I’m Proud of Our Team

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MNVCGUY said:
I get where you are coming from and in most cases I am not a fan of any sort of moral victory or whatever.

Game like last night falls into a different category to me though. Purdue is a legit contender and playing at home. The fact that we were able to take the fight to them the way we did is exciting for the future of this program provided the roster stays mostly in tact going into next year.
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No moral victories, of course. But from my seat, the biggest advancement from the last two years is a competitive spirit to not give up. Last night, and several times this year, they could have (and I think would have in the last two years) rolled over and died in getting behind or other adverse circumstances. Some of that has to do with the talent and shooting skill to actually get back into a game, but its also a mindset that simply hasn't been there in years, including the previous administration. Blowing 20 point leads is heartbreaking, but getting blown out by 30 is downright discouraging and much worse. That's the biggest sign of hope, and that Ben is really instituting a culture in the program.
 


howeda7 said:
And covering the spread..
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God you two can be miserable. The first two years with Ben were terrible, but if you can't see improvement in the roster, individual development, and how they are playing as a team you truly just want to see Ben be unsuccessful. They aren't a finished product, but they play really good defense, and they have significantly improved how they take care of the ball over the year. I have been frustrated with Ben the last couple of years, and I see improvement in the talent on the team and how they play.
 

Tucker32 said:
God you two can be miserable. The first two years with Ben were terrible, but if you can't see improvement in the roster, individual development, and how they are playing as a team you truly just want to see Ben be unsuccessful. They aren't a finished product, but they play really good defense, and they have significantly improved how they take care of the ball over the year. I have been frustrated with Ben the last couple of years, and I see improvement in the talent on the team and how they play.
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Lighten up, Francis.

 



Tucker32 said:
God you two can be miserable. The first two years with Ben were terrible, but if you can't see improvement in the roster, individual development, and how they are playing as a team you truly just want to see Ben be unsuccessful. They aren't a finished product, but they play really good defense, and they have significantly improved how they take care of the ball over the year. I have been frustrated with Ben the last couple of years, and I see improvement in the talent on the team and how they play.
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Well said, next year will be the make or break year for Johnson. I'm with those that feel like it needs to be NCAA tournament or bust next year. Ideally this year will end with an NIT berth which the team can hopefully use as a springboard into next year when they should be very experienced if the roster holds together.

And yeah, those not enjoying this current season because of the previous 2 or whatever reason are missing out on a fun ride. It is a frustrating ride at times......but it is still a lot of fun.
 

Dakota2 said:
Very proud. The measure of a coach and team goes far beyond wins/losses. It is based on improvement trend, competitiveness, and attitude.
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Oh don't say that.....BarnBurner told me countless times before I finally put him on ignore that only wins/loses matter.... :)

I agree 100% however. The powers that be are looking at way more than the record when evaluating a program. The trend for the Gophers this year is way up from where it was the previous 2 years. Still room to grow and the expectations on Johnson will definitely be raised heading into next year.
 

Dakota2 said:
Very proud. The measure of a coach and team goes far beyond wins/losses. It is based on improvement trend, competitiveness, and attitude.

The Gophers and their coach are doing a great job on those measurements.

Now Ben has to face a big choice on whether to use Carrington much more and Hawkins less or ride with Hawk at the controls. He hurt us last night with bad shots and sloppy ball handling at the end when we still had a chance to win.
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I think he will and has to will roll with Hawkins, as he is our best ball handler, makes passes no one else on the team can and is the guy I want on line to make FTs at the end of the game.

FWIW - he stills lead the nation in assists and had 7 last night with 3 TOs; it should have only been 2, as the baseline pass definitely hit off Gillis fingers - Hummel even admitted it.

He still is too sloppy with the ball, but he gives us an edge and makes excellent choices for the most part when he’s in transition. None of us imagined he’d be this good and if he continues to lead the conference in assists and is in the top 10 in steals (he’s fifth right now), he’ll be no worse than honorable mention All Conference.

I like Carrington off the bench for his toughness and D
 
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Holy Man said:
No moral victories, of course. But from my seat, the biggest advancement from the last two years is a competitive spirit to not give up. Last night, and several times this year, they could have (and I think would have in the last two years) rolled over and died in getting behind or other adverse circumstances. Some of that has to do with the talent and shooting skill to actually get back into a game, but its also a mindset that simply hasn't been there in years, including the previous administration. Blowing 20 point leads is heartbreaking, but getting blown out by 30 is downright discouraging and much worse. That's the biggest sign of hope, and that Ben is really instituting a culture in the program.
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The problem with the NIL wild west is that you have to instill the culture all over again, every summer. Ben's roster has been like a rotating door at the Hilton. People go in and out like they are visiting guests with no commitment to the long-term.

This season, however, may give our present guests the desire to stick around for a longer stay. At least that's what I am hoping.
 



