Is the potential to bolt a concern?

[Golden Elephant]

It seems there are 4 coaches who are under prime consideration (or at least speculation) around here: Golden (Temple), Calhoun (Air Force), Hoke (SDSU) & Mullen (Miss St).

I've heard concern from some posters that Golden would surely leave us in a couple years when the Penn St job opens up. That seems to be a reasonable concern, but I haven't heard a similar concern about 2 of the other 4 guys (Hoke & Mullen) would be leaving their current schools after only 2 years.

My point/question is this: Doesn't this indicate that those 2 guys - if they have success here like we hope - would also bolt us after about 2 years here for some big-time job?

I mean, I understand the coaching world is transient, and there's risk that ANY coach would leave us after 2 successful years (a la Holtz), but wouldn't hiring guys who just explicitly showed they would leave a place after 2 years make us feel less certain they'd stay here?

I'd especially be concerned about Mullen, since going from Miss St to MN isn't really much more than a lateral move, at best. I mean, even if another school in the caliber of say Purdue or Illinois was willing to pay the guy an additional $500K or $1M, wouldn't we be worried about losing him?

 

[gophmeister]

That's the risk you take with any candidate. They can leave whenever they feel like it. Who's not going leave? Someone who won't succeed.

 

[MaxyJR1]

If they leave that likely means they had some success here and we should have an easier time making the next hire because of that hire. There is a lot of respect in the Big Ten and I don't see a school hiring or a coach leaving for another gig in the Big Ten.

 

[grunkiejr]

No. Losing is a concern. Winning too much is never a concern of mine.

Hire the best coach possible. If he wins you'll have more money to try to keep him. If you can't afford what someone else will pay him it is still a lot easier to hire a new coach when the last one left because of success rather than hiring one after you just fired the last coach.

 

[highwayman]

That seems to be a reasonable concern, but I haven't heard a similar concern about 2 of the other 4 guys (Hoke & Mullen) would be leaving their current schools after only 2 years.

My point/question is this: Doesn't this indicate that those 2 guys - if they have success here like we hope - would also bolt us after about 2 years here for some big-time job?

The Minnesota job is an upgrade for either of these guys. We would have to catch lightning in a bottle for either to leave after two years. The new coach would have to post at least a 15-9 with a New Years Day win for 2011 and 2012.

I'd take it, BTW.

 

[Wheaton]

I think fear of bolting is a real concern. If you are scared of that Calhoun is your guy as he is already at his alma matter. I can't imagine he has a dream job after the Air Force. If he ever does leave it is because he wants the money or the challenge.

With Hoke and Golden it seems obvious where they would like to be. But that is why you have the buyout clause in the contract. If Maturi is confident in any of these guys and doesn't want to lose them he may need to put in a HUGE buyout clause. However, if Michigan came calling for Hoke or Penn State for Golden, I think no amount of money would keep those two schools away.

 

[FrothyGopher]

No. Losing is a concern. Winning too much is never a concern of mine.

Hire the best coach possible. If he wins you'll have more money to try to keep him. If you can't afford what someone else will pay him it is still a lot easier to hire a new coach when the last one left because of success rather than hiring one after you just fired the last coach.

+1

Plus, if we do the 8-year contract that has been discussed, the U likely gets a fat stack of cash if another school snipes him. That, plus the fact that we must have been winning for the coach to be taken from us, makes it even easier to hire the next guy.

 

[tikited]

+1

Plus, if we do the 8-year contract that has been discussed, the U likely gets a fat stack of cash if another school snipes him. That, plus the fact that we must have been winning for the coach to be taken from us, makes it even easier to hire the next guy.

The winning part sounds good to me.

Everyone is a risk.

 

[howeda7]

It's a concern regardless, but with Mullen and Calhoun, chances are they're going to have to stay long enough (4-5 years) and win to have any big fish come after them. The problem with Golden is that he may bolt for PSU as soon as next year, and it may not even matter whether he's started winning here yet. It's one thing to generally be concerned that your coach may leave, we go through that every year with Tubby. But it's another to have such a specific situation staring you in the face. Holtz had a ND clause in his contract for a reason. I'm guessing Golden would want one for PSU as well.

 

[WAGopher]

I mean, even if another school in the caliber of say Purdue or Illinois was willing to pay the guy an additional $500K or $1M, wouldn't we be worried about losing him?

There is no way that Illinois or Purdue are better coaching gigs than Minnesota. If you argued they were similar, I could buy that. But better? Again, NO WAY!!

 

[BleedGopher]

In no way shape or form am I worried about losing a HC to a "bigger" program. If that happens it means our new HC has done a great job. I would take that as a complement. We're not a mid-major program that consistently needs to be worried about this with every coach. We're a BT program so it will take a New Years Day bowl or two to get the bigger boys coming after our HC. That would be a fine formula for me.

