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GopherHomer said:
Walrus - I don't want you to get me wrong, because I actually look back at the Mason regime with fondness (mostly), but let's not get too gushy about it. Kill's 2012 season was basically an average Mason season. Now, as the years went by Mason did have some great Big 10 victories and Kill will hopefully follow suit, but it's not like we are miles away from where we were for the majority of Mason's years. 4-0 in the non-conference, 2-6 in conference and a non-elite bowl game was pretty much status quo.
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And,GopherHomer, please don't misconstrue my impression of Coach Kill's first two seasons: I actually look at the Kill regime with hopefulness (mostly), so please don't assume too much based upon one "...basically...average Mason season..." Let's see how many "average Mason seasons..." Coach Kill can string together and see if he can last ten seasons as head coach of this program. Believe me, I am pulling for Coach Kill to get this done. His formula MUST be to go 4-0 in ooc and at least 2-6 in conference with a bowl invitation. In order to be "average Mason-like..." he will need to win some of those (what you call non-elite bowl games.. In year number three he would need to be looking at a "break-out" of sorts. He will have opportunities with 9 conference game schedules coming up in the future. He has the advantage of playing in and recruiting to the new stadium.

I don't know if Coach Kill is close to Mason-level or not. If you listen to him, he says his team is too young.

Personally, I think he has to make a move upward in Conference play in 2013 because 2014 and 2015 will be very brutal in terms of back to back games against some very typically powerful Conference foes. That makes it hard in terms of staying healthy and in terms of being emotionally and mentally ready to take on the world . Yes, that situation also presents fantastic opportunities for earth-shattering upsets and monumental victories.

But, GopherHomer before we assume too much about Coach Kill's fate, he needs to put together those years that were at least very "Mason-Like" Some don't like to admit it, but, it is kind of tough to get this program to a truly competitive B1G level. We now have the stadium...but...we also have Nebraska on the schedule every year in addition to our older Big Ten Foes...

I really want to see Coach Kill take us to a level above the Mason levels...but...I will have to see it before I will take it for granted. So, any time anyone downplays Coach Mason's tenure by emphasizing his big losses (which he did have) I will always need to mention his BIG wins...which he also did have. That's all. If you are going to look at an era...look at it with both eyes open...look at the bad...and the good...and, a GREAT win is always going to be a GREAT win, no matter how many HORRIBLE losses there may have been.

The same will hopefully be true for Coach Kill when all is said and done. Be fair. Be even. If you talk about the bad...also talk about the good.

I think you KNOW that, don't you GopherHomer? I think you know that very well and appreciate it, I would guess...

; 0 )
 

EG#9 said:
I don't know why I am choosing to reply to you this once, but here are the facts:

The largest deficit in the 1999 game against PSU was 8 points at 17-9 in the 3rd quarter. The Gophers had the lead early in the 4th quarter, then gave it up and finally won on Nystrom's FG. This was not some sort of spectacular comeback, but was a great win. The big play on the drive to set up the game winning FG was a pass play.

The largest deficit in the 1999 game against Iowa was 21-10 at halftime. Again, the Gophers were never down two touchdowns and needed to come back to beat a 1-9 Iowa team that they were HUGE favorites against. This game doesn't take away from my point either.

Wisconsin in 2003? You can't be f'ing serious. The Gophers were up 10-0, 17-3, 24-6, and then 24-13 at half. Wisconsin tied the game at 27 late in the 3rd quarter, then Minnesota went up by a TD at 34-27. The Badgers would score to tie it and then Lloyd hit a kick to win it. The Gophers NEVER TRAILED in this game and almost blew a 24-6 lead at HOME! This was almost the case of another choke job, NOT an example of a comeback.

Hopefully, the Gophers will be able to run and pass proficiently (and maybe play some defense too). The Glen Mason "level" was consistently losing to Iowa and Wisconsin, never beating a single team that finished the season in the upper echelon of the Big Ten, and finishing with about 3 Big Ten wins a season. I have very few fond memories of allowing that to continue for a decade.
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A come from behind win is a come from behind win. PERIOD. End of story.

How many come from behind wins did you see Murray Warmath pull off? Cal Stoll? Smokey Joe? lou hoax? Guttey? Wacker? (Your own personal favorite) Brewster? How many come from behind wins has Coach Kill pulled off here at Minnesota? How long have you been watching Gopher Football, any way?

You should get out of iowa once in a while eg9...the entire history of the modern era of Golden Gopher Football does not have a LOT of examples of coming from 20 points or more from behind to win. When Gopher Football is COMPETETIVE, it relys on a run-based offense. It does NOT put points on the board at lightening rates of speed. Nope, there haven't been very many come from behind wins of twenty points or more in the past fifty or sixty years. You just aren't looking at a very realistic standard, eg9...not very realistic at all.

But, Coach Mason had a bunch of wins in which his team did come from behind in the fourth quarter to win. Why is that so HARD for you eg9? Did your big idol Brewster have come from behind wins at Minnesota? How many? How many successive points did his teams score? At least some Minnesota coaches had some come from behind wins...