Holy Man said:
The same guys are coming here for the tournament and expect the Gophers to make a nice run at the Target Center. They thought the refs hosed them on early fouls, but were genuinely impressed by the talent level.
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Thanks, it’s nice to get external feedback, so we’re not just a bunch of Myopic Minnesotans 🥸
 

Tucker32 said:
Ha - a typical response. I don't think it's me that has to lighten up. I'm enjoying the team and the progress.
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If you're triggered by a joke about a moral victory and covering the spread in a thread celebrating that they achieved a moral victory (and covered the spread) maybe you do need to lighten up.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
I think he will and has to will roll with Hawkins, as he is our best ball handler, makes passes no one else on the team can and us a guy I want bon line to make FTs at the end of the game.

FWIW - he stills lead the nation in assists and had 7 last night with 3 TOs; it should have only been 2, as the baseline pass definitely hit off Gillis fingers - Humle even admitted it.

He still is too sloppy with the ball, but he gives us an edge and makes excellent voices for the most part when he’s in transition. None of us imagined he’d be this good and if he continues to lead the conference in assists and is in the top 10 in steals (he’s fifth right now), he’ll be no worse than honorable mention All Conference.

I like Carrington off the bench for his toughness and D
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Hawkins does a lot of great things. The one thing he has to watch out for is dribbling himself into trouble with no obvious exit strategy which usually ends up in a turnover. When he avoids that he makes a ton of great passes and sets guys up for good looks. Shame he isn't a little bit bigger to make it easier for him to finish at the basket.....but he is a ton of fun to watch and is really figuring out how to play at this level.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Hawkins does a lot of great things. The one thing he has to watch out for is dribbling himself into trouble with no obvious exit strategy which usually ends up in a turnover. When he avoids that he makes a ton of great passes and sets guys up for good looks. Shame he isn't a little bit bigger to make it easier for him to finish at the basket.....but he is a ton of fun to watch and is really figuring out how to play at this level.
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Agreed.

If he was a bit bigger, would he be a Gopher🤔?
 




Holy Man said:
No moral victories, of course. But from my seat, the biggest advancement from the last two years is a competitive spirit to not give up. Last night, and several times this year, they could have (and I think would have in the last two years) rolled over and died in getting behind or other adverse circumstances. Some of that has to do with the talent and shooting skill to actually get back into a game, but it’s also a mindset that simply hasn't been there in years, including the previous administration. Blowing 20 point leads is heartbreaking, but getting blown out by 30 is downright discouraging and much worse. That's the biggest sign of hope, and that Ben is really instituting a culture in the program.
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Prophetic!

Preach, Holy Man
 

Yesterdays game proved that we can play with anybody - which is a huge improvement over the beginning of the year.

The bigger question is can we not just play but actually beat anybody? Not quite yet but there is a chance that we complete our metamorphosis by the Bigten tournament. Be great to see a nice run going into the tournament and an opportunity to win 3 games at the Target Center for a post season bid.
 

CPTMidnight said:
Yesterdays game proved that we can play with anybody - which is a huge improvement over the beginning of the year.

The bigger question is can we not just play but actually beat anybody? Not quite yet but there is a chance that we complete our metamorphosis by the Bigten tournament. Be great to see a nice run going into the tournament and an opportunity to win 3 games at the Target Center for a post season bid.
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I feel like our offense is still just too dependent on getting hot from 3 point range. In the second half of both Iowa and Purdue the opponents began to overplay our guards and we just don't seem to have the action in place to counter that. We don't reverse the ball well and make other teams move- we rely a lot on the dribble.
 

Holy Man said:
The Kryptonite for Purdue for years, even before this remarkable era, has been guard play and specifically handling the press and speedy teams. If there is a vulnerability in them now, I think that's it. Guards are really good, but not particularly athletic, and are vulnerable to pressure. Painter did a great job of supplementing the roster with Jones, who is a lock down defender and can hit shots. He gives them speed at spots they have lacked.
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Absolutely. And is probably what he was getting at when he said overrated. Overrated, no; however, of great teams in MCAA basketball their vulnerability is particularly easy to see. The rarity with which other great teams have been able to exploit it, also says something.
 

FinnGopher said:
The problem with the NIL wild west is that you have to instill the culture all over again, every summer. Ben's roster has been like a rotating door at the Hilton. People go in and out like they are visiting guests with no commitment to the long-term.

This season, however, may give our present guests the desire to stick around for a longer stay. At least that's what I am hoping.
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Agreed on all counts. Hopefully, the culture is instilled deep enough that it becomes a reason that guys want to come here and doesn't have start at ground zero every summer. Given that he began with roster of one year players, I don't see the revolving door now much different than it has been around here for many years prior to Ben's tenure, or what most D-1 programs are.