Go Gophers!!

 

[2727Gopher]

If they leave that likely means they had some success here and we should have an easier time making the next hire because of that hire. There is a lot of respect in the Big Ten and I don't see a school hiring or a coach leaving for another gig in the Big Ten.

I wouldn't count on that. Mason was considered by Michigan State and was a finalist for the Ohio State job when Tressel got it. I don't think Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, etc. would pause for even a moment if they decided that our coach is who they want for their job.

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

NO!

In no way shape or form am I worried about losing a HC to a "bigger" program. If that happens it means our new HC has done a great job. I would take that as a complement. We're not a mid-major program that consistently needs to be worried about this with every coach. We're a BT program so it will take a New Years Day bowl or two to get the bigger boys coming after our HC. That would be a fine formula for me.

Go Gophers!!

Should NEVER be concerned about a guy leaving that had success with the Gophers. That's ridiculous.

That's similar to the assinine notion in the business world of not wanting to train your people because they may leave for better jobs, that your place is just a "training ground". Soooo, you would rather have incompetent untrained but LOYAL people?

Two reasons I wouldn't be concerned about losing a guy that won a lot of games to a better program (have been mentioned already in one form or another):

1) If that happened, they will have left the program better than when they left it. I would never begrudge somebody for doing their best and leaving for something better.

2) I think the group of programs to which a coach would leave MN and move on is smaller than you think. A lot would have to happen for that to occur. Are there better jobs out there? Of course, lots of them. However....

The number of job openings in a given year that are better than MN, are more attractive to the MN coach at the time, that don't have somebody internal ready to take over, that don't have somebody available that already has SIGNIFICANT ties to that school (alumni, etc.), is actually really really small.


They need the best person for the job, regardless of how long anybody thinks they will be there. Worrying that they might leave is kind of a loser mentality.

 

[Oneoldgopher]

The risk was to do nothing. The opportunity is to move forward with a better coaching staff. To have stood still would be to risk another terrible season of underprepared young men sacrificing themselves needlessly. Where is the risk here? We are at the bottom. There is no risk, only opportunity.

 

[Golden Elephant]

There is no way that Illinois or Purdue are better coaching gigs than Minnesota. If you argued they were similar, I could buy that. But better? Again, NO WAY!!

Tell me the part where I said that Illinois or Purdue are "better" than Minnesota. My point was that Minnesota is not an obviously better job than Mississippi State. For Mullen to leave them for us is a lateral move at best - both programs are BCS schools, but perenielly have finished in the middle to bottom of their conferences. I mentioned Illinois & Purdue because I consider them to be roughly equivalent to us and Miss St. If he leaves Miss St for MN, who's to say he wouldn't leave MN for Ill or Purdue (or, more realistically, a school at a similar level in a different BCS conference). I'm getting at - I don't understand why Mullen would come to Minnesota unless we are willing to pay him significantly more than he's making now. So why wouldn't he just leave right away again if someone else paid him a bit more?

Generally, I agree with most of the posters on this thread that we should hope for success and hope we have to worry about our coach leaving. But I still think we should at least be a little concerned about someone who might bolt us right away. None of these guys is as bad as Lane Kiffin or Petrino, but still, their willingness to leave their current schools in the lurch after 2 years does have me hesitate a little bit about getting too excited about their ability to boost the program long-term.

 

[lugnard]

+1

Plus, if we do the 8-year contract that has been discussed, the U likely gets a fat stack of cash if another school snipes him. That, plus the fact that we must have been winning for the coach to be taken from us, makes it even easier to hire the next guy.

An eight year contract for these guys? Based on their current records?

Am I the only one who sees this as crazy? I can see eight years for Nick Saban or Urban Meyer but these guys? Calhoun, Hoke, Mullen - etc.??? They aren't exactly sure things.

 

[grunkiejr]

Tell me the part where I said that Illinois or Purdue are "better" than Minnesota. My point was that Minnesota is not an obviously better job than Mississippi State. For Mullen to leave them for us is a lateral move at best - both programs are BCS schools, but perenielly have finished in the middle to bottom of their conferences. I mentioned Illinois & Purdue because I consider them to be roughly equivalent to us and Miss St. If he leaves Miss St for MN, who's to say he wouldn't leave MN for Ill or Purdue (or, more realistically, a school at a similar level in a different BCS conference). I'm getting at - I don't understand why Mullen would come to Minnesota unless we are willing to pay him significantly more than he's making now. So why wouldn't he just leave right away again if someone else paid him a bit more?

Generally, I agree with most of the posters on this thread that we should hope for success and hope we have to worry about our coach leaving. But I still think we should at least be a little concerned about someone who might bolt us right away. None of these guys is as bad as Lane Kiffin or Petrino, but still, their willingness to leave their current schools in the lurch after 2 years does have me hesitate a little bit about getting too excited about their ability to boost the program long-term.

