fan. I think you and I agree ML7 is much better than a segment of GH posters realize, and this coaching staff is working hard to put him in position to be effective. Sometimes the other guys just plain beat us.
 

afurry91 said:
If I had to go game by game, I would rate him as follows:

Eastern Carolina: Acceptable
Middle Tennessee: Bad
TCU: Bad
Michigan: Good
Northwestern: Acceptable
Purdue: Acceptable
Illinois: Bad
Iowa: Great
Ohio State: Bad

We're the kind of team that will win some great games if our quarterback gives us something, but it's really a coin toss of what Mitch Leidner will show up. Mitch recognizes that, and I think if he can turn those bad games into acceptable games, he can be a pretty decent Big Ten quarterback. But it remains to be seen whether or not he can do it.
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You are right about it being a coin toss. It seems like Mitch is determined to change the narrative about about him, whatever it is. As soon as people start to buy Mitch stock, he shows up and plays horrible. Then, as soon as he gets bad enough that we start talking about replacing him with a walkon freshman, he plays a great game (Michigan, Iowa). I know he is young, but so is the guy who beat him yesterday.
 

Mitcheroo

Spring /Summer 2014 I was critical of Mitcheroo leading this team as QB. Fall 2014 he has outperformed what i thought he could do in his role. Many parts of that offense that #7 leads without error.
 

CoMn said:
This loss is NOT Mitch's fault. This loss is on Tim Brewster….
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Don't think anyone is putting on the blame on Leidner just pointing out he didn't do "fine" as many are going with.

Tim Brewster's fault?
 

Every year its the same story with a large segment of fans. If only we had an elite qb, or if we had an "average" qb who could make plays with players who are much slower than the elite players they are playing against in a matchup such as Saturday. Let's see Peyton Manning take the current oakland raiders team to the super bowl?
 

march madness said:
Every year its the same story with a large segment of fans. If only we had an elite qb, or if we had an "average" qb who could make plays with players who are much slower than the elite players they are playing against in a matchup such as Saturday. Let's see Peyton Manning take the current oakland raiders team to the super bowl?
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The focus on the QB is getting a little bit old. I understand that it's the most impactful position, but 1500 just had their segment on the Gophers and all they talked about was the quarterback position. I don't think there was a mention of anything else. I don't know why I still expect some actual talk about the game anymore.
 

afurry91 said:
The focus on the QB is getting a little bit old. I understand that it's the most impactful position, but 1500 just had their segment on the Gophers and all they talked about was the quarterback position. I don't think there was a mention of anything else. I don't know why I still expect some actual talk about the game anymore.
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And the same crew from E1500 were on after the Vikes game Sunday, telling everyone that they had to give Teddy B more time to develop, because he had only been starting for less than a full season. Double standard, anyone?
 

short ornery norwegian said:
And the same crew from E1500 were on after the Vikes game Sunday, telling everyone that they had to give Teddy B more time to develop, because he had only been starting for less than a full season. Double standard, anyone?
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Expecting the guys at 1500 to be reasonable may be expecting too much, but if Bridgewater was in his 3rd year with the Vikes it would be a better analogy.
 


Spoofin said:
So much wrong with this statement.
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Even worse is taking something out of context, but you are "Spoofin"..

quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by short ornery norwegianAnd the same crew from E1500 were on after the Vikes game Sunday, telling everyone that they had to give Teddy B more time to develop, because he had only been starting for less than a full season. Double standard, anyone?


Expecting the guys at 1500 to be reasonable may be expecting too much, but if Bridgewater was in his 3rd year with the Vikes it would be a better analogy.
 

Iceland12 said:
Expecting the guys at 1500 to be reasonable may be expecting too much, but if Bridgewater was in his 3rd year with the Vikes it would be a better analogy.
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So much wrong with this statement.

Better?
 

Spoofin said:
So much wrong with this statement.

Better?
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Of course not, but you weren't trying anyway. :rolleyes:

Wait, I'm defending a throwaway line about Teddy B.? Why spoofin, you little doosh-bag, bad dog, maybe you can read.


quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by short ornery norwegianAnd the same crew from E1500 were on after the Vikes game Sunday, telling everyone that they had to give Teddy B more time to develop, because he had only been starting for less than a full season. Double standard, anyone?
 

DoubleAlum said:
I don't know a lot about football, but there is another component here that is often left out of the discussion. It seems to me that Ohio State's receivers as well as other receivers are more open more often than our receivers. I would guess that what plays/routes you call against which coverages and at what times can determine how open your receivers are. I don't recall Mitch missing any wide open receivers Saturday. His pass to KJ Maye under those circumstances was pretty dang good. OSU had our receivers covered very tight. Can play calling and pass route design make a difference? I have no idea to be honest.
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My bet is it is a combination of a lot of things:
- QB and the receivers not always understanding/recognizing what coverage the defense is in.
- Making the proper reads/passing progression
- Running crisp routes
- Accuracy of the QB
- Play calling and design
- Lack of speed to get open especially without Jones and Wolitarsky
- QB not making a lot of audibles/adjustments at the line. Not sure if Leidner just struggles at this or if the coaches just don't allow him to audible but it doesn't appear like he changes much very often.
 

Judd Zulgad writes an article blaming Leidner. He has no clue. It was an Ohio State team that outmanned our guys, and he can't even recognize ability beat guts. BOOOOOOOOO to Zulgad.
 

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