The game is played differently now, and it is even harder for guys like Ben trying to instill good player, good citizen, and team first guys to make that work. I hope it does.
 

bga1 said:
I feel like our offense is still just too dependent on getting hot from 3 point range. In the second half of both Iowa and Purdue the opponents began to overplay our guards and we just don't seem to have the action in place to counter that. We don't reverse the ball well and make other teams move- we rely a lot on the dribble.
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The other issue is Garcia is really the only guy who is good at creating his own shot. I think Christie will get there eventually but probably not this year. Hawkins can drive but isn't big enough to really finish so usually dishes to someone else.

The fun part is you can see the team getting better as the year goes on. Even though these last two games ended in loses those first half efforts were really impressive. Gophers are not a team I would want to face in the Big Ten tournament on a pseudo home court.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Played really well on the road against a team that has a legit shot at winning the National Championship. Sucks we didn’t win but no true fan should be disappointed by the effort against Purdue.
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While I agree with your overall point...Purdue is not going to come anywhere close to winning the National Title.
 



MNVCGUY said:
The other issue is Garcia is really the only guy who is good at creating his own shot. I think Christie will get there eventually but probably not this year. Hawkins can drive but isn't big enough to really finish so usually dishes to someone else.

The fun part is you can see the team getting better as the year goes on. Even though these last two games ended in loses those first half efforts were really impressive. Gophers are not a team I would want to face in the Big Ten tournament on a pseudo home court.
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What is frustrating is, that when they have a hot first half shooting they never seem to use it to their advantage. Most likely you won't stay hot all game but while you are shooting well the D is going to have to try and guard you farther out. We have an aversion to getting the ball inside (we drive more which is nice but never really set down low) which is bordering on pathological sometimes. The Iowa game especially...we made it easy on the refs not to call fouls because we never seem to pressure Iowa near the basket after Garcia went down.

(I realize Edey changes that calculus I am speaking more in general)

I don't know if that is coaching, or is some players just not doing it for whatever reason but if we want to take the next step we need to learn how to better use positives to create more positives. Its a weak analogy but think about in football you can throw slants all day long but sooner or later the D will adjust and that is when you need to change it up a bit and take a shot.

With that said I have no complaints about yesterday and it isn't about moral victories or anything, I was actually impressed more by the fact that the Iowa game didn't drag the down a black hole. This could have snowballed fast but the team came to play. That is a very positive sign in my eyes...if it continues.
 

howeda7 said:
If you're triggered by a joke about a moral victory and covering the spread in a thread celebrating that they achieved a moral victory (and covered the spread) maybe you do need to lighten up.
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So dumb. Not that one comment - it's your consistent negativity about Ben and the team that is stupid. Go ahead with shruggin off some pushback by telling me to lighten up or that I've been triggered. Just enjoying the season and seeing some progress. Try it.
 

atsgopher said:
Your Hot take needs to be amended. Calling then overrated is down right silly.

They are tied for the Nation’s best record.

They have the measurably most difficult schedule.

They are ranked #2 by analytical measures.

Nope, by definition they are not overrated.

They have won 29 games two years in a row and will at least win that many this year.

The last couple years when teams beat them, they don’t stop Zach Edey. He gets his; don’t take a bunch of stupid fouls on Edey just for a WetBlanket’s vanity.

Teams that beat Purdue, do so by stopping their other good players. When FDU beat them, Zach Edey had 21 pts, 15 rbds. Last night, he had 24 pts, 15 rbds.
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I guess when I think a number 2 ranked team I think a team with a true shot to win the title…Purdue is not that.

Historically, they crap the bed in the ncaa tourney under Painter. Plus even with Edey getting his, they play a style of ball, that is so Edey focused that doesn’t really develop really good other player players. They are the equivalent of Tennessee in my mind. A really tough regular season team who grinds you down, but when you space them out with four shooters / four guards who are fast / can all dribble drive…in a one game series…if they get hot, Purdue loses every time, and it’s they track record in the NCAA tourney.

With Edey, he’s such a unicorn, but he being such a unicorn he makes it that Purdue can’t make adjustments on the fly. Do you see Edey doing pick and roll defense on the perimeter? No. They can only play a certain way to gif his uniqueness. And when that fails, they can’t adjust…because he would be out on an island and carved up.
 

bga1 said:
I feel like our offense is still just too dependent on getting hot from 3 point range. In the second half of both Iowa and Purdue the opponents began to overplay our guards and we just don't seem to have the action in place to counter that. We don't reverse the ball well and make other teams move- we rely a lot on the dribble.
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Failure to move/reverse the ball well enough goes directly to Hawk trying to dribble his way into a good assist. He is killing ball movement. Either Ben has to convince him we want more passing to get shots or he needs to play less in favor of Carrington.
 


Holy Man said:
The same guys are coming here for the tournament and expect the Gophers to make a nice run at the Target Center. They thought the refs hosed them on early fouls, but were genuinely impressed by the talent level.
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Of course they thought the refs hosed them. That was one of the most obnoxious crowds I’ve heard on TV in a long time last night.
 


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