; 0 )
 

Weather

I think Kill has a plan. I think he sees the ability to more easily find/develop 300 plus pound linemen
than other positions in Minnesota. I think he also realizes it's hard to put all your eggs in the passing game in Minnesota.
The trend is to play later into the fall/winter and that means outside in Minnesota. There will be days when passing will
be very difficult to execute. Loading up and running the ball is only practical...with guys like Edwards and Jones to
burn you as a change of pace.
 

Late October and November in Minnesota is perfect weather for...

60's Guy said:
I think Kill has a plan. I think he sees the ability to more easily find/develop 300 plus pound linemen
than other positions in Minnesota. I think he also realizes it's hard to put all your eggs in the passing game in Minnesota.
The trend is to play later into the fall/winter and that means outside in Minnesota. There will be days when passing will
be very difficult to execute. Loading up and running the ball is only practical...with guys like Edwards and Jones to
burn you as a change of pace.
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Pounding the rock. Run the ball. Stop the run. The end of October and the month of November can be very good for running the ball in Minnesota!

; 0 )
 

Rescooter said:
Good stuff Ole. I did a little research and you can see the Kill's progression with the size of the line:
Year ........... #300+
2013..........14
2012...........8
2011...........5
2010...........9
2009...........7

A significant increase in o-line 300+. Is this a hint at what type of offense we'll be seeing? I believe so. This will be more patiently run it down your throat in hopes that attrition and fatigue affect the d-line of our opposition. I see a majority of our yards being in the 3rd quarter as the beating takes it's toll. With the B1G running a variety of offenses, it will be difficult to have the personnel to prepare for a run heavy offense one week and the spread the next. This is an offense that is more adaptive to the Minnesota recruiting area. Mason made his career on this type of offense. It's a little less exciting to watch, but after Brewster....I don't care about exciting.
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This isn't really what Mason made his career out of. Mason's scheme used smaller but quicker offensive linemen who can move and outnumber the defense at the point of attack rather than guys who blow the defensive linemen off the line 40 times a game. It can be a very effective rushing offense, but one of the downsides is it doesn't always wear the defense down like a power running game.

If you're going by how many 300+ pound guys go look at 2003 roster, one of Mason's most successful rushing offenses but there were maybe around 4 offensive linemen on the team listed at or above 300 pounds, but for the most part they weren't guys who played. The starters on that line were all under 300.
 


imthewalrus said:
And,GopherHomer, please don't misconstrue my impression of Coach Kill's first two seasons: I actually look at the Kill regime with hopefulness (mostly), so please don't assume too much based upon one "...basically...average Mason season..." Let's see how many "average Mason seasons..." Coach Kill can string together and see if he can last ten seasons as head coach of this program. Believe me, I am pulling for Coach Kill to get this done. His formula MUST be to go 4-0 in ooc and at least 2-6 in conference with a bowl invitation. In order to be "average Mason-like..." he will need to win some of those (what you call non-elite bowl games.. In year number three he would need to be looking at a "break-out" of sorts. He will have opportunities with 9 conference game schedules coming up in the future. He has the advantage of playing in and recruiting to the new stadium.

I don't know if Coach Kill is close to Mason-level or not. If you listen to him, he says his team is too young.

Personally, I think he has to make a move upward in Conference play in 2013 because 2014 and 2015 will be very brutal in terms of back to back games against some very typically powerful Conference foes. That makes it hard in terms of staying healthy and in terms of being emotionally and mentally ready to take on the world . Yes, that situation also presents fantastic opportunities for earth-shattering upsets and monumental victories.

But, GopherHomer before we assume too much about Coach Kill's fate, he needs to put together those years that were at least very "Mason-Like" Some don't like to admit it, but, it is kind of tough to get this program to a truly competitive B1G level. We now have the stadium...but...we also have Nebraska on the schedule every year in addition to our older Big Ten Foes...

I really want to see Coach Kill take us to a level above the Mason levels...but...I will have to see it before I will take it for granted. So, any time anyone downplays Coach Mason's tenure by emphasizing his big losses (which he did have) I will always need to mention his BIG wins...which he also did have. That's all. If you are going to look at an era...look at it with both eyes open...look at the bad...and the good...and, a GREAT win is always going to be a GREAT win, no matter how many HORRIBLE losses there may have been.

The same will hopefully be true for Coach Kill when all is said and done. Be fair. Be even. If you talk about the bad...also talk about the good.

I think you KNOW that, don't you GopherHomer? I think you know that very well and appreciate it, I would guess...

; 0 )
Click to expand...

It's weird...I think we're pretty much in agreement but, yet, I still feel like I'm being lectured.
 

GopherHomer said:
It's weird...I think we're pretty much in agreement but, yet, I still feel like I'm being lectured.
Click to expand...

A lecture means someone with knowledge is teaching you something and you're learning....

....Wren just goes on rants and tangents.
 

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