I disagree. Minnesota clearly is a better job than Mississippi State. MSU has been the equivalent of Indiana in the SEC. Their revenue isn't anywhere near what our revenue is. Their facilities aren't anywhere near what we have. The school is located in a town that is a cow pasture in a state with one of the worst literacy and education level in the country. The academics of the school are weak.

The only thing clearly going for MSU is proximity to more talent. Unfortuntely for MSU they are the little brother in a state that also sees Florida, Tennesee, Alabama, etc poach their talent. It can also be argued that being in the SEC is good but that can be a double edged sword with arguably more competition and the revenue of the conference is less than the Big Ten so it isn't like they are getting any reward for being better in the years or decades when that is the case.

As far as Purdue or Illinois poaching our coach for an extra $500k...I'll be worried about that if they start making more money than we do. They don't. Therefore, I don't see a scenario in which they can poach our coach for an extra $500k and we can't match it.

 

[Tricks]

I disagree. Minnesota clearly is a better job than Mississippi State. MSU has been the equivalent of Indiana in the SEC. Their revenue isn't anywhere near what our revenue is. Their facilities aren't anywhere near what we have. The school is located in a town that is a cow pasture in a state with one of the worst literacy and education level in the country. The academics of the school are weak.

The only thing clearly going for MSU is proximity to more talent. Unfortuntely for MSU they are the little brother in a state that also sees Florida, Tennesee, Alabama, etc poach their talent. It can also be argued that being in the SEC is good but that can be a double edged sword with arguably more competition and the revenue of the conference is less than the Big Ten so it isn't like they are getting any reward for being better in the years or decades when that is the case.

As far as Purdue or Illinois poaching our coach for an extra $500k...I'll be worried about that if they start making more money than we do. They don't. Therefore, I don't see a scenario in which they can poach our coach for an extra $500k and we can't match it.

I believe it would be much easier for Mullen to leave now because of the Cam Newton ordeal. He may not have much to do with it but Mississippi State is obviously involved. Mississippi State may have done nothing wrong but they were the schools who reported Newton wanted to be paid for play. This doesn't look good for all of SEC country. Will Mullen leave Miss. St. for Minnesota? I doubt it but the decision may like more enticing to Mullen now then it did a month ago. Another thing, if Mullen were the guy hired then he probably would receive at least 500K more a year than he is making right now.

 

[lugnard]

I believe it would be much easier for Mullen to leave now because of the Cam Newton ordeal. He may not have much to do with it but Mississippi State is obviously involved. Mississippi State may have done nothing wrong but they were the schools who reported Newton wanted to be paid for play. This doesn't look good for all of SEC country. Will Mullen leave Miss. St. for Minnesota? I doubt it but the decision may like more enticing to Mullen now then it did a month ago. Another thing, if Mullen were the guy hired then he probably would receive at least 500K more a year than he is making right now.

It will take more than $500K as the MSU boosters will match that much immediately. That is unless the pressure for him to leave [as a result of the scandal leak] is intense. The SEC boys would want to keep all that dirt in the family and not air it for God and everyone to see. They could try to make an example of MSU and look hard enough and you will find something.

 

[WAGopher]

Tell me the part where I said that Illinois or Purdue are "better" than Minnesota. My point was that Minnesota is not an obviously better job than Mississippi State. For Mullen to leave them for us is a lateral move at best - both programs are BCS schools, but perenielly have finished in the middle to bottom of their conferences. I mentioned Illinois & Purdue because I consider them to be roughly equivalent to us and Miss St. If he leaves Miss St for MN, who's to say he wouldn't leave MN for Ill or Purdue (or, more realistically, a school at a similar level in a different BCS conference). I'm getting at - I don't understand why Mullen would come to Minnesota unless we are willing to pay him significantly more than he's making now. So why wouldn't he just leave right away again if someone else paid him a bit more?

Generally, I agree with most of the posters on this thread that we should hope for success and hope we have to worry about our coach leaving. But I still think we should at least be a little concerned about someone who might bolt us right away. None of these guys is as bad as Lane Kiffin or Petrino, but still, their willingness to leave their current schools in the lurch after 2 years does have me hesitate a little bit about getting too excited about their ability to boost the program long-term.

I re-read your original post, and did misunderstand your comparison of school's. However, it would be a step up for Mullen if he left Mississippi State for Minnesota. While Illinois and Purdue are similar in many ways to Minnesota, Mississippi State falls short in most categories.

 

[Tricks]

It will take more than $500K as the MSU boosters will match that much immediately. That is unless the pressure for him to leave [as a result of the scandal leak] is intense. The SEC boys would want to keep all that dirt in the family and not air it for God and everyone to see. They could try to make an example of MSU and look hard enough and you will find something.

This is why I said at least 500K.